11 replies to this topic

[Eugen]

I am looking for results, entry lists etc of "Coupe Internationale du MCF" 1904,1905 and 1906.

So:

I. Coupe Internationale 25th Sep 1904
circuit StArnoult-Dourdan-Etampes-Authan-Ablis-St.Arnoult -

5 laps x 54 km = 270 km

Entry (11 starters) :
France (MCF) : Demester (Griffon), Jean Inghilbert (Griffon), Lamberjack (Griffon)
UK (ACC) : 3 riders
Germany (DMV) : 2 riders (Progress)
Austria (MVÖ) : Vaclav Vondrich (Laurin & Klement), Frantisek Toman (Laurin & Klement)
Danmark (DMCC) : Petersen (Humber)

Results:
1 Demester 3:43:43,4
2 Frantisek Toman 4:00:54,4
3 Jean Inghilbert 4:15:31,8
4 Lamberjack 4:44:53,2
5 Vaclav Vondrich 4:53:41,4

FL Toman 38:26

French Eliminatoires 11th? Sept 1904 - same circuit
1 Lamberjack 3:30:14


II. Coupe Internationale 25th Jun 1905
Same circuit as I. Coupe Internationale

5 laps x 54 km = 270 km

Entry (12 starters) :
France (MCF) : 1 Demester (Griffon), 5 Giuppone (Peugeot), 9 Cissac (Peugeot)
Germany (DMV) : 2 Müller (Progress), 6 Menzel (Progress), 10 Jahn (Progress)
UK (ACC) : 3 J.S.Campbell (Ariel), 7 Harry Collier (Matchless), 11 Charles Franklin (JAP)
Austria (MVÖ) : 4 Frantisek Toman (Laurin & Klement), 8 Nikodem (Puch), 12 Vaclav Vondrich (Laurin & Klement)

Results:
1 Vaclav Vondrich 3:05:15
2 Giuppone 3:35:02
Disq Demester 3:13:17

Eliminatoires :

French: ?

Austria: circuit Pacov, 28th May 1905:

Results:

1 Nikodem (Puch) 3:45:31,2
2 Vaclav Vondrich (Laurin & Klement) 3:53:57,8
3 Merfait (Laurin & Klement) 5:11:12,4

ret Otruba (Laurin & Klement), ? (Linser)

UK: circuit Douglas,IOM. 31st May 1905

5 Laps x 25 m = 125 m

7 starters
Results:
1 J.S. Campbell (Ariel-JAP) 4:09:36
2 Harry Collier (Matchless-JAP)

ret Charles Franklin (JAP) 4 Laps, H.Rignold (Rignold) 3 Laps, Charlie Collier (Matchless-JAP) 1 Lap, W.H.Hodgkinson (JAP), F.W.Barnes (Zenith)

III. Coupe Internationale 8th Jul 1906
circuit Pacov (Austria, exactly Bohemia)

Entry (10 starters) :
France (MCF) : Tavencaux (Gillet)
Germany (DMV) : Retienne (Progress)
UK (ACC) : Harry Collier (Matchless)
Austria (MVÖ) : Nikodem (Puch), Otruba (Puch), ? (Puch)

Results:
1 Nikodem 3:13:45,26
2 Otruba 3:29:41,39
3 Harry Collier 3:39:53,39
4 Retienne

Eliminatoires :

French: ?

UK: ?

Austria: circuit Pacov, 3rd Jun 1906:

Results:
1 Otruba (Puch)

other starters: Nikodem (Puch), Vecka (Puch),...

All my sources are czech

Can anybody help?

[Vitesse2]

A snippet or two from Braunbeck's Sport-Lexikon:

For 1905, Braunbeck has Vondrich's time as 3:05'12".

Pacov (in German: Patzau) circuit was 62.5km.

1906: Retienne's time 3:55'21.2"

There's also a map of the French circuit.

[Boniver]

International Motorcycling Federation was founded on December 21, 1904, in the rooms of the restaurant Ledoyen in Paris, under the name of Fédération Internationale des Clubs Motocyclistes.

The Motocycle-Club de France organised a race called the International Cup in Dourdan, south-west of Paris, on September 25, 1904 with the participation from Austria, Denmark, France, Germany, and Great Britain. The race was won by France, but disputes arose over the racing conditions. As a result, the sports authorities of the five countries represented joined together and put forward the idea of creating the Fédération Internationale des Clubs Motocyclistes (FICM).

The birth of this Federation was, however, premature. In July 1906, on the occasion of the International Cup in Patzau, Bohemia, the delegates of the participating countries - Austria, France, Germany and Great Britain - unanimously decided to dissolve the FICM. But, for a question of procedure, the FICM was not dissolved but just remained inactive, the British Federation (ACU) being the only subscriber as from 1907.

Five years later, the Auto-Cycle Union of Great Britain took the initiative of calling a meeting which was held at Olympia in London on 28 November 1912. Delegates from Belgium, Denmark, France, Great Britain, Italy, the Netherlands and the United States were present. The FICM was re-established in order to control and develop the sporting and touring aspects of motorcycling and to assist motorcycle users in those fields. Two weeks later, a Congress was held in Paris in which - beside the countries already mentioned - Germany, Austria and Switzerland also took part. These ten countries are considered as the official founder members of the FICM. The Marquis de Mouzilly St-Mars was elected Patron and the Honourable Sir Arthur Stanley MP President. The following year the first international event held under the aegis of the FICM took place: the International Six Days Reliability Trial.


WAS THIS RACE FOR AUTO OR MOTO ????

[Eugen]

Thank you Vitesse2

It was a motorcycle race, 3 riders per a national team. So-called Gordon - Bennett Trophy for motorcycles.

[Vitesse2]

1905 British Trial: 15 entries, but only 7 starters as per your info. I have one non-starter for you - a 9hp Roc, entered by Arthur Conan-Doyle, the creator of Sherlock Holmes.

The race was due to start at 3.00am, but was delayed by half an hour to allow spectators to gather. Unsurprisingly, they didn't! The original course was to have been the same as that for the British Gordon Bennett trials the day before, but was shortened by cutting out the northern section due to a prior accident on the mountain climb and the inability of the bikes to actually ascend the mountain!

Source: TT Pioneers by Robert Kelly, probably based on contemporary local press reports. This event is seen by motorcycle historians as the origin of the bike TT.

[Graham Gauld]

I am sure Doug Nye will come back on this. It was not Arthur Conan Doyle it was his son Adrian Conan Doyle who in post war years raced the odd Ferrari.

GG

[ensign14]

Originally posted by Vitesse2
1905 British Trial: 15 entries, but only 7 starters as per your info. I have one non-starter for you - a 9hp Roc, entered by Arthur Conan-Doyle, the creator of Sherlock Holmes.

A lemon entry, my dear Vitesse.

[anjakub]

I. Coupe Internationale 1904:
1. Demester (two punctures in first and second lap), 2. Toman (three punctures), 3. Inghilbert (two punctures). Several incidents were happened: stones were thrown at competitors and nails strewn across the road.


II. Coupe Internationale 1905:
„Extracts from Rules for the International Cup Race for Auto Cycles, to be held in France on June 18th or 25th, 1905.
1. The auto-cycle must not weight more than 50 kilos empty, that is without fuel, paraffin, accumulators, tools, spare parts, and luggage. An allowance of 3 kilos is made for machines fitted with magnetos.
2. The auto-cycle must be entirely, and is every part, constructed in the country of the Club which they represent (in this case Great Britain and Ireland).
3. machines must be finished with two brakes, either both at the back, or one at the front one at the back.
4. Silencers (which may be so in appearance only) must be fitted.
5. Every machine to have pedals and chain or cardan shaft capable of propeling it without the aid of the engine. (It has been explained that these need only be sufficient to propel the machine for short distances, and their exclusive use throughout controls will not be enforced this year as heretofore.)
6. The cycles must be ridden by members of competing Clubs, or of Clubs recognised by them (in this case Auto-Cycle Club).
7. The race shall be over a road in road a single stage of a distance of from 250 kilometres to 350 kilometres at most. This distance can be selected from town to town, or broken up into going and returning runs or circuits, provided that each journey shall consist of not less than 40 kilometres.
Note. – The most elaborate precautions as to nails on the course will be taken this year. The course will be guarded by the military, swept on the eve of the race, and guarded all night be one cyclist and one policeman patrolling every kilometre.”

III. Coupe Internationale was held in Austria, whose rider was the winner in Dourdan.

Source: Fédération Internationale de Motocyclisme

[Vitesse2]

Originally posted by Graham Gauld
I am sure Doug Nye will come back on this. It was not Arthur Conan Doyle it was his son Adrian Conan Doyle who in post war years raced the odd Ferrari.

GG

Far be it from me and all that, but I doubt it would have been Adrian in 1905!

He also had a rather hare-brained scheme to convert a Delage 2LCV by reducing its capacity to 1500cc and run it in Voiturette races ...

[Ruairidh]

Originally posted by ensign14
A lemon entry, my dear Vitesse.

Arrgggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh - it took me until I was closing this thread - having wondered what my Brummie supporting friend was on about before I got this (it is one of those Monday's!)

[Eugen]

A small adition - Retienne's first name - Georg.

Thank you all for your help.

[Eugen]

II. Coupe Internationale, on June 25th 1905 = 100 anniversary



Václav Vondøich, Laurin & Klement