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1968 Graham Hill photo ID

Started by Rob Ryder , May 17 2006 09:02

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32 replies to this topic

#1 Rob Ryder

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Posted 17 May 2006 - 09:02

This image was posted on another forum for id (image source unknown).

I am sure it is Crystal Palace, maybe a demo in late 1968 or early 1969. Does anyone have any more info? .. why, when etc.
Thanks
Rob

#2 ian senior

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Posted 17 May 2006 - 09:23

Sure looks like Palace, but I'd say late '68 otherwise the car would surely be carrying no. 1 as Champion. But why did it happen? Was there a meeting at Crystal Palace after NGH clinched the '68 championship and this was a way of letting the public see the new champion?

#3 Twin Window

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Posted 17 May 2006 - 09:30

My vote is for the Palace too.

It makes sense what you say, Ian - a late 1968 victorious homecoming type of thing. James had something similar at Brands, IIRC.

#4 a_tifoosi

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Posted 17 May 2006 - 09:45

Obviously in Motoring Picture Library the description isn't correct.

Kind regards,
Narcís.

#5 Stephen W

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Posted 17 May 2006 - 09:46

Judging by the appearance of the car it is post Brands (July 1968) and prior to Mexico (November 1968) as the 49 ran with exit vents just behind the nosecone fromthe Mexican race onwards.

Was there a Ford Sport Day at Crystal Palace sometime in September/October? Quiet often there would be a demo of a Cosworth powered F1 car at such events.

:wave:

#6 ian senior

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Posted 17 May 2006 - 09:51

Have a look at:

www.bmrc.co.uk/championships/cpalace.html

Looks as though it was the start of the London-Sydney Marathon, and Graham also drove Chitty Chitty Bang Bang!

#7 hyperbolica

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Posted 17 May 2006 - 09:59

Wing spec looks like late '68, but nose cone and rollover bar are earlier. The rollover bar had been raised by Monza IIRC, when the 49s also had the cooling air exiting on top of the nose cone.

The wide front wings were used in the US (note that the bar joining the front wings is broken in this pic, with strange wing angles as a result).

My guess is that this picture is from late summer '68, or it could be some demo taking place later still, but in a car of "older" spec. But as the 49 was used in specs looking like this also in the 1969 Tasman series, it might be a demo of the 1969 Tasman spec 49.

#8 Rob Ryder

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Posted 17 May 2006 - 10:59

Originally posted by ian senior
Have a look at:
www.bmrc.co.uk/championships/cpalace.html
Looks as though it was the start of the London-Sydney Marathon, and Graham also drove Chitty Chitty Bang Bang!

Ian
If it was at the Crystal Palace start of the Marathon it would be Sunday, November 24, 1968. It could be this event as the crowd look well wrapped up in overcoats.
Also the car is carrying #11 - Jackie Oliver's race number for the Mexican GP a few weeks earlier.
Rob

Edited with Mexican GP info before reading Ian's next post - sorry :blush:

#9 ian senior

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Posted 17 May 2006 - 11:02

Originally posted by Rob Ryder

Ian
If it was at the Crystal Palace start of the Marathon it would be Sunday, November 24, 1968.
Rob

Guess so. What date was the Mexican GP that year - surely before then? Presumably Graham was just demonstrating any old 49 that happened to be lying around, rather than the latest race car.

#10 hyperbolica

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Posted 17 May 2006 - 11:07

Originally posted by ian senior
What date was the Mexican GP that year - surely before then?

3rd November.

#11 humphries

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Posted 17 May 2006 - 11:36

Autosport 29 November 1968 "THE GREAT RACE"
The London-Sydney Marathon sets off from Crystal Palace

" In an atmosphere of cheerful chaos, and in front of an absolutely astonishing crowd, 98 cars left Sydenham for Sydney........admission was free........80,000 people turned out................various side attractions were staged, including.....a straight-line dash by World Champion Graham Hill in the Formula 1 Lotus 49B......"

#12 Ronaldo

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Posted 18 May 2006 - 10:04

Get the yellow out quick, he's going the wrong way.

#13 Bruno

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Posted 02 June 2006 - 09:34

maby "London trophy" F2 at Crystal Palace: 3/6/1968.
Jackie Oliver n° 11
Graham Hill n° 12
change the car in practice?

in F1 world championship 1968, Hill at never n° 11.

#14 Rob Ryder

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Posted 02 June 2006 - 11:39

Bruno, it is already identified as Crystal Palace demonstration :up:

#15 Bruno

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Posted 02 June 2006 - 12:40

Originally posted by Rob Ryder
Bruno, it is already identified as Crystal Palace demonstration

sorry! ! ! i do not read English well :down:

#16 Barry Boor

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Posted 02 June 2006 - 14:59

Younger members may not altogether appreciate that being World Champion, as driver or constructor, bore no relation to the number your car might carry at any race back then.

It was some years into the 1970s before this #1 business started - and I still don't like it!

#17 David McKinney

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Posted 02 June 2006 - 16:17

Originally posted by Barry Boor
Younger members may not altogether appreciate that being World Champion, as driver or constructor, bore no relation to the number your car might carry at any race back then.

It was some years into the 1970s before this #1 business started - and I still don't like it!

I don't really care what numbering system they use
But I'd like to be able to see the numbers

#18 Rob Ryder

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Posted 02 June 2006 - 18:05

You guys did so well with the Lotus image, how about trying this one from 1966 - NGH in a BRM.

Where, when and why? I have no ideas :blush:

Rob

#19 David McKinney

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Posted 02 June 2006 - 18:45

Is that the end of a 'Holden' sign?

#20 Roger Clark

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Posted 03 June 2006 - 06:00

Originally posted by David McKinney
Is that the end of a 'Holden' sign?

Or the end of (Esso) Golden?

#21 David McKinney

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Posted 03 June 2006 - 08:09

Reminded me of the contemporary Holden script, is all

#22 Alan Cox

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Posted 03 June 2006 - 08:43

If it were to be "Holden", would suggest a picture taken in the Antipodes, and I don't recall the H16 ever travelling that far.

#23 David McKinney

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Posted 03 June 2006 - 11:24

I have to admit that did worry me. It was certainly never in NZ, but Australian Tasman races sometimes had odd entries that don't stick so readily in my memory bank. Nor would a demo be impossible (though admittedly unlikely)

#24 Cirrus

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Posted 03 June 2006 - 12:08

The lack of side numbers would suggest that it might have been a demo. I agree with David, though - half way round the world was a very long way in 1966/67 for a mere demo.

#25 Rob Ryder

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Posted 06 June 2006 - 18:38

Bump

Looks like I am not the only one that is out of ideas

We need a BRM guru...
Rob

#26 Paul Taylor

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Posted 06 June 2006 - 20:39

Could it be from the Oulton Park Gold Cup? :confused:

#27 Macca

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Posted 06 June 2006 - 20:49

I have a picture of the same car (from studying pipe runs round the engine) at a PR event around the time of the Belgian GP of 1966.....so I think it must be early testing at Snetterton in May or June 1966.

Paul M

#28 Alan Cox

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Posted 06 June 2006 - 21:42

Looks like it could be at the Oulton Park Gold Cup. Although no number is visible on the side, there appears to be a number "7" on the nose - Hill ran with number 7 in that race. The ads are very reminiscent of some that were at Oulton in the sixties. Could it be pre-practice, before all numbers were applied?

#29 Vitesse2

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Posted 06 June 2006 - 22:01

Heh.

I suggested both Snetterton and Oulton when this picture was posted elsewhere! Like Alan I thought it was a 7 on the nose, which suggested Oulton. Equally, the banks being so close to the track suggested Snetterton. There's obviously some work going on in the background, but are they erecting or dismantling that Esso Extra hoarding? And what's that gear on the bank?