Easy, Tom, easy! You make it sound like an obituary! Look, I really appreciate the kind comments, but we all know, or should know, that you have to be your own fiercest critic, on top of any external criticism. That is the only way to improve. There are a few illustrations that I am happy with, but they all have details or larger issues that I know should have been done differently, and could be improved on. But still, thanks.I agree with your absolutism, E1.
The cutaway drawing and its artists
#11001
Posted 22 February 2012 - 00:33
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#11002
Posted 22 February 2012 - 01:18
Easy, Tom, easy! You make it sound like an obituary! Look, I really appreciate the kind comments, but we all know, or should know, that you have to be your own fiercest critic, on top of any external criticism. That is the only way to improve. There are a few illustrations that I am happy with, but they all have details or larger issues that I know should have been done differently, and could be improved on. But still, thanks.
Tony,
I understand your comments, and you are right. I will agonize over a particular couple of lines that I don't like, and that will be all that I ever see on a particular drawing ... and I have a hell of a long ways to go to ever approach your proficiency and your talent. At a certain point, we do them and move on, so they are not infinitely growing entities, they stop as they are and stand as they are at that point. i was not kidding about your work stepping to the head of the line when you first were getting published, so I was very impressed. I always thought that I must have missed years of your work as you honed it in "hidden" publications in England, only later to find that I was seeing your first works.
Since I have been scanning work from various others over the years, I have come to appreciate your work more as I look at the larger scans for the details.
Yeah, you know the problems, but they are among the best ever done in the field, especially when they are taken as a body of work.
... Period ...
Tom West
#11003
Posted 22 February 2012 - 01:31
Thanks. And you know... if we're not careful we may banish Tony into forced-buying of a larger hat collection. Hate to see him weather that expense.I am not sure that I have ever seen a Matthews piece that did not deserve that comment ... from the first to the last. When the first line drawings were coming out, they stepped up the previous standard, in my opinion, and the color just stretched that boundary to a higher level. Have never even seen one done from an unpleasant angle, and that can be pretty tough to achieve every time.
I agree with your absolutism, E1.
Tom West
Kidding, Tony... take the compliments 'cause you deserve them. Beats the alternative.
And TM, I agree with your professional sentiments. I've quoted since 18, ''You have to know you're good... but think you suck." Everyone likes to soften that quote, I like it as is, but perhaps my signature at the bottom of my posts says it better.
#11004
Posted 22 February 2012 - 01:35
And here I'd thought 'Absolutism' was an addiction to really good vodka.Easy, Tom, easy! You make it sound like an obituary!
#11005
Posted 22 February 2012 - 04:33
Success for all
Edited by Motocar, 24 February 2012 - 16:13.
#11010
Posted 22 February 2012 - 22:48
#11011
Posted 22 February 2012 - 22:58
have heard of him, but don't remember whereMark Stehrenberger.
Road & Track house artist , more or less like Werner Buhrer ?
#11012
Posted 22 February 2012 - 23:23
More about him: http://www.stehrenbergerdesign.com/
Edited by ibsenop, 22 February 2012 - 23:26.
#11013
Posted 23 February 2012 - 09:31
Good find, I remember the designers in the 60's always looking out for his work. He has a very distinctive style but I have never seen a cutaway of his before.His work appeared in "Road & Track", "Motor Trend", "Car and Driver" and other magazines.
More about him: http://www.stehrenbergerdesign.com/
#11014
Posted 24 February 2012 - 11:21
Good find, I remember the designers in the 60's always looking out for his work. He has a very distinctive style but I have never seen a cutaway of his before.
Stuart, can I ask, do you recognise this signature from your time working at Jaguar?
I believe it is a styling drawing for the proposed IMSA GTP series, and it is dated 1981.
Jaguar IMSA GTP, Styling drawing, 1981 (Not a cutaway)
#11015
Posted 24 February 2012 - 12:52
#11016
Posted 24 February 2012 - 17:03
Can't say I recognise the signature from any of the designers at that time but I will pass it across to a very good designer friend of mine who should be able to identify if it was a Jaguar design sketch.Stuart, can I ask, do you recognise this signature from your time working at Jaguar?
I believe it is a styling drawing for the proposed IMSA GTP series, and it is dated 1981.
Jaguar IMSA GTP, Styling drawing, 1981 (Not a cutaway)
I met a couple of illustrators today at Race Retro and I informed them about this site and asked them if they could identify some of the missing names. One used to work in the Jaguar Technical Illustration Department and the other was a freelance illustrator for several years so hopefully they can fill in some of the gaps.
#11017
Posted 24 February 2012 - 17:36
http://www.lassiwith...-big-apple/html
Success for all
Edited by Motocar, 24 February 2012 - 17:38.
#11018
Posted 24 February 2012 - 17:50
and were of little use when the rains come the "Monzon" design a vehicle that may be purchased by the growing middle class market Deun emmergente, your final price stay at $ 2.500 100,000 rupees or in its most basic version, much of the equipment offered as accessories including front disc brakes, but it is a car that meets all safety standards and anti-pollution, fire problems in some units contributed to poor publiciada, coupled with environmental problems with the installation of the mega-plant in an area considered protected habitat, the automotive industry saw with concern the new product and began studies to create their own versions, in India Maruti 800 launched a very basic low-priced to compete, so far not reach the top in sales, consumers want something more for your business status and are not associated with a produto so basic, only time will tell sie s a Bluff or sales housing peaked and will give Tata Nano to the success it deserves to be the "Most Economical Auto world "
Interior Tata Nano
Success for all
#11019
Posted 24 February 2012 - 20:00
Ah, very interesting. Thanks very much, Stuart. In that case, and if nothing else turns up, I wonder if the drawing may have originated in the US, via Bob Tullius’s Group 44 Inc?Can't say I recognise the signature from any of the designers at that time but I will pass it across to a very good designer friend of mine who should be able to identify if it was a Jaguar design sketch.
Great stuffI met a couple of illustrators today at Race Retro and I informed them about this site and asked them if they could identify some of the missing names. One used to work in the Jaguar Technical Illustration Department and the other was a freelance illustrator for several years so hopefully they can fill in some of the gaps.
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#11020
Posted 24 February 2012 - 20:27
He has a very distinctive style but I have never seen a cutaway of his before.
The huge database accumulated on the forum permits some interesting associations to be made. If one compares the cutaways of Stehrenberger with the Esprit and Elite cutaways by Tony Divey on page 61 and the Eclat cutaway on page 225, it is apparent that Stehrenberger's task was to convert them to left-hand drive and colorize them for the American (magazine) market. The cutaways were also simplified and made to appear softer.
#11021
Posted 25 February 2012 - 15:57
Good day CVA. This Austin Healey looks to be a 3000 Mark I BT7 roadster. It certainly is not a 4 cylinder Austin Healey Hundred.
From an artistic viewpoint, I am a pure novice who only tries to appreciate the work. Having said that, this effort by Robert Roux seems to have been light on detail.
#11022
Posted 25 February 2012 - 16:02
http://www.haynes.co...hantom_camo.htm
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#11025
Posted 25 February 2012 - 23:52
Good day CVA. This Austin Healey looks to be a 3000 Mark I BT7 roadster. It certainly is not a 4 cylinder Austin Healey Hundred.
Actually it looks to be of a 100-6 BN4. The engine shows the integral port head only available on early 100-6's.
Thankfully they went to a 12 port head later.
Michael
#11028
Posted 26 February 2012 - 22:47
http://www.mbfaq.com...hp?f=8&t=143224
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#11029
Posted 27 February 2012 - 19:19
Theo Page under left bumper corner ?Mercedes Benz C111 cutaway author unknow, of the web:
http://www.mbfaq.com...hp?f=8&t=143224
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#11030
Posted 27 February 2012 - 19:53
Renault 1100 cc. Artist, Editechnic.
Renault 20 TL. Artist, E.T.A.I. France.
Renault 20 TS (Left) and Renault 20 TL (Right). Artist, E.T.A.I France.
Renault 5 EPURE. Artist, E.T.A.I France.
Renault 16. Disc front brake. Artist, Editechnic.
Renault 9 TSE. Artist, E.T.A.I. France.
Renault 16. High-Camshaft engine. Section, not a cutaway. Artist, editechnic.
Renault 6. 850 cc engine. Artist, Editechnic.
Renault engine. 1954. Artist, Schlenzig.
#11031
Posted 28 February 2012 - 10:02
Hi Werks, my friend who worked in the Jaguar Design Department at that time doesn't recognise the signature other than as Duc-Man says it is possibly Brian Hattons work. The bodywork for the XJR-5 was supervised by Lee Dykstra but that is as much assistance I can give. You could try a UK motor art collector Tony Clark www.motoringart.info/Stuart, can I ask, do you recognise this signature from your time working at Jaguar?
I believe it is a styling drawing for the proposed IMSA GTP series, and it is dated 1981.
Jaguar IMSA GTP, Styling drawing, 1981 (Not a cutaway)
#11032
Posted 28 February 2012 - 11:52
Hi Werks, my friend who worked in the Jaguar Design Department at that time doesn't recognise the signature other than as Duc-Man says it is possibly Brian Hattons work. The bodywork for the XJR-5 was supervised by Lee Dykstra but that is as much assistance I can give. You could try a UK motor art collector Tony Clark www.motoringart.info/
Ok, that is great, Stuart. And thanks very much for taking the time.
It is certainly an efficient approach, being able to ask someone who was involved with the various departments at Jaguar.
Initially I considered Uk based, Walton, who in hindsight, is somewhat of a motorcycle specialist it seems. I will continue to explore the US link. (The 44 numbering I think may hint at Group 44 inc).
Thanks also, Duc man.
#11033
Posted 28 February 2012 - 12:11
Success for all
#11037
Posted 28 February 2012 - 21:46
Oei Oei, hazardous guess required.............OK, Berris or Hatton for me
edit......blast !!!!!.............. I see Dick Ellis did many cutaways with shadowing under the car as well.
Edited by macoran, 28 February 2012 - 21:59.
#11038
Posted 28 February 2012 - 21:57
Oei Oei, hazardous guess required.............OK, Berris or Hatton for me
Or, I can just about make out something lurking murkily ahead of the left rear. Cavara?
Edit: Forensics in anoraks may be called for. (Hatton for viewpoint chosen or Berris for style, but still a troubling, familiar yet abstract blemish lingers ahead of that rear)
Edited by werks prototype, 28 February 2012 - 22:07.
#11039
Posted 28 February 2012 - 22:08
I'd say rear wheel detail too intricate for Cavara, but I am popping up to the loft to check through the booksOr, I can just about make out something lurking murkily ahead of the left rear. Cavara?
edit......Phew !!!!! thought I was losing touch. no there are two other 156 by Cavara in the 60 Vetturi ai Raggi X book, and they are typically two of his more or less
poorly proportioned works
I check Ibsen's index if they have been posted, else I'll be scanning come weekend
Edited by macoran, 28 February 2012 - 22:15.
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#11040
Posted 28 February 2012 - 22:17
I'd say rear wheel detail too intricate for Cavara, but I am popping up to the loft to check through the books
Ok. Case remains open. Awaiting your report!
Edit: The 1964 V8 F1 'Aero' that you first posted on page 57, Marc also backs up your instinct for Berris.
Edited by werks prototype, 28 February 2012 - 22:28.
#11041
Posted 28 February 2012 - 22:27
as per edit aboveOk. Case remains open. Awaiting your report!
...........and Hatton odds are dropping in my betshop !!!
#11042
Posted 28 February 2012 - 22:31
Edit: Now I'm thinking Hatton, because of the tyres.
How about we just say Berris drew the thing, Hatton did the wheels and Cavara signed it? eh?
Edited by werks prototype, 28 February 2012 - 22:43.
#11043
Posted 28 February 2012 - 22:41
Not sure, but good enough excuse to have another glass while pondering......I mean studying !!!I reckon you nailed it 45 minutes ago, Marc with Berris?
#11044
Posted 29 February 2012 - 01:47
Not sure, but good enough excuse to have another glass while pondering......I mean studying !!!
OK, I am going to muddy the waters here with a list of the Ferrari 156 illustrations that I have in my own personal index, without any of the pieces from this group added. The year and designation is just what I pulled when I was listing them, so it could actually be different, of course. There will be overlap, be assured.
Allington: 1962 Ferrari 156 ... from The Grand Prix Car 1954-1966. Definitely not an Allington piece here.
Bazallo: 1961 Ferrari 156 ... from Quattroruote Ferrari F1 1948-1963. Some kind of special edition. I show it as a b&w piece.
Berris: 1962 Ferrari 156 ... from Ferrari Racing Tradition. Does not look like a Berris piece.
Berris: 1964 Ferrari 156/64 Aero ... 1-1/2 Liter Grand Prix Racing: Whitelock. Considering ... maybe this one afterall.
Betti (Bruno): Ferrari 156/65 ... Quattroruote Special Sport 1965. Think this one was color, and very different angle.
Cavara: 1960 Ferrari 156 ... Italian Auto Club. Not that one.
Cavara: 1961 Ferrari 156 120° V6 ... Italian Auto Club. Not this one.
Cavara: 1961 Ferrari 156 ... Italian Auto Club. Nope.
D'Alessio: 1961 Ferrari 156 .. Formula 1 2001. Definitely not his style.
Ferguson: 1961 Ferrari 156/61 ... 1-1/2 Liter Grand Prix Racing: Whitelock. Not the Ferguson style.
Ferguson: 1963 Ferrari 156/63 ... 1-1/2 Liter Grand Prix Racing: Whitelock. Not the Ferguson style.
Unsigned: 1963 Ferrari 156 ... Ferrari Monoposto-Alfieri. Back to the mystery ...
So, that is my listing of Ferrari 156 cutaways. Anyone have any suggestions?
Time to change the image again, too ... gotta have some fun.
Tom West
#11045
Posted 29 February 2012 - 02:02
OK, I am going to muddy the waters here with a list of the Ferrari 156 illustrations that I have in my own personal index, without any of the pieces from this group added. The year and designation is just what I pulled when I was listing them, so it could actually be different, of course. There will be overlap, be assured.
Berris: 1964 Ferrari 156/64 Aero ... 1-1/2 Liter Grand Prix Racing: Whitelock. Considering ... maybe this one afterall.
Back to the mystery ...
So, that is my listing of Ferrari 156 cutaways. Anyone have any suggestions?
Time to change the image again, too ... gotta have some fun.
Tom West
There is definitely something about the Berris 'Aero' semi-monocoque Ferrari, Tom. Three of us have noticed that now (you included), so a pattern is forming. (The version of the 'Aero' that I have, unfortunately doesn't have a shadow, that would have been handy, if a little inconclusive).
Edited by werks prototype, 29 February 2012 - 02:19.
#11047
Posted 01 March 2012 - 11:30
Artist?
#11048
Posted 01 March 2012 - 12:15
Studio Collins, I think.Haven't seen this one here before. Four cylinder turbo from the Sierra/Escort Cosworth.
Artist?
#11049
Posted 01 March 2012 - 14:03
http://www.autodiva....p...69&start=40
Success for all
#11050
Posted 01 March 2012 - 14:14
Success for all
Edited by Motocar, 02 March 2012 - 16:45.