Again I suspect Fred is leading there too. He seems to be pointing the wrong way an awful lot this year

I don't think El Fred has got the hang of no traction control yet - seeming to make mistake after mistake in race trim. I'm surprised at that. I expected more. I wouldn't be surprised if Flavio did too to be honest.

The prediction that McLaren would fall apart, without Alonso to guide them and help design the car, and that Hamilton would be unable to make his own setups, has certainly not come through (even taking into account all the personnel lost by Mclaren in recent years, and the big fine). Nor has the prediction that Alonso's talents (in car design and development, mostly) would bring Renault back to the top in no-time. The promised 6 tenths that McLaren would lose and Renault gain, instantly, hasn't shown up either.

Lewis Hamilton is the most cunning driver ever,...and he plays typical cunning political game usually done by people like him.

Lewis Hamilton never wins on merit, he needs Ron Dennis' help to sabotage Alonso's car to win.

Nice to see Nelsinho finding his feet. I can hear the little elf models hitting the tarmac outside the Renault motor home as I type.

Yeah But I still think Lewis is behind Fernando in any given aspect. Alonso spins from time to time, because he has a poor handling car. Hamilton spins because he's overdriving... Fernando is better in the rain than Lewis, just watch the Chinese GP and you'll know who managed his tires better. The Briton also cracks under pressure. Just watch the Brazilian GP;)

And do not blame for being Alonso's fan, because I'm not. I would have preferred Fisi wining the titles.

Wasn't Alonso no.1 at Renault in 05/06 and wasn't he driving an illegal car (06 prob. 05 aswell...)?

Lewis Hamilton just have a big mouth,...thats about all i guess.

With you all the way, but when has there ever been a successful partnership of two truely dominant drivers? It always breaksdown sooner or later....

What do mean by "people like him"? Which kind of people?

In the same car, Fernando wouldn't see which way Hammy went. Last year Hammy matched him, his first year. They all get quicker for the first 3-4 years. Look at their onboards, Fernando's inputs are rough, crude by comparison, Lewis is an artist.

And Shanghai 07? Hammy was 20 seconds ahead of Fernando. Anyone can make their tyres last by driving slowly . Mine would last for 5 seasons at least, does that make me 90 times better than Hamilton?

And Brazil - one off onto tarmac runoff that he knew was there, he was 4.7 seconds behind the leader at the end of the first lap. That was his only mistake, a slight one.

Fernando was lucky not to be up against Lewis this year, he would have looked totally second-best.

Fair enough




Could you remind me of when Hamilton has spun on the track in a race during his F1 career? I know Alonso went off at Canada and Spain last year, and at Canada again this year - as well as spinning at Silverstone and Hockenheim to name but two.



Wouldn't Hamilton still have beaten Alonso had he managed to get the stricken Mclaren into the pits? Are you forgetting Japan? Monaco? Silverstone (where Alonso destroyed his tyres it should be added)? I think it's debatable as to who is quicker in the wet certainly. But it seems odd to home in on one race with a drying track.




Yes do watch it. Wonderful recovery drive following the technical issues that ultimately cost him his WDC. I have to say though that over the year KR and Ferrari were the quickest combination and deserved the championship. But it was a technical gremlin that cost Hamilton the WDC. Just imagine if that had happened to Alonso.

Artist
Hes driving a much better car you cant compare, and good drivers are quick right away.

Alonso didnt spin at canada 07, or silverstone this year. You are imagining things. He spun with a damaged car at fuji and spun at canada this year trying to overtake a bmw.


Alonso didnt destroy his tyres at silverstone he simply wore them out after 35 odd laps.


We cant say it was a technical gremlin because Mclaren still havent confirmed want happened. Safe to say they are hiding the truth which is Hamilton caused whatever problem it was.

You can't compare?

I thought you liked to compare Fernando with everyone?

Anyway I suspect the Renault is better than it's being made to look. Piquet's throttle control is a shambles.

I think poor Alonso is suffering from deja-vú, his rookie teammate is beginning to kick his ass and this despite being giving everything by Uncle Flav which was denied to him at Mclaren, i.e. undisputed no.1 status

ah I see, when its Lewis it happens to, its termed destroying when its Alonso its just that the tyres wore out, glad we got that clear.

R28 has some deficits MP-4 23 does not have...MP-4 23
is a better car...

Alonso's nature,better said a habit, to be in front does not let him to drive only to pick up few points...he will always try more...even if it is not realistic...

in Hockenheim every time he lost a position he was actually trying to overtake...

he did everything OK but R28 simply cannot do a proper overtake...and the car is still unstable,and it will stay like that if they do not put some effort into engine development(since it seems engine freeze is a joke...teams upgrade engine under the pretext of reliabillity even though there was no a single sign of unreliabillity throughout the last two seasons )


I admire Alonso for hise performances in Q2 for some time...

Hamilton is the opposite end of Alonso, he would drive only to pick points, he won't do anything drastic to gain position, that's why he didn't overtake massa and piquet to get the win in Hockenheim. He also didn't challenge Alonso in the last two races last year.

Alonso is a much better driver than Hamilton, you can't argue about that because all his fanboys said so. If he is not much faster than Hamilton, he won't have his fanboys behind him.

Yes..and but You forgot that enviroment was Anglo-German team with more then 1000 employees...

I heard many drivers(e.g.Coulthard in his column ) were quite impressed by Alonso and his performance within the unsuportive team...

David Coulthard claimed that good relationship and friendly atmosphere within the team can bring a lot in performance of the car...

many here on this thread forget that whole team laughed when Hamilton broke agreement last year denying Alonso to have a last lap in Q3 as it was his turn...

anyway the fact is that Hamilton is the 1st one who accused the team publiclly...If he was unsatisified he could have gone
to his second father(honnest Ron) and try to discuss it in private,without

but,I know,whatever he says about the team is justified...

We said our point,and it is time that we move form this thread...

I have a feeling that after more time pass Alonso will come with more and more info about A.D. 2007 and the handling
of McLaren team...

I know that the price of his freeedom(Alonso's) was to
avoid talking certain details...I believe he had to sign something in order to be free to leave McLaren

That's interesting. Most specialist press reported that he was fired.

Brawn: Alonso the best




http://www.f1complete.com/content/view/9689/900/

Spooky.

Maybe he will follow Jacques afterall

Spanish newspaper you say.....

is he?

Neither Alonso could have broken the contract,nor McLaren could have fired Alonso without substantial fee to have been paid off to the oposite side...

since that never happenned I do not know how Your theory can be true...


as far as press is concerned I believe it was reported that the contract is broken by mutual agreement

F1 history is full of team bosses blowing smoke up the ass of drivers they want to sign. Alonso is no doubt one of the best current drivers, and will go down as one of the best ever, but he's also the only top driver potentially available for 2009, and Honda are desperate to make up ground anyway they can. I suspect Ross feels he has a talented driver in Button, but thinks an Alonso as his teammate will be the injection his team and Button need to step it up.

Brawn's comments almost deserve a thread of their own

Maybe Ross ought to have a word in the ear of Ron

That should clear his thoughts a little.

Interesting that Ron said about Hungary 07, "The truth is still to come out".

Which means all the crap hes said about it so far is bullshit
Glad to see hes finally confessed. Hopefully when Alonso's gag order expires he will finally us the truth.

The way he said it I have the feeling it won't be the likes of you Gates that feel vindicated

I agree

IT LASTED FOR ONE YEAR

THE HORROR

I think this year Hekki has been just been zero fireworks, sure he's a cool human being, but he's too bland at Mclaren, from going to Alonso vs Hamilton to having Hekki limp his way long the season, while Kimi struggles with darkness within the ferrari/bridgestone package, it's been less then steller year, all the while Schumacher grins in retirement setting fastest laps in the slick tyres shod ferrari 2009 rules in testing lol

Alonso , I wanted him so badly to stay at Mclaren, I thought it might be his mission to beat Hamilton and leave the team, but I guess situations went other ways. F1's huge loss.

This same GP, qualifying, one year ago, was when all went wrong for McLaren, thanks to its "star drivers". Give me a nice fellow like Kova, anyday. It's still a 1-2 in qual, just like last year, only without all the drama.

My view is Brawn on his own is way overated. It was the Todt,Bryne,Schumacher,Stepney and Brawn combo that did the business,he just happened to be frontman.the face everyone saw on TV during the resurgence of Ferrari.

So fanboys like you can lap up the milk?

links please

and don't tell me that last year Steve Cooper was impartial.....well...you can, you will anyway

yes, at least fair and impartial people as you help to balance the fanboys we read around here.

is it true the rumour that actually Arrows is you?

http://edition.cnn.com/2007/SPORT/11/02/mc...onso/index.html

to underline...alonso has been in intense negotiation over his early exit with mclaren

Hmm, yes, that article doesn't suggest he was sacked. It does quote Fernando about the team though...
""I continue to believe that McLaren is a great team. Yes, we have had our ups and downs during the season, which has made it extra-challenging for all of us, and it is not a secret that I never really felt at home.

"I know there have been suggestions of favoritism within the team and people say a lot of things in the heat of battle, but in the end I was always provided with an equal opportunity to win."

Or you could consider this version of events...

"Lewis Hamilton breathed a sigh of relief last night as his McLaren Mercedes team took their revenge on Fernando Alonso for a season of disruption and intrigue. His Spanish teammate was called to the McLaren headquarters in Woking, Surrey, for what he thought would be negotiations to save his future with the team. But he was effectively dismissed by Ron Dennis, McLaren’s team principal, who tore up his contract for what amounted to disloyalty".

Times

you may consider take this into account then...

http://www.20minutos.es/noticia/276056/0/a.../automovilismo/

http://www.motorpasion.com/2006/07/16-dice...per-con-mclaren

http://www.marca.com/edicion/marca/motor/f...lo/1024100.html

and many more

What a difference a year makes!

obvious with the new barrilainen

Do you remember Australia 07? That picture looks familiar to me.

1588 all over again

I remember that last year, things went really wrong here for McLaren, after a qualifying that should have been an easy 1-2 but wasn't in the end, because of the penalty. And I remember that things really went to shit after that. This won't happen with Kovalainen, because he's not Alonso.

Finnish drivers dont want to fight we just wanna drive fast and make love

I'm afraid that's not the case mate...Keep believing all the b*llsh*t Alonso uses to feed spanish media. Alonso must realise that he has some serious competition!

Updating again, although some fans are starting to be hyperventilated...



In one corner of the boxing ring we have the British side with:

-Alonso the prima donna
-Alonso, the 2WDC beaten by a rookie with the same car.
-Alonso backstabbing his own team in order to race for himself.
-Alonso blackmailing his boss and asking for unconditional N#1 status and preferential car.
-Alonso whinning and complaining all the time.
-Alonso, the man who brought 0.6 seconds to the team?
-Alonso, the man who was fired by McLaren because of his angry and selfish attitude
-Hamilton, the Rainmaster
-Hamilton, the new Ayrton Senna
-Alonso manipulating the Spanish Press and lying day in day out when he was unable to beat his (again) rookie team mate.
-The barbarian Spaniards with their rascist comments about Hamilton's Family in the Carnival
-The barbarian Spaniards cheering at Kovalainen crash when they thought it was Hamilton
-The barbarian Spaniards waving Spanish flags in support for Alonso in Barcelona
-Hamilton, the next Ferrari driver

-HAMILTON, THE ARTIST!


In the Spanish side we have:

-Hamilton, the bigmouth rookie.
-Hamilton the cheater
-Hamilton, the boy who copied Alonso's set-up
-McLaren saboutaging Alonso's car
-Ron Dennis, being unable to stop a crying rookie
-Ron Dennis and his preferences for his little son.
-...And the beloved daddy!
[http://es.youtube.com/watch?v=fdQP0Xurh3E]
-Alonso, the magic in the rain... Magic Alonso
-Hamilton, the crane boy
-Hamiton, pushing the wrong bottom...
-Bottom, pushing the wrong Hamilton
-Hamilton, cracking under pressure
-Alonso, the next Ferrari driver
-The barbarian Britons waving English flags in support of Hamilton in Silverstone

-ALONSO, THE GREAT MASTER!

And more and more to come, ladies and gentlemen

Make your new bets!

This is going hot and hot!!!!

And as referees we have the Germans, who went through all of this before.
Guys, seriously: british Lewismania is a wet fart compared to Schumania in 93-96, ITV pales in comparison to RTL and James Allen is a neutral reporter compared to Heiko Wasser whi even nowadays can not comment a race without stating what genius Schuey had done.

In a couple of years the heat of Alonsomania and Lewismania will have cooled down. Until then - have fun guys. And look forwqard to some french overhyped driver or (Heavens forbid!) an italian driver fighting for the Championship in a british car and thinking about changing to Ferrari. I think the tifosi would go ballistic!