LeMans cars flipping isn't that special though. There were also BMWs and Porsches in LeMans spec flipping in a couple of occasions during the last 15 years. Luckily noone was seriously hurt in LeMans 99 because of the Mercs flipping.

Anyways, this is getting off topic.

Only 5 days until we hit the track in Spain. I wonder what Mark and Mr. Marko are talking about. Hopefully the RB5 is quick and reliable. And as a bonus I wouldn't mind it being a beauty too.

I remember reading what Webber had to say about it. And his complaint was that the engineers did not believe him, they believed the car's aero was just fine. Webber was in-experienced then too, and he only speaks English. At that time in Australia, second languarges were not pushed at school, and in Webber's country town school, learning another language would not have been what an Australian native parent's child would have normally done. Even if it was possible, which I doubt. German engineers all speak good English, and probably another Euro language. They probably thought Webber was an idiot, and had made a mistake, and was not owning up to it. I imagine also, that his direct approach was unusual for those race engineers. What works well with English engineers might not work well with German ones I suspect. In other words they simply did not believe him.

The car wake issue is ridiculous - and MB know about such dangers, as all racing teams do.

And MB are sensitive to aero mistakes at LeMans. Their SLR was equipped with air brakes when it crashed (due to a Jaguar in front swerving I think) and the SLR went into the grand stand where it's engine came out of the chassis and killed a large number of people. MB then pulled out of racing, and I think they then diverted their racing budget expenditures into their famous and innovative road safety programs.

It'll be interesting to see how the RB5 differs in particular to the MP4/24, as despite Newey leaving McLaren in '05, they continued to develop similar design themes and Newey has produced 2 very McLaren-esque cars with Red Bull so far.

It sure will.

Evidently the Renault KERS has been operational, and working too. Which is good news for RBR.

Also the Renault engine is the only one that's been allowed to be upgraded - so it should be equal to the others. In theory, it may even be better, since its revisions have been more recent.

Maybe the extra time designing will make up for the smaller team size ... and maybe Newey will come up with something. Did the team also devote a far bit of the latter half of the season to the new car? We'll know more after Melbourne I guess ... and maybe not until after the 3rd race I guess.

I'm also very excited about the RB5. There is a chance to have a big advantage in the early races. I'm not saying it's likely, as you would always put your money on McLaren or Ferrari but put it this way it's Redbull's best chance they are probably ever going to get. A now or never situation. It's the same for Toyota but more so for Redbull because of Newey and the radical rules changes that go back closer to 90's cars.

Even if Newey has something trully innovative the other teams will eventually copy it and catch up. But in those races until then it could get some very good results. It could take a whole season to catch up because copying someones front wing doesn't give the same benefits unless the other aspects of the chassis (and whole package) are the same. This is best case scenario but it's a possibility.

Beautiful and innovative sounds to good to be true. Hope it lives up to the words, to the eye and also on track.

Vettel will launch the RB5 on Monday. Two days later Webber will be back behind the wheel.

That would never happen to a heavy weight driver like Montoya.
The front of the car would be stuck in the ground, for sure, for sure.

I don't think the car was a waiste.
Mercedes was a regular participant in FIA GT championship and that year MB made a real slim car.
That car had an achiles heel on a particular cirsunstance, when going behind a fastest class car, the air would penetrate under the front of the car and going up on a slope at the LeMan straight, the car could lift its front.

But I saw the Diesel Peugeot doing the same on youtube last year.

I think that Mercedes could have won the race in case of rain or if they could avoid staying behind those GT-ONEs.
Smaller class cars wouldn't generate vacum enought to lift the Mercedes.
But of course, the instinct if driver tells him to take the drag of the car in front.

I only brought up the Webber-Merc flip incident because that IS the reason he won't get a drive with McLaren. I didn't intend to start a debate about whose fault it was, but since its claimed otherwise, how is it practical to instruct a racing driver not to follow another car too closely incase it flips. That in my opinion is the definition of a racing car that is not really fit for purpose and thus inherently dangerous.

The only reason he won't get offered a Mac drive is if they do not consider him good enough.

There are mountains in our way and we must keep climbing it... every day.
Joe Cooker - Up were we belong.

There are always contraints / restrictions to optimize. You have to understand them, live and overcome them.
I understand your point, but some - very few - drivers can deal with adversity.

Didn't stop them hiring Heikki.

P.S: I love Heikki.

That would be the situation now. But I think Mark may have been the alternative to Hamilton. When FA was coming, it was quite uncertain whether Hamilton would get the gig. His ability has not been questioned, as evidence Michael Schumacher has listed Webber amongst the couple of drivers suitable for Ferrari. I do not know if he was ever on offer, and IMO Massa had a Todt based advantage, but he was recognized by Ferrari as being one of the top few drivers. When FA won his first race in the Renault at Hungary in 2005, Webber had the Jag 3rd on the grid. It was an unbelievable performance. Webber lapped Schumacher that day - but so did many others. McLaren now don't need a Webber - they have Hamilton.

They could always get Wurz back - he is statistically McLaren's best ever driver! Prost and Senna trail well behind!

To laugh at?

Well there is now confirmation that Webber will test when the car is launched, after Vettel has had his two days. Great work to get into that position after I remember reading Horner and others predicting he'd miss some tests and focus being ready for the first race. Webber always said he was aiming at the tests, but talk is cheap. So it's thumbs up he has made it, but there is still a long way to go. Stoner had 3 months to recover from his wrist surgery but is still in some pain while testing. I wonder if Vettel will be on hand in cause towards the end of the day he wants to cut the test short and Vettel can take over. Also, don't bin it Mark lol! A crash would be a nightmare you'd think. For the car and his leg.

Looking forward to seeing this car now that Webber said their car looks different to everyone else's.

Sneak Preview, sure is different

nice

Especially the rearend of the RB5 is said to be different, somehow the engine cover would be conjoined with the floor...

Going radical can go one of two ways... Having said that, it's Newey. So it should be effective.

When has Newey last been effective? Over 10 years ago?

Fair comment. But he doesn't pen dud cars, come on.

The by Newey designed STR3 won a race last year and overall did very well considering the budget the team has...

Not exactly the results you would expect for such an overrated overpaid star designer.

Three years and one win (in exceptional track conditions) does not really warrant any commendation based on his apparent past achievements.

He's a great aero no doubt, but he fails miserably as a TD.

Seems to need a decent engineer to team up with (like Lowe/Fry at McLaren and Head at Williams).

Let's see what the RB5 does. I think it's Newey's last roll of the dice before he gets ushered into retirement to pursue his America's Cup yacht design or LeMan racing interests.

Maybe, but RBR doesn't have a budget or the resources similar to that of the topteams...

Like Geoff Willis?

I have a very strong feeling that RBR are going to clean up this year.

How so?

I'm assuming by building a better car than everyone else?

Or maybe he just means that with DC gone, the language will be a bit cleaner.

You make it sound as if he passed away. But he's still around working for the team as well as the BBC. You'll prolly hear even more comments of his this season.

I don't see anything that indicates a particularly strong season but you never know. This new car could be awesome.

Its certainly possible that this year a team that has never won a title will at least fight for this years, or possibly someone like Williams will get back up the top. What i dont see going in Red Bull's favour is their past 2 cars havent been all round strong cars - theyve been super aerodynamically, but borderline poor mechanically at times. A championship winning car will need to be able to win on pretty much all types of tracks, or at least get podiums there.

You dont see anything that indicates a strong season? What are you looking at exactly?

Lets wait til we see the new car and see the testing times before we start making any kind of assumptions.

With such a huge change in regulations, there's bound to be some suprises.

There's a first teaser pic along with an article about the launch.

Rb5 in 3D

http://www.go-f1.com/f1-4012-rb5-red-bull.php

That is well worth a 10 !

A bit dissapointed after ther all the hype about how different the newey car is, on the other hand i think i have to wait for official pics before making a judgement

Yes, like that it's not a lot nicer than the other cars. On the Red Bull cars I don't like the vertical elements in front of the sidepods...

Looks like a pretty thin and high nose for RB5 in that clip.

Thanks a lot for the link !

It doesn't look revolutionary, but it sure looks by far the mosst beautiful of all cars presented so far.

Not really sure about the 'Prost' nose, but the front wing and sidepods look good.

Looking good!

Where's the shark-fin gone though?

Girlfriends of patients doesn't like the cryogenic threatment due to some undesired side effects.

Girl: What's that? I though you loved me!
MW: But darling,... I'm on a Cryo.

In terms of radical looks,

I definitely pick Renault above all else, something about it harks back to cars in from days of old can't place it but that rear treatment around the rear suspension is what strikes the eye the most and somethings up with the nose.


Next I would say BMW and Williams, the side pod upper surface, a similar design. Nose on BMW most like Renault/Toyota, Nose on Williams most like McLaren.

As for what I have seen of the RedBull and if that's the finished shape I would say Ferrari it most resembles although the RB5 does have its own unique contouring of the forward portion of the nose. I don't pay that much attention to front wings as they tend to evolve too fast to really matter in the overall look.

From what I have seen of all the cars so far, I like them a lot, much more pleasing to the eye than the previous cars, they were just to busy to appreciate them as beautiful to look at. The only thing that looks out of place is that rear wing, but I will get used to it. Now none of the above is meant to imply speed that is just a ridiculous assumption many make the mistake of implying.

In terms of liking what I see, the Ferrari, the Mclaren and the RB5 seem most pleasing to my eye so far. The Renault at the moment is the ugly duckling of the bunch.

Red Bull have revealed a teaser animation video of the new car due to be launched on Monday next week. The video and some interesting still shots can be found at http://www.pitlanefanatic.com/viewtopic.php?f=39&t=608

What do you think, worth the wait?

See above.

I don't think the cars in the animation are fully representative to what we'll next week in Jerez. 99.9% certain that the shark-fin for example will make an appearance before Melbourne.

Yes, a transparent one! I think they already sport one (really, a shorter version)... Couldn't help it.

The nose is very sculted in it upper part, the sides of the bmw one are also sculted, i think this will be the new trend.

fffuuuuckkkkk thAt looks amazing