I don't have the 8c2300 book, and would appreciate any information on the Tom Bamford Cad/Alfa; especially in the US after the Cadillac motor was installed..
Bamford Cadillac powered Alfa
Started by
dretceterini
, Feb 04 2004 03:42
17 replies to this topic
#3
willieboy
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Posted 04 February 2004 - 22:05
This is from the Simon Moore book.
There was a mercury V8 installed, which exploded.
Bamford is still alive (2000) but cannot remember to whom they sold it. He told Gordon Barrett that he last saw the car in 1958 but the percentage of AR left in the machine was getting rather low! In his research John de Boer has found clippings reporting the following exploits of this car:
1950 Palm Springs Schick DNF (rear axle)
1952 Torrey Pines Bamford 4th
1953 Madera Bamford (photo in book)
1953 Palm Springs Ran Second
And that is the end of that car, except for the engine, which was fitted some years ago to 2211092. It is rumoured that the rest of the car was broken up in California in the 1950s, but I (SM) cannot confirm that.
Hope this helps
There was a mercury V8 installed, which exploded.
Bamford is still alive (2000) but cannot remember to whom they sold it. He told Gordon Barrett that he last saw the car in 1958 but the percentage of AR left in the machine was getting rather low! In his research John de Boer has found clippings reporting the following exploits of this car:
1950 Palm Springs Schick DNF (rear axle)
1952 Torrey Pines Bamford 4th
1953 Madera Bamford (photo in book)
1953 Palm Springs Ran Second
And that is the end of that car, except for the engine, which was fitted some years ago to 2211092. It is rumoured that the rest of the car was broken up in California in the 1950s, but I (SM) cannot confirm that.
Hope this helps
#4
Ray Bell
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Posted 04 February 2004 - 22:11
Love some details on this car...
What type of Alfa was it originally? What model Caddy engine? And more...
What type of Alfa was it originally? What model Caddy engine? And more...
#5
dretceterini
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Posted 05 February 2004 - 01:02
The car is an 8c2300. The motor is circa 1950 Cadillac. The car still exists. It is NOT for sale per Tim Bamford; Tom's son. I don't know who currently has the car...
The car is in the 8c2300 book, but as I don't have the book, I'm not sure how complete the history is...
The car is in the 8c2300 book, but as I don't have the book, I'm not sure how complete the history is...
#6
Ray Bell
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Posted 05 February 2004 - 01:39
8c2300... forgive me for asking, is that a Monza or a road car?
1950 Caddy, that would be an ohv engine then?
No wonder it broke an axle...
1950 Caddy, that would be an ohv engine then?
No wonder it broke an axle...
#7
dretceterini
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Posted 05 February 2004 - 02:55
I believe it was a road car, but I don't have the 8c2300 book. The engine is indeed an OHV, and is currently with in the car. Horsepower would be around 250-275, I would think...
#8
dretceterini
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Posted 05 February 2004 - 16:14
If I remember correctly, the actor Keenan Wynn owned this car ay one time, and that Max Balchowsky (of old yeller fame) did some work on it; maybe even the motor conversion.
#9
willieboy
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Posted 05 February 2004 - 16:28
The chassis number is 2311229, which is a long chassis drophead coupe road car, not a Monza, with original body possibly by Castagna.
Simon Moore concludes from his research that ths was a car featured in Road & Track May 1951, with a story of it being driven from Kansas City to the West Coast in January 1938 by Harry Steele. 2 photos were used, one showing a UK reg no BYE 284, the other California plate 57-94-14.
The identity of the pre-War owner is not known, but it seems the car passed through the hands of Tommy Lee, ending up with Gil Schick in Southern California. He took the engine out and replaced it with with a Mercury V8. There is a picture of him racing at Palm Springs, reproduced from 'Speed Age' October 1950. At the end of that season, he replaced the body with a new special built by Adolf Deutsch, shown in the book 'Speed and Sport'. Moore says that the car passed in this form to Tom Bamford and Keenan Wynn.
The original Alfa engine was fitted to 8c2300 no. 2211092, another long chassis, originally with a Touring cabriolet body. This car now has a Zagato-style Le Mans body, and was sold to Australia in 1996.
I have scanned the photos referred to above, but have not worked out the upload process yet. I could email direct if you are interested.
Simon Moore concludes from his research that ths was a car featured in Road & Track May 1951, with a story of it being driven from Kansas City to the West Coast in January 1938 by Harry Steele. 2 photos were used, one showing a UK reg no BYE 284, the other California plate 57-94-14.
The identity of the pre-War owner is not known, but it seems the car passed through the hands of Tommy Lee, ending up with Gil Schick in Southern California. He took the engine out and replaced it with with a Mercury V8. There is a picture of him racing at Palm Springs, reproduced from 'Speed Age' October 1950. At the end of that season, he replaced the body with a new special built by Adolf Deutsch, shown in the book 'Speed and Sport'. Moore says that the car passed in this form to Tom Bamford and Keenan Wynn.
The original Alfa engine was fitted to 8c2300 no. 2211092, another long chassis, originally with a Touring cabriolet body. This car now has a Zagato-style Le Mans body, and was sold to Australia in 1996.
I have scanned the photos referred to above, but have not worked out the upload process yet. I could email direct if you are interested.
#11
tam999
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Posted 05 February 2004 - 22:07
Tim Bamford recently sent some photos and the tiniest bit of info to my website regarding his father Tom Bamford and the Alfa-Cadillac. I've emailed Tim asking & hoping for more. Here's what Tim sent me:
http://www.tamsoldra...t/CadAlfa2.html
Tam McPartland
http://www.tamsoldra...t/CadAlfa2.html
Tam McPartland
#12
David McKinney
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Posted 05 February 2004 - 22:47
Which confirms the suspicion I had that it was not a long-chassis drophead coupé by the time it was racing 
#13
Ray Bell
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Posted 05 February 2004 - 22:56
It has some interesting wheels...
Anyone recognise them, or are they unique?
Anyone recognise them, or are they unique?
#14
dretceterini
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Posted 08 February 2004 - 04:31
Early Halibrand wheels, I think...
#15
T54
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Posted 09 February 2004 - 04:32
These look like 1948 Kelsey-Hayes cast for Indy cars. Lots of converted sprint cars used such wheels for speedway use, including the 1951 winning car of Lee Wallard. Halibrand took over the program shortly after I am told.
T54
T54
#16
cabianca
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Posted 13 February 2004 - 05:38
It is correct that the car started out as a 8C2300 long chassis. Pictures of the car in Kansas City exist. Keenan Wynne/Gil Schick put in a flathead Mercury and shortened and drilled the chassis. Cadillac was installed later. Car is NOT in Australia and never was. If someone claims that, they are stealing a serial number. It was in a storage unit in Arizona for years. Purchased in the last couple of years. Owner now trying to decide how to restore it.
#17
Ray Bell
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Posted 13 February 2004 - 06:35
I think willieboy is saying that the original engine is in Australia fitted to another chassis...
#18
dretceterini
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Posted 13 February 2004 - 16:02
Yes, it's the original (rebuilt) ALFA engine that is in another long chassis car that has been rebodied to look like one of the LeMans long chassis cars that is in Australia (or was, last I heard).
