FIA asked to examine Valencia bridge
WTF? Why had this not been looked at months ago I wonder? I thought it was only Michelin that turned up to circuits ill-prepared.

I find it hard to believe a Bridgestone delegation hadn't previously examined the track along with the FIA, especially the bridge section.

It looks like a just 'in case' check to me. Speeds at the bridge will be pretty low anyway - it's right after an exit of a very slow corner that will eject the cars to the right side of the bridge, when the next turn is a sharp right hander just after the bridge ends, so driving line will lead to from right to left side of the bridge (it will be also a minor breaking zone).

I read it and thought it was a 1.5 mm step, but it's up to fifteen mm.

Edit: great thread title

I would have thought the kerbs and track edging at just about all tracks would have been worse than this little bump.

I wonder if it's a steel edge? Hamashima was talking cuts rather than sidewall damage.

Do you think that Bridgestone can advise the teams not to take part in the race, like Michelin did in 2005?

Maybe they'll just ask for a chicane

Sorry, Max called from his vacation spot in Argentina, between the audible moans of unknown female individuals he said that he is going withdraw the FIA crew if the chicane is installed.

Unless it's swastika shaped.

And F1 is supposed to have "some" relevance to road cars...

This gets my vote for 'Thread Title of the Year'

Is it me or with each passing year does the wussie factor of drivers, teams, organizers and tire supplier(s) of this sport go up exponentionally? Just a few years back Champcar had race in San Jose I believe that featured part of the track intersected by rail tracks.

That's exactly what I thought of when I read the story

Regular speed

Slo-mo

Yeah, but the railways weren't sticking up 0.6" over the road surface- they're lower than the roadway even if it is a change in surface.

The issue is that the rounded edge of the bridge does indeed have a metal lip. Naturally this lip is open to the elements and spends most of its time above the salt water and as such it has become fairly oxidised (rusty). It is sharp and somewhat jagged and while there is maybe a 5-10mm gap between the track and the bridge, its the up to 15mm height differential that's causing the fears.

I think they're absolutely right to question it, because if someone gets an immediate deflation through that left kink, they'll go straight into the wall on the bridge. With nowhere for a crane to get to the cars on the bridge, that leaves us with a red flag situation.

If they can agree to not open the bridge at night, then i guess they could always get "some pikies" to lay some new tarmac and cover the gaps.

What makes this so stupid is they had F3 and GT cars there a month ago and claim they 'certified' the circuit. What's more is there were photos of this bridge gap, we've even got some on the website posted after that weekend.

But they only bother to look at it yesterday?

They know where they'll be racing at least 12 months in advance. If the GPDA and other safety groups were serious about what they did they'd look at tracks earlier than 24 hours before FP1.

The one that really annoyed me was a few years ago when they complained about the height of the kerb in one of the Hungary chicanes. How fucking long have we been racing there? If the kerb is too high and damages your car, don't fucking drive over it!

Spot on!
We seem to be forever hearing teams and drivers bemoaning things like bumpy tracks or steep / sharp kerbs etc, It one thing that always frustrates me when calls are made for tracks to be changed to better suit the cars, surely the whole point is to design the cars to best suit the tracks not the other way round.

But I digress, I can see why Bridgestone might be concerned with the metal edge protruding out, but as has already been pointed out, they known about it for months. I remember reading a report a couple of weeks ago saying that special attention had been paid to the gaps in the bridge and all parties involved were happy, so why the change of heart now?

Did you ever see one of those races? The transition over the crossing was as rough as hell. F1 would have crapped itself if it was suggested they should do the same.

Seems I'm not alone in finding this situation surprising and somewhat unforgiveable, espec. as Ross points out, it had been raced before and apparently certified.

(And thanks for the comments about the thread title...)

Spot on.

It's Indianapolis all over again, I hope the FIA don't throw Bridgestone out of the championship, it could make the remainder of the season tricky.


(Great thread title BTW)

Top marks for the thread title.

This is a high profile race, it is being brought in as one of Bernie's new breed of circuits. Now I do not know if Bridgestone were not allowed to have a close look at the circuit before. However, it seems clear that there has not been a complete inspection of the circuit with all relevant parties having representation at the same time. Surely if circuits are paying $20m to stage a race, the least that they can expect is to have a safety inspection before the race. We have has drain covers, and people washing the track already this season. Who is responsible for putting on the show?

I have been very critical of the present tyre regulations, although not necessarily blaming Bridgestone. Bridgestone have been allowed to cost cut to the point where decisions made by them affect the outcome of a race. This is the first instance where they have come out and said that there is a safety concern for the integrity of their tyre. It seem that they can produce a tyre that will run well on snooker/pool table surfaces. But the tyre is under threat when there is a bump in the circuit. It was only a race or two ago when Bridgestone broke the lap record for getting out a press release when a tyre punctured. They blamed debris for damaging the wall of the tyre. Doesn't their concern here indicate that the tyre they are supplying is fragile?

You said what I thought

F1 just continues to turn itself into a parody of itself.

A storm in a glass of water IMO.
But the thread title is great

Those cars are supposed to be road cars. But if the tendency continues they'll have to build railway tracks at some moment.

Once upon a time ....

Everything about that picture is glorious
In fact, it's going on my desktop.

Perigee:

At the first Detroit Grand Prix they had all sorts of problems with man hole covers being sucked off by all the aero forces so they had to weld them in place. Also some asphalt was breaking up in some corners. I witnessed a conversation between JYS and Didier Pironi, the head of the GPDA, Jackie asked him why didn't come to Detroit as he had been requested by the Ford family six-months before and inspect the track like he was asked to, he just arrogantly srugged his shoulders and made-up some bullshit that he had been very busy .

This is what you get with street races the first time.

You are being sarcastic, right??

Problem is this isn't the first street race, F1 street race, or even first race on this circuit :\

Ross you missed my point entirely. Would you like me to clarify it for you?

1. Why didn't anyone notice this in the lead-up?
2. Who ultimately is responsible? Drivers, FIA, Bridgestone?

its a new surface. perhaps bs had requested it to be level, but could only see it wasn't after the new tarmac had been laid...

le chat noir:

Good point, since most of us haven't even put on a tea party we sometimes take for granted the details involved.

Has the surface been relaid since it was used a couple of weeks ago?

Ultimately it's the FiA that approves a track. So the buck stops with them.

IMO this gap is a difficult case to judge. Such a bridge is "alive". Heat and other factors will change conditions like gap, height more than a similar gap in a regular bridge would cause. Even the time of the day does make a difference. So before we can comment on how they came to the conclusion to approve the track, we would need to know about those issues.

Those who ever have listened to train tracks when a train rolls over it, at different seasons, weather conditions time of the day know that the sound changes for the same train over and over. That's all because the gap between the tracks is changing all the time. Similar issue here. I hope they do the sensible thing.

Practice and then examine the tires thoroughly.

wow thats amazing

Not sure if anyone has noticed the plentiful supply of brick walls lining the circuit, oft at rather severe angles to a fast approach (e.g just before braking for final bend), but this strikes me as infinately more dangerous than a lip of tarmac.

Holy shit, and they did it lap after lap? Sort of puts F1 'bumps' in perspective.

Did anyone notice the crashed saloon in the background?

Zoe

I thought it was just me.

The vehicle dynamics of an F1 car have to a lot different to a F3 and a GT car?

What exactly makes this street circuit? From watching the practice it looks to me that every corner that there would chance of striking the barriers they have as much run off as a normal road course. Pretty soon they will make it where people in the seats will have to use binoculars to see the cars go by

no idea actually. still, they didn't check canada so no reason to expect them to check valencia really. surprised they didn't cover the gap with a bit of 4x4 and tarmac over it really, and strip it off post race.





supposing there's a big ish accident on the bridge, before the red flags are flown, what is the driver meant to do? presumably he runs away from oncoming traffic, but its a bit of a distance on a narrow part. can he jump over the barrier to the otherside of the bridge, the other lane, or just to the sea below?

It was an issue right from the very beginning. read page one at the bottom... Tilke's comments

http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/08/22/sports/SRSTREET.php

But that's the point, the track was checked and sanctioned a few weeks ago, so if this really is a big issue how was it missed?

Its an elaborate scheme to have Brundle say another 'pikey' comment on sunday, and give him the boot for good

incompetence?

'The Gravel Trap' on ITV-F1.com have their take on this story.

http://www.itv-f1.com/Feature.aspx?Type=Gravel_Trap&id=43673

'A Bridge Too High' - Good title, but I prefer Perigee's.

They gave three possible solutions:

1) Lower the bridge
2) Raise Valencia
3) Remove the bridge completely and make the cars jump

Unfortunately, I don't see Bernie going for option 3.

Couldn't they weld some temporary steel plate with a non skid surface onto the steel sections to match the gap?

This being F1, they'll probably go for option 2...