278 replies to this topic

[Odseybod]

When the MG Car Club take over Silverstone for thier annual 'MG Live!' meeting, they employ classic busses (Routmasters being the only one I could name ) and coaches to transport the spectators around the circuit, FoC!

Thanks to everyone for posting the pictures. Great stuff.

DC

I seem to remember a vintage bus or two operating around the outside of the circuit at the 2008 Silverstone Classic, but don't remember seeing any since - maybe not concentrating at the right time. But I think the number of spectators at the furthest outposts of the circuit (Club and Stowe) may not be enough to justify it - certainly pretty sparse out there year before last.

I was actually thinking of a shuttle bus system for the inside of the circuit, though the crowds might make that unworkable without a properly segregated bus lane. Then again, it would remove the justification for those kamikaze scooters and mini-bikes mentioned earlier.

[David Lawson]

I agree regarding the need for some sort of shuttle around the circuit. I am pretty fit but it takes all my resolve now to walk the circuit with all my heavy rucksack. It is a chicken and egg situation I think, not many people currently attempt a lap of the whole circuit but I'm sure they would if they could hop on and off a mini bus. When I was at Stowe and Becketts on Friday I was in the company of about five other spectators yet these are two excellent viewing points. Even the appallingly organised GP Live at Donington managed to run a shuttle.

Regarding the comments about Silverstone lacking atmosphere and resembling an industrial estate, I don't think it is that bad. Having spectated there for over forty years I have my memories as I walk round and there are still sections of the circuit that retain the original feel of the old track. I think that as the circuit is undergoing major rebuilding this didn't help this year, hopefully next year will see it a little more finished and tidied up.

I know there are some corners where there are large run off areas but Maggotts still takes your breath away as you stand thirty feet from the cars at very high speed entering the Becketts sequence. The exit of Becketts and Chapel are well worth a look as is Stowe where you have a great view of Hangar straight, Stowe and then the drop into Vale - you also have the benefit from the stand of lovely views over the open countryside beyond. The outside and inside of Bridge and the Luffield area also gets you pretty close to the action. Abbey also has excellent viewing. The outside spectator area of Copse is too far back nowadays but the bank and stand on the inside of the corner gets you close to the track.

If they set up a shuttle and had decent signs encouraging people to have a look then I think people might change their view on the circuit.

I wasn't going to post anymore of my pictures but while I'm on here is my final batch.



The source of the greatest sound over the weekend.


Ferrari 625A


Jaguar D type and Lotus Xls


Porsche Speedster


Beautifully presented Lotus 18


A man very much at one with his machinery.


Ferrai 206A


Cooper Maserati


Porsche 356A - ex Jim Clark?


Ferrari 250lm


Co-ordinated Lotus20/22 - BMW equipe


Lola T70 hurriedly taken from the inside of Becketts just as security moved me from the prohibited area, hence the poor panning.


Talbot Lago cockpit

David

[F3Wrench]

Brilliant photos David, I'd be too embarrassed to post mine now with all these superb shots. If you think that's poor panning, you ought to see mine...

[garyfrogeye]

Le mans Classic had quite a few free train/coach/bus things that stopped at various points around the village and the Bugatti circuit picking up and dropping people off. It seemed to get through the crowds fairly well and while it didn't go to the far reaches of the circuit, it took some of the strain off of our weary feet.

[dank]

The only time I've ever seen shuttle buses trundling around Silverstone in recent years was at the MotoGP event last month. The double decker buses winding their way around the Becketts side of the circuit was most amusing, like something from On the Buses. Absolute mayhem, meeting quad bikes, hard of hearing spectators and the like.

Me, I don't mind the walk around the circuit. It's a tradition I have. Walking anti-clockwise with the cars approaching me at speed. I like it for the fact that most folk can't be bothered to make their way to Stowe and Club, two of the best spots, and so it feels like I have that section of the circuit all to myself. I'm greedy like that.

[Rob Ryder]

But what the next Classic really needs is some form of centre transport system - rather like the road train at Duxford IWM - to take you from Point A to C, if necessary via B. Should surely be possible to organise something like that, on a circular route, with stops at (say) Copse, Becketts and the bottom of the National Straight. A site the size of Silverstone really deserves something like that - and not just for old codgers contemplating an expedition to the furthest reaches of the known Universe (aka Abbey).

It has been a coule of years since I was at the Classic, have they stopped running the double-decker bus around the circuit access road? I was ideal for a quick jump from Abbey back to the car park gate #4.
Rob
Oops, just seen Odseybod's post regarding the bus..

Edited by Rob Ryder, 27 July 2010 - 18:57.

[Odseybod]

The only time I've ever seen shuttle buses trundling around Silverstone in recent years was at the MotoGP event last month. The double decker buses winding their way around the Becketts side of the circuit was most amusing, like something from On the Buses. Absolute mayhem, meeting quad bikes, hard of hearing spectators and the like.

Me, I don't mind the walk around the circuit. It's a tradition I have. Walking anti-clockwise with the cars approaching me at speed. I like it for the fact that most folk can't be bothered to make their way to Stowe and Club, two of the best spots, and so it feels like I have that section of the circuit all to myself. I'm greedy like that.

Would normally agree, Dank. But having walked from the paddock to Copse, then halfway to Becketts, then back to the Paddock Kaff & Bar, then over the two bridges and up to to Abbey, then back over the bridges to the paddock to collect Mrs Odseybod, then back over the bridges to the car park by the main entrance, there were wisps of steam to be seen rising from the footwear (at least, I hope it was steam, not miasma - didn't risk a sniff). Some form of bus travel for part(s) of the journey would have been quite welcome.

Edited by Odseybod, 27 July 2010 - 19:37.

[zakeriath]

There was a red open top double decker bus running around the track this year. Based at club all weekend I saw in quite a few times. It parked behind us to watch the historic Grand Prrix cars on Sunday.

Wether it was private or not I dont know

[Allen Brown]

They stopped running the bus around the perimeter road after Judy complained about it lapping her.

(Sorry Judy!)

[Giraffe]

They stopped running the bus around the perimeter road after Judy complained about it lapping her.

(Sorry Judy!)

You are a sad loss to the Diplomatic Corp., Allen.

[Cirrus]

Hi Alan.

Nothing to do with The Silverstone Classic, which I could not attend this year, but I keep meaning to ask who it is that is depicted on your avatar?

Ian

It's Professor Stanley Unwin, as John Winfield and others have spotted - he's a bit of a hero of mine.

"Are you all sitty comftybold two square on your botty? - Then I'll begin."

Deep Joy!

[Twin Window]

"Are you all sitty comftybold two square on your botty? - Then I'll begin."

Deep Joy!

[Barry Boor]

Deep joy, indeed. And, IIRC, For the best picket in a brewflade....

[alansart]

It's Professor Stanley Unwin, as John Winfield and others have spotted - he's a bit of a hero of mine.

"Are you all sitty comftybold two square on your botty? - Then I'll begin."

Deep Joy!

Wonderful

[F3Wrench]

They stopped running the bus around the perimeter road after Judy complained about it lapping her.

(Sorry Judy!)

[Stephen W]

When the MG Car Club take over Silverstone for thier annual 'MG Live!' meeting, they employ classic busses (Routmasters being the only one I could name ) and coaches to transport the spectators around the circuit, FoC!

I seem to remember a vintage bus or two operating around the outside of the circuit at the 2008 Silverstone Classic

I also remember the buses back in 2008.

I agree regarding the need for some sort of shuttle around the circuit. I am pretty fit but it takes all my resolve now to walk the circuit with all my heavy rucksack.

If they set up a shuttle and had decent signs encouraging people to have a look then I think people might change their view on the circuit.

I agree, if you go prepared for the day then the shuttle bus service would be an ideal way of getting round the venue. Maybe a time-table and fixed stopping off points would be a good way of encouraging the public to use the facility.

They stopped running the bus around the perimeter road after Judy complained about it lapping her.

(Sorry Judy!)

[Bauble]

As one's youth disappears rapidly in the rear view mirror, walking the circuit becomes a real chore, at most meetings one can get the car in, which makes a big difference. I must get a 'classic' and sneak it in next year.

Plenty of pictures from the meeting at www.picasaweb.google.co.uk/rbmapics and all free to download if you wish.

Regards to all.

Bauble.

PS; Don't forget the Bentley Drivers Club meeting on august 7th. A wonderful clubbie

Edited by Bauble, 28 July 2010 - 11:14.

[Ted Walker]

Shame it clashes with VSCC Prescott

[LotusElise]

Dad and I appreciated the stand access that was included in the price this year. We managed to find some decent viewing spots both in and out of the grandstands - Club, the Complex and the startline all gave us good views.

The catering is extortionate, although the chicken and chips I had was substantial and quite tasty.

To add to the Judy debate - she isn't the greatest driver and I doubt she claims to be anything other than an enthusiast, but she has good awareness and track manners, unlike many others I could mention.

[2F-001]

Before we move on completely from the splendid Stanley Unwin, I think I can bring him more "on topic".
I've always remembered him advertising Pirelli tyres...



"Outstandifold in the wetty gripper!"

Edited by 2F-001, 28 July 2010 - 16:55.

[Allan Lupton]

Who are tsl-timing that they head both Practice and Race result sheets "Classification" and the practice sheet even has the race format? Which other meetings do they do?

They do the timing for HSCC, BARC, BRSCC and for Goodwood, Allan, but I agree their format is a little strange on this occasion.

OT a bit, but . . .
I see in the RAC MSA's "Motorsport Now" that tsl-timing had to pay costs after a "software problem" had got a race result wrong at Brand's.
That sort of thing should be sorted at the time and place, not in a Colnbrook inquisition as that one was.

[Giraffe]

There was a very rude words said by Patrick Watts about the winning Mustang's legality; but Mr Minshaw also seemed to have upset people in the first corner. Driver of Mustang indicated Patrick needed to read the regs of the meeting (not App K apparently). This info courtesy of Radio Silverstone at Club where many large American cars were going via Silverstone village on the extra tarmac ...

Here is Dean Forward's controversial Mustang, "developed way beyond the FIA homologated spec of it's rivals" (according to this weeks Autosport) pictured the previous Wednesday at Mallory testing..........


By giraffe138 at 2010-07-30

By giraffe138 at 2010-07-30

By giraffe138 at 2010-07-30

[simon drabble]

there is an ironic honesty in the car I find rather refreshing!! Is Dean Forward a prepper?
I heard the outburst on the PA - these things should be voiced to the clerk of the course not to all and sundry.
We are after all just weekend warriors!!!

[2F-001]

Just out of curiosity, what developments does that Mustang feature that take it beyond Appendix K?

[LotusElise]

there is an ironic honesty in the car I find rather refreshing!! Is Dean Forward a prepper?
I heard the outburst on the PA - these things should be voiced to the clerk of the course not to all and sundry.
We are after all just weekend warriors!!!

It all got very personal. If that had been a GP meeting, then Watts would probably have been disciplined.
I know I've asked before, but did anyone see what Jason Minshaw did to him? I know they traded a bit of paint.

[john aston]

I found Watts' outburst rather refreshing but then maybe I have heard too many anodyne platitudes from current GP drivers.Ironic in a way- I seem to recall that paint swapping was a Watts' speciality in BTCC days...

[john ruston]

A race is run for these American Sock cars and people are suprised that there is a bit of banging and stuff!

Probable outcome is both cars will fail to get accepted in future races.

The racers involved are probably under the illusion its important!It's not.If Mr watts was that good he would still be in Modern racing rather than old crocks.Think he also raced an Allard that lapped about 8 sec quicker than it had done in previous owners hands.Not unusual in Historics.

Its the other entrants that will be annoyed that the winning car is supposedly bending the rules not the spectators.

As it takes twenty plus spectators to pay same as one race car the entrants will win and car will be checked.They do not last long.

The weekend is a game and the quicker people who plough into other competitors are thrown out the better and then you can sort eligibility problems.

Real cars(not that there are many) will vanish unless something is done.

[rwills]

& here is Roger on his electric Raleigh Chopper, one of only 8 made.


By giraffe138 at 2010-07-26

It is actually petrol powered, you probably couldn't hear it Giraffe due to the cars around!

[rwills]

Co-ordinated Lotus20/22 - BMW equipe

The Diffey BMW/Lotus was very cool especially as the BMW was used to tow the Lotus to the circuit!

[john ruston]

Wasn't so cool when it was knackered due to towing car !

[mariner]

I am lucky enough to usually do both the GFOS and Silverstone each year. I love both because they are different, the FOS is a big garden party with world class cars of every type whereas Silverstone is a real race meeting. The ability to go into the pit garages at Silverstone always impresses me and they are actually less crowded than the FOS main paddock

Like others I thought the Paddock Cafe offers reasonably priced food for a captive event. As for Beer prices it depends on whether you usually sup in central London or outer Manchester I guess!

I was amazed by all the professional classic preparation companies with the huge transporters/hospitiality units. Why the entries at this years FOS and Silverstone seem down I don't know but money didn't seem to be an issue. The standard of their work is impressive though.

My favourite moment was to go from looking at one of the aforementioned huge professional transporter units with all the laptops and Facom tools etc. to the Classic Team Lotus pit where a 75 year old Bob Dance was working on the ex Jim clark 25 with just a screwdriver and small hammer fixing the mirrors. It struck me that he probably held more race preparation knowledge in his head than all the professional preparers combined. That is no criticism of them but a reflection on the scope of what Bob Dance and his contemporaries achieved.

[David McKinney]

A more logical comparison would be between the Goodwood Revival and the Silverstone Classic

[LotusElise]

A more logical comparison would be between the Goodwood Revival and the Silverstone Classic

I love both, but the mostly unrestricted pit access at Silverstone is a definite plus point.

[F3Wrench]

Just out of curiosity, what developments does that Mustang feature that take it beyond Appendix K?

I too would be interested to know the answer to '2F-001's question - any offers?

[Twin Window]

The only specific thing I remember being told is that it has discs on the rear; not being very mechanically-minded the rest didn't stick!

[Giraffe]

Ted Walker presides over the Lotus 30's debut....


By giraffe138 at 2010-08-02

[LCRider]

I too would be interested to know the answer to '2F-001's question - any offers?

I remember 600bhp and cannot drive around corners

As I recall whatever else may have happened at Copse on lap 1 Watts and Forward collided on the exit of Beckets onto the Hanger straight which caused Watts to spin and effectively ended his race.

Edited by LCRider, 02 August 2010 - 22:12.

[john ruston]

Its the wrong forum to answer questions on the build of racecars .Try one of the racers forums although in all probability you will find they whinge but havn't got the bottle to say in public their actual views on the correctness of cars.
Historic Car Racing and History Forums do not have much in common.This forum follows things like FOS and Chummley not racing.Only common ground is Goodwood Revival.Sure Tony would like to change things but understand the main contributors views and as lots of the racing these days is with what in old days would be called silhouette cars can see problem.

[Giraffe]

Sure Tony would like to change things but understand the main contributors views and as lots of the racing these days is with what in old days would be called silhouette cars can see problem.

It's just offering another view that many TNFers seem to like, John. The 'problem' is down to the organisers who in turn seem to be reflecting the desires & requirements of (some) of the competitors.

Edited by Giraffe, 03 August 2010 - 11:50.

[john ruston]

The Race Promotors just need to fill grid due to economics and thats why fakes,replica and generaly bent cars are let start and do not get thrown out until other racers shout.The V8 and Mr Watts have are both probably close to be shown red card but suggest some of the older past it race drivers should get same treatment.

[bradbury west]

Ted Walker presides over the Lotus 30's debut....

By giraffe138 at 2010-08-02

My curiosity has got the better of me.
Which Lotus 30 is that then? Rum sort of bib spoiler and mudflap, if you ask me. I have looked in the usual books, but not MS or Autosport in period, and can see nothing like it. The Brooklands Gold Lotus test portfolio has several pieces on 30s and 40s, but no spoilers like that. Is it supposed to be the Bamford car, which was reworked in a big way, but which had a very big bib spoiler but also a much enlarged radiator intake? If it is, surely it should run in the full Bamford spec. I recall well the Peter Denty restored version at Silverstone some years ago,- or was that a 40?- and that had only a modest ali bib fitment. I think Mick Walsh tested it later.

The link here
http://forums.autosp...p;#entry4087138
to the Nick Louden photo thread which is always worth an airing for those not familiar with his work,
shows gentelman Jack and and JC in various versions. Perhaps Peter Darley can throw some light on period spec. as there are no such fitments shown in his JC book. What is the cut-off date for the race series in question? Have I just got it all wrong, another C. R. A. F. T. day?
Roger Lund

[eldougo]

My thoughts exactly Roger ?? How do they get away with racing such a car.

Quote.
I have looked in the usual books, but not MS or Autosport in period, and can see nothing like it. The Brooklands Gold Lotus test portfolio has several pieces on 30s and 40s, but no spoilers like that. Is it supposed to be the Bamford car, which was reworked in a big way, but which had a very big bib spoiler but also a much enlarged radiator intake? If it is, surely it should run in the full Bamford spec. I recall well the Peter Denty restored version at Silverstone some years ago,- or was that a 40?- and that had only a modest ali bib fitment. I think Mick Walsh tested it later.

[Graham Gauld]

My thoughts exactly Roger ?? How do they get away with racing such a car.

Quote.
I have looked in the usual books, but not MS or Autosport in period, and can see nothing like it. The Brooklands Gold Lotus test portfolio has several pieces on 30s and 40s, but no spoilers like that. Is it supposed to be the Bamford car, which was reworked in a big way, but which had a very big bib spoiler but also a much enlarged radiator intake? If it is, surely it should run in the full Bamford spec. I recall well the Peter Denty restored version at Silverstone some years ago,- or was that a 40?- and that had only a modest ali bib fitment. I think Mick Walsh tested it later.

The car is claimed to be the David Prophet/ Gerry Ashmore car. I took Gerry over to see the car and he certainly did not recognise the spoilder on the front Pic shows Gerrry Ashmore with the car in the paddock.



Uploaded with ImageShack.us

[johnbowers]

David, these are superb photos. Any chance of obtaining an electronic copy of the one of Lotus 25/R4 at Becketts? I am putting together a scrapbook of the car's new life in historic racing, and would like to include this photo.

[Peter Darley]

My curiosity has got the better of me.
Which Lotus 30 is that then? Rum sort of bib spoiler and mudflap, if you ask me. I have looked in the usual books, but not MS or Autosport in period, and can see nothing like it. The Brooklands Gold Lotus test portfolio has several pieces on 30s and 40s, but no spoilers like that. Is it supposed to be the Bamford car, which was reworked in a big way, but which had a very big bib spoiler but also a much enlarged radiator intake? If it is, surely it should run in the full Bamford spec. I recall well the Peter Denty restored version at Silverstone some years ago,- or was that a 40?- and that had only a modest ali bib fitment. I think Mick Walsh tested it later.

The link here
http://forums.autosp...p;#entry4087138
to the Nick Louden photo thread which is always worth an airing for those not familiar with his work,
shows gentelman Jack and and JC in various versions. Perhaps Peter Darley can throw some light on period spec. as there are no such fitments shown in his JC book. What is the cut-off date for the race series in question? Have I just got it all wrong, another C. R. A. F. T. day?
Roger Lund

Looking at my period shots of the 30/40, no Team Lotus car ran with that front end configuration. All the additional bits and pieces seem to be added once the car passes from the original owner and slips from International racing. By coincidence I have been doing some research on the Guards Int. Trophy Race at Brands, 29-8-66, for Coterie Press. The Alan Eccles entered Lotus 40 for Gerry Ashmore, No 21,
is shown to have a high level exhaust system, running a 5.7 litre engine. It finished 7th. The other 40, and 30, both ran 4.7 litre.
The entry list also includes a certain Jim Clark in a Felday-BRM, No 39. There was also another Felday entered for Mac Daghorn running a 7 litre V8 ! No 19
Photos of the above will shortly be on coteriepress.com website.

[Odseybod]

Looking at my period shots of the 30/40, no Team Lotus car ran with that front end configuration. All the additional bits and pieces seem to be added once the car passes from the original owner and slips from International racing. By coincidence I have been doing some research on the Guards Int. Trophy Race at Brands, 29-8-66, for Coterie Press. The Alan Eccles entered Lotus 40 for Gerry Ashmore, No 21,
is shown to have a high level exhaust system, running a 5.7 litre engine. It finished 7th. The other 40, and 30, both ran 4.7 litre.
The entry list also includes a certain Jim Clark in a Felday-BRM, No 39. There was also another Felday entered for Mac Daghorn running a 7 litre V8 ! No 19
Photos of the above will shortly be on coteriepress.com website.

Just for comparison, this was the 30 at the recent Lotus Festival at Snetterton - much more 'of a piece' (sorry, don't have the programme handy to remind me whose it was).

[Alan Cox]

(sorry, don't have the programme handy to remind me whose it was).

Looks like Mike Wrigley from the helmet

[Allan Lupton]

Just for comparison, this was the 30 at the recent Lotus Festival at Snetterton - much more 'of a piece' (sorry, don't have the programme handy to remind me whose it was).

Don't know what year that is supposed to represent but there was no air dam on Clark's car at the 1965 TT (p501 MotorSport, June 1965)

[Odseybod]

Don't know what year that is supposed to represent but there was no air dam on Clark's car at the 1965 TT (p501 MotorSport, June 1965)

I read the Series 2 car of 1965 gained front and rear spoilers (among other changes to try to sort out its handling).

[Peter Darley]

Looks like Mike Wrigley from the helmet

Dan Collins