You're right. It's often a good sign when the car sheds a lot of bodyparts, because they take a lot of energy, which could be put on a driver's body otherwise.I think it's because crashes in which the car spins, sheds bodyparts, spins again, and soforth look more dangerous because they look spectacular. But with an accident like this - and like that of Dale Earnhardt, which also looked relatively calm - all the energy of the crash is channeled to one moment.
Allan Simonsen RIP
Started by
FLB
, Jun 22 2013 16:00
224 replies to this topic
#51
Anderis
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Posted 22 June 2013 - 17:38
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#52
Coral
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Posted 22 June 2013 - 17:39
Oh no, what terrible news. You just don't expect things like that to happen any more...RIP. 
#53
Boxerevo
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Posted 22 June 2013 - 17:39
Yes,the worse situation.all the energy of the crash is channeled to one moment.
#54
404KF2
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Posted 22 June 2013 - 17:46
Very sad. Condolences to his family.
#55
ANF
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Posted 22 June 2013 - 17:47
Onboard from the second car behind Simonsen gives a better understanding of the impact. http://youtu.be/Pg_oqa7ovLs?t=46s
#57
Teapot
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Posted 22 June 2013 - 17:59
Onboard from the second car behind Simonsen gives a better understanding of the impact. http://youtu.be/Pg_oqa7ovLs?t=46s
It looks like he hit the barriers sideways...I'm afraid some investigation over the state of that barrier is due: it shouldn't have buckled so much to allow the car to hit those trees...
#58
Myrvold
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Posted 22 June 2013 - 18:00
It looks like he hit the barriers sideways...I'm afraid some investigation over the state of that barrier is due: it shouldn't have buckled so much to allow the car to hit those trees...
Then again, it looks like he hits it on the right side, driver sits on the left.
#59
olliek88
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Posted 22 June 2013 - 18:08
The theory about the tree, seems partly unlikely now, as the car hit the barrier on the right side, and the driver sits on left. It seems more likely that it was internal, not external that caused this.
Not necessarily, for big impacts where there's a close to instant deceleration (which may be the case if the car did strike a tree behind the barrier) internal organs can go into shock and just cease to work, the UK TV programme "5th Gear" covered it many years ago.
Its all irrelevant conjecture for now though, i'm sure the ACO will get to the bottom of it and take appropriate action.
Edited by olliek88, 22 June 2013 - 18:08.
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#60
Myrvold
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Posted 22 June 2013 - 18:09
Ye, with external, I was mainly thinking of the driver actually making contact with the tree.Not necessarily, for big impacts where there's a close to instant deceleration (which may be the case if the car did strike a tree behind the barrier) internal organs can to go into shock and just cease to work, the UK TV programme "5th Gear" covered it many years ago.
Its all irrelevant conjecture for now though, i'm sure the ACO will get to the bottom of it and take appropriate action.
It is, it's just a part of my reaction to such news. Sadness, then a curiosity to find out what happened. Sorry if this offends anyone, it's my way of dealing with these situations.
#61
olliek88
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Posted 22 June 2013 - 18:12
Ye, with external, I was mainly thinking of the driver actually making contact with the tree.
It is, it's just a part of my reaction to such news. Sadness, then a curiosity to find out what happened. Sorry if this offends anyone, it's my way of dealing with these situations.
Oh i wasn't implying that you were being offensive or anything, its a natural reaction to find out how/why a tragedy like this happened.
#62
muramasa
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Posted 22 June 2013 - 18:16
If it did hit tree, the (lack of) barrier there and safety standard should be put into question. It's (kind of) exit of corner but if car goes straight there, it would most likely impact the armco at quite a steep angle, so there should be tyre barrier or cushion.
One hour of repairing work suggested the impact and damage was extremely severe and eventually justified in worst way, also the car didnt travel much from impact point. Actually everything pointed to one thing. how terrible.
If there were barrier/cushion there, he could've been saved. Will wait for detailed investigation, but what a shame is totally understatement.
#64
aray
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Posted 22 June 2013 - 18:25
RIP...time and again it reminds us how fatal the sports we cheer for can be....
#66
dweller23
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Posted 22 June 2013 - 19:58
Damn, second fatal accident today. First the poor fellow at Nordschleife, now Simonsen... My thoughts are with his family. 
#67
Myrvold
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Posted 22 June 2013 - 20:13
Damn, second fatal accident today. First the poor fellow at Nordschleife, now Simonsen... My thoughts are with his family.
The VLN one was a heart attack, and not a crash, in case of people wondering. Wolf Silvester is the guy, he was 55yo.
#68
Nobody
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Posted 22 June 2013 - 20:36
RIP
Edited by Nobody, 22 June 2013 - 20:36.
#69
Desdirodeabike
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Posted 22 June 2013 - 21:11
Just about the worst news. I am a Dane myself and we generally love the Le Mans. Even if Tom Kristensen wins again this year, it will be with no joy.
Sov sødt, Allan. Jeg håber at du sover med englene. Hvil i fred.
Sov sødt, Allan. Jeg håber at du sover med englene. Hvil i fred.
#70
karne
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Posted 22 June 2013 - 21:20
Rest in Peace, Allen.
When I went to bed, I had heard he was conscious and ok. Then I opened Twitter this morning and...
When I went to bed, I had heard he was conscious and ok. Then I opened Twitter this morning and...
#71
pRy
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Posted 22 June 2013 - 21:21
Onboard from the second car behind Simonsen gives a better understanding of the impact. http://youtu.be/Pg_oqa7ovLs?t=46s
Yes the car spun and goes in backwards/side right side impact. But by the time the car comes to a rest on the track the left side door is gone. So something else has happened off camera, perhaps the car snapped back into the barrier after the initial impact.
#72
oetzi
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Posted 22 June 2013 - 21:21
It takes a brave man to do Le Mans. RIP.
#76
dweller23
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Posted 22 June 2013 - 22:33
Looking from Corvette onboard, it seems that had there been normal, non-tarmac run-off, he'd be ok, stopped by gravel trap. Those tarmac run-offs are deathtraps, just look how Natascha Gachnang was "lucky" at Abu Dhabi to "only" break her legs...
#77
Myrvold
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Posted 22 June 2013 - 22:39
Just about the worst news. I am a Dane myself and we generally love the Le Mans. Even if Tom Kristensen wins again this year, it will be with no joy.
Sov sødt, Allan. Jeg håber at du sover med englene. Hvil i fred.
Ouch, being Norwegian, I understood your last sentence, that made quite an impact on me. Don't know why, felt even more sad reading it in Danish
Yes the car spun and goes in backwards/side right side impact. But by the time the car comes to a rest on the track the left side door is gone. So something else has happened off camera, perhaps the car snapped back into the barrier after the initial impact.
Ye, but from the Vette onboard, it kinda looks like it bounces out again, not into a new spin. It¨s weird. But is it possible that such a hit can wreck the whole car just by the force?
Looking from Corvette onboard, it seems that had there been normal, non-tarmac run-off, he'd be ok, stopped by gravel trap. Those tarmac run-offs are deathtraps, just look how Natascha Gachnang was "lucky" at Abu Dhabi to "only" break her legs...
You want to dig up, and make a gravel-trap where there are a normal road the rest of the year? This is one of the big dangers by using normal roads in racing.
#78
Jazza
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Posted 22 June 2013 - 22:42
Looking from Corvette onboard, it seems that had there been normal, non-tarmac run-off, he'd be ok, stopped by gravel trap. Those tarmac run-offs are deathtraps, just look how Natascha Gachnang was "lucky" at Abu Dhabi to "only" break her legs...
Perhaps, but that part is not a tar run off. Instead, that is the normal road that gets used the rest of the year. It is where the race track meets the public part of the circuit. It never has or could be gravel at that point.
#79
dweller23
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Posted 22 June 2013 - 23:02
Apologies, I thought it was a part of the circuit segment. I'm shocked as much as pretty much everyone is.
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#80
krapmeister
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Posted 22 June 2013 - 23:14
Horrible news to wake up to this morning
I had a bad feeling about it watching last night, especially when they took the car back to parc ferme under a tarp and then - apart from hearing he was conscious - no further news on his condition by the time I went to bed 3hrs into the race.
RIP
I had a bad feeling about it watching last night, especially when they took the car back to parc ferme under a tarp and then - apart from hearing he was conscious - no further news on his condition by the time I went to bed 3hrs into the race.
RIP
#81
Myrvold
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Posted 22 June 2013 - 23:42
Apologies, I thought it was a part of the circuit segment. I'm shocked as much as pretty much everyone is.
An easy mistake to make. Sorry if I came across as a bit harsh.
#82
Seano
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Posted 23 June 2013 - 00:32
A dreadful and shocking accident.
I don't follow this type of racing but the rear end of the car did seem a little unstable prior to the crash. Tarmac, kerbs or gravel can cause different problems where a car gets loose at speed, there's no one size that fits all and in all weathers.
RIP Allan.
Seano
I don't follow this type of racing but the rear end of the car did seem a little unstable prior to the crash. Tarmac, kerbs or gravel can cause different problems where a car gets loose at speed, there's no one size that fits all and in all weathers.
RIP Allan.
Seano
#83
BCM
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Posted 23 June 2013 - 01:05
Why do they paint the outside of corners like that?
Moisture + painted surfaces is like driving on ice. And the transition from grip to no grip is instant. Allan got his rear left onto the blue painted area on exit and as soon as he hits the throttle it spits him off with zero chance of recovery.
The outside of the corner was already paved. Seems like a very strange thing to do from a safety point of view.
Moisture + painted surfaces is like driving on ice. And the transition from grip to no grip is instant. Allan got his rear left onto the blue painted area on exit and as soon as he hits the throttle it spits him off with zero chance of recovery.
The outside of the corner was already paved. Seems like a very strange thing to do from a safety point of view.
#85
PLAYLIFE
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Posted 23 June 2013 - 01:49
Very sad news.
As someone mentioned earlier, he was known to Aussie here since he raced in our GT Championship and would make yearly appearances at V8 Supercar enduros like Sandown and Bathurst. Saw him race many times at Albert Park. He lists Le Sarthe as his favourite circuit in the world.
Condolences to his family and friends.
He leaves behind partner Carina and a child born in 2012
As someone mentioned earlier, he was known to Aussie here since he raced in our GT Championship and would make yearly appearances at V8 Supercar enduros like Sandown and Bathurst. Saw him race many times at Albert Park. He lists Le Sarthe as his favourite circuit in the world.
Condolences to his family and friends.
He leaves behind partner Carina and a child born in 2012
#86
Eff One 2002
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Posted 23 June 2013 - 02:06
Tragic news. R.I.P. A sad reminder that every racing driver chooses their career on the understanding that death may choose them.
#87
NotSoSilentBob
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Posted 23 June 2013 - 02:44
RIP Allan Simonsen, an amazing driver who impressed all over the world didn't just confine his talents to Europe. The Australian racing community will be gutted.... he was very much admired down here, could drive anything fast and certainly did.
#88
Jimisgod
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Posted 23 June 2013 - 04:05
RIP
I think he hit something behind the guardrail. There should be tyres there anyway.
I think he hit something behind the guardrail. There should be tyres there anyway.
#89
sheepgobba
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Posted 23 June 2013 - 04:06
RIP
The accident from the videos just seem so odd :/
The accident from the videos just seem so odd :/
#90
Jimisgod
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Posted 23 June 2013 - 04:09
RIP
The accident from the videos just seem so odd :/
The accident itself wasn't very strange, but it shouldn't have been fatal. A better solution is needed for walls so close to the exit of corners.
#91
krapmeister
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Posted 23 June 2013 - 04:13
RIP
I think he hit something behind the guardrail. There should be tyres there anyway.
This.
If not tyres then some kind of soft barrier to cushion the blow...
#92
repcobrabham
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Posted 23 June 2013 - 04:42
RIP Allan Simonsen, an amazing driver who impressed all over the world didn't just confine his talents to Europe. The Australian racing community will be gutted.... he was very much admired down here, could drive anything fast and certainly did.
a huge loss for us. here's one of the many reasons he was so admired:
http://www.youtube.c...eature=youtu.be
RIP 'honorary aussie' allan simonsen
#93
V3TT3L
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Posted 23 June 2013 - 05:13
Simonsen was the 22nd driver to die in the event.
The last death occured in 1997, when french Sébastien Enjolras crashed his Welter LM97-Peugeot in practice sessions.
The last death occured in the main event/race was Jo Gartner in 1986. The Austriac crashed hisPorsche 962 at the Mulsanne straight.
The last death occured in 1997, when french Sébastien Enjolras crashed his Welter LM97-Peugeot in practice sessions.
The last death occured in the main event/race was Jo Gartner in 1986. The Austriac crashed hisPorsche 962 at the Mulsanne straight.
#94
bmardini
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Posted 23 June 2013 - 06:48
Looking at the way his Aston twitched, I suspect a puncture or a break in the suspension or steering. Kicking the rear out is one thing - but a driver of his level would have reflex-corrected that no problem. The sudden dive to the left (which ended in the wall) is suspicious. I think something broke.
RIP...
RIP...
#95
Nemo1965
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Posted 23 June 2013 - 07:40
Looking at the way his Aston twitched, I suspect a puncture or a break in the suspension or steering. Kicking the rear out is one thing - but a driver of his level would have reflex-corrected that no problem. The sudden dive to the left (which ended in the wall) is suspicious. I think something broke.
RIP...
I don't think so. It was the fourth lap, right? I don't know how many laps these cars can drive on a gallon, but my guess is the car was fully tanked. The rear kicks out, the driver gets of the throttle, applies opposite lock, the car rights itself... and then, because of the weight of the fuel and the length of the car, you get a weight transfer from the rear to the front, from the right-bank to left-front. And then car dives to the left, in a jerky, unexpected manner...
There is quite some footage from production cars racing crashing on the Nurburgring (Nordschleife), and there you often see this apparently strange veerrs after a correction...
#96
HuddersfieldTerrier1986
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Posted 23 June 2013 - 08:09
Whatever happened, it's a tragedy. The only positive, if you can say anything positive, is he died doing what he loved, driving racing cars. I expect we'll see a sombre podium with no real celebrations, champagne etc.
#97
olliek88
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Posted 23 June 2013 - 08:22
Looking at the way his Aston twitched, I suspect a puncture or a break in the suspension or steering. Kicking the rear out is one thing - but a driver of his level would have reflex-corrected that no problem. The sudden dive to the left (which ended in the wall) is suspicious. I think something broke.
RIP...
It had been raining, he ran wide onto the still damp and extremely slippery blue paint, the backend stepped out on him he corrected it but it gripped on him and snapped back the other way. Sadly it looks like driver error. A very similar thing has just put the #99 out of the race.
Edited by olliek88, 23 June 2013 - 08:22.
#98
Paul Parker
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Posted 23 June 2013 - 08:51
It had been raining, he ran wide onto the still damp and extremely slippery blue paint, the backend stepped out on him he corrected it but it gripped on him and snapped back the other way. Sadly it looks like driver error. A very similar thing has just put the #99 out of the race.
These painted track margins are lethal in wet/damp conditions as we know from experience and they've been around for years (somebody will know how many) but what purpose do they serve? Presumably they are an FIA obligation.
What makes this tragedy worse is the fact that we are all used to seeing drivers escape unharmed or lightly injured from massive high speed impacts, especially in F1, but the Aston looks as though it has collapsed structurally. What did it hit to cause this amount of damage?
My sincerest condolences to Allan's family, friends and colleagues.
#99
Peat
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Posted 23 June 2013 - 08:54
What makes this tragedy worse is the fact that we are all used to seeing drivers escape unharmed or lightly injured from massive high speed impacts, especially in F1, but the Aston looks as though it has collapsed structurally. What did it hit to cause this amount of damage?
A tree a few inches behind the armco. They don't budge. The roll cage was effectively split in half. Huge amount of energy going on in there, dreadful.
RIP Allan.
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#100
Paul Parker
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Posted 23 June 2013 - 09:08
A tree a few inches behind the armco. They don't budge. The roll cage was effectively split in half. Huge amount of energy going on in there, dreadful.
RIP Allan.
Thank you for the info Peat.
Given how they have turned the formerly forested Esses area into a desert why then are there trees adjacent to the armco elsewhere?
Of course this is motor racing and fatality levels are now thankfully very low but this inconsistency has cost a life, and apparently unnecessarily.
