20758 replies to this topic

[PoliFanAthic]

Don't know what tyres he had, but it was neither medium nor soft!!

Ah, I just saw it now, when he comes in, they do a mock pit-stop and change to intermeds.

No clue how many softs he used.

[Dalton007]

Michael's seat is being wasted by... Michael. Mercedes needs two competitive drivers for the future. Michael's had his time, give a youngster a chance.

[ivand911]

Q3 at least.

[Urawa]

Michael's seat is being wasted by... Michael. Mercedes needs two competitive drivers for the future. Michael's had his time, give a youngster a chance.

Same **** after ever saturday, booooring

[Diablobb81]

Michael's seat is being wasted by... Michael. Mercedes needs two competitive drivers for the future. Michael's had his time, give a youngster a chance.

The two drivers are pretty much equal in results.So, no.

[Urawa]

btw yesterday in FP2 he went 0,01 sec faster

[Wilgot]

The two drivers are pretty much equal in results.So, no.

But it is qualifying that matters, haven't you heard?

[Math89]

lol, write him of on saturday. Accuse the team of team orders when he ends up before Rosberg on sunday.

[ivand911]

Michael will play games now with DIR and SUT.

[Szoelloe]

no kers might explain those ridiculous S2 times

this^^

dumb vultures are flying again

[ivand911]

MS go out on mediums too and beat Nico's time. Why he is not going out??? free place.

Edited by ivand911, 12 November 2011 - 14:01.

[arknor]

Michael's seat is being wasted by... Michael. Mercedes needs two competitive drivers for the future. Michael's had his time, give a youngster a chance.

like who? disresta im getting owned by my team mate ?

there is no one worthwhile to give the second seat to atleast with msc mercedes get a driver who is matching his team mate and one that comes with alot of sponsors who are only there because michael is

without the techincal dnfs rosberg hasnt had michael would be ahead on points also

[Urawa]

right behind Nico

[ivand911]

Yeah, 8th , one place behind Nico. Nice. I think he just try to save the tires with not pushing to hard. Push tyres and you will have less tyre in the race.

Edited by ivand911, 12 November 2011 - 14:08.

[Johnrambo]

Schumacher was absolute crap today.

[Urawa]

so could somebody explain to me why his fastest time of the weekend was done yesterday in the second practise and track improvement do absolutely nothing for him?

[Diablobb81]

It went much better than expected. Good. And the race can only be better than last year.

[zelpre]

Schumacher was absolute crap today.

yep =/

[Urawa]

Schumacher was absolute crap today.

already thought about an excuse for tomorrow afternoon?

[mani1]

I am quite perplexed and honestly, a bit worried too. Schumi almost 1sec behind rosberg in Q3. That should not have happened under any circumstances. Unless theres some sort of a explanation, I am guessing Rosberg wont be catchable here

[ivand911]

I am quite perplexed and honestly, a bit worried too. Schumi almost 1sec behind rosberg in Q3. That should not have happened under any circumstances. Unless theres some sort of a explanation, I am guessing Rosberg wont be catchable here

Quite the opposite I think. Did MS give interview to the BBC, what he said?

Edited by ivand911, 12 November 2011 - 14:16.

[Lelouch]

so could somebody explain to me why his fastest time of the weekend was done yesterday in the second practise and track improvement do absolutely nothing for him?

agreed

It went much better than expected. Good. And the race can only be better than last year.

dunno why in qualifying we get answers for everyone bar Michael and his car that raise even more questions..

[Skanka]

Yeah, 8th , one place behind Nico. Nice. I think he just try to save the tires with not pushing to hard. Push tyres and you will have less tyre in the race.

He's just way to slow in qualifying. At least today he's 8th so it's alright, but it's still embarrassing for him to be 0.8s, 1s slower than Rosberg in qualifying. This year it doesn't matter much but if next year Mercedes finally delivers a good car, his qualifying weaknesses will hurt him much more. Tomorrow's looking good because he will start alongside Rosberg but I just wish he could sort out his qualifying problems...

[Dalton007]

like who? disresta im getting owned by my team mate ?

there is no one worthwhile to give the second seat to atleast with msc mercedes get a driver who is matching his team mate and one that comes with alot of sponsors who are only there because michael is

without the techincal dnfs rosberg hasnt had michael would be ahead on points also

Michael achieved some major feats in F1, but he HAD his time! Merc should be looking to the future and Michael isn't the future.

[ivand911]

He's just way to slow in qualifying. At least today he's 8th so it's alright, but it's still embarrassing for him to be 0.8s, 1s slower than Rosberg in qualifying. This year it doesn't matter much but if next year Mercedes finally delivers a good car, his qualifying weaknesses will hurt him much more. Tomorrow's looking good because he will start alongside Rosberg but I just wish he could sort out his qualifying problems...

Setup difference, different way of using tyres. He was 0,8 sec slower in India too, how the race finished?

[PoliFanAthic]

Surprisingly decent p8. Not the first time Schumacher's gap to Rosberg is so big, I can recall some of the recent races where it was the case, but then the difference vanished in the race.

A shame for all four cars that went out (MGP, FI), seeing how it made absolutely no difference to how they would've started. MGP wanted to place Rosberg on 7, in front of Schumacher, because he deserved it, so he did an outlap early on, but the rest was just tire wastage. Not that it matter too much in the end though, they'll only be driving against each other.

[ivand911]

[Skanka]

Setup difference, different way of using tyres. He was 0,8 sec slower in India too, how the race finished?

I know all that, I'm a Schumacher fan. I'm just concerned about next year, because he will need to be competitive in qualifying then.

[ivand911]

Not very smart from FI, they know very well ,what will happen at the start if they finished Q3 ahead of MS.

[ivand911]

I know all that, I'm a Schumacher fan. I'm just concerned about next year, because he will need to be competitive in qualifying then.

Next year if they have better car(not very plausible) , MS will change the strategy.

[Johnrambo]

Next year if they have better car(not very plausible) , MS will change the strategy.

He's slow on purpose then?

[DutchCruijff]

He's slow on purpose then?

Yes, it's called "looking at the bigger picture". Try it sometime.

[ivand911]

Any interview from MS, RTL forget him! What happen?

[Kubiccia]

so could somebody explain to me why his fastest time of the weekend was done yesterday in the second practise and track improvement do absolutely nothing for him?

IIRC, that happened in Valencia as well.

Definitely there was other GP where his fastest lap of the weekend was in FP2 and his qualifying was the only one of all 24 cars that didn't lowed the FP2 by more than a second.

[Johnrambo]

Yes, it's called "looking at the bigger picture". Try it sometime.

I do and Schumacher still is slow as hell.

[ivand911]

He's slow on purpose then?

I think it is called: make the best result in Q with the least effort and using less tyres. This is what I think. He and Nico have completely different set up for sure.
I hope MS is not in the meeting with stewards right now(DIR-Q1).

Edited by ivand911, 12 November 2011 - 14:41.

[PoliFanAthic]

So by the fact that Schumacher is much slower in sector 2 (about 0.5 secs) and his top speeds are 3-4 kmph slower than Rosberg's at all intermediate points, can one reasonably conclude that he's running more downforce?

Would that mean higher or lower tyre use?

[arknor]

Michael achieved some major feats in F1, but he HAD his time! Merc should be looking to the future and Michael isn't the future.

then neither is rosberg yet he just signed a long term contract so maybe merc no something you dont

[ivand911]

http://www.fia.com/e...ing-sectors.pdf
http://www.fia.com/e...ying-speeds.pdf
http://www.fia.com/e...ifying-trap.pdf
If it is about the down force, I think more will be better for tyres? Less wheel spin. But, I think it is more connected with general set up, or how 160 kg of fuel will change the car performance. It is maybe about the springs, camber, shocks. Will see. With wings right now ,they can't change down force so much. Or they can change it more at the front wings. At the speed trap the speed is equal.

Edited by ivand911, 12 November 2011 - 14:57.

[Paco]

Next year.. what in the world are people concerned about.

Pirelli has already said they are changing the composition and gonna be more aggressive with their compound.
Floor changes to the car is gonna change downforce etc.

Those 2 changes alone are reason enough to believe a significant change in setup will be needed so drawing a comparison to this years qualifying is bullocks.

At the very least.. MS trend has been on significant improvement this year where Nico has pretty been flat with only a tick better in qualifying. Almost as if Nico has peaked and Michael race over race has gotten more comfortable.

Seems like a great many on this boards are sooooo short sighted as the old saying .. "you're only as good as your last race" has not gotten even shorter to.. "you're only as good as the last lap you turned out"..

[Paco]

Merc problems isn't the drivers.. but the technical team. Let them work that out before writing off Schumi.

Took Jordan a little bit on his return to the NBA to get the next sets of championship. Don't count out Schumi once he senses the car can win races...

[SeanValen]

Michael achieved some major feats in F1, but he HAD his time! Merc should be looking to the future and Michael isn't the future.

Did you watch the races this year or just qualifying sessions
Qualifying this year is about those who want to use it for what they want to use it for, Schumacher's results in the races, and potential races where his speed was quicker, and it has been quicker for majority of the season baring a few gps, qualifying means nothing to me this year if a driver does well on sunday, this car is not good in qualifying and race,

If you were racing this year, do you want qualifying or race performance? Simple question, the nature of the tyre rules/quali rules ,you can do this, Michael plays within what he needs to do leading up to the final lap of the weekend.

The future of mercedes is making sure their technical crew deliver a strong car, or rosberg has signed a new contract for nothing, or Schumacher goes back to ferrari for a 3rd car which Luca keeps talking about, that's the future of mercedes, no other drivers in the field is gonna make this car get any better.

If Schumacher's race speed was slow this year, you got a point, but someone was either not watching the races properly or chooses not to believe the living legend is actually alive and well, and very fast still in a group of drivers who are also very fast, until you accept that, your in a matrix world where Schumacher is still in 2010 season form lol

It's actually amazing he's improved since last year, from returning to the sport, you and others joined in the party in writing him off last year, now your thinking, I don't want anyone saying I told you so, well I TOLD YOU SO, SCHUMACHER WILL MAKE ALOT OF PEOPLE WHO DOUBTED HIM LOOK LIKE IDIOTS!!

Jackie Stewart, Moss and the rest of the turds Christmas season will be bitter knowing the guy who annoys them the most is back and awaiting improvements from his team. Schumacher's motivation increases not because of his money/cars/past success, but what critics like you think he should do with his life, if you say he's slow, he'll go faster, just wait and watch, even if he had a odd race this weekend, he's done more then enough to be the faster consistent race performing driver this year, now just a strong car is needed, and it will take a slower car to make Vettel look like a rosberg or schumacher this year, the car itself makes people lazy, I'm sure when Vettel comes crashing down to earth one day, and has incidences with backmakers, his season won't look any better then Michael's this eyar, these cars are racing almost in different formulas looking at their car differences, it's very challenging to be sure who's doing what with kers, drs, tyre choices and alll.

Edited by SeanValen, 12 November 2011 - 15:14.

[DutchCruijff]

Michael is done and dusted with Ferrari, no possibility whatsoever that he'll return to a laughable 3rd car.

[Urawa]

well, Nico said now the rear tyres are going off very quickly.
I thought it didn´t look too bad tyre wise this weekend.
Looking forward to the race.

[HaPe]

So by the fact that Schumacher is much slower in sector 2 (about 0.5 secs) and his top speeds are 3-4 kmph slower than Rosberg's at all intermediate points, can one reasonably conclude that he's running more downforce?

Would that mean higher or lower tyre use?

Some driver mentioned a decent fact for the race tomorrow: It's going to turn dark and much colder than it will be at the start and first stint.
It hurted a couple of drivers in Q3 that the track changed massively just for the last q3 runs today (cause it got dark and colder).

With that in mind it would be reasonable to have more downforce for the (then) colder track, getting more out of the tyres in the second part of the race.
It's also right, that this can(!) hurt in qualifying.

So my guess is that Schumacher has taken this route - opting for better race performance.
I'm also thinking that his Q3 run was on the used soft tyres from Q2 end, so he has still new softs for tomorrow.

[ivand911]

HaPe good point.
I don't know if it means something but:
India:
Nico Q3 1:25.451 Nico race 1:28.6 , difference 3,2 sec.
Michael Q3 1:26.3 , Michael race 1:28.5 , difference 2,2 sec.
Vettel ,3,1 sec
Button 3,0 sec
Alonso 3,4 sec
but Kova 1,7 sec.

Michael get closer to his Q time than Nico.

Edited by ivand911, 12 November 2011 - 15:31.

[SeanValen]

Michael is done and dusted with Ferrari, no possibility whatsoever that he'll return to a laughable 3rd car.

You was readhing by post, thanks, but no one thought he would return, no one thought he would go to mercedes, the guy is unpredicatable. But he does want a title/success, either way, trying to think what he thinks as he said about Kimi coming to f1 again, is impossible, you can only guess, but I do think Michael is as unpredictable as they come.

well, Nico said now the rear tyres are going off very quickly.
I thought it didn´t look too bad tyre wise this weekend.
Looking forward to the race.

Nico reminds me of a young Jarno Trulli, and we know what his career is known for, qualifyer, expert.

Even if Nico has a good race tomorrow, or Brazil, he still will lose out in overall race performance impressions this year, he just is not setting up his car to do well in the race, because he knows Michael is back, he's waiting for Michael to trip up in the race, he's got no option, he's not as fast as him consistently in rrace, then look good through his qualifying and race result, the thinkg is Schumacher has given him some easy points this year, but that isn't reflected in the points tally,, unless Rosberg improves this, not just in the final 2 races, but next year also, and I think Schumacher will be even more on guard next year to try and not give Nico any front wing/race incidence handouts, that can't go on, especially if merc improve the car and get up there. So if people think Michael has improved this year, next year he may go a step further, and if off throttle is going, maybe they will help Michael even more with his driving technigue, the scene is set for more Michael improvements.

Having a car just in the top ten is difficult, you have to go out like Michael did today, use soft tyres to ensure he gets into Q2/Q3, if he and Nico had a faster car like Mclaren, they will have easier cut off points, save time, save tyres even more potentially, Michael shouldn't of gone out as much as he did today if the car was on the pace of a mclaren, he is more vunerable is Schumacher on qualifying because he is trying to squeeze the car into the heighest position without comprimising race pace, Nico either is doing the opposite on choice or has no option to go the schumacher way, because of the way they drive on tyres, or whatever, it could be very technical set up differences which makes them go different routes until the last lap on Sunday, so far Schumacher has shown overall to be the better Sunday driver, THE DAY THAT COUNTS people!

Edited by SeanValen, 12 November 2011 - 15:34.

[Urawa]

Ross talks about "a small" difference in comparison to Nico that hampered MS top speed today and they have to look into the data...
Michael says the lower track temperatures tomorrow could be a bit of an advantage as they we´re fighting with tyre temperatures.

http://www.motorspor...n_11111224.html

Edited by Urawa, 12 November 2011 - 15:36.

[HaPe]

There is also another thing that got my attention today.

With the current rules for Q3 it's set that the drivers with equal effort in Q3 (e.g. join track but no timed lap) will be sorted by their starting number. Okay....

When Q3 began, Nico was immediately out on track with hard tyres and not completing a timed lap, which was just to put him in front of anybody else with same or less effort (= Schumacher and the 2 Force India).
So, Schumacher could just have done the same and would - whoops - be in front of Rosberg (because the lower starting number).

Why he didnt do it? (..and I think that happened once before too)
I think that perfectly proves the point of what he said in interview earlier (and what was taken as excuse by his haters):
He simply doesnt care, whether Rosberg is in front in qualifying (this year).

Edited by HaPe, 12 November 2011 - 15:40.

[Paco]

HaPe good point.
I don't know if it means something but:
India:
Nico Q3 1:25.451 Nico race 1:28.6 , difference 3,2 sec.
Michael Q3 1:26.3 , Michael race 1:28.5 , difference 2,2 sec.
Vettel ,3,1 sec
Button 3,0 sec
Alonso 3,4 sec
but Kova 1,7 sec.

Michael get closer to his Q time than Nico.

Very very interesting stat.

Now the questions to be asked, why has Michael not been able to qualfy like the other top 6 who get nearly an extra second over Michael on Soft and Low Fuel.. weird