The best thing about 2007: Hamilton vs Alonso is gone for 2008

We'll miss the best thing about 2007, the alonso-hamilton fights, forget the mclaren cheating thing, we've lost a teamate battle.

What are your thoughts on this?

Ok, it won't be bad if:

Renault and Mclaren build even enough cars for Alonso and Hamilton to fight
But the comparison factor is gone, their not the same cars

If Ferrari have a edge, Kimi vs Massa isn't quite the same dramatic effect, their's a sense of family and unity with ferrari, it's nice, but not entertaining enough.

The Psychological inter team handeling of Alonso and Hamilton is gone, it was fasinating to see Dennis, for good or worse, it was talking points

Alonso is more entertaining being a bad loser then a winner, and Hamilton is more entertaining in his quiet smirks when he overcame Alonso, I think we were very spoiled in 2007, which we were lucky, with Schumacher gone, the mclaren pairing filled in the schumacher void talking point.


If one guy dominates, he has to be universally likeable, to have the respect for doing the Schumacher type domination, if its Kimi or Alonso, it could be boring, but if its Hamilton-he's a marketing dream for Bernie, and non serious f1 fans get into it, but still domination is not as entertaining, and Hamilton or wherever has to do the super drives associated with Schumacher in the past, I mean even in 2004, where MS won alot, he still did that 4 stopper in france.


I'm not his biggest fan, but for the sport, Hamilton is a massive star, if he wins alot, good for coverage, people know him, sort of Tiger Woods style winning. People wanna see him wind up Alonso though, every driver needs a archnemsis, either they have it or media create it, Schumacher VS Hill, Schumacher vs Jacques, Schumacher vs Montoya, Schumacher vs Alonso

Schumacher vs Hakkinen was a rarity, I think Hamilton vs Kimi could mirror the respectful racing of those previous two, but Kimi is everyone's friend really

So my friends, imagine 2007, if Alonso had Dela Rosa as a teamate, and Hamilton was a test driver, that could of happened, or Mac took a chance on Hamilton and Alonso never came to mclaren, either way, one of them would of dominated and won, while Kimi and Massa tried but failed in reliability stict ferraris, it would of been a story, but the racing much less dramatic, and if it wasn't for the race races at Fuji, you still have the basic problem of f1, once one car has got it better, you better have a interesting and likable driver winning, and even then it's not awesome, it's better Schumacher doing a race from the back in the rain etc, then up front and selecting his fastest laps. You need a bit of luck every f1 season to get a good 4-5 good races out of say 17-18 races.

If were unlucky, with no teamate battle, and if there's little rain, and if there's not enough grit and malice amongst the competitors upfront for a hard battle, then the not so exciting f1 rules these days will show the sport up. F1 requires patience, for every so so gp, you get a great one, Fuji 2007 was a highlight, had it not rained, it could of been less then great end to the season etc, you had the rain, you had a title fight, you had teamates involved in a title fight, quite lucky we got it really.


2008 could be a return to some normality, the best thing is probabley the new races, the night race, something me looks forward too, just the location and night aspect, makes me want to visit the GP. Plus the street track in Spain, that's the exciting thing about 2008, the new gps for me.

I can't imagine the hate against Hamilton if he starts dominating, especially from Spain. So far I've only seen like 1 spanish hamilton fan.

edit: I am for one, glad that Hamilton vs Alonso is gone for 2008 ( at least compared to 2007). It just brought around too much nationalism, jingoism and hate around the forums. The best thing that could happen in 2008 is for Ferrari to dominate so that the 2007 season will be long forgotten and we can enjoy 2009 with the new set of regulations.

Originally posted by SeanValen
I'm not his biggest fan, but for the sport, Hamilton is a massive star, if he wins alot, good for coverage, people know him, sort of Tiger Woods style winning. People wanna see him wind up Alonso though, every driver needs a archnemsis, either they have it or media create it, Schumacher VS Hill, Schumacher vs Jacques, Schumacher vs Montoya, Schumacher vs Alonso

Schumacher vs Hakkinen was a rarity, I think Hamilton vs Kimi could mirror the respectful racing of those previous two, but Kimi is everyone's friend really

I want to see Hamilton 'v' Alonso, it would be far more entertaining on and off the track than Hamilton 'v' anyone else and its these type of rivalries that get people watching and talking about Formula 1. A bit of spite never hurt anyone and it makes for great drama, particularly in a World title battle. Those examples you gave are spot on and I know which ones I enjoyed more, on and off the track.

My hope is that McLaren and Ferrari are very close, and we get Hammy vs. Kimi. This would be a very interesting battle, Kimi with his James Hunt approach and Hammy with his full-on nothing-but-F1 approach.

Both very dominant characters (I loved the descriptions of Kimi at the test calmly waiting for Todt and Montezemolo to come to him and pay their respects ). Both very strong in the head, fast, but fair.

Kimi probably slightly faster on a lap, Hammy slightly more determined. It would be a great contest.

If Renault can get Fernando up there too, so much the better. These are three of the best ever, IMO.

Nothing like a bit of needle to liven things up! Indeed the battle to watch this year will be Hamster vs Fred.Roll on Melbourne I canny wait.

Originally posted by Fatgadget
Nothing like a bit of needle to liven things up! Indeed the battle to watch this year will be Hamster vs Fred.Roll on Melbourne I canny wait.

Not much of a battle considering that Williams and BMW will mostly likely be separating them in the grid.

Originally posted by F1Obsession

Not much of a battle considering that Williams and BMW will mostly likely be separating them in the grid.

If you expect Renault to struggle that much, your in for a shock.

What I would love to have seen was drivers racing completely independant of each other within the team. No team strategy for solid constructer points, driver picks the fuel loads/tyres and when they need to pit.

Would be have saved McLaren alot of bother.

Originally posted by MichaelPM
What I would love to have seen was drivers racing completely independant of each other within the team. No team strategy for solid constructer points, driver picks the fuel loads/tyres and when they need to pit.

Would be have saved McLaren alot of bother.

There is only one optimum strategy and only one pit.

If you are think Hamilton vs Alonso at McLaren being gone is the best for 2008, then you must have missed the entire spygate or actually enjoyed it.

Originally posted by F1Obsession
I can't imagine the hate against Hamilton if he starts dominating, especially from Spain. So far I've only seen like 1 spanish hamilton fan.

edit: I am for one, glad that Hamilton vs Alonso is gone for 2008 ( at least compared to 2007). It just brought around too much nationalism, jingoism and hate around the forums. The best thing that could happen in 2008 is for Ferrari to dominate so that the 2007 season will be long forgotten and we can enjoy 2009 with the new set of regulations.

and?

Originally posted by F1Obsession


There is only one optimum strategy and only one pit.

There is no only one optimum strategy. F1 is unpredictable.

Originally posted by volumenzero


There is no only one optimum strategy. F1 is unpredictable.

F1 is unpredictable. But there is only one optimum strategy given all the information they have at the start of the race.

Originally posted by volumenzero


and?

and what? I just expressed my opinion that's all.

Well from a completely outside view, Alonso is a pussy, he ran away from a rookie, while getting paid well, a great champion he will never make as he didn't duke it out.

From an F1 fans point of view there are many circumstances as to why Alonso left, it wasn't an enjoyable battle it was kind of embarrassing really watching the level of childish antics that went on between them. I didn't see either of them apply their skill and outright ability against each other on track. It was more of right I am behind what trick or request or bleat can I make to get an advantage. I would've thought there was much more head to head racing to be done by those two before it got dirty. The other thing it would seem was apparent is that they had different styles with regards to suiting a track as one would be dominating the other at times. So it wasn't a GIANT on track battle, more of a Desperate Housewives drama, if you dig that sort of thing then I guess it was good.

Hamilton on the surface looks like a more than decent driver, in fact given his pre F1 history he is a legend all ready at those levels he raced at. He still didn't look polished to me last year, he ONLY looked impressive to me when in the lead and when WAYYYY back, but in the mid front fight he was the least likely to pick up a spot through pushing that I saw of the top 6 (yep add Nick and Kubica in there as well). But thats rookie for ya.

Overall I am a little disappointed that Alonso left, I think there is unfinished business there and Alonso was a bit of a Pussy to leave.

Originally posted by PassWind
Well from a completely outside view, Alonso is a pussy, he ran away from a rookie, while getting paid well, a great champion he will never make as he didn't duke it out.

I find it rather curious that he wants to come to Ferrari, given that their current driver climate is one of equality with no preference given to a world champion. I am sure part of the reason is he wants to drive the best car and he has noticed that Kimi has been alot happier there. But would he really want to come if it meant he got exactly the same situation albeit without a rookie. Kimi seems up for it...but would Alonso? and it absolutely wouldn't work I don't feel between Massa and Alonso in the same team.

I kind of get the impression that Alonso saw that MS went to Ferrari and got preferential treatment and the love and misty-eyed devotion of the team, and wanted the same thing....and one morning at McLaren woke up it hadn't happened as he thought and was rather upset about it all.

Regarding this seasons prospects, ideally I would have liked it to have more teams fighting it out at the top...not just a two horse race which is what it appears on initial inspection to be shaping upto. I really hope in that case its a four way race for the WDC.

It will be interesting to see how Renault and Alonso fare throughout the season, how some of the new boys perform and I'm also hoping Honda can start to make some inroads into getting their house and car a bit more in order.

Originally posted by PassWind
Hamilton on the surface looks like a more than decent driver, in fact given his pre F1 history he is a legend all ready at those levels he raced at. He still didn't look polished to me last year, he ONLY looked impressive to me when in the lead and when WAYYYY back, but in the mid front fight he was the least likely to pick up a spot through pushing that I saw of the top 6 (yep add Nick and Kubica in there as well). But thats rookie for ya. [/B]

This has all to do with the McLaren and Ferrari dominance. You can't blame Hamilton for getting the pole and winning it from there. The only way the dominance breaks if the car breaks, which happened to Hamilton. So basically in both of those cases Hamilton has impressed you. The thing is Hamilton hasn't had too many chances for the third case. Altough he did overtake Kimi in Monza. Don't say anything about Kimi neck being hurt because if he wasn't unable to race then they wouldn't have let him.

Originally posted by Chiara


I find it rather curious that he wants to come to Ferrari, given that their current driver climate is one of equality with no preference given to a world champion. I am sure part of the reason is he wants to drive the best car and he has noticed that Kimi has been alot happier there. But would he really want to come if it meant he got exactly the same situation albeit without a rookie. Kimi seems up for it...but would Alonso? and it absolutely wouldn't work I don't feel between Massa and Alonso in the same team.

I kind of get the impression that Alonso saw that MS went to Ferrari and got preferential treatment and the love and misty-eyed devotion of the team, and wanted the same thing....and one morning at McLaren woke up it hadn't happened as he thought and was rather upset about it all.

Regarding this seasons prospects, ideally I would have liked it to have more teams fighting it out at the top...not just a two horse race which is what it appears on initial inspection to be shaping upto. I really hope in that case its a four way race for the WDC.

It will be interesting to see how Renault and Alonso fare throughout the season, how some of the new boys perform and I'm also hoping Honda can start to make some inroads into getting their house and car a bit more in order.

I can see how Fernando was completely surprised by his status and Lewis' at McLaren, and his quiet character really told against him I think. He didn't join in the pre-season "bonding" week, and didn't socialise that much in the team, while Hammy was there in the factory all the time, spending time in all the departments and generally making himself the central figure. FA could only have answered that with dominant driving, and various problems stopped that happening.

So I think that being more prepared would enable him to cope better at Ferrari, if he got equal status. His expectations would be lower, much closer to what he'd get.

But maybe I'm a bit biased by the prospect of that mouth-watering competition between Kimi and Fernando in the same car...

Like you I am a bit desperate for a third or fourth team to dilute the hostility between Ferrari and McLaren. Red Bull would be my preference (if I were choosing), Webbo really deserves a break and there could be fireworks between him and Hammy ...

Originally posted by F1Obsession


This has all to do with the McLaren and Ferrari dominance. You can't blame Hamilton for getting the pole and winning it from there. The only way the dominance breaks if the car breaks, which happened to Hamilton. So basically in both of those cases Hamilton has impressed you. The thing is Hamilton hasn't had too many chances for the third case. Altough he did overtake Kimi in Monza. Don't say anything about Kimi neck being hurt because if he wasn't unable to race then they wouldn't have let him.

Of course the team and medics wouldn't allow him to race if they felt physically he was unable to. But in defence of Kimi or anyone who has been involved in a high speed crash/impact, sometimes the extent and severity of the injury is not always immediately apparent. For example with Whiplash, where symptoms can either be immediately apparent or even appear days later.

Putting his neck that wasn't 100% percent under such extreme G-forces can't have improved matters, can it?

It's a sorry state of affairs when the redeeming feature of the 2007 season was all the in-fighting at McLaren off the track. Let's hope that 2008 is remembered solely for the Racing and nothing else like we had last year.....Though with what happened at the test at Barcelona, doesn't look like we're going to get it does it?

Originally posted by Chiara


Of course the team and medics wouldn't allow him to race if they felt physically he was unable to. But in defence of Kimi or anyone who has been involved in a high speed crash/impact, sometimes the extent and severity of the injury is not always immediately apparent. For example with Whiplash, where symptoms can either be immediately apparent or even appear days later.

Putting his neck that wasn't 100% percent under such extreme G-forces can't have improved matters, can it?

That's my point. If they thought the crash was so severe the doctors woudn't have let him race having considered everything you've listed as a precautinary measure.

Originally posted by F1Obsession


That's my point. If they thought the crash was so severe the doctors woudn't have let him race having considered everything you've listed as a precautinary measure.

I'm just speculating here, but perhaps Kimi didn't feel it was so bad at the time, and there were no obvious signs of any damage to the muscle, ligament and vertabrae. However, it could be that once he got to a certain point in the race enduring all those extreme pressures on his neck muscles might have exarcebated any slight soft tissue injury there was.

But it's all done and dusted and in the past now, so as you rightly point out there is little point debating the subject.

Personally, I have high hopes for this season. WDC KR seems in top form with the best car. But I think new-kid on the block, LH, is the fastest man in F1 and Mclaren (slightly slower than the Ferrari currently)will give him the car that will allow him to carry the fight to the Ferraris. FA in a resurgent Renault should not be counted out and with FM &HK will play the roles of spoilers. The WDC & WCC might seem to be a ferrari lock right now, but F1 is known for its unpredictabilty!

I would've liked to see how Alonso vs Hamilton would've developed for a 2nd season, particularly if they'd remain matched in terms of speed/consistency or would Hamilton gain something with an extra season of experience. The rivalry was also good on track as we saw in Monaco/Indy (despite the difficulty to overtake in current F1 cars ruining the party) and in that awesome first lap at Spa. But I reckon the internal situation had become unbearable for both Alonso and the McLaren staff, and the off-track rivalry was reaching levels of unbearable idiocy for us fans (see how silly the Barcelona racism episode is still going). So mixed feelings I guess.

I think this season is shaping up for a Raikkonen vs Hamilton year, which should bring good racing as well (within what is possible with these crap cars...), without so much needless drama. Looking forward to it.

I won't miss the Hamilton-Alonso affair at all in 2008, it was more like a soap opera than an interesting thing. Most of it happened outside the track and it was awful. If I have to see it I prefer they are in different teams, as it happens now. But I hope the moaning to the media and bashing stops.
I preferred much much better the kind of rivalry between Michael Schumacher and Alonso in 2006, were both fought, Schumi tried to cheat in Monaco, Alonso got unfairly penalised in Monza, both were fairly penalised in Hungary, Michael had to cut a big difference, etc.

Originally posted by Chiara


I find it rather curious that he wants to come to Ferrari, given that their current driver climate is one of equality with no preference given to a world champion. I am sure part of the reason is he wants to drive the best car and he has noticed that Kimi has been alot happier there. But would he really want to come if it meant he got exactly the same situation albeit without a rookie. Kimi seems up for it...but would Alonso? and it absolutely wouldn't work I don't feel between Massa and Alonso in the same team.

You lack understanding of Alonsos issue at Mclaren. There would not be a problem at Ferrari because Kimi is not a rookie and a WC. Alonso would view him of equal status and accept it.

Well think about it. He would get a better shot at the title with Ferrari, so why wouldnt he want to join? Supposedly the climate is good there, even Kimi is happy now

Originally posted by Durant


You lack understanding of Alonsos issue at Mclaren. There would not be a problem at Ferrari because Kimi is not a rookie and a WC. Alonso would view him of equal status and accept it.

Thank you Durant for so politely and kindly pointing out my glaring ignorance. However I do feel a simple elaboration of your understanding of the situation would have sufficed.

Originally posted by F1Obsession


This has all to do with the McLaren and Ferrari dominance. You can't blame Hamilton for getting the pole and winning it from there. The only way the dominance breaks if the car breaks, which happened to Hamilton. So basically in both of those cases Hamilton has impressed you. The thing is Hamilton hasn't had too many chances for the third case. Altough he did overtake Kimi in Monza. Don't say anything about Kimi neck being hurt because if he wasn't unable to race then they wouldn't have let him.

I didn't blame Hamilton thats the point the car was pretty darn good. When he was in less than ideal racing conditions he didn't do as well as his team mate in my opinion and fell off the rear more the not. Recognising he was a Rookie its to be expected. He still has some ways to go when you take away the car factor which was a very good car.

Hamilton has his chance this year to run away with it if he is good enough you will have your WDC, though he blew it last year, again excusable he was a rookie, which is why I was a little dissapointed with Alonso leaving.

I thought I was the only one who would miss the whole Hamilton vs Alonso saga. Everyone on this forum seemed to be fed up with them and liked them less because of their comments on each other.

I think we're spoiled last year too, this is the most intense teammate rivalry we've seen in quite a while. I was kinda disappointed when McLaren fired Alonso, I was hoping for a re-match between them.

Not really looking forward to Kimi vs Lewis, they're not in the same team, it's totally different. It would have been totally "respectful", if Alonso and Hamilton had been in different teams last year.

Everyone says Hamilton is lucky to have a championship winning car in his first year in F1, I think the best thing has happened for him in F1 so far is having Alonso as teammate.

Originally posted by SeanValen
I mean even in 2004, where MS won alot, he still did that 4 stopper in france.


I'm not his biggest fan, but for the sport, Hamilton is a massive star, if he wins alot, good for coverage, people know him, sort of Tiger Woods style winning.

or Mac took a chance on Hamilton and Alonso never came to mclaren, either way, one of them would of dominated and won,

-that 4-stopper race can't have meant anything to anybody except the most diehard MS fans; no special drives from MS that year (well, maybe Monaco... )

-so you think for business reasons it would be nice if Lewis dominated? rather than someone who is actually the best driver? entertainment over quality then?

-McL or their drivers did not score any legitimate results in 07, and you talk of winning something? heck, at McL currently only Kovalainen has a podium, Hamster needs to score his first F1 result this year - even though McL probably shouldn't be on the grid this year either...

Originally posted by HSJ

-McL or their drivers did not score any legitimate results in 07, and you talk of winning something? heck, at McL currently only Kovalainen has a podium, Hamster needs to score his first F1 result this year - even though McL probably shouldn't be on the grid this year either...

Its amazing how every single one of your posts are always loony tunes.

Originally posted by Durant


Its amazing how every single one of your posts are always loony tunes.

I think he's from another planet.

Originally posted by Atreiu
If you are think Hamilton vs Alonso at McLaren being gone is the best for 2008, then you must have missed the entire spygate or actually enjoyed it.

Read the title again Sir.

Originally posted by SeanValen



Read the title again Sir.

Duh, my interpretation skills, or lack of, have made a fool of me.
Sorry.

(Where's the smiley for smacks himself in the head?)



Anyhow, as long as some incompetent press and imbecil fans are around, Hamilton vs Alonso will be never over.

Originally posted by Atreiu

(Where's the smiley for smacks himself in the head?)

Not quite what you wished for, but it may suffice

Originally posted by HSJ
-so you think for business reasons it would be nice if Lewis dominated? rather than someone who is actually the best driver? entertainment over quality then?

Like someone just said, what planet are you from? If Lewis were to dominate, it would make him certainly one of the best drivers, most likely THE best driver in the field. That's quality, entertainment and great for bernie. Of course, not great for you because that would make Raikkonen pretty much nothing in the scheme of things.

What cracks me up is you Kimi fanboys getting your nickers in a knot when someone says Lewis as World Champion would be better for Formula 1 and business on a whole. It may be harsh but its the absolute truth, Bernie knows it and so does anyone with a neutral view on things.

That's something you don't have. Raikkonen is a fantastic driver and one of the best but he's not exactly the best World Champion off the track. For one, he hardly speaks and that's something that would really piss Bernie off. Formula 1 is as much business as it is sport.

I'm still trying to understand how Lewis could dominate and yet it WOULDN'T be quality. Ah of course, its all down to the car unless your Kimi Raikkonen.

While 2007 was certainly the most compelling season in a long time, I wouldn't like to see a repeat; Todt, Briatore and Mosley having a field day over spygate, then the hypocrisy of the way the Renault case was handled, plus the seething hate coming out of Spain over the whole Hamilton / Alonso affair, the whole year was like a particularly nasty soap opera.

Hopefully in 2008 we'll see Raikkonen, Massa, Hamilton, Kovalainen and Alonso all fighting for wins (I'm ruling out BMW because I can't believe a car that ugly can be made to handle well). If Williams can occasionally get in amongst them then it will be a great year. I just hope it's not the yawnfest of another Ferrari domination.