I've just received some details of next year's event. Apparantly thier will be an extra race in the schedule, either the Fordwater Trophy for Production Sports and GT Cars or the Earl of March Trophy for 500cc F3 cars. No disrespect to the Production sports Car boys, but can we start a campaign for his Lordship to get his trophy out?
Goodwood Revival 2005
Started by
Roger Clark
, Dec 04 2004 10:19
28 replies to this topic
#3
Roger Clark
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Posted 04 December 2004 - 10:36
Originally posted by Gary C
Pardon ??
There's always one. I was aware of the possible double entendre, but I thought no, TNF is a serious forum, populated by mature people, I'll leave it as it is. When will I learn?
#4
Eric McLoughlin
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Posted 04 December 2004 - 13:05
Personally, I'd like to see the 500cc boys (and girls, if any) back.
#5
RAP
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Posted 04 December 2004 - 13:08
The 500cc cars get my vote!
#6
RTH
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Posted 04 December 2004 - 16:18
Make an earlier start and do both.
#7
Mike Lawrence
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Posted 05 December 2004 - 04:32
It is not permitted to start earlier, or finish later, a Goodwood. The circuit is restricted to five days of unsilenced racing a year and this was part of the deal Goodwood thrashed out with the local authorities which means that no activity may occur on a Sunday. Some grassroot clubs lost their sprints and single-stage rallies.
Historically, Goodwood was much more about production sports and GT racing than it was about the 500cc Formula Three. Goodwood was the first British circuit to drop F3 (rivalry between the BARC and the BRSCC, formerly the Half-Litre Club).
That is the historical position, but the Revival does not operate to strict historical rules. There are no end of cars admitted these days with no Goodwood link whatsoever. They are admitted because they are vaguely of the type which could have raced in period. The event is actually close to becoming parody - why have Oliver & Hardy look-al-likes in a Model T, as happened this year? Oliver & Hardy belong to the 1930s, during the entire history of Goodwood they made only one film ('Robinson Crusoeland'. 1950) and that was an embarrassing flop.
Wait a minute, Goodwood is permitted to run five days of racing a year and currently the Revival occupies just three. This means there is space for a two-day meeting.
It could not be on the scale of the Revival, for which grandstands and such are specially erected, but it is permissable. The trouble is that such an event could dilute the effect of the Revival when so many of us make an effort to dress for the occasion.
There are two days of unsilenced racing still available to the circuit. If someone could suggest a feasible use for those two days, I am sure that Lord March would be pleased to know. I once wrote him a letter and the result was the Goodwood Soapbox Derby. I cannot think of a way to use those two days, or I'd have written the letter.
Neither Lord March nor any member of his staff can think how to use those two days. There was a plan to celebrate the 40th anniversary of the Mini, in 1959, with a two-day event at Goodwood, and the plan was discussed to a serious level, but it was Silverstone which played host to the celebration
Somebody out there may just have a compelling idea.
Historically, Goodwood was much more about production sports and GT racing than it was about the 500cc Formula Three. Goodwood was the first British circuit to drop F3 (rivalry between the BARC and the BRSCC, formerly the Half-Litre Club).
That is the historical position, but the Revival does not operate to strict historical rules. There are no end of cars admitted these days with no Goodwood link whatsoever. They are admitted because they are vaguely of the type which could have raced in period. The event is actually close to becoming parody - why have Oliver & Hardy look-al-likes in a Model T, as happened this year? Oliver & Hardy belong to the 1930s, during the entire history of Goodwood they made only one film ('Robinson Crusoeland'. 1950) and that was an embarrassing flop.
Wait a minute, Goodwood is permitted to run five days of racing a year and currently the Revival occupies just three. This means there is space for a two-day meeting.
It could not be on the scale of the Revival, for which grandstands and such are specially erected, but it is permissable. The trouble is that such an event could dilute the effect of the Revival when so many of us make an effort to dress for the occasion.
There are two days of unsilenced racing still available to the circuit. If someone could suggest a feasible use for those two days, I am sure that Lord March would be pleased to know. I once wrote him a letter and the result was the Goodwood Soapbox Derby. I cannot think of a way to use those two days, or I'd have written the letter.
Neither Lord March nor any member of his staff can think how to use those two days. There was a plan to celebrate the 40th anniversary of the Mini, in 1959, with a two-day event at Goodwood, and the plan was discussed to a serious level, but it was Silverstone which played host to the celebration
Somebody out there may just have a compelling idea.
#8
Rob29
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Posted 05 December 2004 - 08:52
As there seem to be more competitors wanting to race than there is time in the day,why not 2 festivals? A 2-day one for the single seaters and a 3-day one for the rest?
#9
john ruston
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Posted 05 December 2004 - 09:01
I think they will stick to the one event.They could give the other days to VSCC or similar but there is no way they will spoil the festival or revival ,its grown into to a massive success and cannot be diluted..by adding something else.
#10
Racers Edge
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Posted 05 December 2004 - 09:56
GOODWOOD...extra 2 days???
Why not just add these days before the existing schedule for testing. All the costs are in place for the set up, and a few extra bodies to assist will always be there available. Alot of cars seem to show up fresh from restoration without any driver / engine or /chassis time on them. This would be Charles putting something "back" into the sport, not just take the $$$...
I would think the extra 2 days will be a welcome gesture to the racers maybe not to all the fans? But the cars ALWAYS need to be tested. (or) on the same 2 days add on to the existing schedule
(Wed.>Thur>) organize a Race Acadamy, to refresh the driving skills for some old tired drivers. One day testing, and one day a school to at least teach some of the new drivers ( and old) the best way to get around Goodwood in a safe & fast fashion...
Why not just add these days before the existing schedule for testing. All the costs are in place for the set up, and a few extra bodies to assist will always be there available. Alot of cars seem to show up fresh from restoration without any driver / engine or /chassis time on them. This would be Charles putting something "back" into the sport, not just take the $$$...
I would think the extra 2 days will be a welcome gesture to the racers maybe not to all the fans? But the cars ALWAYS need to be tested. (or) on the same 2 days add on to the existing schedule
(Wed.>Thur>) organize a Race Acadamy, to refresh the driving skills for some old tired drivers. One day testing, and one day a school to at least teach some of the new drivers ( and old) the best way to get around Goodwood in a safe & fast fashion...
#11
RTH
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Posted 05 December 2004 - 10:17
It's such a wonderful place these days with so many more people wanting to take part it's a real shame and a waste not to use all the permitted days to the full.
Two more days certainly would not dilute it, or damage the image in any way , quite the reverse.
I wish they would make plans for another historic meeting , a bit lower key , why not Easter weekend ? But anytime would I'm sure be well received.
All circuits in UK , if they ran a much tighter ship as they all used to in the 1970's could easily fit more races in to a day with far less time wasting dead track time , which is bad for competitors and spectators alike, 10 even 12 races a day has been done in the past, and it's much better entertainment and lower costs for all concerned, - just a bit less parading about by the clerk of the course.
Two more days certainly would not dilute it, or damage the image in any way , quite the reverse.
I wish they would make plans for another historic meeting , a bit lower key , why not Easter weekend ? But anytime would I'm sure be well received.
All circuits in UK , if they ran a much tighter ship as they all used to in the 1970's could easily fit more races in to a day with far less time wasting dead track time , which is bad for competitors and spectators alike, 10 even 12 races a day has been done in the past, and it's much better entertainment and lower costs for all concerned, - just a bit less parading about by the clerk of the course.
#12
Barry Boor
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Posted 05 December 2004 - 19:07
The possibility of fitting in more races is negated by two terrible words:
SAFETY CAR
SAFETY CAR
#13
Jack-the-Lad
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Posted 06 December 2004 - 04:23
Assuming (incorrectly, as it turns out) that Revival would be run on the recently-traditional first weekend of September, my nephew and his fiancee obligingly scheduled their wedding for September 15. Now it seems that His Lordship has quite contrarily, without so much as a phone call to confer, scheduled 2005 Revival for the same weekend! So, while you lot are having a jolly time, I'll be stuck in a chapel, with my imagination firmly at Madgwick! Enjoy it, and I'll be looking forward to 2006!
Jack
Jack
#14
Barry Boor
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Posted 06 December 2004 - 07:48
I wonder just how many people find the new date less convenient.
Then again, I suppose there will be just as many people for whom mid-September is far better than earlier.
Maybe his Lordship is seeking a new audience!
Then again, I suppose there will be just as many people for whom mid-September is far better than earlier.
Maybe his Lordship is seeking a new audience!
#15
RAP
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Posted 06 December 2004 - 09:14
As for the two "spare" days, how about recreating the delightful Members Meetings? One day for the 1950s and the second for the 1960s. Run in Spring to avoid clash with FOS or Revival.
Practice in the morning, 6 or 7 10 lap races in the afternoon. (no overnight stays required for competitors)
Accept entries only from the type of car that would have been at a Members meeting. This would allow people to compete who have no chance of a race entry at the Revival. eg for the 1960s day
Marque Sports (MGB, Sprites, TR, Morgan)
GT ( Elan, Marcos, etc)
F Libre (any single seater with a "club racing" history)
Sports Racing (Lotus 23, Lotus 7, )
Saloons 1300cc (Mini, A40, Anglia)
Saloons +1300 (Big Anglia, Mustang, Lotus Cortina, Jags)
Handicap
For the 50s
Late 40s early 50s sports (XK120, Allard, MG Spl, pre war cars with Goodwood history)
Pre 56 Sports (C type, Frazer Nash, Lotus X)
Late 50s "production" sports racers 1500cc (Lotus 11, Cooper)
Late 50 "production " sports racers over 1500 (D type, DB3S, Lotus 15 HWM)
Marque Sports (AC, TR, Morgan)
50s Saloons (A35 etc)
Handicaps
I know this sounds rather like a HSCC meeting (what's wrong with that ??) but I think the Goodwood tag would still make it special.
Practice in the morning, 6 or 7 10 lap races in the afternoon. (no overnight stays required for competitors)
Accept entries only from the type of car that would have been at a Members meeting. This would allow people to compete who have no chance of a race entry at the Revival. eg for the 1960s day
Marque Sports (MGB, Sprites, TR, Morgan)
GT ( Elan, Marcos, etc)
F Libre (any single seater with a "club racing" history)
Sports Racing (Lotus 23, Lotus 7, )
Saloons 1300cc (Mini, A40, Anglia)
Saloons +1300 (Big Anglia, Mustang, Lotus Cortina, Jags)
Handicap
For the 50s
Late 40s early 50s sports (XK120, Allard, MG Spl, pre war cars with Goodwood history)
Pre 56 Sports (C type, Frazer Nash, Lotus X)
Late 50s "production" sports racers 1500cc (Lotus 11, Cooper)
Late 50 "production " sports racers over 1500 (D type, DB3S, Lotus 15 HWM)
Marque Sports (AC, TR, Morgan)
50s Saloons (A35 etc)
Handicaps
I know this sounds rather like a HSCC meeting (what's wrong with that ??) but I think the Goodwood tag would still make it special.
#16
john ruston
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Posted 06 December 2004 - 09:33
Now that is the perfect recreation of a typical club day at Goodwood.On the assumption that it would be to downmarket for the present Goodwood sales team how about doing it at Cadwell Park but that may be to far up north.
#17
D-Type
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Posted 06 December 2004 - 09:35
Jack-the-Lad
Contact His Lordship, explain the problem and he might let you hold the wedding at Goodwood. There is a precedent of sorts: Husche von Hanstein was married at the Nurburgring (I think).
RAP,
Great idea - any car that has run at the main Revival or the Festival should be ineligible as should any car restored to 'Pebble Beach' levels.
Could we also have a 50's libre race - for all those with cars that nobody runs series for?
Contact His Lordship, explain the problem and he might let you hold the wedding at Goodwood. There is a precedent of sorts: Husche von Hanstein was married at the Nurburgring (I think).
RAP,
Great idea - any car that has run at the main Revival or the Festival should be ineligible as should any car restored to 'Pebble Beach' levels.
Could we also have a 50's libre race - for all those with cars that nobody runs series for?
#18
Roger Clark
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Posted 06 December 2004 - 12:26
Two days, slightly downmarket of the Goodwod Revival? How about the British Grand Prix?
#19
FW07B
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Posted 06 December 2004 - 13:15
This is a bit off track for this thread but can anyone answer why there are no Lotus Elan 26r's permitted to race in the Tourist Trophy event at the revival or standard series 1 elans in the Fordwater trophy?
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#20
john ruston
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Posted 06 December 2004 - 13:47
They are not fancy enough as people like to see Ferrari's,Abarths,alfas etc.Should change if Nick Mason or Rowen Atkinson buys one.Of course they would have 1600cc engines!
#21
Jack-the-Lad
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Posted 06 December 2004 - 21:53
[QUOTE]Originally posted by D-Type
[B]Jack-the-Lad
Contact His Lordship, explain the problem and he might let you hold the wedding at Goodwood. There is a precedent of sorts: Husche von Hanstein was married at the Nurburgring (I think)
I'm sure he'd allow it to be held in the new "vendor" area. You know, the part that is completely and jarringly out of place, between the pre-66 car park and the track entrance....
Jack
[B]Jack-the-Lad
Contact His Lordship, explain the problem and he might let you hold the wedding at Goodwood. There is a precedent of sorts: Husche von Hanstein was married at the Nurburgring (I think)
I'm sure he'd allow it to be held in the new "vendor" area. You know, the part that is completely and jarringly out of place, between the pre-66 car park and the track entrance....
Jack
#22
Jack-the-Lad
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Posted 06 December 2004 - 21:55
Originally posted by FW07B
This is a bit off track for this thread but can anyone answer why there are no Lotus Elan 26r's permitted to race in the Tourist Trophy event at the revival or standard series 1 elans in the Fordwater trophy?
I've often wondered that myself. I believe the26R would be "in period" and they are certainly impressive on the track, one of my all-time favorites.
Jack
#23
Doug Nye
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Posted 06 December 2004 - 23:06
Originally posted by FW07B
This is a bit off track for this thread but can anyone answer why there are no Lotus Elan 26r's permitted to race in the Tourist Trophy event at the revival or standard series 1 elans in the Fordwater trophy?
It really hasn't been a case of none being 'permitted' - it's just the way the entry choice has worked out when balancing those cars and owners to invite against the number of spaces open and the dating-bracket of the race in question. To my knowledge we have nothing against 26Rs at all and one of my abiding images of Goodwood is of Tommy Weber's 'gold bug' Elan spinning to a halt on three wheels out of the chicane, with the the thrown wheel ricocheting off the safety bank to soar higher than the grandstands...
...Umm, on second thoughts, maybe subliminally we did have something against 26Rs...
DCN
#24
Ray Bell
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Posted 06 December 2004 - 23:18
Ahhh... 26Rs...
Niel Allen!
Yes... 26Rs...
Peter Hopwood!
26Rs... infamy...
Doug Macarthur flying out of the turbulent field at the Northern Crossing!
And on the flip side... useless 26Rs...
Fred Gibson!
Niel Allen!
Yes... 26Rs...
Peter Hopwood!
26Rs... infamy...
Doug Macarthur flying out of the turbulent field at the Northern Crossing!
And on the flip side... useless 26Rs...
Fred Gibson!
#25
Jack-the-Lad
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Posted 06 December 2004 - 23:20
Originally posted by Doug Nye
It really hasn't been a case of none being 'permitted' - it's just the way the entry choice has worked out when balancing those cars and owners to invite against the number of spaces open and the dating-bracket of the race in question. To my knowledge we have nothing against 26Rs at all and one of my abiding images of Goodwood is of Tommy Weber's 'gold bug' Elan spinning to a halt on three wheels out of the chicane, with the the thrown wheel ricocheting off the safety bank to soar higher than the grandstands...
...Umm, on second thoughts, maybe subliminally we did have something against 26Rs...
DCN
#26
john ruston
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Posted 07 December 2004 - 05:54
They have a Brooklands race without a Talbot 105's so its not only Elans.It is a large well organised fancy dress garden party with some racing cars thrown in.A superb weekend and we are lucky to have it in England but dont confuse the event with a serious Historic race event like the Spa Festival.
#27
RAP
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Posted 07 December 2004 - 14:03
I have written to Goodwood with my suggestion of a "members meeting" type week end. If it appeals, write/e mail/ phone Goodwood in support!
#28
Ted Walker
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Posted 08 December 2004 - 08:59
Regarding the Elan 26R,you might yet see one next year as the ex Ian Walker Le Mans car is being restored by a well known "mouse type person" with the idea of kicking some ass.
#29
Gary C
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Posted 08 December 2004 - 15:51
I would love to race my 1969 Formula Ford at Goodwood, and I know a lot of the other guys at the HSCC would too. How about some sort of other 'club' meeting (VSCC & HSCC??) earlier in the year. No??
