99 replies to this topic

[ivand911]

Bruno hit him twice!!!

[DutchCruijff]

Free up 2 hours on a Sunday, 10 laps in and race over.

[zelpre]

can't believe it...

[Disgrace]

Schumacher turned in early, Senna was deep on the brakes. Racing incident.

[Massa_f1]

Bruno hit him twice!!!

I am passed caring. He has no one to blame but himself for his stupid Saturday strategy. I say that as a fan.

[DutchCruijff]

Bruno hit him twice!!!

He was having a moan at Schumacher whilst turning into the corner, with FOM providing a crappy angle, I'd say Bruno was at fault for the 2nd, the one which has destroyed Schumi's race, collision. Poor concentration.

Edited by DutchCruijff, 27 November 2011 - 16:31.

[ivand911]

MS was ahead of the time of the crashes, clearly Bruno fault.

[Tarzaan]

OMG. What Bruno thougt?

[Tarzaan]

Schumacher turned in early, Senna was deep on the brakes. Racing incident.

It was a clear overtake. Ha was way ahead of Senna.

[ivand911]

It was a clear overtake. Ha was way ahead of Senna.

MS was clearly overtaking him ,leave him enough space.

[Disgrace]

It was a clear overtake. Ha was way ahead of Senna.

Clearly not, as they hit each other. Schumacher can squeeze but if the guy inside comes in hot, then you're asking for a crash and it happened. If Schumacher took a wider line, and Senna still hit him, then it would be clearly 100% Senna.

Edited by Disgrace, 27 November 2011 - 16:37.

[ivand911]

Clearly not, as they hit each other. Schumacher can squeeze but if the guy inside comes in hot, then you're asking for a crash and it happened. If Schumacher took a wider line, and Senna still hit him, then it would be clearly 100% Senna.

I think you forget the first hit and you focus only on the second hit. First hit make MS car jump forward. Clearly MS race pace is not bad. Damn Bruno.

Edited by ivand911, 27 November 2011 - 16:42.

[Tarzaan]

Clearly not, as they hit each other. Schumacher can squeeze but if the guy inside comes in hot, then you're asking for a crash and it happened. If Schumacher took a wider line, and Senna still hit him, then it would be clearly 100% Senna.

It was a clear overtake but Bruno breaks too late...

[Diablobb81]

Shitty end of the season. Roll on 2012.


Stupid Senna.

[sharo]

Yeah, every youngster there behaves like a bull on the arena when he sees MS near him.

[JtP1]

OMG. What Bruno thougt?

He quite clearly doesn't, as previous races have proved.

[Sakae]

What's the stewards' decision over the incident?

[sharo]

What's the stewards' decision over the incident?

Didn't you watch the race?

[Sakae]

Didn't you watch the race?

I had visitors and it was on and off; drive through penalty escaped me. Sorry.

[Disgrace]

Pretty bold prediction to say they'll collide again in 2012.

[as65p]

Yeah, every youngster there behaves like a bull on the arena when he sees MS near him.

Oh come on, the proverbial bully get's bullied and the fans whine?

[PoliFanAthic]

Senna was behind and he overdid it. Turned out poorly for both of them.

[pRy]

First contact was 50/50. Second contact was against Senna because a) he was locked up and b) he had his right hand out of the cockpit waving at Schumacher.

[PoliFanAthic]

I don't think there was much that could be done for the second contact after the first occurred...?

[Buttoneer]

Note this topic split from the Michael Schumacher one by me. Please direct any complaints about the existence of this thread to me via PM.

[krea]

1. contact: **** happens
2. contact: Senna's fault 100%

[seltaeb]

1. contact: **** happens
2. contact: Senna's fault 100%

+1.

[ivand911]

First contact, MS was ahead, Bruno didn't even turn to take the corner, he was going straight, hit MS from the side. MS left him a lot of room from inside.

[jj2728]

Yeah, every youngster there behaves like a bull on the arena when he sees MS near him.

Yeah, except this time the young bull was named Senna....can noone see the irony in this?
Senna got a drive thru, end of story.

[cheapracer]

Well it was Senna's fault for not realising that he doesn't have the right to take the normal racing line after he has clearly declared to Schumacher that he is taking/protecting the inside line - that's where he has to stay and drivers like Button and MS are always going to go the 'squeeze' line from the outside once they have claimed the corner.

I think MS may have squeezed a little early TBO taking Senna by surprise (and MS judging by the jink to the right) but the second hit should not have happened.

However, at the end of the day it is entirely Schumacher's fault for his shitty qualifying and crappy start putting him back there - I'm fairly certain he would admit that himself.

[ivand911]

MS was on the racing line and ahead. Drivers don't take that corner on the inside line. They do that when defend or overtake.

[wingwalker]

The wheel banging was the most curious thing about - it looked to me like Senna almost wanted it, but I guess he simply outbraked himself bigtime (no lockup, though). The second one was the usual endplate-against-rear wheel stuff we've seen many times. I'd count it as racing incident, but if someone needed to be penalized, it was Senna.

Also, MSC had a very similar thing happen to him at T1 in 2006 with Fisichella. video

Edited by wingwalker, 27 November 2011 - 20:53.

[fieraku]

Racing incident!
Penalties are kittyfying F1! Hate em.

[sosidge]

1. contact: **** happens
2. contact: Senna's fault 100%

Yep.

Schumi was maybe unnecessarily aggressive with his early turn in, but Bruno should have been wise to it. Second contact was avoidable and unnecessary. Correct decision to penalise Senna.

[Tardis40]

Senna outbraked himself and caused the incident. Schumacher had him cold turkey. Idiot move.

[exmayol]

MS should have qualified higher... another wasted race.

[Muz Bee]

When you're hard on the brakes into a turn, the speed you are carrying up the inside determines how tight a line you can hold. I would have thought that was obvious to a racing fan. So the first contact was pure racing incident and MS put himself at risk in the move. If we are going to attribute blame for such incidents and punish them then the signal we are giving is "no overtaking". OK I exaggerate but you get my point. The penalty I assume was for the way Bruno then monstered Michael's left rear which looked like anger and frustration.

[i.am.cloned]

1. contact: **** happens
2. contact: Senna's fault 100%

Exactly

[ivand911]

When you're hard on the brakes into a turn, the speed you are carrying up the inside determines how tight a line you can hold. I would have thought that was obvious to a racing fan. So the first contact was pure racing incident and MS put himself at risk in the move. If we are going to attribute blame for such incidents and punish them then the signal we are giving is "no overtaking". OK I exaggerate but you get my point. The penalty I assume was for the way Bruno then monstered Michael's left rear which looked like anger and frustration.

I think the signal will be , don't outbrake yourself and don't hit the guy who already overtake you. Why "no overtaking"? Sutil and Rosberg have similar moment ,but they didn't crash.

[Raelene]

When you're hard on the brakes into a turn, the speed you are carrying up the inside determines how tight a line you can hold. I would have thought that was obvious to a racing fan. So the first contact was pure racing incident and MS put himself at risk in the move. If we are going to attribute blame for such incidents and punish them then the signal we are giving is "no overtaking". OK I exaggerate but you get my point. The penalty I assume was for the way Bruno then monstered Michael's left rear which looked like anger and frustration.

I agree

[ClubmanGT]

I thought it was about as avoidable as it gets for both drivers - Senna might have run a little wide in the corner, but Schumacher wasn't entirely clear and could have given him a bit of room (as it stands, he just took a slightly wider line).

I'm about as dye-in-the-wool when it comes to MSC as it gets, but it wasn't really deserving of a penalty for either. Both a bit careless really. One thing lead to the other, singling Senna out was a tad unfair.

[F1Champion]

I thought it was clear cut, Michael was ahead, Bruno outbraked himself and stuck his hand up instead of focussing on correcting the car and hit him again. Totally avoidable, especially when you saw the space he had on his side.

[g1n]

It was a racing accident, for comparison look at Rosberg Sutil "near overtake", Sutil passes Rosberg, Rosberg brakes later, Sutil leaves room, both drive off without an accident.

In MSC vs Senna case, MSC passes Senna, Senna outbrakes himself, MSC does not leave a space, collision.

both at fault, ie, a racing accident. no one to blame. Yet another blunder by the stewards.

[911]

IMO, it was a racing incident and Bruno made a mistake.

[scheivlak]

I thought it was clear cut, Michael was ahead, Bruno outbraked himself and stuck his hand up instead of focussing on correcting the car and hit him again. Totally avoidable, especially when you saw the space he had on his side.

Indeed.
Rightful decision by the stewards.

[Wilgot]

First hit, racing incident. Second hit, Bruno's fault. This is why he needs to qualify higher.

[baddog]

It was a racing accident, for comparison look at Rosberg Sutil "near overtake", Sutil passes Rosberg, Rosberg brakes later, Sutil leaves room, both drive off without an accident.

In MSC vs Senna case, MSC passes Senna, Senna outbrakes himself, MSC does not leave a space, collision.

Incorrect. Rosberg braked later and got back fully alongside.. Senna just nerfed into the side of Schumacher while behind. these are wholly different things.

[Sakae]

First hit, racing incident. Second hit, Bruno's fault. This is why he needs to qualify higher.

Alternatively, drivers like Senna should be send for next five races to the back of grid until he learns how to drive. He can share his new position with Hamilton parking nearby.

Edited by Sakae, 27 November 2011 - 23:17.

[black magic]

equally vapid comment from coulthard that have to brake in a straight line. we see every race the overtaker, esp when on the outside line squeeze the inside runner to enforce the corner.

bruno failed to take the opportunity and use more of the track. the second contact was sheer petulance

[PedroBR]

He tried to pass Bruno Senna in the outside, in Brasil, in the S do Senna.

Not going to happen