15 replies to this topic

[arttidesco]

I have always admired Martin Krejci's tremendous racingsportscars.com project but while I was looking up James Hunt I was rather surprised to learn that James drove the #17T Yardley BRM P 160-03 in practice for the Rhein-Pokalrennen at the Hockenheimring in 1971.

I'd always thought the James made his debut in a Grand Prix car with the #56 Hesketh run Surtees TS9B at the non championship Race of Champions in 1973.

Can anyone confirm and give any other details about James run at the Hockenheimring in 1971 ?

A photo would be a bonus.

Relevant answers may be used and credited in a forth coming blog.

Thanking you in anticipation of your responses.

[RA Historian]

According to Autocourse 1971-72, the Jochen Rindt Memorial Trophy race was run June 12, 1971, at Hockenheim. Hunt is not listed as being in the race. Three BRMs were in the race, two works P-153s for Howden Ganley and John Miles, and a private P-133 for Robs Lamplough. Does not address whether or not Hunt practiced, but I tend to doubt it for a few reasons, one of which is why would BRM run a newer P-160 for an unknown (at that time) while giving its works drivers year old P-153s?

Tom

Edited by RA Historian, 16 July 2011 - 00:29.

[rateus]

Just had a look at the report in Chris Ellard's 'The Forgotten Races' and, while he also remains silent regarding Hunt's participation, he does provide a possible explanation for BRM needing additional drivers. The Hockenheim race was run on the same weekend as Le Mans and the organisers were apparently hoping that should either Siffert or Rodriguez retire from the 24 Hours early, they would make the trip to Germany for the race on Sunday. BRM did take a P160 along as a spare, and the organisers even arranged for a practice session on Sunday morning in case either driver arrived. Alas for them, although both were early retirements from Le Mans, neither felt the need for a spot of F1 to fill their vacant Sunday.

Incidentally there was one other BRM at Hockenheim. In addition to the P133 for himself Robs Lamplough also brought along a P126 (also of 1968 vintage) for local hero Bernd Terbeck, which failed to start owing to unspecified 'engine problems'. As his best time was over 30 seconds off pole (and nearly 20 behind even his teammate), probably just as well...

[Tim Murray]

No mention of Hunt in either the Autosport report or the F1R Black Book. BRM had three entries, the two P153s for Ganley (#16) and Miles (#17) and the brand new P160 chassis 03 (#18) with no driver listed. According to Autosport Miles had 'an option' on the P160 and practised in it, but was quicker in the P153. On the Sunday morning 'a rumour had been circulating that Pedro Rodriguez was on his way from Le Mans to drive the P160, but though the car was all ready behind the pits, no Pedro appeared.'

No mention also in the Donaldson biography of Hunt. At the time of the Hockenheim race James was still recuperating from his nasty F3 accident at Zandvoort in May. However, he was back racing at Crystal Palace a week after the Hockenheim race, so his injuries would probably not have stopped him driving at Hockenheim, given the chance.

Edited by Tim Murray, 16 July 2011 - 07:11.

[Giraffe]

No mention in "Against All Odds" either. I've asked Howden.

[Doug Nye]

Though 20secs slower than team-mate suggest an engine problem...of some magnitude?

DCN

[Bauble]

Though 20secs slower than team-mate suggest an engine problem...of some magnitude?

DCN

LIKE! Not having one?

Bauble

[arttidesco]

LIKE! Not having one?

Bauble

Or pedal power ?

Thanks for your responses I'll take this up further with Martin and post his response

[Tim Murray]

According to Autosport Terbeck's problem, which happened early on in practice, involved 'breaking the crankshaft take-off gear to the valve train, and doing his engine no good'.

My earlier post was incorrect. In practice Miles was quicker in the P160 than in the P153, but, for whatever reason, ended up racing the P153. Perhaps the team really did expect Rodriguez to turn up and race the P160.

[arttidesco]

According to Autosport Terbeck's problem, which happened early on in practice, involved 'breaking the crankshaft take-off gear to the valve train, and doing his engine no good'.

My earlier post was incorrect. In practice Miles was quicker in the P160 than in the P153, but, for whatever reason, ended up racing the P153. Perhaps the team really did expect Rodriguez to turn up and race the P160.

I'll let Martin know we think Miles tested the P 160

[Allen Brown]

May I add my name to the list of those who will eat their hat if this is correct.

Looking at the other BRMs at that race, I think he has the P153s the wrong way round too - Ganley drove his usual 06 and Miles used 07.

[David McKinney]

I'll let Martin know we think Miles tested the P 160

Tim's post mentions practice, quite a different matter from testing
(ie, one's an official part of the competition, the other's not)

[arttidesco]

Tim's post mentions practice, quite a different matter from testing
(ie, one's an official part of the competition, the other's not)

I'll let Martin know we think Miles took the P160 out in practice

And that you think he has the chassis numbers mixed up Allen

[Giraffe]

No mention in "Against All Odds" either. I've asked Howden.

Hi Tony,
Yes I have seen the Hunt / BRM story. Locke de Bretteville directed me to it.


Allen does NOT need to eat his hat. I can tell you with absolute certainty that James
did not drive a BRM ( or any other car ) in the Jochen Rindt Trophy race at Hockenheim.


There were two 153's - for John Miles and me. They did have a P160 there should
Jo or Pedro have been able to come.


I had a vague notion that John drove the P160 in the race , when it was
obvious that neither Jo or Pedro would be arriving on Sunday. ( It had only
been going to happen if either of the 917's broke down ) .


I guess I was entirely concentrating on my car , so exactly which one John was driving
was not at the forefront of my mind !


I wonder how the Hunt story got started . Anyway there is absolutely NO truth in
it .


See you at the Classic.


I am in Spain playing golf with John Fitzpatrick at the moment.


Howden

[RA Historian]

...and THAT settles THAT!

Thanks Tony!

[arttidesco]

You can't get better than a first hand account of one of the people most likely to know, thanks to Tony for getting in touch with Howden and thanks to Howden for his response

I'll make sure Martin sees this