13 replies to this topic

[indyricefan13]

I know that there are already threads about these races but I have a few questions and I hope you'll excuse me for starting a new one.
As you know I am a native of Lviv (Lwow) and that is why the Grand Prix really interests me. When I first noticed how much threads had something about those races in them here I became fascinated with the race. So I owe this to you.
I have a few questions regarding the race. It must be stupid as I live in the town where it was held but nonetheless.
1.Where can I find good photos from the Lwow GP on the Net.
2.Was Antoni Heller, the driver who raced in the 1930 race in Lviv actually a Lviv resident. I found out some time that at the beginning of the 20th century a certain Ludvig Heller lived in Lviv. He was the director of the famous Lviv Opera house. The villa, in which he lived with his wife can still be seen. Could there be a connection between Ludvig and Antoni Heller?

I am trying to obtain a very interesting photo through one photo agency which may be connected with the racing. All of you, who are interested in the Lwow GP know Count Potocki, who finished second in the 1930 race. The Palace, which the Potocki family owned is a Lviv landmark. Although it was called "The Place of Happiness" during the Soviet times now it is once again called "Potocki's Palace". The photo shows a man standing in front of a racing car and the Potocki pallace in the background. I assume that the man is Count Potocki and that the car is the Bugatti he raced in the 1930 race. If my assumption is correct and if I get it I'll try to scan it and post it here.

[anjakub]

Indy, I try answer for your questions:
1. Nowhere (In future propably on my website).
2. I don't know about connection between Ludwik (Ludvig) Heller and Antoni Heller.
Before WW2 we heve many counts Potocki, also in automobile sport. It is very popular Polish nobleman's surname.

[indyricefan13]

Originally posted by anjakub
Indy, I try answer for your questions:
1. Nowhere (In future propably on my website).
2. I don't know about connection between Ludwik (Ludvig) Heller and Antoni Heller.
Before WW2 we heve many counts Potocki, also in automobile sport. It is very popular Polish nobleman's surname.

Thanks. Would be nice to see a site about the racing in Lwow. I'll try to search something in the library. There are a lot of Polish newpapers there and as I can speak Polish I will probably be able to find something out. But life is so busy and so far I haven't been able to find the time. There is also a new museum about Lwow in the 20th century over here, which I still haven't been to. Maybe there's something over there. I'll probably check it out during the week end.
So far thanks for the info.
Regarding Count Potocki. What other Potockis raced and where and did they have any success? Was the Lwow Grand Prix the biggest race in Poland? Or was there another GP held in some other part of Poland in those days?

[Rob29]

Originally posted by indyricefan13


.
Regarding Count Potocki. What other Potockis raced and where and did they have any success? Was the Lwow Grand Prix the biggest race in Poland? Or was there another GP held in some other part of Poland in those days?

Lwow was the only international race held in Poland pre-war.In 1970 there was an F3 race at Szcetin. Only Polish post war driver I recall was Adam Potocki,who had moved to France and raced in F3.He was on front row at Rouen race supporting French GP that I attended in 1968.

[anjakub]

In Grand Prix Lwowa took part Count Maurycy Potocki and Count Adam Potocki.

Other international pre-war races in Poland: Tatra (hill climb), Ojców (hill climb), Zakopane (track race) and... Poland Grand Prix. Under the name Poland Grand Prix was the International Rally of the Automobile of Poland in 1939. Of course the Lwow Grand Prix was the biggest race in Poland.

[indyricefan13]

anjakub, thanks.
You also mentioned in the other threads about the Lwow Grand Prix about some other classes that raced there. I seem to recall that you mentioned that the Romanian Nadu won some sort of sports car race and that there were also vioturette races. I recall the results of a voiturette race in 1933 but was it held the other years as well?
In total, if you count all the races and all the classes that raced through the streets of Lwow how many are there? who were the winners of the other races? I only have the results of the GPs themselves and of the voitirette race from 1933 when Veyron won.
and in what was the sport car class? Nowadays sports cars are ALMS, Grand Am cars. Something different was probably called a sports car in the 30s.

[anjakub]

Lwów races 1925-2001

From 1925 to 1930 flat races (a sort of speed trial) in the environs of Lwów


September 8, 1925
Track: Stryj – Bilcza Wolica: 10 km
Henryk Liefeldt (PL) Austro-Daimler


September 12,1926
Track: Stryj – Lwów: 20 km
Race cars:
Henryk Liefeldt (PL) Austro-Daimler
Touring cars:
Gotfryd Zangl (PL) Steyr VI SS


June 12, 1927
Track: Stryj – Lwów: 20 km
Race cars:
Henryk Liefeldt (PL) Austro-Daimler
Sports cars:
Adam Potocki (PL) Austro-Daimler
Race 5 km (flying start)
Race cars:
Henryk Liefeldt (PL) Austro-Daimler
Sports cars:
Adam Potocki (PL) Austro-Daimler


September 9, 1928
Track: Stryj – Lwów: 20 km
Race cars:
Henryk Liefeldt (PL) Austro-Daimler
Sports cars:
Stanislaw Szwarcsztein (PL) Bugatti T43


August 25, 1929
Track: Stryj – Lwów: 20 km
Race cars:
Edward Zawidowski (PL) Bugatti 35B
Sports cars:
Maurycy Potocki (PL) Austro-Daimler ADR


September 7, 1930
Track: Stryj – Lwów: 20 km
Sports cars:
Maurycy Potocki (PL) Austro-Daimler ADR


The winners of the Lwow Grand Prix (street race)

Wyscigi Automobilowe o Nagrode miasta Lwowa
September 8, 1930
Race cars:
Henryk Liefeldt (PL) Austro Daimler ADR
Sports cars:
Tadeusz Skolimowski (PL) Alfa Romeo 6C-1750
Touring cars:
Maria Kozmianowa (PL) Austro Daimler ADR
Motobike
Sports 600 cc:
Kazimierz Krzeminski (PL) Ariel
Racing 250 cc:
Rudolf Wilim (PL) Ariel
Racing 600 cc:
Tadeusz Rudawski (PL) Ariel


Miedzynarodowe Okrezne Wyscigi Automobilowe o Nagrode miasta Lwowa
June 7, 1931
Race cars:
Hans Stuck (A) Mercedes-Benz SSK
Sports cars:
George Nadu (RO) Bugatti
Touring cars:
Hans Stuck (A) Mercedes-Benz - 1st in general classification
Maria Kozmianowa (PL) Austro Daimler – 1st in “dominant type” touring cars class (3rd place in general classification)


II Miedzynarodowe Okrezne Wyscigi Automobilowe, Grand Prix Lwowa
June 12, 1932
Race cars:
Rudolf Caracciola (D) Alfa Romeo 8C-2300 Monza
3rd place Laszlo Hartmann (H) Bugatti 37A (1st in 1500 class)
Sports cars:
Florian Schmidt (CS) Bugatti
Motobike:
500 cc:
Czeslaw Gebala (PL) Ariel
350 cc:
Rudolf Breslauer (PL) Coventry Eagle
250 cc:
Erwin Geyer (PL) DKW


III Miedzynarodowe Okrezne Wyscigi Automobilowe, Grand Prix Lwowa
June 11, 1933
Race cars:
Eugen Björnstad (N) Alfa Romeo 8C-2300 Monza
Race cars, class 1500 cc:
Pierre Veyron (F) Bugatti 51A


Next Grand Prix of Lwow was planned in 5 June 1934, but it has been canceled from financial reasons.


It has passed 60 years...


First (Fifth) Camel Gran Pri Mista Lvova
September 22-24, 1995
Ukrainian Championship, round 2
Formula 1600:
Oleksandr Medvedchenko
Formula 1300:
Viktor Kholyavko
Sports cars class 7:
Sergiy Peleshok
Sports cars class 8:
Dimitro Ribak
Sports cars class 12:
Volodimir Chopenko


VI Gran Pri Mista Lvova
September 20-22, 1996
Ukrainian Championship, round 2
Formula 1600 (group E8) :
Oleksandr Armand
Formula 1300 (group E7) :
Valerij Morachevskij
Sports cars Class A, N-7:
Sergiy Peleshok
Sports cars class A, N-8:
Dimitro Ribak
Sports cars class A, N-9:
Vadim Reuckij
Sports cars class A, N-12:
Oleksandr Salyuk


VII Debica Gran Pri Lvova
September 20-21, 1997
Ukrainian Championship, round 4
Formula 1600 (group E8) :
Oleksij Varavin
Formula 1300 (group E7) :
Oleksandr Armand
Sports cars class A, N-8:
Leonid Leonov
Sports cars class A, N-9:
Leonid Kuzmuk
Sports cars class A, N-12:
Leonid Protasov


VIII Gran Pri Mista Lvova
September 19-20, 1998
Ukrainian Championship, round 5 and 6
Formula 1600 (group E8) :
Oleksandr Medvedchenko
Sports cars class A, N-8:
Ivan German
Sports cars class A, N-9:
Vadim Reuckij
Sports cars class A, N-12:
Oleksandr Salyuk (jr)


Galinstrakh IX Gran Pri Mista Lvova
September 17-18, 1999
Ukrainian Championship, round 4 and 5
Formula 1600 (group E8) :
Oleksij Varavin and ?
Group B, class 8:
Yurij Serov and ?
Group A, N; class 9:
Dmitro Ribak and ?

Pidkova X Gran Pri Mista Lvova
September 16-17, 2000
Ukrainian Championship, round 2 and 3
Formula 1600 (group E8) :
Oleksandr Medvedchenko and Oleksandr Kolodiazhnyj
Sports cars group N, class 8:
Viktor Kholyavko and ?
Sports cars group A, class 8:
Pavlo Gontovoy and ?


Pidkova XI Gran Pri Mista Lvova
October 27-28,2001
Ukrainian Championship, round 2 and 3
Group E8 (Formula 1600) :
Oleksij Varavin and Oleksandr Medvedchenko
Sports cars Group A, class 8:
Ruslan Serov and Pavlo Gontovoy
Groups A, N, H; class 9:
Oleksandr Feldman and Dmitro Ribak

[indyricefan13]

Thanks again. I found an interesting article on the Net about the racing in Lwow but it is in Ukrainian. Maybe I'll translate it but I doubt that there is any really new information in it.
I am really happy to live in a city with such a big racing heritage. Lately I started attending Speedway events (motor bikes racing on a dirt oval). I think it is pretty popular in Poland. At least I see it on Polish TV from time to time. It isn't really big over here. Only four cities are represented: Lviv, Chevonohrad, Rivne and Poltava but I enjoy it. I missed the European qualifying round which was held in Lviv about two months ago But in about a month there will be more racing with riders from six countries including Ukraine, Poland, Russia, etc. Too bad that there are no more Grand Prixs in Lviv. By the way, I read in the article I mentioned that the money the organizers made during thre 1932 Lwow Grand Prix was given to charity because the unemploymet was rising dramatically.

[anjakub]

Speedway is most popular motorbikes sport in Poland. In our speedway 2nd league (lowest level of contest) take part Ukraina Rivne (now on 4th position) as well as Latvian team Speedway Center Daugavpils. In year 2004 started other Ukrainian team - SKMS "SKA Speedway" Lviv.

[Alexey Rogachev]

Originally posted by anjakub
VIII Gran Pri Mista Lvova
September 19-20, 1998
Ukrainian Championship, round 5 and 6
Formula 1600 (group E8) :
Oleksandr Medvedchenko
Sports cars class A, N-8:
Ivan German
Sports cars class A, N-9:
Vadim Reuckij
Sports cars class A, N-12:
Oleksandr Salyuk (jr)

I cannot believe my eyes - Medvedchenko and Reutsky are still racing (or were racing not so long ago, that doesn't make much difference)! Given that their career started in the mid-70s, they can be put to the group of "long-livers" of motorsport together with such drivers as Emerson Fittipaldi or Dieter Quester...

[indyricefan13]

Originally posted by anjakub
Speedway is most popular motorbikes sport in Poland. In our speedway 2nd league (lowest level of contest) take part Ukraina Rivne (now on 4th position) as well as Latvian team Speedway Center Daugavpils. In year 2004 started other Ukrainian team - SKMS "SKA Speedway" Lviv.

SKA is the local track in Lviv and 'SKA Speedway' is out team, which I am a great fan of. A few weeks ago they won the Ukrainian championship with their riders Serhiy Senko and Ivan Myronov. Generally, speedway racing in Ukraine is still struggling but just like in Grand Prix racing the city of Lviv has a big speedway tradition. The first club was established in the 60s and went on to become champions of the USSR in 1963. Then the sport disappeared from the city until it was reestablished in the late 80s. Now it is struggling. In the Ukrainian championship this year the two teams from Lviv and the two teams from Chervonohrad had relatively good equipment. Rivne's equipment wasn't that good and that of Poltava was horrible. Actually the team from Poltava hasn't raced in about 15 years professionally so I guess it is good for Ukrainian Speedway to have them aboard. I'd love to see Speedway racing in Ukraine be as strong as it is in Poland.

[Kvadrat]

From David Venables' The Racing Fifteen-Hundreds.

[anjakub]

Vladimir, on map from Venables' book is error. Before WW2 in Lwow was Abrahamowiczow street not Abramowiczow.

[Kvadrat]

Thank you for correction.