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The AUTOSPORT Bulletin Board > Forums > The Nostalgia Forum > Motorcycle Racing Nostalgia
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Russell Burrows
Originally posted by picblanc


Interesting that Florian Camathias used the "English" left hand sided chair?


Yes, must have been a Swiss thing : Schedigger too had a left side chair. It used to be brilliant watching Duebel/Horner and some of the other Germans on Paddock at Brands.
picblanc
Originally posted by knickerbrook
Chas Mortimer?


clap.gif clap.gif Yes Barry, Chas Mortimer it is. wave.gif
picblanc
Originally posted by Russell Burrows


Chas Mortimer, TZ, 1977, Snetterton. biggrin.gif


Yes, no & no Russ, its 1976 Silverstone. wave.gif
picblanc
Originally posted by sterling49
Great photo Russell, Max was another guy that I remember, going to school just a few miles from Brands bred a few young petrol heads and we often talked about the heros of the day! Thanks for the tip on the Bill Ivy book, I will look it up, it was such a tragedy to lose him in that F2 race, he was so very talented.

The sidecar outfits have changed just a bit from the early days :\


Hurry up and get the book Sterling me lad, it was in practice for the 500GP at Sachsenring on a Jawa in East Germany he was lost.wink.gif
Russell Burrows
Originally posted by sterling49
Great photo Russell, Max was another guy that I remember, going to school just a few miles from Brands bred a few young petrol heads and we often talked about the heros of the day! Thanks for the tip on the Bill Ivy book, I will look it up, it was such a tragedy to lose him in that F2 race, he was so very talented.

The sidecar outfits have changed just a bit from the early days :\


Haven't they, not sure they're more of a spectacle though. It was a seizing Jawa that did for little Bill, Sterling - practice for the East German GP.
Russell Burrows
Originally posted by picblanc


Hurry up and get the book Sterling me lad, it was in practice for the 500GP at Sachsenring on a Jawa in East Germany he was lost.wink.gif


Two out of three there Gra: the Jawa was a 350.
picblanc
Originally posted by Russell Burrows


Yes, must have been a Swiss thing : Schedigger too had a left side chair. It used to be brilliant watching Duebel/Horner and some of the other Germans on Paddock at Brands.


Could be Russ, here is Rolf Biland & Kenny Williams another left hand chaired Swiss driver.

Photo Copyrighted to Graham Etheridge, racebikepics.
picblanc
Originally posted by Russell Burrows


Two out of three there Gra: the Jawa was a 350.


blush.gif blush.gif Cant be right all the time!! 350? so it was!!wink.gif wave.gif
picblanc
Just having a quick squiz through my "modern" sidecar pics, the vast majority had/have changed to the left hand sided chair, Rolf Steinhausen/Bruno Hiller being one of the exceptions!

Photo Copyrighted to Graham Etheridge, racebikepics.
sterling49
Originally posted by Russell Burrows


Two out of three there Gra: the Jawa was a 350.


Not much gets passed you lot! lol.gif

You missed the eyear guys, I am guessing around '69 as he was also driving a Brabham (IIRC blush.gif ) BT23 F2 car.
Russell Burrows
Yeah, originally connected with them driving on the wrong side of the road, but then some adapting to the situation that most circuits run clockwise?
sterling49
What engines are these outfits running? 1100c.c.?
Russell Burrows
Originally posted by sterling49


Not much gets passed you lot! lol.gif

You missed the eyear guys, I am guessing around '69 as he was also driving a Brabham (IIRC blush.gif ) BT23 F2 car.



'69 is spot on Sterling.
picblanc
Originally posted by sterling49


Not much gets passed you lot! lol.gif

You missed the eyear guys, I am guessing around '69 as he was also driving a Brabham (IIRC blush.gif ) BT23 F2 car.


To true, and just like you car guys, our anoraks are hanging up close by!! tongue.gif
Russell Burrows
Originally posted by sterling49
What engines are these outfits running? 1100c.c.?


When they raced at the same GP as solos they were 500'S. Not sure what happened in more modern times. I do know though that the name has been changed to something silly.
picblanc
Originally posted by sterling49
What engines are these outfits running? 1100c.c.?


In my modern pics? at GP's they were 500cc mostly Yamaha engined, but in British racing they could use up to 1000cc engines again mainly TZ750 engines, but still left open for the Imp or Saab 1000cc car engined users.
sterling49
Originally posted by picblanc


Saab 1000cc car engined users.


Saab 1000c.c what the heck is that? No! Not the two stroke lump from the 96......
picblanc
This one taken in 1977, was a lovely 1000cc Vincent engined outfit, with polished copper carb trumpets.

Photo Copyrighted to Graham Etheridge, racebikepics.
picblanc
A modern outfit from 2006

Photo Copyrighted to Graham Etheridge, racebikepics.

Basically a 3 wheeled car!!
fil2.8
[QUOTE]Originally posted by picblanc
[B]This one taken in 1977, was a lovely 1000cc Vincent engined outfit, with polished copper carb trumpets.


Almost a pleasure to welcome you back on the forum Buster i've got a couple of piccies to put on from the weekend as soon as I know how !!!! confused.gif

Thats a pic of M Attrill's outfit is it not ???wink.gif
sterling49
Lovely photos Graham, but they are not sidecars as I remember them smoking.gif

I bet Owen Greenwood's Mini thing would give them a run!
fil2.8
Here's another chariot for your perusal up.gif I'll let Mr Fu love.gif provide the WWW wink.gif





sterling49
Looks like Clearways.......
fil2.8
Originally posted by sterling49
Looks like Clearways.......


Mr Fu love.gif must have found you with his piece of 4x2 lol.gif lol.gif Sorry it's Silverstone rolleyes.gif
sterling49
Originally posted by fil2.8


Mr Fu love.gif must have found you with his piece of 4x2 lol.gif lol.gif Sorry it's Silverstone rolleyes.gif


blush.gif blush.gif :yawn: and it's goodnight from Kent! Anyone can make a mistake, says the hedgehog climbing off the yardbroom lol.gif
fil2.8
Originally posted by sterling49


blush.gif blush.gif :yawn: and it's goodnight from Kent! Anyone can make a mistake, says the hedgehog climbing off the yardbroom lol.gif


And it's goodnight from Devon :yawn: :yawn: :yawn: No housework today then ???wink.gif wave.gif
Ninja1950
Originally posted by Russell Burrows
Yeah, originally connected with them driving on the wrong side of the road, but then some adapting to the situation that most circuits run clockwise?


The Swiss were one or the last country to swap from driving or riding on the the right side (left) of the road to then swap to the wrong side (right) of the road like the rest of Europe.

Biland had old bus with RHD in 1979-1980.


If it was better for most circuit why would you change?


Murray
picblanc
Originally posted by fil2.8
Here's another chariot for your perusal up.gif I'll let Mr Fu love.gif provide the WWW wink.gif







Werner Schwarzel & Andy Huber 1981/2?
Russell Burrows
Originally posted by Ninja1950


The Swiss were one or the last country to swap from driving or riding on the the right side (left) of the road to then swap to the wrong side (right) of the road like the rest of Europe.

Biland had old bus with RHD in 1979-1980.


If it was better for most circuit why would you change?


Murray


Swiss? I've always thought it was the Swedes.
picblanc
[QUOTE]Originally posted by fil2.8
[QUOTE]Originally posted by picblanc
[B]This one taken in 1977, was a lovely 1000cc Vincent engined outfit, with polished copper carb trumpets.


Almost a pleasure to welcome you back on the forum Buster i've got a couple of piccies to put on from the weekend as soon as I know how !!!! confused.gif

Thats a pic of M Attrill's outfit is it not ???wink.gif
[/QUOTE]

Yes! confused.gif wave.gif
fines
Originally posted by picblanc


Werner Schwarzel & Andy Huber 1981/2?

I'm sure you're right here, must be Werner and Andy - I thought I'd be clever and check the year by the race number, but they ran #5 both years! lol.gif

EDIT: Ha! There was no Sidecar GP at Silverstone in '81, so it must be 1982!!! A bit strange, though, why no British Sidecar race when the Champion was a Scot??? confused.gif
picblanc
Originally posted by fines

I'm sure you're right here, must be Werner and Andy - I thought I'd be clever and check the year by the race number, but they ran #5 both years! lol.gif

EDIT: Ha! There was no Sidecar GP at Silverstone in '81, so it must be 1982!!! A bit strange, though, why no British Sidecar race when the Champion was a Scot??? confused.gif


There was Michael deffo! I was there and Jock broke down early on, it was won by Rolf Biland. confused.gif wave.gif
fil2.8
Originally posted by picblanc


There was Michael deffo! I was there and Jock broke down early on, it was won by Rolf Biland. confused.gif wave.gif


wave.gif I'll go along with that up.gif
fines
Ha! You're right, of course! blush.gif

Serves me right for only checking one source, even if it was Maurice Büla's impressive tome! Wonder if there are more bloopers like that in it? confused.gif
seh1066
Back after some weeks (too much work smile.gif) with a WWH - a well known rider.

fines
Ricardo Tormo, Bultaco, Hockenheimring, 1982, Sep 26, finished 4th. smile.gif (the book's still on my lap)
seh1066
Originally posted by fines
Ricardo Tormo, Bultaco, Hockenheimring, 1982, Sep 26, finished 4th. smile.gif (the book's still on my lap)


clap.gif That was too easy, I think ! But more difficult will follow...
fines
Why, it's always easy if even I know the answer! lol.gif
seh1066
This one should take longer... smile.gif

carrotcruncher
ref post 2991:
OI, whats wrong with carrotcrunchers then? stoned.gif
fil2.8
Originally posted by carrotcruncher
ref post 2991:
OI, whats wrong with carrotcrunchers then? stoned.gif


Not a lot rolleyes.gif young Mr Burrows refered to ' a carrot cruncher ' not carrotcruncher which is your monicar I presume rolleyes.gif rolleyes.gif wink.gif
Russell Burrows
Originally posted by carrotcruncher
ref post 2991:
OI, whats wrong with carrotcrunchers then? stoned.gif


Sorry Carrot....just trying to explain that Minter was a country boy given to plain speaking. What a rider though !
ex Rhodie racer
Guys, I posted this up on the lucky escapes thread, and it was suggested I repost it on here as I am sure some of you will recall this event and my experience might be of interest.

I´ve witnessed quite a few accidents in my time, but the worst I´ve seen was the incredibly lucky escape by Barry Sheene and Jack Middleburg at Silverstone while practicing for the 1982 British GP.
There was a practice session on the Thursday before the event (official training started on Friday), which was open to all classes of bikes from 125´s to 500´s. Incredibly, there weren´t any marshals in attendance, despite the fact that almost 50 machines of varying capacity and performance were allowed onto the circuit at the same time. I was standing on the bridge over the circuit just before Woodcote (unlike the F1´s, the motorcycles didn´t used the chicane through Woodcote), looking back down the circuit towards Abbey.
Halfway through the session, a rider on a 250 fell exiting the very fast (I think flat on a 250) Abbey sweep, and both he and his motorcycle slid up the road, with the bike coming to rest diagonally across the middle of the road, about 100 meters before the bridge.
Anyone familiar with this stretch of road will know that visibility at that point is rather limited because the road crests a brow, which makes it almost impossible to see anything at ground level when the rider is flat on the tank, tucked under the fairing bubble.
Several riders passed by the stationary machine, and I could see by their reaction they hadn´t seen the bike in the road until they were almost past it.
Just as this realization dawned on me, Barry Sheene swept around Abbey, and Jack, trying to gain the maximum slipstreaming effect, was tucked in behind him with less than a few inches separating them, and riding totally blind. Barry probably saw the bike he was heading for, about 50 meters before he hit it, but at the speed he and Jack were travelling, which must have been around 260 kph, there was absolutely no time for him to react. In fact, I only saw his head starting to come out from behind the screen as he hit the machine, and he certainly hadn´t had time even shut off.
The explosion that followed as he hit the obviously full petrol tank, together with the sound of the incredible impact, not only of Barry´s machine colliding with the stationary bike, but also of Jack slamming into the rear of Barry, sounded like a bomb going off. At that point I just closed my eyes as I was positive no human could survive what I had just witnessed.
As we now know, Barry suffered quite severe leg injuries, while Jack escaped with little more than a badly sprained back.
That has to rank as the greatest escape on 2 wheels.



Top pic is the remains of Barry´s machine
Bottom pic, Jack´s bike.
Copyright. Toon Kannekens

As a footnote, that crash really ended Barry´s career IMO. It came at precicely the wrong time, what with Yamaha having just decided to give Barry equal machinery to Kenny. I think this was actually the very first time Barry or Kenny actually ever rode the Vee 4. We can only wonder how things would have developed for Barry with this machine at his disposal. Alas, it was never to be. More´s the pity.
fil2.8
Yes , I remember it well , I arrived at Silverstone shortly after the accident -- I was helping Tony Head then--Tony had been out in the same session and you are quite right it was a mixed session . Bit wise after the event but lack of marshalls or not some of the faster guys ie. 500 riders could have used a bit more caution all things considered IMHO . But speed differentals probably would not have altered the outcome of this tragedy frown.gif
TZ350
IIRC wasnt it Patrick igoa's bike?
exclubracer
Originally posted by TZ350
IIRC wasnt it Patrick igoa's bike?


Julian wave.gif without looking it up I thought it was J-L Tournadre's 250 ??

I'm probably wrong (again!) lol.gif
jeff sayle
Originally posted by exclubracer


Julian wave.gif without looking it up I thought it was J-L Tournadre's 250 ??

I'm probably wrong (again!) lol.gif

Think it was Igoa, horrific accident,that in hindsight should never have happened.
exclubracer
Originally posted by jeff sayle

Think it was Igoa, horrific accident,that in hindsight should never have happened.


Correct Jeff, just checked it.

I AM wrong again, doh ! :\

Julian didn't you have an off at that meeting as well? Gearbox breakage or similar?

Or did I dream that one as well ? rolleyes.gif
picblanc
Most people remember Barry's Daytona accident so well, probably because most of it was caught on film, and bad though it was, it was no where near this one in 1982, Barry was within a whisker of dying that day, and even when stabilized later, of loosing both his legs!! To get back in the saddle, and I can still remember him riding into the BBC studio during the "Sports Personality of the Year" programme on his plain white RG500 in the December of 1982, to get back out at the top level in 1983 GP's, all be it on inferior machinery to the factory riders bikes, just showed what a great courageous man & rider he was. frown.gif up.gif
picblanc
Oh and yes it was Patrick Igoas bike. :\
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