Well, we 'ad it tough!

No real excuse really for starting this, except it certainly counts as nostalgia, and there are an awful lot of Monty Python fans on TNF. It's Jeremy Clarkson's piece in today's Sunday Times.

http://www.timesonli...icle6869288.ece

TW, you can bin this if you want to, after we've all had a quiet chuckle.

All together now, "There's nothing Nietzche couldn't teach ya 'bout the raising of the wrist. Socrates, himself, was permanently pissed..."

Terry Jones was on the radio this morning, and quite surprised me by saying that Python is much bigger in the USA than in the UK. In the USA he regularly gets recognised walking down the street, whereas this hardly ever happens in Britain.

...and apparently 'Holy Grail' has a much bigger fan base than 'Life of Brian', which surprised Micheal Palin, as he and the rest of the Pythons think Brian is a much better film. American religious sensibilities, perhaps...

it IS a much better film!

I thought it might improve my opinion of Clarkson, but it doesn't (and I've worked with him!).

I'd like to see John the Baptist's impression of Graham Hill.

Headmaster: Right, it's come to my notice that certain boys have been running a unit-trust linked assurance scheme with fringe benefits and full cash-in endowment facilities. Apparently small investors were attracted by the wide-ranging portfolio and that in the first week the limited offer was oversubscribed eight times.
Stebbins: It was Tidwell's idea, sir.
Headmaster: Shut up, Stebbins! I haven't finished. Oh, by the way, congratulations on winning the Italian Grand Prix at Monza.
Stebbins: Thank you, sir.

Funnily enough, I can't find Stebbins in the Black Books

I thought it might improve my opinion of Clarkson, but it doesn't (and I've worked with him!).

The article didn't improve my opinion of Clarkson either (and I've never met the man). It did remind me, however, of seeing the wonderful "First Farewell Tour" at Manchester Opera House. The programmes were all poster-sized with all the pages printed on one side of heavy-duty paper, so you can imagine a thousand or so people trying to read them in their seats. There was also an exceptionally foul-mouthed version of the "Albatross sketch" at the interval, with Terry Jones sat amongst us receiving dog's abuse from Cleese, the Usherette.
When the final curtain fell, the legend "Piss Off" was projected on to it. My main recollection of "Life Of Brian" is going to the opening night on Deansgate and arguing with the god botherers picketing the showing. Great times.

Funnily enough, I can't find Stebbins in the Black Books

Can be found on TNF though...

http://forums.autosp...amp;hl=Stebbins

I thought it might improve my opinion of Clarkson, but it doesn't (and I've worked with him!).

Not exactly conclusive, but for what it's worth, I have a nephew who works in TV, and he told me that Jeremy Clarkson was a good bloke, a real professional and a pleasure to work with. JC came out very well in comparison with several other well-known 'celebs', whose names I was asked not to mention, but one with the initials TW came in for the heaviest criticism.

I keep getting this feeling of déja vu ....

I keep getting this feeling of déja vu ....

I keep getting this feeling of déja vu ....

Can be found on TNF though...

http://forums.autosp...amp;hl=Stebbins

On which thread Ensign made exactly the same post in 2003!

I value consistency.

it IS a much better film!

Quite agree, it has moments that still make me laugh out loud, but 'Grail' is a bit clunky. Having said that, 'Come back and fight, you coward!' springs to mind...

[/quote]Headmaster: Shut up, Stebbins! I haven't finished. Oh, by the way, congratulations on winning the Italian Grand Prix at Monza. [/quote]

Always remember being quite freaked out by that - after all it was late at night for a youngster to be concentrating...

But does anybody remember the Terry Gilliam cartoon that had the Fred Saunders F5000 Crossle in it... ???

...and apparently 'Holy Grail' has a much bigger fan base than 'Life of Brian', which surprised Micheal Palin, as he and the rest of the Pythons think Brian is a much better film. American religious sensibilities, perhaps...

The Holy Grail was bigger in Oz too, as at that time Monty Python was very big on TV wheras by the time the Life of Brian came out I dont think they were on TV anymore.
I liked both the movies but was never that keen on the TV series. A little too silly and disjointed for my taste though it had its moments. Life of Brian caused its own deliberate publicity with its subject matter, that made more publicity then the movie!

I value consistency.

From a Birmingham City Fan?

From a Birmingham City Fan?

Go on then, spoil the thread...

From a Birmingham City Fan?

You draw some, you lose some.

I was living in the USA when Holy Grail came out and I noticed that bits I laughed most at left US cinema goers (in suburban Pennsylvania at least) bemused and bits I found weak or too silly had them rolling in the aisles. It wasn't things only someone from the UK would understand, it was a totally different humour in many cases.
The real downside was that, for months afterwards, whenever I asked for something in a shop or fast food joint etc, female staff would call their colleagues over with "Hey....come and listen to this guy, he sounds just like Monty Python!".

...and apparently 'Holy Grail' has a much bigger fan base than 'Life of Brian', which surprised Micheal Palin, as he and the rest of the Pythons think Brian is a much better film. American religious sensibilities, perhaps...

I don't think those of us here in the states who are Python fans are bothered by religious sensibilities . I think it might be due to air time . I've seen Holy Grail probably a dozen times , but can only remember seeing Life of Brian once .

It's a bit ironic this thread coming up , as my local PBS station , the same one who introduced Monty Python to the US , has been having a Python marathon this weekend . There was a good "documentary" type program on last night , "Monty Python - Before and After , in which they told of how they all came together and early years . Quite interesting .

I don't think those of us here in the states who are Python fans are bothered by religious sensibilities . I think it might be due to air time . I've seen Holy Grail probably a dozen times , but can only remember seeing Life of Brian once .

Python fans might not be bothered by religious sensibilities, but a lot of your countrymen appear to be. "Creation", a highly-praised new film about the life of Charles Darwin, has been turned down by every US distributor:

http://www.telegraph...us-America.html

That's probably why you "can only remember seeing Life of Brian once." Even PBS probably aren't brave enough to show it - the major networks wouldn't even consider it.

"He's not the Messiah - he's a very naughty boy!"

Quite agree, it has moments that still make me laugh out loud, but 'Grail' is a bit clunky. Having said that, 'Come back and fight, you coward!' springs to mind...

'I'll bite your legs off!'

I don't think those of us here in the states who are Python fans are bothered by religious sensibilities .

It wasn't meant as criticism, but Brian certainly caused a bit of a stir amongst some members of the church in the UK.

I saw "The life of Brian" some 15 years ago and enjoyed it.
Saw it again lst week and am still wondering how could I like that stuff.
There are a few good moments, but mostly the acting is awful, and the gags are over stirred. Looks like a bunch of teenagers wrote it.

Edited by Paolo, 12 October 2009 - 12:03.

At the risk of being stwuck very rufwly to the ground, can I be the first to point out that the "Four Yorkshiremen" sketch pre-dates Python?

It wasn't meant as criticism, but Brian certainly caused a bit of a stir amongst some members of the church in the UK.

So was the case in Holland. It only generated free publicity for the movie.

There are a few good moments, but mostly the acting is awful, and the gags are over stirred. Looks like a bunch of teenagers wrote it.

Here I disagree to the fullest.

Python fans might not be bothered by religious sensibilities, but a lot of your countrymen appear to be. "Creation", a highly-praised new film about the life of Charles Darwin, has been turned down by every US distributor:

http://www.telegraph...us-America.html

That's probably why you "can only remember seeing Life of Brian once." Even PBS probably aren't brave enough to show it - the major networks wouldn't even consider it.

"He's not the Messiah - he's a very naughty boy!"

Bingo! I think Richard's reasoning on the absence of Life of Brian from the box in the US is spot on. Stupid religious morons - have to wonder what they're so afraid of.

However, put me down as one of those who favours Holy Grail over Life of Brian. However, I did see Life of Brian again recently and enjoyed it - possibly because it's been so long since I last watched it.

Neil

At the risk of being stwuck very rufwly to the ground, can I be the first to point out that the "Four Yorkshiremen" sketch pre-dates Python?

Tell that to the kids of today and they won't believe yer!

Python fans might not be bothered by religious sensibilities, but a lot of your countrymen appear to be. "Creation", a highly-praised new film about the life of Charles Darwin, has been turned down by every US distributor:

http://www.telegraph...us-America.html

That's probably why you "can only remember seeing Life of Brian once." Even PBS probably aren't brave enough to show it - the major networks wouldn't even consider it.

"He's not the Messiah - he's a very naughty boy!"

It wasn't meant as criticism, but Brian certainly caused a bit of a stir amongst some members of the church in the UK.

I didn't take it as a criticism . And I'm sure if it were released today , The Life of Brian would cause a stir , and probably protest . But I don't remember any repercussions when it was first out . Monty Python has always had a rather large "cult" following here , and those outside that circle don't seem to care or care to understand what's going on there . I think they have pretty much flown under the radar here .

And I doubt PBS would be reluctant to show it . They wouldn't be taking near as much a chance as they did back in the early 70's by showing Monty Python , uncut and uncensored , in the heart of conservatism , Dallas Texas . But that being said , I have to assume those who would have protested at the time simply didn't understand what it was about , and or didn't watch it long enough to know there was reason to be concerned . But the fact they don't show Life of Brian often could be simply due to it not being as popular as Grail . And just last week I was watching a PBS /"Nova" movie type documentary on Charles Darwin that leaned heavily towrds the religious implications and impact of his theories , so I don't think PBS has that fear .

As far as the major networks here in the states , well , they didn't understand that style of comedy . John Cleese was mentioning this very point in the show I refered to earlier . The major network shows , he said , would tell you there is a joke coming , explain the joke to you , then tell you when to laugh . And I'm sure the "Big Three" networks here would be reluctant to take on any Python material if for no other reason that the failed attempt by ABC to air a censored , redacted version of Python late at night , which resulted in the Python clan sueing them and winning due to a clause that Terry Jones was clever enough to include in their contract that the shows must be aired in their entirety .

Sorry, I'm such a total Python fan that I would give Clarkson a good run for his money in reciting the sketches, films, and music (anyone had the pleasure of hearing the Oliver Cromwell song? Now that's the way to learn history!), but for me the funniest python was Michael Palin. He had the funniest scenes in Life of Brian ("Are they wagging me?"), and gave some achingly funny peformances in the "Ripping Yarns" series.

Anyone else out there seen Tom Parkinson's Schooldays and The Legend of Eric Olthwaite?

"Remember what yer Dad said before he died?"
"Oh yes. It was uuurrggghhhhhh...."

Anyone else out there seen Tom Parkinson's Schooldays and The Legend of Eric Olthwaite?

Tomkinson's Schooldays, surely? and ah, the Town Hall rain gauge ...

Not exactly conclusive, but for what it's worth, I have a nephew who works in TV, and he told me that Jeremy Clarkson was a good bloke, a real professional and a pleasure to work with. JC came out very well in comparison with several other well-known 'celebs', whose names I was asked not to mention, but one with the initials TW came in for the heaviest criticism.

My last three Top Gears were Clarkson's first three. Knew very little, had no feel for history, and technically inept (couldn't find or identify a battery!!!) Since then I have encountered him a few times, and every time a bit of a "do you know who I am" and a Diva. He might come out well in comparision! Now having also worked with Ray Baxter he was 150% a nice, informed, super knowledgable, down to earth bloke. Ate his bacon butties with the rest of us (none of JC's "send it to my caravan, and don't bother me afterwards"), maybe times have changed!

Anyway, blessed are the cheesemakers.................

Anyone else out there seen Tom Parkinson's Schooldays and The Legend of Eric Olthwaite?

A good black pudding is so black that even the white bits are black.

maybe times have changed!

Clarkson and Baxter - two different generations, much like their programmes. Top Gear is not meant to be serious or informative, as you know, unlike the type of motoring progs of yore. Initially I found Clarkson fairly tedious and sometimes offensive, but now, with the combination of presenters and, I assume, a bigger budget, I quite look forward to TG, and on occasions it is the funniest show of the week - at the moment, there's not much competition...

Clarkson - I would thwow him to the gwound...

Agree about Michael Palin, the funniest Python and the best broadcaster of that group.

My last three Top Gears were Clarkson's first three. Knew very little, had no feel for history, and technically inept (couldn't find or identify a battery!!!) Since then I have encountered him a few times, and every time a bit of a "do you know who I am" and a Diva. He might come out well in comparision! Now having also worked with Ray Baxter he was 150% a nice, informed, super knowledgable, down to earth bloke. Ate his bacon butties with the rest of us (none of JC's "send it to my caravan, and don't bother me afterwards"), maybe times have changed!

Anyway, blessed are the cheesemakers.................

I'm a bit out of my depth here, I've never met either Clarkson or Baxter, so I suppose I shouldn't really express an opinion on them, but JC has always seemed like a 'good bloke' to me, as did Raymond Baxter to a lesser extent. However, a year or two ago, I read Baxter's autobiography, or rather I struggled through the first few chapters, then skimmed through the rest trying to find interesting bits, and there weren't too many of those. Clearly the written word isn't to be relied on, as I formed a mild dislike for the man, as did two others who read the book after me. Yes, I know it's illogical, disliking someone you only 'know' through a book, but there it is, all the fault of the media. As for Michael Palin, I'd agree that he seems to be another 'good bloke', and certainly a talented broadcaster, as like him or not, is Jeremy. Michael P lived most of his life in Whitworth Crescent Sheffield, a few hundred yards from where I spent my formative years, while Clarkson was born on Sheffield's outskirts, he says Doncaster but I'd have said Rotherham was nearer, but as I said earlier, I never met either of them. So much for my opinion then , but I still think you're being a little hard on Clarkson.

Sorry, I'm such a total Python fan that I would give Clarkson a good run for his money in reciting the sketches, films, and music (anyone had the pleasure of hearing the Oliver Cromwell song? Now that's the way to learn history!), but for me the funniest python was Michael Palin. He had the funniest scenes in Life of Brian ("Are they wagging me?"), and gave some achingly funny peformances in the "Ripping Yarns" series.

Anyone else out there seen Tom Parkinson's Schooldays and The Legend of Eric Olthwaite?

"Tomkinson's Schooldays" and "The Testing of Eric Olthwaite" . Also, "The Ballad of Oliver Cromwell" pre-dates Python, being from the radio show "I'm Sorry, I'll Read That Again". I'd leave it a week or two before taking on Clarkson My favourite "Ripping Yarn" is "Golden Gordon", and the useless, useless bastards of Barnstoneworth United. I wonder if Palin deliberately put them in the red and white striped shirts and black shorts of Sheffield United, as he is a Wednesday fan.

Surely Clarkson has a point though. I wanted to replace my worn out copy of that Ustinov masterpiece, "The Grand Prix du Roc". I see it is now unashamedly called "The Grand Prix of Gibraltar". Not only the disc has been digitally remastered it seems. On a second point, I've often wondered why Michael Palin previously owned one of my cars. He never struck me as a racing car person.

Edited by lowdrag, 14 October 2009 - 06:33.

I wonder if Palin deliberately put them in the red and white striped shirts and black shorts of Sheffield United, as he is a Wednesday fan.

I'm pretty sure he's on record as saying that he did. Another little known fact about Sheffield man Michael Palin CBE is that he's had an asteroid and two railway trains named after him, though modern multiple unit thingies unfortunately, not proper engines.

While Python may have broken new ground and set new standards, I have always felt that some of the post-Python material - Ripping Yarns and Fawlty Towers in particular - is in fact better.

And I agree about Michael Palin. He is a charming man, to quote Morrisey. Sorry to brag, but when dining at the Coupole in Paris one evening, he was sitting just a couple of tables away. I mustered up my courage and went to shake his hand, worried that he would be bothered by yet another punter distracting him from his oysters. But not at all. He was most amenable and we chatted away for a good few minutes. Mind you, I did butter him up by saying that he starred in one of the greatest films ever made - Brazil - and that "The Curse of the Claw" almost made me suffocate with laughter.

Edward

Edited by SEdward, 14 October 2009 - 14:11.

I'm a bit out of my depth here, I've never met either Clarkson or Baxter, so I suppose I shouldn't really express an opinion on them...

Blimey, Rob! If we are limited to expressing opinions on only those people we have met, it's going to be a dull old time! Well, for me, anyway, having met so few... People who seek and exploit 'celebrity' status to a greater or lesser degree have to expect mere mortals to gossip about them, and judge their character, rightly or wrongly. I try not to be too critical of personalities even if I cannot stand their public persona, but some do annoy excessively, others are obviously complete ... well, what can I say. The vast majority I either like, or have no real oppinion on.

I did have a short list, once, of people I detested without ever having met them. This was important, that I must not have ever met them. Top of the list was Karl-Heinze Rummenigge...

"Rummenigge, Rummenigge, sexy knees..."

I'd recommend any Python fan to have a look at Michael Palin's "Diaries - 1969-1979". It's a fascinating read, full of anecdotes and very insightful comments.

I don't think Palin's the outright funniest Python (can't decide between Chapman and Cleese on that) but "Ripping Yarns" was hilarious and I do enjoy his travel shows. Terry Jones is kind of the invisible Python but deserves a great deal of kudos as he wrote (or co-wrote w/Palin) most of the best stuff they did...

Edited by EcosseF1, 15 October 2009 - 02:22.

On a second point, I've often wondered why Michael Palin previously owned one of my cars. He never struck me as a racing car person.

That comment from lowdrag made me think of Michael Palin as the car-obsessed loony in Murder at Moorstones Manor, another classic Ripping Yarns. That was just hysterical: Dora (fiancee): "Choose between me and your car!" Hugo (Palin): "OK!" - and drives off into the distance leaving her standing in the middle of the moors. I also have acquired one of the great lines from that episode in my common parlance - "What he needs is a damn good thrashing!" with reference to pratically everyone that slightly pisses you off.

Yes, got the titles wrong for Tomkinson's Schooldays and The Testing of Eric Olthwaite, thanks for the corrections from Slurp1955 (intriguing user name!) and Odseybod. That's the problem with getting ancient, you suffer from memory loss, not to mention arthritis, hair falling out, loose teeth, and memory loss.

Anyone want to discuss shovels at all?

I don't think Palin's the outright funniest Python (can't decide between Chapman and Cleese on that)

Purely personal taste of course, but as performers I thought that Palin and Idle were the best, I never liked Cleese and Chapman quite as much. What I think many of us tend to forget is that much of the show material was really rather weak, which is why it's hardly ever repeated today, we just see the same comedy classics over and over again, which is fine with me. I can remember sitting through Monty Python shows barely cracking a smile, and then a piece of pure comic genius like The Philosophers' Song came along, and that made up for everything. Next day, friends would come up and say things like "Did you see Python last night, Heidegger Heidegger was a boozy beggar...", so it's not just my sense of humour. I have to admit though, that I was at uni in those days, my friends were fellow students, and we all wanted to show that we knew who Heidegger was.

♫ "Immanuel Kant was a real pissant..." ♫

Though since I never met Immanuel Kant (1724-1804), and guided by the categorical imperative, I can't really express an opinion...

I have to admit though, that I was at uni in those days, my friends were fellow students,

I remember once in 1966 when I was at uni, being puzzled when a large television lounge suddenly became heavily populated. Ten minutes later, it emptied again ... "Magic Roundabout" had ended.

Hmmm, but more often than not, the shows had this amazing 'stream of consciousness', which may not always have been downright funny, but would still leave me watching in astonishment.

'No more buttered scones for me, mater, I'm ohf to play the grahnd piano'

Though since I never met Immanuel Kant (1724-1804), and guided by the categorical imperative, I can't really express an opinion...

Not even a teeny weeny one?