did he know something?
I don't think so. I think that was more down to having a respect for past performance, which few others seem to have.
Posted 21 March 2011 - 09:55
did he know something?
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Posted 21 March 2011 - 16:45
Posted 21 March 2011 - 17:02
Posted 21 March 2011 - 17:17
It's crazy to think that this guy was so close to 13 consecutive wins.
Posted 21 March 2011 - 17:21
I dare say, if you put one of today's drivers in the best car (ie Red Bull) that had a clear margin over others, we wouldn't have seen the same sort of domination Schumacher displayed in 2002 and 2004.
Posted 21 March 2011 - 17:36
It's crazy to think that this guy was so close to 13 consecutive wins.
Yep Michael holds some unbelievable records and if I did my math correctly we have in Australia next weekend:How about an entire season on the podium every race?
Posted 21 March 2011 - 18:56
Posted 21 March 2011 - 19:07
Nice. I suppose that's what they were filming after the test at one point?Michael Schumacher and his Nice 2011 F1 Mercedes MGP W02
Posted 21 March 2011 - 19:17
Nice. I suppose that's what they were filming after the test at one point?
Posted 21 March 2011 - 19:18
Moss raced in an era where death was not uncommon. If you go back and watch those GPs it is evident the the drivers were careful to leave each other room to race. Things have changed, and Schumacher does not deserve to be singled out because the entire sport has become more aggressive. Look at the incidents Coulthard has caused, not the least of which was when he took off Schumacher's right front wheel in a blinding wet race.
Posted 21 March 2011 - 19:19
I was thinking the same. I see some water on the track where he is walking. Barcelona was dry on Friday when they filmed. Some oval also. Secret test, I hope. Nice slides. To do that he feel the car well.Some of it looks like Barcelona but they seem to have done some Rockingham filming as well
Edited by ivand911, 21 March 2011 - 19:23.
Posted 21 March 2011 - 23:41
Posted 22 March 2011 - 00:00
Michael Schumacher and his Nice 2011 F1 Mercedes MGP W02
Posted 22 March 2011 - 01:16
I dare say, if you put one of today's drivers in the best car (ie Red Bull) that had a clear margin over others, we wouldn't have seen the same sort of domination Schumacher displayed in 2002 and 2004.
Posted 22 March 2011 - 03:20
Michael Schumacher and his Nice 2011 F1 Mercedes MGP W02
Posted 22 March 2011 - 03:29
Posted 22 March 2011 - 07:25
Don't agree. Had Alonso or Hamilton been in the Red Bulls last year, it would have been domination.
Maybe not quite 2004 Ferrari proportions but close. Mainly because Red Bull still had reliability issues.
Posted 22 March 2011 - 09:08
Posted 22 March 2011 - 10:06
Posted 22 March 2011 - 12:01
If people choose to ignore the facts, even subjectively speaking, I am yet to see a single demon drive from Alonso of the same calibre as, for instance, Spain 94 or Monaco 97.
Posted 22 March 2011 - 12:13
There's no definitive evidence that LH is that much better than Vettel, or indeed better at all.Don't agree. Had Alonso or Hamilton been in the Red Bulls last year, it would have been domination.
Posted 22 March 2011 - 12:18
Its all down to opinion but I think Lewis's racecraft is far superior than that of Vettel IMO. Vettel is a hot lap specialist and has had the machinery to back him up once he has been at the front. I don't remember many races where he has had to attack from the mid field and work his way up successfully and I can think of a few examples from LH. Vettel is still reletively new and I think it will come with time, but theres no way I would put him on the same level or ahead of Hamilton in terms of ability right now.There's no definitive evidence that LH is that much better than Vettel, or indeed better at all.
Posted 22 March 2011 - 13:50
You could say I was underestimating them if there was even a shred of evidence to support the notion that they could match MS in his prime: there isn't any.
Look at their first title winning campaigns. Schumacher had effectively only 75% of the season to get the job done, was robbed of a win and had two gifted to his chief rival: and yet managed to win more than either Alonso or Hamilton could. Alonso further had the benefit of a superior car in the first half of his season,a luxury that MS didn't have. Hamilton did a better job considering how good the Ferrari was, but was it as convincing as 1994? Absolutely not. MS won more in 12 races than Alonso or Hamilton could in an entire season.
Look at Alonso's career stats. At the same stage in their respective careers, Schumacher had won more than twice as many races as Alonso has managed so far: 53 to 26. There's a massive gulf between the win percentages of someone like Alonso and drivers like Schumacher and Senna, at every stage of their careers. FA has been racing for ten years now and so far there has been absolutely nothing to suggest he is capable of doing as good a job with a dominant car. If people choose to ignore the facts, even subjectively speaking, I am yet to see a single demon drive from Alonso of the same calibre as, for instance, Spain 94 or Monaco 97. What is amusing to me is that people persist with believing this baseless 'most complete driver' nonsense because of the hype, and are then at a loss words to explain some of his 'uncharacteristic' mistakes year after year. Schumacher also had no real weaknesses at this stage in his career, unlike Hamilton who has messed up twice when it counts most.
Posted 22 March 2011 - 14:01
There's no definitive evidence that LH is that much better than Vettel, or indeed better at all.
Posted 22 March 2011 - 14:03
Raikkonen drove a better one.Oh I don't know, I thought he drove a pretty decent race at Imola in 2005.
Posted 22 March 2011 - 14:42
Edited by ivand911, 22 March 2011 - 14:42.
Posted 22 March 2011 - 15:19
Posted 22 March 2011 - 15:23
Posted 22 March 2011 - 15:28
I doubt that. They even talk about 2013.I predict this will be Michael Schumacher's last year in F1.
Posted 22 March 2011 - 15:53
Posted 22 March 2011 - 16:44
Oh I don't know, I thought he drove a pretty decent race at Imola in 2005.
I am a big-time schumi fan but even I have to admit Alonso's drive in Hungary 2006 was one of the best drives in F1 History until he had the tyre nut problem. But schumi's drive in China was like the ULTIMATE!!!!! I was watched the race again and again - Just too Good to be true. Almost reminds me the story of the hare and the tortoise .. lol
Posted 22 March 2011 - 16:57
Posted 22 March 2011 - 17:04
Posted 22 March 2011 - 17:05
Edited by BRK, 22 March 2011 - 17:06.
Posted 22 March 2011 - 17:12
I'm obviously a Michael fan, but let's give credit where it's due. Alonso was a formidable opponent in both his title winning years, and he kept his head on his shoulders and did only what was necessary to bring it home when it mattered. 2006 was a great season for both of them. The ebb and flow, first one having the advantage, then the other clawing it back. And it was all epitomized in China as the Renaults pulled out a big initial lead on a wet track and then Michael reeled them both in as the surface dried. Only Fernando could have held Michael off that year.
Posted 22 March 2011 - 17:13
Thanks for the heads-up.Hmmmm. Possibly the greatest driver of all time, makes a pretty impressive comeback and talk is of "could do better" nature!!! Without idolising the 7 times WDC I think any weaknesses perceived by armchair critics are "incredible"/
Forgive shameless promotion here but for a bit of interesting Schumacher backstory I hope you might be interested in Mark Stewart Productions' film, 'F1 60th Anniversary: Plus Ca Change' which will be shown on BBC4 at 8:00pm on Sunday 27 March. In the film, Michael himself very nearly admits to a weakness when speaking of the Jerez 1997 incident.
Posted 22 March 2011 - 17:44
Fred was great during those battles; I had similarly high respect for Mika 1998-2001 too. I never understand why some people seem to think that being a fan of driver 'A' means you need to slag the hell out of his opponents.
Posted 22 March 2011 - 17:44
Not having opportunity to see film for myself, can you elaborate on the last part, please?Forgive shameless promotion here but for a bit of interesting Schumacher backstory I hope you might be interested in Mark Stewart Productions' film, 'F1 60th Anniversary: Plus Ca Change' which will be shown on BBC4 at 8:00pm on Sunday 27 March. In the film, Michael himself very nearly admits to a weakness when speaking of the Jerez 1997 incident.
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Posted 22 March 2011 - 17:51
That's a gross generalization. At least in my case I have never and will never criticize his 'opponents' like Hakkinen (in fact I was a bit of a fan, myself), Hill or Raikkonen,or even JV and Juan Pablo. Simply because there wasn't anything to be critical of, they all got the praise they deserved from fans and the media, weren't overrated or overhyped (with the exception of JV early on), and were criticized for their failings in equal measure. More importantly, I think all of them knew where to draw the line between sport and life outside of the race track....
Can't say any of this is true in the case of Alonso. Nonetheless, I rank him as being the 4th best driver on the grid today,but all I'm saying is that Vettel and LH are a step ahead already: while MS was and is in a different league,with the Sennas and Prosts of the racing world. I don't see how this is 'slagging the hell out of' him. Then again I'm sure you know what I mean when you get called all sorts of stuff for being critical of Hamilton..;)
Bottomline: I'm not here to make friends or rack up goodwill among rival fanbases so I wouldn't be lonely when winter beckons. (I've heard this actually happens a lot on internet fora until things get really ugly and real opinions spill out the bag!) I don't have a problem with saying it like it is,that's what I'm here for.
/OT
Posted 22 March 2011 - 18:08
I wasn't particularly referring to you, but rather the all too common situation on here of people preferring to slate rather than praise. Always strikes me as odd from a gathering of people who supposedly love the sport.That's a gross generalization. At least in my case I have never and will never criticize his 'opponents' like Hakkinen (in fact I was a bit of a fan, myself), Hill or Raikkonen,or even JV and Juan Pablo. Simply because there wasn't anything to be critical of, they all got the praise they deserved from fans and the media, weren't overrated or overhyped (with the exception of JV early on), and were criticized for their failings in equal measure. More importantly, I think all of them knew where to draw the line between sport and life outside of the race track....
Can't say any of this is true in the case of Alonso. Nonetheless, I rank him as being the 4th best driver on the grid today,but all I'm saying is that Vettel and LH are a step ahead already: while MS was and is in a different league,with the Sennas and Prosts of the racing world. I don't see how this is 'slagging the hell out of' him. Then again I'm sure you know what I mean when you get called all sorts of stuff for being critical of Hamilton..;)
Bottomline: I'm not here to make friends or rack up goodwill among rival fanbases so I wouldn't be lonely when winter beckons. (I've heard this actually happens a lot on internet fora until things get really ugly and real opinions spill out the bag!) I don't have a problem with saying it like it is,that's what I'm here for.
/OT
Posted 22 March 2011 - 18:13
I think what you're trying to say is 'I won't criticize opponents who Schumacher could ultimately beat with a car or tyre advantage but i will criticize one who made him stoop to new lows (Monaco q) and retired him.'
Posted 22 March 2011 - 18:25
I agree it's often slating the drivers they're not a fan of. However in this particular case I don't think it's slating.I wasn't particularly referring to you, but rather the all too common situation on here of people preferring to slate rather than praise. Always strikes me as odd from a gathering of people who supposedly love the sport.
Anyway, back on topic ...
Edited by Augurk, 22 March 2011 - 18:26.
Posted 22 March 2011 - 18:25
I wasn't particularly referring to you, but rather the all too common situation on here of people preferring to slate rather than praise. Always strikes me as odd from a gathering of people who supposedly love the sport.
Anyway, back on topic ...
Edited by BRK, 22 March 2011 - 18:26.
Posted 22 March 2011 - 18:26
I'm not trying to troll. I just find it interesting that all Schumacher's opponents who he overcame in the end are given respect, while the one who he couldn't defeat gets none. Seems like it should be the other way round if anything. I guess the others knew their place.
Oh, joy, we have a new troll.
Posted 22 March 2011 - 18:34
I agree with you on respecting Fred, personally I think he's the best driver on the grid right now even thought I'm a Vettel fan. However, you're stretching it a very long way by suggesting that MS only overcame his other opponents with the aid of a car or tyre advantage.I'm not trying to troll. I just find it interesting that all Schumacher's opponents who he overcame in the end are given respect, while the one who he couldn't defeat gets none. Seems like it should be the other way round if anything. I guess the others knew their place.
I'm not a Schumacher fan but with the Merc looking good I do think he may get some revenge on Alonso this year.
Posted 22 March 2011 - 18:38
I'm not trying to troll. I just find it interesting that all Schumacher's opponents who he overcame in the end are given respect, while the one who he couldn't defeat gets none. Seems like it should be the other way round if anything. I guess the others knew their place.
I'm not a Schumacher fan but with the Merc looking good I do think he may get some revenge on Alonso this year.
Posted 22 March 2011 - 18:40
It's a hell of a big leap to say Alonso or Hamilton would've been as dominant as Schumacher had they been at Ferrari. Neither has shown anything that provides a base for that claim, or even to suggest that Ferrari would have been as dominant as they were had they been there in stead of Schumacher. On the contrary, recent history has shown us several incredible cars but only one driver ever to extract that kind of season-long domination from it. I say a Williams in '96, '97, McLaren in '98, Renault in '05, McLaren in '07, Brawn in '09, Red Bull in '10
Hill, Villeneuve, Hakkinen, Alonso, Hamilton/Alonso, Button, Vettel should've walked away with them easily yet they have all seen to keep it exciting until the last race. Of all of those only Button has really shown the kind of dominance during the period Brawn was still way ahead of the pack. Yet he is widely regarded as the least talented of the recent lot (Alonso/Hamilton/Vettel).
Posted 22 March 2011 - 18:48
The Schumacher domination period was absolutely achieved with a car and tyre advantage. I believe Michael is/was an incredible driver, it's just his stats and achievements are skewed by the advantage he held for these years.I agree with you on respecting Fred, personally I think he's the best driver on the grid right now even thought I'm a Vettel fan. However, you're stretching it a very long way by suggesting that MS only overcame his other opponents with the aid of a car or tyre advantage.
Posted 22 March 2011 - 18:50
Simply, Schumacher, is the best