From Inside 100 Great Cars 1986 Porsche 928 S
Credited to Technical Art
I do congratulate you - that couldn't have been an easy join to hide!
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Posted 10 August 2010 - 21:54
Guys,
It has been rather quiet for a couple of days, so thought I would throw out a scan that I just tried to clean a bit. I am not sure who the illustrator is for this one, as there is no reference of any sort for this, or for a couple of other pieces that seem to be by the same person. This is an early Ford GT-40, as shown in the May, 1964 issue of Sports Car Graphic. If anyone recognizes the artist, I would appreciate the information.
I have to tell you that I hate these color overlays, as they never held reasonable registration, so putting them together can be a real thrill. The printing was really horrid, too, as this has so many destroyed lines, messed up screen overlays, the mis-registration, and a variety of printing flaws that are a real bear to clean up.
Tom West
Posted 10 August 2010 - 21:57
I always had something with inventing and conjuring up names.Do tell, then, what would your ideal name be? Nothing wrong with Tony, surely?
Posted 10 August 2010 - 22:13
I really don't have a clue Tom.
I have the article somewhere, and will have to dig it up to see if the artist is credited in the by-lines.
I think I have offered before that it could be a Vic Berris ( the detailing of the nuts on the gearbox housing),
but it may even be a Clarence LaTourette on one of his better days. I don't see a Gordon Bruce in it.
All the other GT40s (Hatton/Page/Ellis have been aired), and it doesn't look like a Hostler/Collins or Marsden.
Ibsen ? any ideas ?
Posted 10 August 2010 - 22:18
Posted 10 August 2010 - 22:47
Just in awe of the guys who do these drawings everytime I visit this thread. You guys should be lecturing design students on presentation techniques.
What size typically would a full car cutaway be drawn at? A2? A1? Bigger?
Posted 10 August 2010 - 23:53
Marc! Have you been reading my mail?EDWARD WORTHINGTON-MANDEVILLE
Eddie to us !!
Posted 11 August 2010 - 00:17
For me - 20"x30" roughly, an old Imperial size, and used by the main supplier of illustration board in the UK. Next size up was 30"x40", and I always had, still have, a couple in stock in case I needed something slightly bigger, as inevitably an illustration would sometimes 'grow'. In 'The Old Days', using a hard-surfaced board and ink line you could splice a strip on if a front wing suddenly became determined to leap off the edge, but with softer, water-colour boards it was more important to have an un-joined surface.What size typically would a full car cutaway be drawn at? A2? A1? Bigger?
Posted 11 August 2010 - 00:29
You can 'squirm' the guide as you draw inside it, or, if it's a reasonable size, use French curves. It is often the case that it just isn't that critical. For instance, along a crankshaft you might find that the point where you should use 32 degrees - my 'degree' symbol key process no longer works, apparently - is inbetween two main journals which are 30 and 35, so no need to draw it. On an illustration where it is critical, or where it would be obvious if you fudged the issue, then you just find a way, but essentially, as I started this ramble, you shift the guide slightly as you use it.While we're on the topic of technical questions, maybe Tony can answer what an illustrator does when the ellipse needed to be drawn is something like 32 degrees- very specifically not a standard template ellipse size...
Posted 11 August 2010 - 01:30
You can 'squirm' the guide as you draw inside it, or, if it's a reasonable size, use French curves. It is often the case that it just isn't that critical. For instance, along a crankshaft you might find that the point where you should use 32 degrees - my 'degree' symbol key process no longer works, apparently - is inbetween two main journals which are 30 and 35, so no need to draw it. On an illustration where it is critical, or where it would be obvious if you fudged the issue, then you just find a way, but essentially, as I started this ramble, you shift the guide slightly as you use it.
Edited by Tom Johnson, 11 August 2010 - 01:32.
Posted 11 August 2010 - 11:39
... you simply 'squirm' or shift the ellipse template as necessary along its minor axis to achieve the desired size.
Posted 11 August 2010 - 15:40
Edited by Tony Matthews, 11 August 2010 - 16:19.
Posted 11 August 2010 - 18:05
If you look closely at Tom's photo you can see him doing a bit of squirming...
Posted 11 August 2010 - 19:06
Here is a grubby little sketch on the working drawing of the Ferrari F2000 engine, as I was working out what angle ellipses to use for the valves. Not only are they splayed 24 degrees transversely, but 6 degrees logitudinally, so the angles had to be added or sutracted from the main angle of that cylinder, which is 50 degrees. It is not possible to use an ellipse guide to give exact ellipses for all the valves, there are going to be anomolies, but it is possible to use ellipses near enough to look OK, maybe slightly too fat, maybe slightly too slim - you draw them and see how they look. If it is not possible to get them all looking right with available guides, that's when the squirming comes in. Ignore the inked 40, that is to do with the crankshaft.
The finished result.
Posted 11 August 2010 - 20:38
Now that is interesting - I always worked the other way, all my squares were based on an ellipse! In fact everything was based on a sphere - ah, the beautiful sphere - as any section is a circle, every circle is an ellipse, and from any ellipse you can construct a square. The only way I could see myself using a square to define an ellipse is if I knew the square was perfect, and my method of construction didn't give me that assurance.Another tid-bit of info that helped me get any ellipse looking right was using basic geometry. When a circle is confined by a perfect square, the circle will always touch each mid-point of the sides of the square. So, if I had trouble getting an ellipse to look right, I would construct a square in perspective at the location of the circle, then choose the right ellipse or combination thereof to meet the mid-points of the perspective square.
Edited by Tony Matthews, 11 August 2010 - 21:13.
Posted 12 August 2010 - 11:04
Edited by Tony Matthews, 12 August 2010 - 11:56.
Posted 13 August 2010 - 18:29
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Posted 13 August 2010 - 21:12
Posted 14 August 2010 - 17:44
Edited by ibsenop, 15 August 2010 - 13:25.
Posted 14 August 2010 - 22:00
I am interested and in particular the Auto Union. can you PM me some details?I was going through some old stacks of drawings and found a bunch of Inomoto line-art cutaway prints. They are 14" X 20" prints on very nice slightly textured heavy paper. They were part of a collection that a Japanese Artist gave to me 20 years ago and I thought that I had lost them. I am keeping the BRM, but any of the others are available if anyone out there is interested. Some examples are: 1954 MB 300SL Coupe, 1958 Ferrari 250 Testa Rosa, 1935 Auto Union B Type, 1925 Ford Model T, 1948 Ferrari Tipo 166 Spider Corsa, and 1930 Aston Martin International.
Tom
Posted 14 August 2010 - 23:40
I always had something with inventing and conjuring up names.
I think Tony would make a fabulous.......
EDWARD WORTHINGTON-MANDEVILLE
Eddie to us !!
Posted 14 August 2010 - 23:42
That is his brother by the super-rich daddyJames Wellington Prescott ...?
Edited by macoran, 14 August 2010 - 23:44.
Posted 14 August 2010 - 23:51
That is his brother by the super-rich daddy
Eddie frequently calls himself Jim !!
Posted 14 August 2010 - 23:53
Jim! Dear Jim - haven't heard from him - Jim, him, bit of poetry there - for decades! Same mummy, different daddy, otherwise like peas in a pod, don'tcha know?Eddie frequently calls himself Jim !!
Posted 14 August 2010 - 23:56
Posted 15 August 2010 - 00:08
I am puzzling on the afctntActually, as the child brides is on the blower to someone in Australia I might as well have a snifter, so cancell the old nite nite!
Cheers! Yr afctnt cllgue Eddie.
Posted 15 August 2010 - 00:09
if it was affctnt I'd have a clueI am puzzling on the afctnt
Posted 15 August 2010 - 08:23
Yes, sorry, I meant aectonaettte.if it was affctnt I'd have a clue
Posted 16 August 2010 - 12:50
Posted 17 August 2010 - 19:54
Posted 17 August 2010 - 22:27
Posted 17 August 2010 - 22:50
Obviously Crick and Watson hadn't got that far! Springs - helixes - do seem to cause confusion. If you look at the valve springs in Vic Berris' Ferrari engine cutaway, looks like a stack of washers. I don't like to be critical, but so many times I see valve springs that are not helical...Very strange - the RR spring looks OK. I wonder why ...
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Posted 17 August 2010 - 22:51
I recall you remarking something similar about another cutaway quite some time ago, but just don't recall which.Interesting "Crick and Watson" LR spring...
Posted 17 August 2010 - 22:52
Interesting "Crick and Watson" LR spring...
Posted 17 August 2010 - 23:04
Had to look up the reference!
Posted 18 August 2010 - 09:09
Marc, I do occasionally comment, and I probably have mentioned valves prings before, but I have never seen a road spring like that before, and I can't think that I ever will again!
Posted 18 August 2010 - 14:39
Posted 18 August 2010 - 17:19
Very interesting Richard, thanks. Not only reversed out of blue but proper valve springs too! More please...Hello all,
Please forgive me interrupting the flow of this amazing thread, but having been a longtime lurker, I have now come across some material which may be of interest to this thread's enthusiasts. I have a number of Motor magazine inserts from 1938/9 entitled Technical Review. Each one is 4 sides with a description of the topic on the first page, and then three pages of cutaway drawings (unattributed as far as I can see) of examples illustrating the topic. I have attempted to post the code for 2 of these pages illustrating different approaches to "V-type engines". I have another dozen or so that I could post if they are of interest.
Regards,
Richard
Posted 18 August 2010 - 17:30
Edited by Tony Matthews, 18 August 2010 - 17:36.
Posted 18 August 2010 - 19:53
I think we should have some RULES for this thread New posters SHOULDN"T apologize for posting anything,especially not if it is good stuff from 1938.Hello all,
Please forgive me interrupting the flow of this amazing thread, but having been a longtime lurker, I have now come across some material which may be of interest to this thread's enthusiasts. I have a number of Motor magazine inserts from 1938/9 entitled Technical Review. Each one is 4 sides with a description of the topic on the first page, and then three pages of cutaway drawings (unattributed as far as I can see) of examples illustrating the topic. I have attempted to post the code for 2 of these pages illustrating different approaches to "V-type engines". I have another dozen or so that I could post if they are of interest.
Regards,
Richard
Posted 18 August 2010 - 20:55
Edited by bradbury west, 18 August 2010 - 20:56.