446 replies to this topic

[Grundle]

So who will be the team to beat in Korea?

Circuit Guide: Virtual preview from Red Bull

Circuit layout:


Personally I believe the top 3 teams will be separated by less than 3 tenths, but McLaren>Ferrari>Red Bull purely because of the first sector where the McLarens can overtake Red Bull on the first lap with that kilometre long straight. Hopefully the new rear wing f-duct will work perfectly. Maybe I'm being too optimistic though. Ferrari will be close, but I heard SD saying developments are really small now since Singapore, so I think they will be third best, in quali at least.

This track most resembles Valencia, where all three teams were close, and Red Bull had a small advantage, but what has changed since then?

My prediction: Vettel pole, Hamilton win.

Edited by Grundle, 13 October 2010 - 00:53.

[Birelman]

So who will be the team to beat in Korea?

Circuit Guide: Red Bull Virtual Lap(BBC)

Circuit layout:


Personally I believe the top 3 teams will be separated by less than 3 tenths, but McLaren>Ferrari>Red Bull purely because of the first sector where the McLarens can overtake Red Bull on the first lap with that kilometre long straight. Hopefully the new rear wing f-duct will work perfectly. Maybe I'm being too optimistic though. Ferrari will be close, but I heard SD saying developments are really small now since Singapore, so I think they will be third best, in quali at least.

This track most resembles Valencia, where all three teams were close, and Red Bull had a small advantage, but what has changed since then?

My prediction: Vettel pole, Hamilton win.

Screwed up track, has kinda a little bit of heaven for each of the top team's traits. I guess it'll be interesting to see what package puts the lap together. I can't wait.

[Massacrator]

McLaren:
- good on the long straights
- medium on hi-speed corners
- bad in the the strong breaking points with slow corners

RedBull:
- good on the hi-speed corners
- medium on the strong breaking points with slow corners
- bad in the long straights

Ferrari:
- good on the strong breaking points with slow corners
- medium on the hi-speed corners
- medium on the long straights

Conclusion:
1. Ferrari
2. RedBull / McLaren
3. RedBull / McLaren

[Dunder]

Parts of the track suit each of the top 3 teams.

Three decent length straights for McLaren, four or five traction zones for Ferrari and 6 high speed corners for Red Bull.

Based on recent form, I would have to favour Red Bull and Ferrari over McLaren particularly if the track surface is uneven in the corners. Finding a setup quickly will be very important however so the simulator work that has been done could be decisive.

Edited by Dunder, 13 October 2010 - 00:22.

[Massacrator]

Btw, anyone dares to guess the aprox. laptime? pole lap?

I'd say, after a deep analyisis and comparing to other tracks, arround 1.37.253

[Dunder]

Btw, anyone dares to guess the aprox. laptime? pole lap?

I'd say, after a deep analyisis and comparing to other tracks, arround 1.37.253

Very hard to say. A lot will depend on the grip level of the new asphalt.
I can do 1:35's in F1 2010 but I suspect it is not a very accurate rendition of the track.

[hotstickyslick]

If there is very low grip then Red Bull, if not then Ferrari. Can't see McLaren winning.

[Grundle]

If there is very low grip then Red Bull, if not then Ferrari. Can't see McLaren winning.

But didn't McLaren 1-2 in Canada?

[Atreiu]

This track most resembles Valencia, where all three teams were close, and Red Bull had a small advantage, but what has changed since then?

Thanks for the thread and work, but you've got to be kidding. Valencia is more or less 5 full throttle sections where they go from 2nd to 7th gear. Between these sections there are chincanes and/or hairpins. Korea looks nothing like that. It's more like 3 full throttle sections and one very long winding and twisty left and right sequence of corners of all types. It's not the same as Valencia at all. Going only by looks, it's like they put together a circuit which is half Hungaroring and half Circuit Gilles Velleneuve. It was mixed up at Canada, anyone could have won that race. The picture at Hungaroring was exactly the opposite.

IMO, it'll all be like Suzuka from Korea to year end. Red Bull a little but vitally faster everywhere with McLaren and Ferrari basically matched and racing each other. And Vettel should have a small but decisive uperhand as long as he keeps it together. The only unkown is Kubica and Renault. They could be anywhere from the podium to scrapping with Williams and Force Indias.

[Captain Tightpants]

I'm predicting Red Bull vs. Ferrari, with the Bulls having the upper hand. McLaren will be a distant third, though I expect they'll be the most important team for Brazil and Abu Dhabi. Whatever happens in Korea is going to decide a lot going into the final two races, because Mark Webber is right - he needs to win one more race. Even if he wins in Korea and Alonso comes second, Alonso is going to need a fifth race win to stay in touch with Webber. And then he's going to need to win in Abu Dhabi to take the tite. South Korea is possibly going to be the most important race of the season because this one is going down to the wire. We just won't know who is going to be in it until afterwards.

[ViMaMo]

Any info on what corner needs what gear? That would predict the teams's strengths.

[Captain Tightpants]

Any info on what corner needs what gear? That would predict the teams's strengths.

At a guess, I'd say:

Turns 1, 3, 4, 6 and 15 are all second-gear corners.
Turns 2, 11, 12, 14 and 16 are all third-gear corners.
Turns 7, 8, 9, 13, 16, 17 and 18 are al fourth-gear and above.

But like I said - I'm just guessing.

[lafitek]

McLaren:
- good on the long straights
- medium on hi-speed corners
- bad in the the strong breaking points with slow corners

RedBull:
- good on the hi-speed corners
- medium on the strong breaking points with slow corners
- bad in the long straights

Ferrari:
- good on the strong breaking points with slow corners
- medium on the hi-speed corners
- medium on the long straights

Conclusion:
1. Ferrari
2. RedBull / McLaren
3. RedBull / McLaren

this track will be another turkey / belgium for ferrari

[pikamoku]

in that picture I see 2 sections with Suzuka-like corners, the "S" corners. From 6 to 9 and 11 to 15. High speed corners where the Bulls will blast everybody in qualy trim. In the race LH and FA will fight with them. IMO.

But the track surface will be more than "green". It will be plenty of oil, dust, .... I dont know if there'll be support races but in FP1-2 could be like wet track

[Crafty]

Looks almost like an airfield track with a run down the main strip doesn't it.

Disagree about McLaren being bad in braking areas for slow corners - did ok in Spa ddin't they ?

No-one has mentioned Renault yet ? I think they could do okay here.

I think the first half of the lap looks great for McLaren. The second half will favour a car that can change direction nicely so you'd have to tip your hat to the red bull, especially when you look at the 11-12-13 sequence

What will screw McLaren up is if the track is bumpy, or worse still gets progressively uneven through the weekend - its possible because that surface has had hardly any cure time.
The McLaren is very stiff, kind of difficult to get a car to turn in when its bumping around.

I think there will be one hell of a pile up into the first corner, someone mid field trying to take a gamble and losing.

I wonder what tyre wear will be like on a brand new surface - whenever we have seen new tracks before they have had other races beforehand, so this is unchartered territory.

[Mika Mika]

McLaren:
- good on the long straights
- medium on hi-speed corners
- bad in the the strong breaking points with slow corners ???

RedBull:
- good on the hi-speed corners
- medium on the strong breaking points with slow corners
- bad in the long straights

Ferrari:
- good on the strong breaking points with slow corners
- medium on the hi-speed corners
- medium on the long straights

Conclusion:
1. Ferrari
2. RedBull / McLaren
3. RedBull / McLaren

Redbull will be the best at all the final 3 circuits...

BTW the McLaren is supposed to be excelent under brakeing

[keeppushingurep1]

1st sector looks good for mclaren/ferrari, second is red bull and 3rd is redbull/ferrari IMO

Mclaren seemed very very strong in Japan (more than ferrari)

Looks like a nightmare for setups,

I think is going to be very very tight

[Clatter]

What's the weather forecast for the weekend? Wet weather looks likely to be the biggest issue with the new tarmac.

[Ferrari2183]

Redbull will be the best at all the final 3 circuits...

BTW the McLaren is supposed to be excelent under brakeing

Yeah, Mclaren's braking is just fine it's the traction out of the slow stuff that is hampering them.

Furthermore I don't agree with your assessment on RB being the best at the 3 remaining circuits.

Korea is an unknown which plays to the strengths of all the top teams. Bit of a mystery to me who will turn out trumps but I'd have to put Red Bull down as the favourites.

Brazil sector 1 and 3 are made of long straights and sector 2 has a series of slow hairpins that require good traction on exit. Ferrari will definately go very well there and I'd wager that Renault throw a spanner in the works. Mclaren's competiveness depends on how effective the resurfacing was. If it is not bumpy then I'd say they are favourites.

Abu Dhabi looks very much like a Ferrari circuit. Lots of 90 degree turns and some slow stuff where again traction is paramount coupled with 2 long straights. I'd put Mclaren on par with Red Bull with Ferrari just sneaking it.

Furthermore, I feel Ferrari really need this F-duct V2 as the remaining tracks all have long straights and they will leave themselves vulnerable to overtaking in all the remaining tracks if their straightline speed is not up there. Korea at turn 3, Brazil at turn 1 and Abu Dhabi at turns 8 and 11 are all good overtaking spots preceded by long straights.

Edited by Ferrari2183, 13 October 2010 - 08:44.

[Captain Tightpants]

Looks like a nightmare for setups,

I suspect that may have been Hermann Tilke's intention - encourage overtaking by producing a circuit where the one setup that handles both sections of the circuit best actually compromises the car overall. Instead, teams and drivers will have to play to their respective strengths.

[noikeee]

Any info on what corner needs what gear? That would predict the teams's strengths.

I haven't played F1 2010 on this track, which would be a big help, but here's my guesses:

1 - heavy braking zone, 2nd gear
2 - easy flat for all cars, 3rd/4th gear
3 - very heavy braking zone, 2nd gear
4 - heavy braking zone, 2nd gear
5 - 2nd gear
6 - 2nd gear
7/8 - very fast S, possibly flat for some cars, others might need a lift. 6th gear?
9 - 4th/5th gear
10 - short braking zone, 2nd gear
11 - 3rd gear
12 - 3rd gear
13 - 4th/5th gear
14 - short braking zone, 2nd/3rd gear
15 - 2nd gear
16 - possibly flat for some cars, 3rd/4th gear
17/18 - easy flat for all cars, 5th/6th gear

IMO if it wasn't for the long straight it'd be easily a Red Bull track. I'd still expect them to have a slight advantage.

Edited by paranoik0, 13 October 2010 - 08:45.

[D.M.N.]

Give a warm welcome to Tropical Cyclone!

fergieweather
KOREAN GP Trend: Focus on evolution & track of tropical cyclone f'cast to develop Phillipine Sea next week; poss. rain Korea by race day?
1 hour ago

[King Six]

We've already seen that straights don't mean anything if you're good (or not good) at the twisty/high downforce bit.

Red Bull should take pole, but it's a new track so the drivers/team might screw it up.

Like I said before, the straights would probably have to be twice as long to rule out Red Bull's advantage or the advantage of having an excellent time in the twisty bit.

[Dunder]

Thanks for the thread and work, but you've got to be kidding. Valencia is more or less 5 full throttle sections where they go from 2nd to 7th gear. Between these sections there are chincanes and/or hairpins. Korea looks nothing like that. It's more like 3 full throttle sections and one very long winding and twisty left and right sequence of corners of all types. It's not the same as Valencia at all. Going only by looks, it's like they put together a circuit which is half Hungaroring and half Circuit Gilles Velleneuve. It was mixed up at Canada, anyone could have won that race. The picture at Hungaroring was exactly the opposite.

IMO, it'll all be like Suzuka from Korea to year end. Red Bull a little but vitally faster everywhere with McLaren and Ferrari basically matched and racing each other. And Vettel should have a small but decisive uperhand as long as he keeps it together. The only unkown is Kubica and Renault. They could be anywhere from the podium to scrapping with Williams and Force Indias.

That is actually not a bad assessment. A cross between Canada and Hungary is about right.
Medium-high downforce levels look to be the way to go but it will be interesting what aero packages go on first in FP1.

[barnardferrari]

Circuit layout:

I didn't realise the track was built on top of the Millennium Falcon. Maybe that was the cause of the delays.

[stevvy1986]

What's the weather forecast for the weekend? Wet weather looks likely to be the biggest issue with the new tarmac.

Very hard to say so far out, however as you say, engineers have said the biggest issue would be rain, due to the oils coming to the top of the track (or something like that, can't remember exactly), making driving on a wet track basically like driving on ice. Also I know we're 7-10 days away, so it may mean very little at this stage, but Ian Fergusson mentions a possible development of a tropical cyclone meaning rain by race day isn't impossible. However, we're a long way out, and tropical cyclones etc are very difficult to predict with any accuracy, but he does mention the possible development of 1 possibly affecting the race weekend.

[AlanWake]

I believe the track will suit the F10, so I see Ferrari and Red Bull fighting for the win. I would not be surprised if Alonso gets the pole and wins again...with Vettel in the second place. Mclaren will be the third fastest car on the grid.

[dau]

I didn't realise the track was built on top of the Millennium Falcon. Maybe that was the cause of the delays.

They had some problems with Chewbacca, but then they got him a new job at Sauber.

[flyer121]

We've already seen that straights don't mean anything if you're good (or not good) at the twisty/high downforce bit.

Red Bull should take pole, but it's a new track so the drivers/team might screw it up.

Like I said before, the straights would probably have to be twice as long to rule out Red Bull's advantage or the advantage of having an excellent time in the twisty bit.

True , RBRs will be much stronger than any others but there is a catch.
Generally most tracks have long back straights in sector 3 but this one being anti clockwise is unusual and has it in Sector 1. Therefore any car with massive straights advantage over RBRs will have the first lap advantage.
Even if McLarens / Renault / Ferrari lose pole to RBRs , they are still in a position to attack the RBRs on first lap especially because the straights are part of the first sector.

Lets say Lewis is P3 , he has a much better chance of nailing either one or both RBRs by the end of S1 and afterwards even if he is slow RBRs can not overtake back in
S2 or 3 ... Perhaps Lewis can even back them up towards other cars with straight line advantage.

The only chance to regain the position back will be pit-stop jumps by running in clear air.

RBR need to sit down and agree that the P1 driver will go for the win and P2 guy plays a blocking role so that their first few laps are protected.

[mtknot]

Playing this track on F1 2010, it seems that ferrari would probably do very well here, as their car is good in medium speed corners. Although the track slightly undulates, and there are sweeping corners that play to red bull's strengths, the radiuses of the corners aren't tight enough to favour the red bulls over the ferrari in my opinion.

Anyway here's my summary:

1st corner - Mclaren would have straightline advantage, but ferrari and especially red bull have much better braking distances
2nd - this kink is designed to probably enhance overtaking as it allows another car to slip in and take the apex...expect kobayashi to come alive here
3rd - slightly downhill, requires rearward bias, may favour ferrari.
4,5 - mickeymouse, favours ferrari and anything softly sprung, is a flat part of the track
6, 7, 8 - a fast section that can be taken almost flat out
9 - what looks like negative camber causes car to understeer here
10 - big test of braking stability, expect drivers to fly off the track here
11-12-13 - odd section, can take different lines
14-15-16 - feels like singapore
17- is wondering what the kink is for... generating crashes?

[TURU]

Playing this track on F1 2010 ................................................................................
.........................................................................

Red Bull track, as all of them are. There are many tight corners and they will have MASSIVE advantage over there. Anything other than RB pole will be a surprise.

Edited by TURU, 13 October 2010 - 14:13.

[RC127]

Give a warm welcome to Tropical Cyclone!

fergieweather
KOREAN GP Trend: Focus on evolution & track of tropical cyclone f'cast to develop Phillipine Sea next week; poss. rain Korea by race day?
1 hour ago

For once I hope Ian Fergusson is wrong, as James Allen has reported that engineers in the paddock have told him that with the oils so near the surface of the still-curing racetrack, rain would make the track virtually undriveable in wet conditions. Don't need another washout in qualifying (nor a cancelled race).

Imagine after all the uncertainty over whether there would be a race in Korea, the race has to be abandoned not due to the track being incomplete but because of this phenomenon (of the oils in the asphalt sitting on top of the water like ice)?

[RC127]

I didn't realise the track was built on top of the Millennium Falcon. Maybe that was the cause of the delays.

Great spot!

[kandru]

Playing this track on F1 2010, it seems that ferrari would probably do very well here, as their car is good in medium speed corners. Although the track slightly undulates, and there are sweeping corners that play to red bull's strengths, the radiuses of the corners aren't tight enough to favour the red bulls over the ferrari in my opinion.

sorry for being picky, but I'd rather you wrote 'radii'.

17- is wondering what the kink is for... generating crashes?

exactly

[Tenmantaylor]

All the way thru turn 4-18 is just ridiculous IMO. Not going to promote any good racing, just left, right, left right. If someone makes a mistake they will block the guy behind at the next apex quite easily, there just isn't any room to get a run on someone.

As for who's going to be strongest look at how the split times varied between the teams at Suzuka. Sector 1 at Suzuka will be very similar to turns 4-18 at Korea, a MASSIVE Red Bull advantage. In qual at Suzuka McLaren matched Red Bull in sectors 2 and 3 but Red Bull were at least 3-5 tenths faster than McLaren through S1. Red Bulls manoeuvrability in medium corners is just immense

http://www.formula1....it_diagram.html

Who do F1.com get to do their racing line on these graphics? Alex Yoong? The drivers will be cutting the apex at T18 (close to a wall?) as much as possible and going diagonally across S/F straight, not hugging the pit entry

Another observation: Turn 9-10. If someone has a big moment in 9 or entry of turn 10 it looks like theres a a possiblity of hitting someone on the exit of 10 across the runoff.

Edited by Tenmantaylor, 13 October 2010 - 15:01.

[Tolyngee]

I didn't realise the track was built on top of the Millennium Falcon. Maybe that was the cause of the delays.

They had some problems with Chewbacca, but then they got him a new job at Sauber.

From TESB:

Obi: "That boy was our last hope."
Yoda: "No, there is another."

Regarding delays -

Bernie: "That track is our only hope of staging a race on 10/24."
Fuji/Indy/San Marino/Magny-Cours/Nurburgring/etc: "No, there are others."


When more delays ensue -

From RotJ:

Lando: "I tell you'll they'll have that shield down."
Lando: "Come on Han, don't let me down."

Bernie: "I tell you they'll have that track ready."
Bernie: "Come on Korea, I needs the monies!"

Then, when the track breaks-up that weekend -

From RotJ:

Admiral Ackbar: "it's a trap!"
Bernie: "the track is crap!!!!"

Vader: "take off this mask"
Luke: "but you'll die"
Vader: "I'm already dead."
Vader: "Tell your sister... you were right about me."


Korea: "Help us take off these blinders so we can see what we've done."
Bernie: "But even you'd see that you wouldn't want to come here."
Korea: "The dream of a Korean GP is already dead."
Korea: "Tell F1... They were right about Korea."

At the end of RotJ, you see Luke watching Vader's carcass burn, then looks over and sees the spirits of Yoda, Obi, and his father.
At the end of Korea, you see Bernie watching the track being burned to the ground in the riots, then he looks over to Brazil and see the spirit of F1 lives on!

Can't wait for the HD 3-D special edition!

[Seanspeed]

I have a feeling that people writing off Mclaren are going to be surprised.

Unless the track surface really sucks and starts to break up or something, I think they'll be quick, possibly quicker than Ferrari over a lap, and of course the long straight at the very start of the race will mean that with a good exit, they can overtake and then control the pace from the front.

[iotar]

All the way thru turn 4-18 is just ridiculous IMO. Not going to promote any good racing, just left, right, left right. If someone makes a mistake they will block the guy behind at the next apex quite easily, there just isn't any room to get a run on someone.

http://www.formula1....it_diagram.html

Who do F1.com get to do their racing line on these graphics? Alex Yoong? The drivers will be cutting the apex at T18 (close to a wall?) as much as possible and going diagonally across S/F straight, not hugging the pit entry

It's not completely finished to symbolise problems with building Korean track on time .

[Didn't they change a diagram? On previous one the long straight wasn't long enough.]

[bauss]

I have a feeling that people writing off Mclaren are going to be surprised.

Unless the track surface really sucks and starts to break up or something, I think they'll be quick, possibly quicker than Ferrari over a lap, and of course the long straight at the very start of the race will mean that with a good exit, they can overtake and then control the pace from the front.

I think the 3 top teams could end up dead even. It could all boil down to which team hits the sweet spot of car configuration

It seems (from Horners comments) Red Bull are taking a high downforce Suzuka like package...which leaves them vunerable on the straights but prolly fastest overall as there is huge time to be gained in the rest of the track.

I will settle with 2nd row as a Mclaren fan. One Red Bull atleast will be got on the first lap. Another possibly when the inevitable safety car comes out.

If the cars are super closely matched...n considering it will likely rain at some point in the weekend...(either limiting practice time on track or during race/qualy)... driver skill in mastering a new circuit could be crucial.

[Seanspeed]

All the way thru turn 4-18 is just ridiculous IMO. Not going to promote any good racing, just left, right, left right. If someone makes a mistake they will block the guy behind at the next apex quite easily, there just isn't any room to get a run on someone.

There doesn't need to be an overtaking spot every couple corners. 1 or 2 good overtaking opportunities is good enough, and this track definitely has that.

[Ferrari2183]

I have a feeling that people writing off Mclaren are going to be surprised.

Unless the track surface really sucks and starts to break up or something, I think they'll be quick, possibly quicker than Ferrari over a lap, and of course the long straight at the very start of the race will mean that with a good exit, they can overtake and then control the pace from the front.

That may well be true but turn 7 to 14 is Red Bull heaven. They will probably be the fastest over a lap and will be capable of jumping whoever at the stops. It's difficult to know who will be fastest because Hungary was a long time ago and teams have developed their cars. What I do know is that Renault currently have the best F-duct and the one lap pace they showed in Japan coupled with their fast starts could pose a serious threat to the championship contenders.

[Seanspeed]

That may well be true but turn 7 to 14 is Red Bull heaven. They will probably be the fastest over a lap and will be capable of jumping whoever at the stops. It's difficult to know who will be fastest because Hungary was a long time ago and teams have developed their cars. What I do know is that Renault currently have the best F-duct and the one lap pace they showed in Japan coupled with their fast starts could pose a serious threat to the championship contenders.

Its hard to jump people at the stops nowadays, though, cuz teams can react to their competitor's pitstops. If Lewis is P1 for half the race and then pits, he'll be very quick when he comes out due to being 27/28 laps lighter and on fresh tires. If Lewis is P1 for half the race and Red Bull pits, then Lewis can just come in the next lap and minimize damage. Its certainly not a given that Red Bull could do it unless they go for a very different strategy that leaves them clear track to run at their own pace.

Anything can happen, but I think Mclaren are going to be a threat at Korea, whether it be their overall pace or just their ability to overtake at the start.

[Tenmantaylor]

he'll be very quick when he comes out due to being 27/28 laps lighter and on fresh tires.

They take fuel out at pitstops these days? I know what you mean, you come out faster than you went in as you weight the same but with fresh tyres. The new tyre advantage used to be offset by coming out heavier after having fuel added. Cars used to be at their fastest before pitstops, now its after pitstops and then at the end of the race.

[Atreiu]

Maybe it'll be like China. Despite the huge back straight and some other smaller straights, car setup leans much more towards downforce and cornering than top speed (which is basically what they do at every single crap circuit Tilke has ever built).

[King Six]

Maybe it'll be like China. Despite the huge back straight and some other smaller straights, car setup leans much more towards downforce and cornering than top speed (which is basically what they do at every single crap circuit Tilke has ever built).

Yep, Tilke creates standard spec high downforce circuits and then throws a useless straight onto it and says ''there, it's an exciting circuit''

They don't know how to make high speed low downforce circuits these days

Gotta cherish tracks like Canada whilst you can.

Edited by King Six, 13 October 2010 - 16:08.

[stevvy1986]

Give a warm welcome to Tropical Cyclone!

fergieweather
KOREAN GP Trend: Focus on evolution & track of tropical cyclone f'cast to develop Phillipine Sea next week; poss. rain Korea by race day?
1 hour ago

From Ian on Twitter: not joking...but early modelling suggests peripheral effects for Korea, not a direct hit. Early days, but could get interesting.

[Sukhoi]

i am smelling that one



sniff sniff ...

Edited by Sukhoi, 13 October 2010 - 16:28.

[D.M.N.]

From Ian on Twitter: not joking...but early modelling suggests peripheral effects for Korea, not a direct hit. Early days, but could get interesting.

Hopefully it doesn't turn into direct hit otherwise we'll head towards Japan V2.

Edited by D.M.N., 13 October 2010 - 16:32.

[Villes Gilleneuve]

Anything can happen, but I think Mclaren are going to be a threat at Korea, whether it be their overall pace or just their ability to overtake at the start.

I'd give even odds on that track surface breaking up.

[Massacrator]

Surface will be perfectly fine.