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F1 attempts to return to the USA

Started by rmac923 , Mar 14 2010 19:50

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293 replies to this topic

#151 Henrytheeigth

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Posted 04 May 2010 - 10:24

Please go back to Indy FFS!

#152 Captain Tightpants

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Posted 04 May 2010 - 10:40

True. I just think that the perimiter road looks like a fantastic circuit that we could end up missing out on.

Well, I don't actually mind the top half at all. Even with that sharp bend in there, it's got a kind of flow about it. The bottom half could be better, but I expect that with the corners being so close together, the FIA will have something to say about it.

Please go back to Indy FFS!

The most boring circuit short of Valencia? Surely you jest!

#153 Henrytheeigth

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Posted 04 May 2010 - 10:55

The most boring circuit short of Valencia? Surely you jest!

I have a court jester for that lol. No mate, I have enjoyed each and every USGP there. Sure it aint like the great old days at the Glen, but sure as heck beats Valencia! I love watching F1 there, and racing it in sims. I guess if there is a better alternative then I'd have to support it, but it was fine and why go elsewhere really. I mean it was fine for me, just my opinion.

#154 August

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Posted 04 May 2010 - 19:43

I'd love to see Indy back in F1. Turn 13 was unique in F1. With some modifications it could be a lot better circuit than it was. Maybe the oval's back straight could be used with oval's turn 3 leading onto it. That would create a good overtaking spot.

#155 nordschleife

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Posted 04 May 2010 - 22:21

I actually prefer the circuit made up by the roads that are highlighted in pink.
It seems that circuit designers these days try to put too many corners in. If they just followed the layout of the existing roads it would be fantastic.

Agreed.

#156 Jones Foyer

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Posted 04 May 2010 - 23:02

Just run F1 on the oval. All the way. I'd love to see it.

#157 Captain Tightpants

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 08:03

Monticello Motor Club make a bid.

Posted Image

Hotlap

#158 JPW

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 08:57

Interesting, it's easy to see why Bernie would consider this the "right" crowd and the 'right" people.

Still don't think these people realise what it would take to get their track, facilities and infrastructure suitable for the F1 circus and lets say 50.000 people. It would ruin their club completely, if I were a member I wouldn't be too enthusiastic about this.

But have to say it is a nice track.

#159 One

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 09:06

Monticello Motor Club
Hotlap

Lots of mid speed corners and little ev differences....?

#160 PayasYouRace

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 09:10

That's an interesting circuit. A bit different from what there is on the calender. They'd need to put a lot of upgrades in though. It doesn't even have a full size pitlane at the moment.

#161 phil1993

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 09:12

Track looks nice but by no means F1 standard - too narrow

#162 sosidge

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 09:24

Monticello Motor Club make a bid.

Hotlap

The impression I get is of a VERY nice club track - reminds me of Oulton Park in the UK a little from the onboards with the trees and constant elevation changes. If you were being romantic you could call it a mini-Nurburgring - but I won't!

That being said, it looks narrow from the wheel of a fast road car, and even it's most significant straight has a big kink in it. I can't imagine that it would become F1 standard without a major widening programme and the reprofiling of the main straight with a pit complex alongside. So much of the charm would be lost.

However, it would be great to see F1 back in the US on a decent track. If F1 is truly a global sport, it needs to be in the world's biggest market, even if most American's would rather be watching NASCAR.

#163 Captain Tightpants

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 10:06

Could we maybe get the thread title changed? We were discussing Indianapolis, but then the thread became the de facto home for discussing the future of the USGP when the Jersey proposal came up, and now we're talking Monticello (largely because this was the only thread that I could remember that discussed the future of the USGP).

#164 One

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 10:06

There is one article on this news site.

Tilke was there.;)

He spoke about some upgrades.

Another Captains Predictioon. Captain is an :wave:

insider.

#165 One

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 10:07

Could we maybe get the thread title changed? We were discussing Indianapolis, but then the thread became the de facto home for discussing the future of the USGP when the Jersey proposal came up, and now we're talking Monticello (largely because this was the only thread that I could remember that discussed the future of the USGP).

Like Berni and Mario working on USGP?

Edited by One, 21 May 2010 - 10:07.

#166 Captain Tightpants

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 10:08

Another Captains Predictioon. Captain is an insider.

Nope, Captain just has a quicker draw than anyone else.

Also, I've been terribly bored for the past six weeks and haven't had much else to do.

#167 One

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 10:11

O my second visit to the youtube film, I see more ups and downs... What is the lap time prediction?

#168 Captain Tightpants

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 10:11

Like Berni and Mario working on USGP?

There's been nothing to indicate Andretti was involved in the Jersey bid, and while he's featured in the videos on the MMC website, he seems to be there to give them credibility; that video was made two years ago at least.

#169 One

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 10:12

Nope, Captain just has a quicker draw than anyone else.

Also, I've been terribly bored for the past six weeks and haven't had much else to do.

So you get tweets of Tilke? I got Bernie's butBernie's last awas wabout his wig,... wrong one I assume. FLav on his tweet said he will be back. :lol:

#170 Captain Tightpants

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 10:14

So you get tweets of Tilke? I got Bernie's butBernie's last awas wabout his wig,... wrong one I assume. FLav on his tweet said he will be back.

I don't Twitter.

Can I use "Twitter" as a verb?

#171 One

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 10:15

No that will be to tweet, as they say.

BTW the image you posted, is this what Tilke think of it, no as there is no start/finish complex etc. Will that be on the Shorter straight? I think so.

#172 One

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 10:16

Now the title is F1 attemtpt to return to USA

#173 steveninthematrix

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 10:16

personally, I'm for back to back to back three race american tour of F1

Indy , Montreal, Monticello...

over three weekends, get some buzz and excitement going, etc

in the early 80's, there were three USA F1 gps, if i recall, they were called the west, midwest, and east US F1 GP races....,

C'mon Bernie, make it happen.... F1 should be in the USA, and I think two races would be good for the show, as long as the tracks are very different to each other,

Indy and Road America?

Indy and Watkins Glen?

Indy and Laguna Seca?

Indy and Infineon?

#174 One

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 10:27

That is a wild thoughts.

Three races at once makes better chance for F1 to root in USA?

What then the race will be called?

Pacific GP for Laguna Seca
US GP for MMC?

And the third...

#175 Captain Tightpants

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 10:33

BTW the image you posted, is this what Tilke think of it, no as there is no start/finish complex etc. Will that be on the Shorter straight? I think so.

Actually, that's the image that appears on the MMC official website. It was just hosted on another and I posted it here. The current Start/Finish Line is indeed on the shorter straight, but there's nothing to stop it being moved to one of the longer ones. If push comes to shove, they could always build it along the back stright. Having seen videos of the circuit - Keith Collantine has updated the story on F1 Fanatic to include a high-quality video - it'll need to be widened and smoothed out a little first.

C'mon Bernie, make it happen.... F1 should be in the USA, and I think two races would be good for the show, as long as the tracks are very different to each other,

Why should America be entitled to two races when they can barely organise one? There are no American drivers, teams or World Champions - and that's the only reason why Spain got two. The assumption that America is deserving of two races simply because it's America reeks of the stereotypical arrogance that has given America as a nation a worldwide reputation.

Indy and Road America?

Indy and Laguna Seca?

Indy and Infineon?

Indy is rubbish. Elevation changes disqualify Laguna Seca and Sears Point, while a lack of room for run-off area disqualifies Road America.

#176 One

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 11:08

There is no track shot on Google...?

67 Cantrell Road
Monticello, NY 12701

#177 zeph

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 11:12

I would LOVE to see F1 return to Long Beach. Finally a GP within driving distance. And another street track would be a welcome addition to the current calendar.

#178 Captain Tightpants

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 11:13

There is no track shot on Google...?

67 Cantrell Road
Monticello, NY 12701

MMC was built after the Gogle Maps photos were taken.

#179 SeanValen

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 11:13

Track seems interesting enough.

#180 rmac923

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 11:26

There's been nothing to indicate Andretti was involved in the Jersey bid, and while he's featured in the videos on the MMC website, he seems to be there to give them credibility; that video was made two years ago at least.

I asked the Mods WEEKS AGO to change the thread name (since I don't think I can), after I misread the article. :rotfl:

Happy it was finally changed, though I surprised it took more than 2 months.

#181 pRy

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 11:37

It's just another Donington, a dream that will never happen and perhaps used by Bernie as a negotiation tool. They'd be better taking a lot of money, a clear piece of land and building a brand new circuit.

#182 rmac923

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 11:46

Oh, the track itself:

It looks nice, obviously needs a bunch of upgrades. (Terraces, Garages, Parking-lot Runoffs :lol:

)

However, if this does go through, what I fear is that you have to be a $125,000 member to get in to the race.

Which would further the point of F1 being an elitist club. That will not help in attracting new American fans.

#183 One

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 11:48

It is not Donington as the owner refuses to give it up for sells to a race promoter. A worse case then?

But it looks lot more convincing that anywhere so far we have seen.

NYC track had that problem with environmentalists so would be far from being reachable at this very moment, I assume.

#184 Xpat

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 11:48

Why should America be entitled to two races when they can barely organise one? There are no American drivers, teams or World Champions - and that's the only reason why Spain got two. The assumption that America is deserving of two races simply because it's America reeks of the stereotypical arrogance that has given America as a nation a worldwide reputation.

Indy is rubbish. Elevation changes disqualify Laguna Seca and Sears Point, while a lack of room for run-off area disqualifies Road America.

Lol, please tell us what we can do to become deserving! :rolleyes:

You really do seem to have something stuck in your craw about Americans. Relax.

#185 One

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 11:48

Oh, the track itself:

It looks nice, obviously needs a bunch of upgrades. (Terraces, Garages, Parking-lot Runoffs )

However, if this does go through, what I fear is that you have to be a $125,000 member to get in to the race.

Which would further the point of F1 being an elitist club. That will not help in attracting new American fans.

Really.

That is sad. This club should be a better people tho for Bernie...

#186 Captain Tightpants

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 11:53

You really do seem to have something stuck in your craw about Americans. Relax.

I have nothing against Americans in general or in particular - I'm just wondering what it is that entites America to have two races when they have no representation on the grid.

#187 mtknot

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 12:06

Track looks slighly mickey mouse, but in a more classical and not tilke-ish way. They wont be able to do much without destroying a lot of the area around the track to fit the facilities in. To fit a paddock behind the pit boxes would require something like bridges...

Unless they use tunnels or something, its going to be difficult to fit these huge grandstands and buildings in.

#188 sblick

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 12:18

I have nothing against Americans in general or in particular - I'm just wondering what it is that entites America to have two races when they have no representation on the grid.

I think you need to see the sponsorship on the side of the car to get fair "representation" on the grid. There is probably a few hundred million dollars worth of sponsorship on the grid from US based companies. It used to be the car companies that wanted to be here, but with only Mercedes and Ferrari it doesn't really matter anymore. Even though we are probably Mercedes' and Ferrari's biggest market. F1 wants to do this just like the FIFA wants professional soccer in the US. If you crack the market the money is awesome.

I still look at anyone's bid for an F1 race in the US as folly unless they have committed financial backing. Ya, Monticello is a lovely track but where is the 150 million to build stands, pit complex, parking areas and upgrades to track. I haven't looked at this from Google Earth but I am sure there are some people in the area who won't be to keen to have an F1 race in their "backyard". Besides it looks like it suffers the same problem Road America has in that it is far from an urban center and all the hotels.

#189 Xpat

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 12:22

I have nothing against Americans in general or in particular - I'm just wondering what it is that entites America to have two races when they have no representation on the grid.

Having drivers and/or teams is a prerequisite to having a race(s)? Really?

Let me give you a little information on what constitutes entitlement to a F1 race: $50,000,000. If the US could build 15 tracks and pay Bernie's fees he would pick up F1 and move it lock, stock, and barrel to the US. If we had to pick a place that should always have a F1 race, that really "deserves" a race, I think we would agree that Silverstone would be high on that list. And yet Bernie doesn't care about the history or anything else. He was ready to leave Silverstone because they didn't do what he wanted them to do. There is no entitlement to a F1 race other than the money to put one on.

#190 New Britain

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 12:25

Why should America be entitled to two races when they can barely organise one? There are no American drivers, teams or World Champions - and that's the only reason why Spain got two. The assumption that America is deserving of two races simply because it's America reeks of the stereotypical arrogance that has given America as a nation a worldwide reputation.

I believe that there was at least one more reason why Spain got 2 GPs - something related to Flavio Briatore's owning the F1 broadcasting rights in Spain!

Wrt America or anywhere else being "entitled" to 0, 1, or 2 GPs, that must in part derive from the size of a nation, in terms of population and, separately, of financial support for the event.

#191 mkay

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 12:36

I have nothing against Americans in general or in particular - I'm just wondering what it is that entites America to have two races when they have no representation on the grid.

because US is as "big" as the whole of Europe in terms of global clout and influence, and most importantly car sales..

#192 onemoresolo

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 13:19

I think the USA is more deserving of having three races than Turkey, Abu Dhabi, Bahrain or Korea are of having one.

The fact that 1 in 5 watched the Daytona 500 shows how popular motorsport is in the USA. Indy attracted as many fans as Silverstone. Turkey and these other countries throwing money at Bernie can only dream of drawing a real crowd.

I'd rather have three races in one country that will draw crowds and also help the finances of the teams through more sponsorship opportunities than race in the middle of nowhere on the whim of some wealthy individuals.

#193 highdownforce

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 13:20

I don't Twitter.

Can I use "Twitter" as a verb?

Tweet.

#194 Messi10

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 13:27

Here it is folks..
http://www.youtube.c...feature=related

I think is too narrow but with some pretty cool turns..

#195 Messi10

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 13:30

I have nothing against Americans in general or in particular - I'm just wondering what it is that entites America to have two races when they have no representation on the grid.

ask the teams.. they will tell you.

Edited by Messi10, 21 May 2010 - 13:30.

#196 steveninthematrix

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 13:35

That is a wild thoughts.

Three races at once makes better chance for F1 to root in USA?

What then the race will be called?

Pacific GP for Laguna Seca
US GP for MMC?

And the third...

1982 F1 Calendar,

three races in USA

Posted Image

#197 Captain Tightpants

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 13:56

Having drivers and/or teams is a prerequisite to having a race(s)? Really?

No, but it sure as hell helps because it gives local crowds somone to support. I'd say it's twice as important in America, given that Formula 1 would be competing directly with NASCAR and Indycar.

because US is as "big" as the whole of Europe in terms of global clout and influence, and most importantly car sales..

Still doesn't mean they should have two races.

ask the teams.. they will tell you.

I get the importance of the United States as a market for the teams - but I don't think it's so completely important that having two races is completely justified. In fact, I suspect the calls for two races have been made so as to make it easier for fans to see a race because major metropolitain areas like New York and Los Angeles are so far apart. Well, people in Vancouver have to travel all the way to Montreal if they want to see a race. People in Darwin and Perth have to travel to Melbourne. People in Brasilia have to travel to Sao Paulo. Canada, Australia and Brazil are all big nations, yet no-one there is calling for two races in a season.

#198 chrisj

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Posted 21 May 2010 - 14:18

It's pretty close to Montreal, which I don't think is a good thing. I doubt that there would be enough interest to sustain both races. This seems like another pipe dream of somebody. Why not put a USGP in a place people might want to go, where the weather is nice, like Florida or Southern California?