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Motorcycle racing 1969-1990 nostalgia 2


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#19851 Rennmax

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Posted 01 October 2010 - 17:25

Some nice bikes to be auctioned here from the German Willi Marewski collection, but 160 000 to 180 000 GBP for a BSA triple ?? The 7R seems to be a bargain compared to that amount, so come on Russ :wave:

http://www.classic-a...m-1274.aspx?p=1

Edited by Rennmax, 01 October 2010 - 17:30.


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#19852 justpassing

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Posted 01 October 2010 - 17:31

Hans Otto is riding in heaven since '97 ....

God bless him, but I think even Hans Otto would have cracked up laughing at that one. :rotfl:

PS, I hope Hermann Tilke hasn´t had anything to do with the great race track in the sky. ;)

#19853 Rennmax

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Posted 01 October 2010 - 17:44

PS, I hope Hermann Tilke hasn´t had anything to do with the great race track in the sky.;)


Let Hermann Tilke design his mickey mouse tracks, guys like Hans Otto Butenuth always preferred circuits :wave:

Edited by Rennmax, 01 October 2010 - 17:45.


#19854 Russell Burrows

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Posted 01 October 2010 - 18:17

Some nice bikes to be auctioned here from the German Willi Marewski collection, but 160 000 to 180 000 GBP for a BSA triple ?? The 7R seems to be a bargain compared to that amount, so come on Russ :wave:

http://www.classic-a...m-1274.aspx?p=1

In my dreams, Renn - nice looking one though, matching numbers an all.

#19855 justpassing

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Posted 01 October 2010 - 18:28

Let Hermann Tilke design his mickey mouse tracks, guys like Hans Otto Butenuth always preferred circuits :wave:

To true :wave:

#19856 Macca

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Posted 01 October 2010 - 18:42

Yes, the first replies were right - Small Part, who was sharing with Scott, and Helmut Dahne.

Paul M

#19857 Rennmax

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Posted 01 October 2010 - 18:43

This is good innit.
Posted Image


Looks a bit like Imatra, 3 Jack Findlay, 7 Keith Turner, 6 Paul Smart ?, 17 John Dodds, but who's the guy with the jet helmet sitting on the MV ??

Edited by Rennmax, 01 October 2010 - 18:45.


#19858 Russell Burrows

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Posted 01 October 2010 - 18:50

Looks a bit like Imatra, 3 Jack Findlay, 7 Keith Turner, 6 Paul Smart ?, but who's the guy with the jet helmet sitting on the MV ??


Looks like Kelvin Carruthers dosen't it. According to the blurb it's Ago; an accompanying photo shows him wearing Rod Gould's crash helmet. Doesn't actually look much like him in this one though, aye. You've cracked the rest Renn.

Edited by Russell Burrows, 01 October 2010 - 21:04.


#19859 Arthur

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Posted 01 October 2010 - 18:53

Some nice bikes to be auctioned here from the German Willi Marewski collection, but 160 000 to 180 000 GBP for a BSA triple ?? The 7R seems to be a bargain compared to that amount, so come on Russ :wave:

http://www.classic-a...m-1274.aspx?p=1

Notice my old Guzzi is up for auction.Oh how i wish I had kept it instead of selling fo £145 to a collector.Mind you it has really been restored well as last time i saw it it was laying in the IoM mountain museum in a delapidated state. Well done Richard you made a great job of it

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#19860 Rennmax

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Posted 01 October 2010 - 19:02

Looks like Kelvin Carruthers dosen't it. According to the blurb it's Ago; an accompanying photo shows him wearing Rod Gould's crash helmet. Doesn't actually look much like him in this one though, aye. You've cracked the rest Renn; I think though that's John Dodds up the back there between Ago and number 32.


Strange indeed. I know that Ago once tried Gould's Buco helmet in practice ( I think it was in Brno), but I have a feeling that pic shows a race start... doesn't the MV rider wear spectacles :confused:

#19861 philippe7

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Posted 01 October 2010 - 19:11

Looks like Kelvin Carruthers dosen't it. According to the blurb it's Ago; an accompanying photo shows him wearing Rod Gould's crash helmet. Doesn't actually look much like him in this one though, aye. You've cracked the rest Renn; I think though that's John Dodds up the back there between Ago and number 32.


Vincent Glon's Racing Memo site does say that Ago tried Rod Gould's Buco helmet "in practice", but it seems he did so in the race too... ;)
http://www.kakeh.com...tart500_692.jpg
http://www.kakeh.com/imatra/images/Start69!!.jpg

#19862 Rennmax

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Posted 01 October 2010 - 19:12

Notice my old Guzzi is up for auction.Oh how i wish I had kept it instead of selling fo £145 to a collector.Mind you it has really been restored well as last time i saw it it was laying in the IoM mountain museum in a delapidated state. Well done Richard you made a great job of it


From 145 GBP to a 30 000 - 35 000 GBP price tag. No bad interest rate, even when you take account of the restauration :stoned:

Edited by Rennmax, 01 October 2010 - 19:21.


#19863 Rennmax

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Posted 01 October 2010 - 19:25

Vincent Glon's Racing Memo site does say that Ago tried Rod Gould's Buco helmet "in practice", but it seems he did so in the race too...;)
http://www.kakeh.com...tart500_692.jpg
http://www.kakeh.com/imatra/images/Start69!!.jpg


Thanks Philippe, mystery solved. #3 on the far right could be Steve Ellis

#19864 philippe7

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Posted 01 October 2010 - 19:47

Thanks Philippe, mystery solved. #3 on the far right could be Steve Ellis


Yes indeed , Steve Ellis it is .

I'm still quite puzzled though, if you go to the relevant season description page on Vincent Glon's site
http://racingmemo.fr...OTO-GP-1969.htm
and scroll down the page 'til you get to the Imatra race, there is a picture from the start of the race that shows the same bunch of riders, but in apparently different grid positions , and with Ago wearing, as far as I can tell, his usual helmet in Italian colours ..... could it be that in those days , in Imatra, the practice sessions were also given a "bump start" from standing positions ? and that those pics from the kakeh site would be from one of those ? If I'm not mistaken Imatra is one of those circuits ( like Anderstorp ) where the pits/paddock are not situated on the start-finish line, which might explain things ....

#19865 roadshop

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Posted 01 October 2010 - 20:35

Looks a bit like Imatra, 3 Jack Findlay, 7 Keith Turner, 6 Paul Smart ?, 17 John Dodds, but who's the guy with the jet helmet sitting on the MV ??



Could # 6 be Esso Gunnarson?

#19866 philippe7

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Posted 01 October 2010 - 21:38

Could # 6 be Esso Gunnarson?


Like Rennmax, I think #6 is Paul Smart .

#19867 Russell Burrows

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Posted 01 October 2010 - 21:47

On Joe Francis' Seeley.

#19868 Arthur

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Posted 02 October 2010 - 14:11

From 145 GBP to a 30 000 - 35 000 GBP price tag. No bad interest rate, even when you take account of the restauration :stoned:

Sure is If we had all kept our old racers instead of selling them for peanuts now in old age they would provide a better pension fund than the insurance companies can In my case E.M.C PUCH-MOTO GUZZI-AERMACCHI-BULTACO- 2 MANX NORTONS-ROYAL ENFIELD GP- DUCATI 125 HONDA CR110-DMW
and I did a straight swop of the Ducati 125 for an immaculate rebuilt BROUGH SUPERIOR 100cc V TWIN MATCHLESS ENGINED. Sold it for £250 what a fool I was. But there we raced on a shoestring and sponsorship and financial help was rare.No advertising allowed on yourself or bikes in those days. First advertising on a bike I ever see was at the Ulster GP in Ireland around 1969 Guess what it was for Answer 'DUREX' banned in south then but legal in north LOL

Edited by Arthur, 02 October 2010 - 14:12.


#19869 Rennmax

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Posted 02 October 2010 - 15:57

Those were the days Arthur...in the early seventies, I was offered a Vincent Black Shadow in fair condition for 2000 Deutschmarks, then 2/3 of a new Japanese 250 cc bike. Well, I didn't have the money...and probably not the skill to maintain it

Edited by Rennmax, 02 October 2010 - 16:00.


#19870 Rennmax

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Posted 02 October 2010 - 16:14

Nice X-mas present

http://www.bonhams.c...SaleSectionNo=2

Edited by Rennmax, 02 October 2010 - 16:16.


#19871 HEMEYLA

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Posted 02 October 2010 - 16:49

..... could it be that in those days , in Imatra, the practice sessions were also given a "bump start" from standing positions ?


Thats right, for the public (and the riders) practice was like a race.

Kake Heikkinen:

1=Ago
32=Lindh
7=Turner
22=Hansen
6=Smart
27=Kuparinen
5=Ellis

Edited by HEMEYLA, 02 October 2010 - 17:03.


#19872 Russell Burrows

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Posted 02 October 2010 - 17:20

Nice X-mas present

http://www.bonhams.c...SaleSectionNo=2

I can recall first seeing at Brands on what must have been one of its first public appearances. My memory is that much to the displeasure of Mr Seeley, John dropped it during the practice session and as a result received an immediate ban from riding it any more, at least for that day. It did reappear though, with Colin himself giving it a squirt for a few laps.

Edited by Russell Burrows, 02 October 2010 - 18:11.


#19873 Rennmax

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Posted 02 October 2010 - 17:45

I can recall first seeing at Brands on what must have been one of its first public appearances. My memory is that much to the displeasure of Mr Seeley, John dropped it during the practice session and received an immediate ban from riding it any more, at least for that day. It did reappear though, with Colin himself giving it a squirt for a few laps.


Hi Russ, have just taken a look into Colin's book Vol 1, Page 192, where these happenings are reported, at least from his point of view.. would be nice if Jim would comment. Wonder who ownes the bike now plus the sidecar outfit, the lot before. Yesterday we spotted parts of the Marewski collection, now we have these ones, some people need money so it seems

Edited by Rennmax, 02 October 2010 - 18:50.


#19874 knickerbrook

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Posted 02 October 2010 - 18:44

In that Imatra shot, the rider behind Smart (with pudding basin, and in line with the tree trunk) looks like it could be Godfrey Nash?

#19875 Russell Burrows

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Posted 02 October 2010 - 18:49

In that Imatra shot, the rider behind Smart (with pudding basin, and in line with the tree trunk) looks like it could be Godfrey Nash?


http://www.kakeh.com...tart500_692.jpg

I think you're right Barry and perhaps Lewis Young number 32?

#19876 Rennmax

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Posted 02 October 2010 - 18:54

http://www.kakeh.com...tart500_692.jpg

I think you're right Barry and perhaps Lewis Young number 32?



...and Billie Nelson behind Steve Ellis

#19877 Russell Burrows

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Posted 02 October 2010 - 19:12

...and Billie Nelson behind Steve Ellis

Definitely :up:

#19878 Rennmax

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Posted 08 October 2010 - 11:54

Does anyone know if a claim for prominent machinery has ever taken place according to the AMA claim rule beside Cooper's BSA at Ontario in '71 ?? Does this rule still exist ? Thanks

#19879 jaybee49

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Posted 08 October 2010 - 14:11

Hi Russ, have just taken a look into Colin's book Vol 1, Page 192, where these happenings are reported, at least from his point of view.. would be nice if Jim would comment. Wonder who ownes the bike now plus the sidecar outfit, the lot before. Yesterday we spotted parts of the Marewski collection, now we have these ones, some people need money so it seems


I am not quite sure what you would like me to comment on really. John sold it all to a guy down south called Michael Start or something like that, in the early 90's - 93, I think maybe. When John was home in Aug/Sept from Thailand, and to race at Schotten, Colin who works for Bonhams asked to have a meeting with John to discuss what John could remember about the whole equip and most of what was discussed, I guess it appears now on the Bonhams page/link.

It went against the grain really as John is quite fed up with the whole subject these days and has moved on , but he obliged from what I gather and supplied what info he could to Colin.

I have read the Colin's explanation of what went on about the subject and I was at Brands for the Hutch, and also at Snetterton when the engine was removed from the Seeley frame, in his book - Vol 1, and it seems quite an accurate account of everything as far as I can remember...

Here is a pic of me helping John & Helmut trying to get it started at Brands Hatch on the Saturday morning of the Hutch.

Posted Image

John giving the renovated URS solo a run at the Nurburgring about 1991.

Posted Image

I am attending the Stafford Classic Bike show next week, so I am interested to see what happens and how much it all goes for....

Hope that helps.

Edited by jaybee49, 08 October 2010 - 14:15.


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#19880 Rennmax

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Posted 08 October 2010 - 15:25

Thanks a lot for your post, Jim. When I read the mentioned passage in Colin Seeley's book, I wondered if there was a kind of tension between John and him from the beginning of the URS project. Colin writes about a 'nervous Blanchard' and ' unfortunately, in my opinion, Blanchard got carried away and had not taken into account it should have been 'steady as you go' on the first race event outing. He was going too quickly too soon, I was absolutely furious'. He also states a bit later that John blamed the exhaust system as reason for the crash though.
English is not my native tongue so I possibly got it completely wrong, but reading between the lines, there seems to be some sort of strain between Colin and John and the switch to the Lockheed/Rickman brake was only the final straw ?

Hoping I'm not too indiscreet....

Edited by Rennmax, 08 October 2010 - 15:52.


#19881 jaybee49

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Posted 08 October 2010 - 16:02

Thanks a lot for your post, Jim. When I read the mentioned passage in Colin Seeley's book, I wondered if there was a kind of tension between John and him from the beginning of the URS project. Colin writes about a 'nervous Blanchard' and ' unfortunately, in my opinion, Blanchard got carried away and had not taken into account it should have been 'steady as you go' on the first race event outing. He was going too quickly too soon, I was absolutely furious'. He also states a bit later that John blamed the exhaust system as reason for the crash though.
English is not my native tongue so I possibly got it completely wrong, but reading between the lines, there seems to be some sort of strain between Colin and John and the switch to the Lockheed/Rickman brake was only the final straw ?

Hoping I'm not too indiscreet....



Well, it does not appear that John was his ‘blued eyed boy’ as in the same way John Cooper was that‘s for sure…

I believe that the disc brake issue was the straw that broke the camel’s back.

#19882 Rennmax

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Posted 11 October 2010 - 18:23

Thanks Jim, pics from John's camp in Schotten

Posted Image

Posted Image

Edited by Rennmax, 11 October 2010 - 18:24.


#19883 Russell Burrows

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Posted 23 October 2010 - 19:45

C'mon guys have a go at this one, you know you want to. Oh, and I'm certain of only one of them.
Posted Image

#19884 picblanc

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Posted 23 October 2010 - 19:53

Some where in Holland, only one who looks a bit familiar is#5 who could be Godfrey Nash?
Oh &#32 Les Kenny?

#19885 Russell Burrows

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Posted 23 October 2010 - 20:07

Some where in Holland, only one who looks a bit familiar is#5 who could be Godfrey Nash?
Oh &#32 Les Kenny?


Been on the bench for a while Gra, but you're in pretty good form. It is Les, and I'm almost certainl it's Tilburg, 1975. I don't know the rest :blush:


#19886 gmwzorro

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Posted 23 October 2010 - 20:34

C'mon guys have a go at this one, you know you want to. Oh, and I'm certain of only one of them.
Posted Image

2 looks like Boet Van Dulmen and Rob Bron for 5 ???

Edited by gmwzorro, 23 October 2010 - 20:41.


#19887 HEMEYLA

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Posted 23 October 2010 - 21:43

Raalte races on the Luttenbergring 1975, it's 5 minutes from here at racing speed :lol: (no houses around Tilburg / Hilvarenbeek / recreationpark De Beekse Bergen circuit).

The "Hendrikabocht" with "backmarkers":

32. Les Kenny, 11
5. Bert Struijk, 14
9. Gerrit Veldink, 13
2. Wietse Veenstra, 12
46. Helmut Kassner, 17

All on Yamaha (351-500 ccm)

#19888 Russell Burrows

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Posted 23 October 2010 - 22:00

Raalte races on the Luttenbergring 1975, it's 5 minutes from here at racing speed :lol: (no houses around Tilburg / Hilvarenbeek / recreationpark De Beekse Bergen circuit).

The "Hendrikabocht" with "backmarkers":

32. Les Kenny, 11
5. Bert Struijk, 14
9. Gerrit Veldink, 13
2. Wietse Veenstra, 12
46. Helmut Kassner, 17

All on Yamaha (351-500 ccm)

Thanks for that :up:

#19889 HEMEYLA

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Posted 23 October 2010 - 22:06

Your'e welcome, same event 50ccm :smoking:

Posted Image

#19890 Russell Burrows

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Posted 23 October 2010 - 22:08

No idea who but he's got it cranked over at some serious angle of lean there. Ah, yourself perhaps?

Edited by Russell Burrows, 23 October 2010 - 22:17.


#19891 HEMEYLA

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Posted 23 October 2010 - 22:21

The same rider, TT Assen 1975 ........................... yes it's me. :wave:

Posted Image

#19892 Russell Burrows

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Posted 23 October 2010 - 22:26

Excellent shot. :up: I was there in '75, must have watched you.

#19893 HEMEYLA

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Posted 23 October 2010 - 22:34

9th on the startgrid but had an engine problem halfway the race, no result. :mad:

#19894 picblanc

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Posted 24 October 2010 - 12:05

Great pics Ton, any idea who this is? I posted it some years a go & did not get an answer, I think he is Dutch it was taken in 1976 @ Brands Powerbike meeting in October.
Posted Image
Photo Copyrighted to Graham Etheridge, racebikepics.

#19895 fil2.8

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Posted 24 October 2010 - 14:00

Great pics Ton, any idea who this is? I posted it some years a go & did not get an answer, I think he is Dutch it was taken in 1976 @ Brands Powerbike meeting in October.
Posted Image
Photo Copyrighted to Graham Etheridge, racebikepics.



Well , I have the prog from that meeting in my grubby little hands , and he must have been an ' extra ' as he wasn't listed :eek:

Incidently , looking through the listed riders for the 350 race ( 3 heats ) are Phil Read and Giacomo Agostini on MV's !!! , Luton boy was not riding for them then !! as was a ' Team Life ' member , entered on 500 Suzuki and tz 750 !!! , I can't remember him riding the MV then , can anyone ?? , any piccies of Ago or Luton boy on them that day , Buster ?? :confused:

#19896 picblanc

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Posted 24 October 2010 - 14:20

He did not ride the 350 MV for definite, he was 5th in MCN race on his TZ750 though.
I am sure that the final of 350 race was won by Adrian Godden, & it was the last ever apperance of the 350 MV Agusta.

#19897 fil2.8

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Posted 24 October 2010 - 14:33

He did not ride the 350 MV for definite, he was 5th in MCN race on his TZ750 though.
I am sure that the final of 350 race was won by Adrian Godden, & it was the last ever apperance of the 350 MV Agusta.



Well , according to my prog , the final was won by #50 , Christian Sarron 2nd #26 Alan North 3rd #41 Chas Mortimer 4th #28 Roger Nicholls 5th #21 Giacomo Agostini 6th #8 Tony Rutter .

Adrian Godden ( where are you ? ) won his heat of the ' Shellsport 500 ' riding #32 from Roger Nicholls and Pierre Soulas # 52 , all entered on oversize tz's :up:

#19898 picblanc

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Posted 24 October 2010 - 14:44

oops thats right Sarron won 350

#19899 fil2.8

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Posted 24 October 2010 - 14:51

oops thats right Sarron won 350


Grovel , grovel :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :p :wave:

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#19900 Rennmax

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Posted 24 October 2010 - 15:23

He did not ride the 350 MV for definite, he was 5th in MCN race on his TZ750 though.
I am sure that the final of 350 race was won by Adrian Godden, & it was the last ever apperance of the 350 MV Agusta.


I think Read's last appearance in the UK on a MV was at Cadwell Park in September that year, on a 500 notabene