Racing Minors

I saw something different in Minors today. A flat 4 Subaru motor. Not quite certain why but it was a neat conversion complete with 2 downdraught carbs. And it was a convertible! I should have taken a photo, I had the camera in my pocket!

Lee you really need to get out more! :-)

I saw something different in Minors today. A flat 4 Subaru motor. Not quite certain why but it was a neat conversion complete with 2 downdraught carbs. And it was a convertible! I should have taken a photo, I had the camera in my pocket!

Lee, if my memory serves me correctly the MM engine bay was originally designed to take a flat 4 engine.

I forget the details but somebody on here is bound to know...

 

Lee, if my memory serves me correctly the MM engine bay was originally designed to take a flat 4 engine.

I forget the details but somebody on here is bound to know...

 

That is what I understood too. And that would have been before they widened the body!

 

Lee, if my memory serves me correctly the MM engine bay was originally designed to take a flat 4 engine.

I forget the details but somebody on here is bound to know...

 

Yes and in period a few were fitted with Jowett Javelin motors which didn't 'alf make 'em go - particularly when accelerating, as an axle ratio that was high enough wasn't available then.

 

Lee, if my memory serves me correctly the MM engine bay was originally designed to take a flat 4 engine.

I forget the details but somebody on here is bound to know...

 

Yes Issy was interested in a flat four prototype, but the hierarchy wanted him to use existing ancient engines....then (was it Leonard Lord?) came along and said the body is too wide, take 6" out of it!  after the lowlight jigs had been made.  That's why you see the split bumper bars and centre bonnet moulding etc

I thought it was the other way round - When they made the prototype Issigonis (or was it Lord Nuffield?) decided the car was too narrow so they cut it down the middle and made it 6" wider.  As they had already purchased a load of bumpers shaped to fit the front end they had to cut them in the middle and insert a spacer piece.

Mick, i think D-Type is correct.

Mick, i think D-Type is correct.

I think he is too!...Issy was minimalist and wanted only the interior room he thought was appropriate... 

So glad we eventually narrowed the gap in our collective recollections ;-) 

Pleased to see you've broadened you knowledge, after that minor slip-up, Mick.

found this interesting image of a minor sponsored by BMC of san francisco. I think this is 1963 at bonneville utah. hope the link works ! sorry about the fluff ! the proper shot is about half way down the page.

mike in canada    http://www.jalopyjou...28585&page=4148

Edited by group7, 18 November 2013 - 02:30.

found this interesting image of a minor sponsored by BMC of san francisco. I think this is 1963 at bonneville utah. hope the link works ! sorry about the fluff ! the proper shot is about half way down the page.
 
mike in canada    http://www.jalopyjou...28585&page=4148

I thought it was the other way round - When they made the prototype Issigonis (or was it Lord Nuffield?) decided the car was too narrow so they cut it down the middle and made it 6" wider.  As they had already purchased a load of bumpers shaped to fit the front end they had to cut them in the middle and insert a spacer piece.

Issigonis was very unhappy about the widening, I believe.

One of the main reasons Minors were overlooked for the A35 was the front suspension...Minor had torsion bar and those 'B' awfull Armstrong Knee action shocks.

The early side valves had a shorter engine compartment and when they went to the OHV motor they had to notch a section about 10L x  2D  Inches out of the firewall to fit the taller engines rocker box .

I fitted several different motors into my old 52 Series MM side valve , and endless hours with torsion bars

Cheers

Lynds

One of the main reasons Minors were overlooked for the A35 was the front suspension...Minor had torsion bar and those 'B' awfull Armstrong Knee action shocks.
The early side valves had a shorter engine compartment and when they went to the OHV motor they had to notch a section about 10L x  2D  Inches out of the firewall to fit the taller engines rocker box .
I fitted several different motors into my old 52 Series MM side valve , and endless hours with torsion bars
 
Cheers
Lynds

Yes Roger, but it had wishbones and it was easier to fit telescopics. Minors, you could put telescopics on the back, Konis completely stopped the axle tramp but the front end was harder to sort out. Somewhere on another thread I mentioned Harry Ratcliffe's Minor with 3 anti roll bars. 

The C type Jaguar had torsion bars too of I remember correctly

Edited by Sharman, 18 November 2013 - 21:54.

My Hillclimb Minor - Last used early 90's - 

due for a resurrection soon

Standard steel body shell , but ford gearbox and english axle 

to handle 1380cc 'A' series with KAD 16v head [180ish bananas]

Edited by carlt, 18 November 2013 - 22:15.

a bit more information which I think ? applies to the minor at bonneville back in post #111 "the other competitor in the class, a morris minor entered by richard hart, blew two engines in his efforts, missed cracking 100 mph by a fraction. he had what was essentially an oversize formula junior engine-a mark 11 sprite block, MG 1100 crank and .180-inch overbore-totalling just over 1200cc. a weber 45DCOE carburetor helped to develop 85 hp at 6000, but it wasn't enough" I found this info on sports car digest.

   mike in canada

Edited by bradbury west, 21 November 2013 - 19:57.

thanks for that information bradbury, I shall have to watch out for that issue in the shops.

   mike in canada

As posted elsewhere:

Pacific Northwest Historics, Pacific Raceways, Kent, Washington, July 5-7

Back to basics...guest celebrity Brian Redman with Stephen Newby and Newby's Morris

Vince H.

Edited by raceannouncer2003, 19 November 2013 - 06:54.

As posted elsewhere:

 

Pacific Northwest Historics, Pacific Raceways, Kent, Washington, July 5-7

Back to basics...guest celebrity Brian Redman with Stephen Newby and Newby's Morris

 

Vince H.

Tradesman's racing Vince. That's a pick-up

I think I've asked this before. 
 
In Britain, people seemed to prefer to race the Austin A35 rather than the Morris Minor - Why? 
 
Both were powered by the A-Series so power was the same. Was the A35 lighter?  It's wheelbase was shorter, did this improve cornering and handling.  Was the monocoque stiffer? Or was it simply cheaper?

When I was younger in the late 60's, we put K Series Corolla motors into Morris Minors. I had one with x4 Amal carbs and more, which pulled 7200rpm in top gear, 3.7 diff, over 100mph. We used to go out past Murray Bridge and pass HK Holdens at the "Ton" and watch their disbelieving faces. Morris Major brakes ofcourse. We had a group of blokes here in Adelaide with crazy Morrises. All road registered, engines included 1900cc Fiat, 186 Holden 6, MGA1600, Cortina 1600 c/flow, even a van with a 4 cylinder Bedford truck motor. Also Bug Eyed Sprites with Galant 1600, Corolla, 179 Holden 6, MGA 1600, Rotary Mazda, and the "Frite" with a Chrysler Valiant Six. They were the days!!

Pete S.

Well, Brian started racing in a Minor estate car (station wagon) so they're not far off

Really?  A Traveller, with a wooden framed body?  That must have had outstanding chassis stiffness!

Hello,

I am new to this forum but have visited it a few times previously.

I was hoping that someone could answer a question for me, I am researching the Harry Ratcliffe Minor 1000 with a view to building a model and I am trying to find the correct colour for the car.

I have seen it refered to as grey or green?  I have read through this thread and looked on the British Vita site but I have not come across a definite answer.

Thank you.

Cheers

Eric

Now dons tin hat in case someone chucks a brick at me as the answer is in here and obvious!

Really?  A Traveller, with a wooden framed body?  That must have had outstanding chassis stiffness!

Probably a Van that had been wooded...much more common in Oz than genuine Woody's :wink:

Edited by 275 GTB-4, 21 November 2013 - 05:12.

Hello,

 

I am new to this forum but have visited it a few times previously.

I was hoping that someone could answer a question for me, I am researching the Harry Ratcliffe Minor 1000 with a view to building a model and I am trying to find the correct colour for the car.

I have seen it refered to as grey or green?  I have read through this thread and looked on the British Vita site but I have not come across a definite answer.

Thank you.

 

Cheers

Eric

 

Now dons tin hat in case someone chucks a brick at me as the answer is in here and obvious!

Very definitely Grey

Really?  A Traveller, with a wooden framed body?  That must have had outstanding chassis stiffness!

Whilst we are on the subject of racing Minors; back in the '70's a certain J. Funnell used to appear in the club racing results driving a Morris Minor. Does anyone know whether he was the Jim Funnell who was studying Mechanical Engineering at Leicester Poly at the same time as me in the late '60's? He owned a "split screen" Minor which was far from standard. 

Can't vouch for James Funnell's polytechnic provenance, but here are two shots of his Minor taken circa 1979/80. The first shows the car at rest in the Oulton Park paddock and the action snap hails from Country Corner, Aintree.

The car has clearly moved on but I remember seeing a photo, probably in Motoring News presumably earlier in the '70's when it looked more like a road car and being split screen and four door was probably the car he had as a student. Interesting that in later development he has retained the outline of 4 doors.

Edited by bradbury west, 21 November 2013 - 22:53.

Just catching up on this resurrected thread.

Herewith a photo of that New Zealand mid-60s icon, the Morrari, in its Borrani wheeled period.

In truth, it shouldn't really be considered a 'Racing Minor', it's more like the circuit-racing equivalent of a dragstrip 'funny car'. The body was the only Morris Minor part of the car, and it was used mainly because of the similarity of wheelbase with the Ferrari. The body is actually made from 2 different models of Minor, only the front portion being from a low-light.

But it was electrifyingly fast, and the Girling disc brakes should have stopped it quite well.

Stu Buchanan

Just catching up on this resurrected thread.

 

Herewith a photo of that New Zealand mid-60s icon, the Morrari, in its Borrani wheeled period.

 

 

In truth, it shouldn't really be considered a 'Racing Minor', it's more like the circuit-racing equivalent of a dragstrip 'funny car'. The body was the only Morris Minor part of the car, and it was used mainly because of the similarity of wheelbase with the Ferrari. The body is actually made from 2 different models of Minor, only the front portion being from a low-light.

 

But it was electrifyingly fast, and the Girling disc brakes should have stopped it quite well.

 

Stu Buchanan

That is exactly the point I made early in the thread. It is all very interesting but they are NOT Racing Minors.

Hello,

 

I am new to this forum but have visited it a few times previously.

I was hoping that someone could answer a question for me, I am researching the Harry Ratcliffe Minor 1000 with a view to building a model and I am trying to find the correct colour for the car.

I have seen it refered to as grey or green?  I have read through this thread and looked on the British Vita site but I have not come across a definite answer.

Thank you.

 

Cheers

Eric

 

Now dons tin hat in case someone chucks a brick at me as the answer is in here and obvious!

Harry Ratcliff's Minor was Green, there is colour footage of it at Mallory in 1961,  

That is exactly the point I made early in the thread. It is all very interesting but they are NOT Racing Minors.

'Racing' Minors is a contradiction in terms. All racing Minors have been much modified. Many became Sports Sedan type racers. A Minor with a sub 1 litre engine and tiny drum brakes was never a racer

Lee

I can assure you that in the late 50s well tuned sub 1000cc minors were very much racers, tiny brake drums with Ferodo linings did not have much effect I admit, the usual remedy was to fit Riley/Wolsely 1.5 brakes.

At the same time Harry's Minor was Grey. By way of explanation I must add that it was Grey whenever he lapped me.

Edited by Sharman, 23 November 2013 - 10:49.

Edited by bradbury west, 23 November 2013 - 17:35.

Those not familiar with the redoubtable Harry Ratcliffe might enjoy this piece from years ago. The last para resolves the colour. I must declare my bias as HR was/is one of my boyhood heroes.
You might also enjoy the rest of the British Vita website, a top team in those halcyon days.
http://mountgreen.co..._Ratcliffe.html
Roger Lund

You only need to read the FIRST paragraph Roger, to confirm the veracity of my statement

John

Grey it is then.  Would that been a factory grey, looks quite dark.

Edited by luca, 23 November 2013 - 22:12.

I clearly got too engrossed in the story, and only remembered the key last para. There is a similar write up later in 1962 AS, I recall, detailing the spec and prep of Rod Bloor's A35 and A40. I will turn it up and scan just for the record as the spec is remarkable for the day. In his autobiog Memoirs of a Rallying clergyman dear old Rupert Jones goes into some detailing of the spec of the record breaking a35 which CUAC used at Montlhery in 57, similarly covered in a Sporting Cars article too, as he does with VOK 490, the 100/6 used similarly. Both of those cars enjoyed works support from Abingdon via Marcus Chambers, endorsing Roger Clark's earlier point. Rupert also mentions some of the tweaks used by Doc Shepherd in his A35. His A40 is well documented in The Autocar.
Roger Lund

Pretty well all the work on Rod's cars (Sport's Motors) was done by Denis Wolstenholme, who, earlier, had built and modified Alex McMillans cars. He offered to do a Renault 5 TS for me when I had a Renault Main Dealership, unhappily that was in the early 70s when business was so bad that in one 6 month period we didn't sell 1 new car!!!!. And they think it has been tough over the last few years.

Warwick Farm Creek Corner 6th September 1968

Edited by 275 GTB-4, 27 December 2013 - 10:40.

Warwick Farm Creek Corner 6th September 1968...possibly camera angle, but looks like mid to rear-mounted Driver!

.......and the front end looks odd too. Another of these non Racing Minors

They look like Holden wheels so possibly Holden suspension and grey powered? ....sure looks like a racing Minor to me

Edited by 275 GTB-4, 28 December 2013 - 05:27.

GTB

It looks to me as though it is a Minor body over a something or other frame, the driver appears to be sitting over the rear axle, the track all round is exceedingly wide and the front axle line looks well forward, suggesting an engine centralised as much as possible.  

Not a Racing Minor, a bitza which has had Minor body parts used to hide its knickers.