No they didn't. Haug never said that. Is English your second language?

Well, Alonso could do it once he had overtaken Hamilton in the start. No problem with it. It's called racing.

Wow. This is the most ignorant statement that has ever appeared on atlasf1, and that is some achievement.

Brake testing is NOT racing, it is the absolute antithesis of racing. It is not just stupid, but highly dangerous. There have been several deaths and very serious injuries in F1 alone from cars riding up the back of other cars. You are saying that creating a situation like that DELIBERATELY is not only acceptable, but RACING? Lewis Hamilton can tool around at the start, wait for Massa to lap him, and then braketest him into the championship? What's clever about that?

Nadsat, if that is your idea of "racing", please do everyone a favour and eff off to watch demolition derbies instead.

Not it's not, but maybe for Alonso fans brake testing is "racing"

Wonder if someone brake tested Alonso, how would you feel then? Alonso has a long list of brake testing, Hamilton, Coulthard, Doornbos -shows what a fair guy he is

Yes Lewis was a better driver than Alonso last season.

Remember too that Alonso cheated last season - testing his car with set up information via Pedro from Stepney - Hamilton didn't.

What complete rubbish.

When did he brake test Hamilton?
At Bahrain? Actually Hamilton rammed Alonso TWICE
PS even showed the telemetry you bloody muppet.

He didn't brake test Coulthard either, Renault showed the stewards the telemetry too and they decided to take no action.

The only one he did that to was Doorknob and that was during a FP where that guy was being a c***, not that it makes it fair but cut the "he has a long list" crap.



Oh is this why Alonso beat him 10-7 in the races?

LOL, you ran out of excuses to bash Alonso and made up that BS.



Of course, that information was only available to Fernando and Pedro. Nobody at McLaren knew about it. Seems that the british propaganda really works.

Hamilton had been copying Alonso's setup for many races so he did used illegal information as did Fernando.

When Massa and Kimmi signed the extension to the their contracts Alonso WAS under contract with Renault for 1 year, with the posibility to exercise a second year with the French team if the performance was to Alonso's specifications.

What do you mean Alonso was "available"?

Get some glasses.

No, what I am saying, and you seem to have difficulty reading, is that most media are biased. The only difference is that while we in Spain KNOW our media is biased, we also know YOURS is also biased.

Do you understand now or would you like me to translate it into Goidelic?

Well, stand aside for a second. Here's Fernando, a 2 x WDC, coming into a British team and finding out that the team has ILLEGAL information of Ferrari's development.

Now, what WE DO KNOW if how the FIA reacted to Alonso's and Lewis' testimony: 100 million dollar fine, no WCC and the stigma of having been caught lying. We know the FIA did not punish De la Rosa, Lewis or Alonso, so, from this, we can only conclude that NONE of these three individuals did anything wrong or illegal.

What Ronald Dennis and his bitches did, is plant a story, like they do many times, in the British specialized press, which always happily complies without even checking to see if what is being reported is fact or just mere gossip (hence is a de-facto propaganda machine) saying that Alonso had blackmailed the team.

Now, we all know the FIA is French and we all know how much the Brits dislike to be controlled by a French body of power (hence the constant criticism by what some call the "British lobby," meaning Windson, Matchett, etc; is it me or does it seem the criticism for the FIA ONLY seems to come from the British teams?) but we can only make conclusions from facts, and the fact is that Alonso was not penalised by the FIA.

Now, you have another choice, which is to believe a story planted in the British specialized press by one of Ronald Dennis' bitches, mere uncorroborated gossip from a guy that has just been busted LYING.

Hasn't this been discussed in various topics whole year long? As far as i know this is about the "alonso factor @ interlagos 2008"

Funny, nobody has ever managed to find any evidence that Alonso did not blackmail McLaren. No counter-stories, no counter-suggestions, nothing. Nothing in the foreign media, I understand. Was there anything in the Spanish media stating that Alonso did not threaten Dennis that he would not pass emails on to the FIA if he did not get number 1 status? Because regardless of any planting Ron Dennis was the one who provided the smoking gun evidence to the FIA.


It is also a fact that the FIA lied to justify penalizing McLaren and only the British media pointed out that fact. Perhaps that means that the British media are the only media that actually care about reporting the truth?

Two words 'court transcript'

I can't argue with the ridiculous, sorry.

I understand that you have got issues and that you like wielding your big wide brush.

The Spaniards were offered immunity from prosecution in exchange for grassing. Alonso and De La Rosa were clearly cheating and happy to do so.

But that is precisely what I am saying: How do you know that Fernando Alonso backmailed Ronald Dennis or McM? Were you THERE when this alledged incident took place?

As far as the rest of the media NOT carrying the story, or as you choose to know it "nobody has ever managed to find any evidence that Alonso did not blackmail McLaren"; I think it has more to do with not trusting the source (British specialized media) than them actually not wanting to pursue the incident.

I personally am of the opinion that Fernando Alonso was USED shamelessly, by Ronald Dennis and his bitches, as a scapegoat to the whole spying scandal. I mean, look at the British media's reaction to the supposed "blackmail" incident vs the spying scandal. Does it look fair and balanced??? And the way McM has their bitches critizising the FIA every chance they get... I mean, total rubbish. I've never seen anything like this (in sports) in my life.



The FIA lied in what?? Again, BACK WHAT YOU SAY MAN!!!

The fact that the British media pointed out something is irrelevant to me. I do not trust their information. Period. Anything they say, unless corroborated by another news outlet, I (metaforically) would hold with a pair of tweezers, at arm's length, while holding my breath.

I think everything needs to be put into perspective:

http://www.pitflaps.co.uk/

seems about right to me, especially the February issue.

I would also like to know who Ron's "bitches" are because I'm not sure Autosport have done a story on them and it would be good if we could all be kept informed of useful information like this.

It's in the court transcript.

El captian, if you have such a problem with the British and British media, where do you insist on visiting a british media site, why not go pollute a spanish site where you can spew you endless tripe and hate about McLaren and how baddly Alonso was done to.

According to Cadena SER Haug and Dennis spoke to Alonso´s manager to ask him to play safe.

My thoughts exactly.

I think that would be an extremely foolhardy thing for Dennis to do. Alonso has made it clear that he doesn't owe McLaren -and particularly Dennis- any favours at all. It would be like a red rag to a bull I'd imagine.

Here's hoping Alonso breaks a driveshaft off the line...

Not only that, there´s no point at asking that.

It´s a great opportunity for Alonso, Vettel...to get a great result since Hamilton does not need a W, they all have to push and try to overtake him asap because they know he shouldn´t take many risks.

Have you ever read anything else aside from Autosport? Did you ever noticed how some papers seem strangely reticent to pursue certain news that are worth investigating because it involves Team X while they will jump on the stupidest gossip story known to mankind just because it benefits Team X? Have you ever wandered why this is so?

There is a reason for this, and it involves many papers in many countries. Have you ever noticed how Marca never says anything negative about Real Madrid? Have you ever noticed how it is difficult to find negative news about McM in Autosport magazine?

Nowadays access to teams/athletes may mean the difference between having a career as a writer or not. Hence you have writers, and not necesarily investigators, writing what athletes or teams want, which may or may not coincide with the truth. Now, as of lately this level of intellectual servitude has taken to the additional task of demonizing "the opposition," and are doing so actively. Marca does it with Barcelona all the time.

Now, all of these relationships of interest have had a big impact of the quality of the writing, sometimes resorting to mere gossip and not investigating what is most important. Hence that is why Austosport will NEVER pursue a serious investigation of the entire spying scandal but yet will elaborate INSATIABLY about the supposed or alledged blackmailing incident with Alonso. Or Marca's outright denial that (as per Ferguson's correct accusation) Real Madrid distorts the player's markets so that they could make "a bundle" by overvalueing their players and planting FALSE accusations about other rising starts that conflict with their market.

The ones who get involved in this game without any remorse I like to call "bitches", because they do what the "pimp" wants them to do.

Because I trust and like British people, but not some of their institutions.

And?? Link?? Can you please elaborate? What does the transcript say?

El Crapitan, the rest of your ranting post made some sense, but what does this last sentence mean?

So you've never read the most famous FIA court transcript in F1 history, yet you want to tell us all how the world works? You take the biscuit.

It's El Capitán. I don't think I ever insulted you, so I'm going to play nice and ask you to calm down a little.

What I meant with the last sentence of my comment is that those who report the news are no longer independent in the sense that they can report that which they deem is worth reporting. Nowadays people report things that go through various "filters" (aka censorship) before they are published.

Hence the freedom to write is gone (partially at best) and we end up with teams/athletes dictating what is newsworthy and what is not. Of course, they do not do this directly, but if you have direct access to such and such player or team, get invited to all of their parties and then, out of the blue, you get invited no more because you wrote a piece the team/athlete did not find "suitable" for their marketing needs... you kinda get the point. Ya know what I mean?

I don't believe that for a nanosecond.

So what did it say??? Do you have a link???

Apologies, was just needling you.

Yes, I do take your point but I'm afraid I don't agree with it.

Some elements of the media have an agenda for sure, but as a reader I always strive to find an objective view point.

I think some, but not all, of the specialist press writers in the UK offer this.

No harm done my friend!

As far as you finding an "objective point" of view... I do not deny that, but look at half of the posts here and tell me the stupidity in the writing hasn't percolated to people's opinions. I mean, if you find gossip as damaging and morally wrong as spying and lying... It's kind of hard to find any objectivity there. Don't you think?

Haven't we argued enough about last season? There will never be any agreement on that stuff, so can we just move on? This thread is about brazil 2008. Alonso will not do anything untoward to Lewis today. Any contact between any of the runners would be purely incidental to the racing. Fred does not have a agenda against Lewis. And he has made it clear that crashing an f1 car into another on purpose is just fanboy fantasy rubbish.

Agreed 100%, but i think if a crash happens with Hamilton involved people will say it was on purpose bla bla bla.

Also in this day and age where dnfs are more costly, and the points system rewards the winner less, it's harder to run away with wins alone, you need not to dnf, so drivers are or have to be more friendly to a certain basis and have a peace eventually, as they depend on each other for some sort of rational racing interaction on track where the very championship foundations hangs in the balance.

The equalibrium of f1 drivers solidarity in relation to racing is much more clearly defined, the days of Senna and Prost messing with each other, will likely not happen again, f1 cameras, f1 public, f1 drivers have all changed into a new beast. 2007 was a accident, no one was expecting Alonso and Hamilton to be in the same team, it lasted one year, didn't work out, but it was exciting to see, ashame it didn't continue, we needed something like to get our minds off the fia's messing with the sport



THE EQUALBRIUM SHIFTS