I am trying to research the colours of the Stanguellini FJ that Pedro Rodriguez ran in Mexico in early 1961.
The car was sold by MOMO Corp to Ricardo Rodriguez and airfreighted to Mexico in Jan 11 1961 and driven by Pedro in FJ races on: 1/14/1961 at the Parilla-Autodroma Magdalena Mixiuhca. #10
Later races : I Primio Azteca on 9/3/61 at Ciudad Sahagun Industrial Park, Hidalgo, race #25 and then in the Primio de la Independencia-"Septima Carrera"- (GP de Mexico) Mexico City. #10
The stanguellini raced at Sahagun with a narrow (@100mm) light coloured stripe over a darker triangular flash tapering from the nose back to the windscreen.
Any Photos, information on the colour that the car raced in at this time are much appreciated.
Pedro Rodriguez Stanguellini FJ
Started by
silicanza
, Dec 11 2006 08:09
23 replies to this topic
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#2
Barry Boor
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Posted 11 December 2006 - 09:33
If the Momo Corp was anything to do with Alfred Momo, then this was almost certainly the car that was driven by Walter Hansgen.
When Walt raced it, it was painted a bright mid-blue.
When Walt raced it, it was painted a bright mid-blue.
#3
cstlhn
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Posted 11 December 2006 - 14:13
Originally posted by Barry Boor
If the Momo Corp was anything to do with Alfred Momo, then this was almost certainly the car that was driven by Walter Hansgen.
When Walt raced it, it was painted a bright mid-blue.
I believe this is the car that you are refering to. Seated is Hangsen with Momo one side and Cunningham on the other! This was taken at Daytona.
Cheers, David
#4
Barry Boor
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Posted 11 December 2006 - 14:33
No, no! The car I am referring to is FRONT engined!
Picture from the Ade Ketchum Cllection - found in the book 'WALT HANSGEN' by Mike Argetsinger
Picture from the Ade Ketchum Cllection - found in the book 'WALT HANSGEN' by Mike Argetsinger
#5
Barry Boor
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Posted 11 December 2006 - 19:02
I am informed by Mike Argetsinger himself that the blue Stanguellini is owned and raced by one Bill Gelles and is extremely unlikely to be the car that went to Mexico.
It is also interesting to note that there is no certainty that Walter Hansgen actually RACED the rear engined car picture above.
Unless anyone can confirm this?
It is also interesting to note that there is no certainty that Walter Hansgen actually RACED the rear engined car picture above.
Unless anyone can confirm this?
#6
Gary C
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Posted 11 December 2006 - 19:18
Looks nice in blue, doesn't it?
#7
Barry Boor
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Posted 11 December 2006 - 19:29
It's even nicer than that, actually, Gary. But my scanner hasn't done the picture justice.
#8
David McKinney
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Posted 11 December 2006 - 20:51
A front-engined FJ Stanguellini, allegedly new to the Rodriguez brothers, was sold from Mexico to New Zealand a year or two ago.
#9
Ray Bell
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Posted 11 December 2006 - 21:07
Originally posted by cstlhn
.....Seated is Hangsen with Momo one side and Cunningham on the other! This was taken at Daytona.
What a superb photograph!
Thank you, David...
#10
David M. Kane
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Posted 11 December 2006 - 21:14
I didn't even realize they did a rear engine car...wild looking exhaust!
#11
silicanza
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Posted 11 December 2006 - 21:59
The stanguellini is front engined, one of the last built; chassis #198.
It has sliding block rear end, "MOMO" shock conversion and ran with the wider and taller 13" borannis on the front. (Stanguellini were standard with 12"). Also wider 14" at the rear. The car was equiped with a five speed gearbox.
The car came to NZ about two years ago after spending all its life in Mexico.
It came to light that the original MOMO bill of sale and air manifest was still in Mexico . They show the sale of the car ( #198 ) to Ricardo Rodriguez. The documents had been given to the owner of Stanguellini #196, Pablo Gonzalez in Monterrey Mexico who very generously forwarded them to NZ.
There is a good chance the colours the car ran in were either; silver, white or dark blue as these are the colours that survive. Alais most of the surviving paint had been stripped from the remaining body parts. Dash was red.
It has sliding block rear end, "MOMO" shock conversion and ran with the wider and taller 13" borannis on the front. (Stanguellini were standard with 12"). Also wider 14" at the rear. The car was equiped with a five speed gearbox.
The car came to NZ about two years ago after spending all its life in Mexico.
It came to light that the original MOMO bill of sale and air manifest was still in Mexico . They show the sale of the car ( #198 ) to Ricardo Rodriguez. The documents had been given to the owner of Stanguellini #196, Pablo Gonzalez in Monterrey Mexico who very generously forwarded them to NZ.
There is a good chance the colours the car ran in were either; silver, white or dark blue as these are the colours that survive. Alais most of the surviving paint had been stripped from the remaining body parts. Dash was red.
#12
David McKinney
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Posted 11 December 2006 - 22:08
Now I'm confused
The car I was talking about was #189, though I may of course transposed the numbers in error
However, my notes have Pablo Gonzalez as owner of 198 in 2000
Does this mean two cars went from Mexico to NZ in the last year or so?
Or did Gonzalez own 196 and 198?
Or am I going completely bonkers?
(The initials of the owner of "my" 189 are NR)
The car I was talking about was #189, though I may of course transposed the numbers in error
However, my notes have Pablo Gonzalez as owner of 198 in 2000
Does this mean two cars went from Mexico to NZ in the last year or so?
Or did Gonzalez own 196 and 198?
Or am I going completely bonkers?
(The initials of the owner of "my" 189 are NR)
#13
cstlhn
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Posted 11 December 2006 - 23:28
I know of two rear engined Stanguellinis. One is in the Stanguellini Museum in Modena, Italy and the other is in the collection of Lawrence Auriana. It was supposed to have raced at this years Monaco Historics but was disqualified? I do not know if there was a third? Also which car is in my photo?
David
David
#14
silicanza
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Posted 12 December 2006 - 00:50
David. Your numbers are transposed. 198 is the chassis number.
NR.. thats me....Nigel (Hunter) Russell.
The other Mexican cars are:
196, Pablos car , run by Leonel M. Garza - Monterrey in 1961.
195, Guido Terzi 1961, car, restored by Alamo sports Tx, then to NY . Don't know where this is.
197, is with Kermit at Alamo sports cars.
The other Mexican driver of Stanguellinis was Juan Manuel Rullán. Did he drive 197?...or, apparantly there is one remaining chassis still in Mexico. Number ???
Lorenzo Bandini ran a Stanguellini in the I Carrerra Cd de Mexico early 1961, what the chassis number was or if the car went back to Italy I don't know. Here in lies another question.
Carlos Jaliffe recent released biography, will have a good photo of the 198 and 196 on the circuit racing in 1961. Its not in colour and is the best photo I have so far. Thanks to Carlos.
The car ran at the Mexican GP so there should be photos laying around, just a process of finding them.
Any leads to intenational photographers that would have been at the circuit that year?
NR.. thats me....Nigel (Hunter) Russell.
The other Mexican cars are:
196, Pablos car , run by Leonel M. Garza - Monterrey in 1961.
195, Guido Terzi 1961, car, restored by Alamo sports Tx, then to NY . Don't know where this is.
197, is with Kermit at Alamo sports cars.
The other Mexican driver of Stanguellinis was Juan Manuel Rullán. Did he drive 197?...or, apparantly there is one remaining chassis still in Mexico. Number ???
Lorenzo Bandini ran a Stanguellini in the I Carrerra Cd de Mexico early 1961, what the chassis number was or if the car went back to Italy I don't know. Here in lies another question.
Carlos Jaliffe recent released biography, will have a good photo of the 198 and 196 on the circuit racing in 1961. Its not in colour and is the best photo I have so far. Thanks to Carlos.
The car ran at the Mexican GP so there should be photos laying around, just a process of finding them.
Any leads to intenational photographers that would have been at the circuit that year?
#15
Cirrus
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Posted 12 December 2006 - 07:41
The Stanguellini "Delfino" did not actually get to race at Monaco this year. Having qualified fastest, it was disqualified for having illegal dampers.
It saved them from having to strip the engine....
It saved them from having to strip the engine....
#16
David McKinney
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Posted 12 December 2006 - 07:43
Thanks Nigel
I deliberately mentioned initials only in case you wanted to maintain your anonymity ;)
Matteo Panini in Italy owns a car alleged to be ex-Bandini, though whether or not it is the one that went to Mexico I don't know. And I don't know the number. He should be relatively easy to track down via google - or PM Graham Gauld
I deliberately mentioned initials only in case you wanted to maintain your anonymity ;)
Matteo Panini in Italy owns a car alleged to be ex-Bandini, though whether or not it is the one that went to Mexico I don't know. And I don't know the number. He should be relatively easy to track down via google - or PM Graham Gauld
#17
silicanza
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Posted 12 December 2006 - 12:24
No problem with anonymity when you live as far as we do.
Do you ever come back and visit?
I am surprised how few photos of the early racing days of the Rodriguez brothers are in circulation. I surpose most of the focus is on their racing outside of Mexico. NZ was lucky in having Jack Inwood photographing at the circuits. I can only hope he had a Mexican equivalent.
Do you ever come back and visit?
I am surprised how few photos of the early racing days of the Rodriguez brothers are in circulation. I surpose most of the focus is on their racing outside of Mexico. NZ was lucky in having Jack Inwood photographing at the circuits. I can only hope he had a Mexican equivalent.
#18
David McKinney
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Posted 12 December 2006 - 12:45
Long time since I've been back to NZ - might make it 2007 though, if everything pans out
#19
silicanza
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Posted 12 December 2006 - 13:00
Know doubt we will see you. I'am just around the corner from Roger Herrick. See him most days.
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#20
Pedro 917
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Posted 12 December 2006 - 13:35
Don't get your hopes too high Nigel, even Carlos had a very hard time to find pictures of the early days. Most of his pictures are from the Rodriguez family and members of the Scuderia Rodriguez. They've lost a lot of them as a result of the earthquake of 1985 when mama Rodriguez' apartment collapsed. Also, negatives from that era are very very rare.
I was thinking of the book "American Racing" that has a lot of pictures from that period, amongst them pictures of a Formula Junior race in Cuba (IIRC). I can check for the editor tonight when I return from work.
I was thinking of the book "American Racing" that has a lot of pictures from that period, amongst them pictures of a Formula Junior race in Cuba (IIRC). I can check for the editor tonight when I return from work.
#21
silicanza
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Posted 12 December 2006 - 20:06
Thanks Carlos. I have not seen the book.
Probably the best hope for a photo is by a visitor to the GP at the time.
I am fairly sure (not certain) that 198 was silver with a white stripe. What colour the underlying flash was I have no idea.
Are you able to post the photo of Terzi's stanguellini and George Koehnes ELVA?
Probably the best hope for a photo is by a visitor to the GP at the time.
I am fairly sure (not certain) that 198 was silver with a white stripe. What colour the underlying flash was I have no idea.
Are you able to post the photo of Terzi's stanguellini and George Koehnes ELVA?
#22
Pedro 917
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Posted 12 December 2006 - 21:40
Hi Nigel,
Here's the only picture in the book but the #2 car is a Stanguellini, following your description, it may help. The picture was taken in Cuba 1960.
copyright : Tom Burnside
The book says you can contact Tom Burnside : tbside@aol.com for more info about the pictures.
Cheers,
Luc Ghys
Here's the only picture in the book but the #2 car is a Stanguellini, following your description, it may help. The picture was taken in Cuba 1960.
copyright : Tom Burnside
The book says you can contact Tom Burnside : tbside@aol.com for more info about the pictures.
Cheers,
Luc Ghys
#23
silicanza
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Posted 13 December 2006 - 08:59
Hi Luc. Great action photo. thanks for posting. # 2, #42 and car 32? in the centre rear are all Stanguellini FJ. The other car in the left rear looks to be a Cooper.
On car #2, below the "LASO" there is a circular logo, could these be the wings and body of the Eagle on the Scuderia Rodriguez badge?
On car #2, below the "LASO" there is a circular logo, could these be the wings and body of the Eagle on the Scuderia Rodriguez badge?
#24
Pedro 917
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Posted 13 December 2006 - 10:42
No Nigel, that was a sticker of a local sponsor that all cars had.
