Ross Stonefeld
Jul 17 2009, 09:39
He's a British F3 champion, why wouldn't he get one?
QUOTE (hallows @ Jul 17 2009, 10:08)

I'll to stick to Jamie. Not very keen on following a tradition that came about because some inbred royal couldn't speak properly.
Did you see what I did there? Annoying, isn't it, when people think they know why being wrong is the right thing to do. I should know, I've spent years having my first name spelt in entertainingly inaccurate ways (Graham, Grahame, Greame, Graheme, Greyham, Greaham - all of which are wrong, because it's spelt Graeme).
It's Jaime. And his surname is Alguersuari, not whatever abomination Legard came out with at the weekend.
Anyhoo, I say give the guy a chance. He might be crap, but that'll be no different to what Bourdais ended up being - which is a great shame IMO because he clearly has talent. It might just be, though, that he needs a roof over his head to perform properly a la the 908 LMP1...
QUOTE (harrows @ Jul 17 2009, 09:08)

I'll to stick to Jamie. Not very keen on following a tradition that came about because some inbred royal couldn't speak properly.
OK, if you want to look and sound ignorant... You can also name it "Jaume", the catalan variation of his name.
And, about the pronunciation... I heard the BBC and thought there was a new girl in town! It's something like "Hi-meh" not Jamie nor Jaimee.
QUOTE (OfficeLinebacker @ Jul 16 2009, 23:23)

Anyway yeah Montoya was involved in an incident with the leader, good point.
Maybe Ross and hunnylander meant last backmarker to collide with the leader?
I think Ross meant the situation 5 years or so ago when JPM was comfortably leading the Brazil GP and Jos Verstappen ran over him.
brabhamBT19
Jul 17 2009, 11:07
QUOTE (Kucki @ Jul 17 2009, 13:03)

I think Ross meant the situation 5 years or so ago when JPM was comfortably leading the Brazil GP and Jos Verstappen ran over him.
2001
QUOTE (4MEN @ Jul 17 2009, 11:10)

OK, if you want to look and sound ignorant... You can also name it "Jaume", the catalan variation of his name.
And, about the pronunciation... I heard the BBC and thought there was a new girl in town! It's something like "Hi-meh" not Jamie nor Jaimee.
Jimmy it is, then! Anyways, he doesn't sound promising. Buemi seems a capable driver, I'd like to see Klien paired with him, or maybe Liuzzi, but if Loeb's arriving at the end of the season I guess there aren't many F1 drivers willing to act as a stopgap.
hunnylander
Jul 17 2009, 11:48
Two Million Reasons For Alguersuari Debut With Toro Rosso
Jaime Alguersuari's formula one debut is being powered by sponsorship from two major Spanish companies. It is expected that Toro Rosso will announce next Monday that the 19-year-old Spaniard is to be Sebastien Bourdais' replacement for the Hungarian grand prix and beyond. Spanish media claim he is backed by the oil company Repsol as well as La Caixa, Spain's leading savings bank.
Press sources claim the companies are advancing 2 million euros to the Faenza based team, guaranteeing Alguersuari the race seat for the forthcoming Hungarian and European grands prix. Even if Toro Rosso decides to oust the rookie after Valencia, the team is able to keep the Spanish sponsorship funds, the newspaper Diario AS said.
Former Spanish F1 racer and Ferrari test driver Marc Gene is reportedly a close friend of Alguersuari, but he believes the youngster is facing "the most difficult debut in the history" of the sport. "Jaime is ready, but there are lot of factors playing against him," the 2009 Le Mans winner told Spain's Diario Sport. He said the testing ban means Alguersuari has not done any proper circuit testing at all in F1 machinery, while Hungary is one of the "most difficult" circuits on the calendar. (source: PaddockTalk)
Ross Stonefeld
Jul 17 2009, 12:19
2mil for 2 races or the entire rest of the season?
This testing ban needs to be revised now. It's going to be hard for Jaime not having had a proper test in an F1 car.
On the other hand, if he does alright then it will look really impressive.
Rinehart
Jul 17 2009, 14:48
QUOTE (Ross Stonefeld @ Jul 17 2009, 10:39)

He's a British F3 champion, why wouldn't he get one?
Its like saying that any experienced light aircraft pilot should obviously be given a license to fly an F15.
Its all very well saying that its fine for this kid to race in a car twice as powerful as his F3 car, with barely any experience, but obviously if he were to unfortunately cause a fatal shunt the rules would be changed tout sweet with the benefit of hindsight.
I think that an F1 license should be a little more sacred and the newcomers should have to gain more experience than winning another category. I'd propose in the region of 2000 test kms. Therefore teams need to be able to run more cars during the winter. Saving money at the expense of the next generation of drivers skill and safety is not smart imo.
Don't take my word for it, read what Gene had to say.
Ross Stonefeld
Jul 17 2009, 14:52
Err, no one's ever had a problem with F3 champs getting super licenses and drivers have made F1 debuts with next to no testing. It's not ideal, but he's not going to kill anyone. The worst that will happen is he will be embarassingly slow. Maybe he shouldn't be at the front of the line of drivers waiting to get into F1, but he's not unqualified.
D.M.N.
Jul 17 2009, 14:57
If he's embarrasingly bad and causes crashes, he'll have his Super Licence revoked like Yuji Ide. Simples.
Rinehart
Jul 17 2009, 14:58
QUOTE (Ross Stonefeld @ Jul 17 2009, 15:52)

Err, no one's ever had a problem with F3 champs getting super licenses and drivers have made F1 debuts with next to no testing. It's not ideal, but he's not going to kill anyone. The worst that will happen is he will be embarassingly slow. Maybe he shouldn't be at the front of the line of drivers waiting to get into F1, but he's not unqualified.
Name some of these other drivers that have had anything like as little testing as this kid?
The very point is he is unqualified compared to every other debutant in the modern history of F1.
The testing is the point of issue, not his championship. If he had come 2nd in the F3 championship but had 1000kms more F1 testing he would be MORE qualified.
Ross Stonefeld
Jul 17 2009, 15:05
It's just a race car you know, not the space shuttle. He'll be off the pace because of lack of testing, but he won't be an issue for anyone else.
Sure, Jaime Alguersuari probably ain't the most promising choice of all drivers who are vaguely available. The question though is, who is the best choice of the Red Bull Junior driver program or what ever it's called? Is there anyone with more experience except for Scott Speed maybe?
expert
Jul 17 2009, 15:47
Brendon Hartley was testing over the winter in place of Mark Webber. But he doesn't have 2 million euros.
Rosemayer
Jul 17 2009, 16:52
sreevishnu
Jul 17 2009, 17:02
yeah the Twat Vertappen idiot ruined JPM's great race
It would have been a record if JPM won that race
Kooper
Jul 17 2009, 17:07
QUOTE (OfficeLinebacker @ Jul 16 2009, 22:32)

Pretty much sums up the history of the world.
9/11===Schuey's fault
Bad racing===Schuey's fault
Iraq war==Shuey's fault
well you left out the global recession, swine flu & killing Kimi's career. Lets face it, Schuey is the epitome of evil
QUOTE (Kooper @ Jul 17 2009, 19:07)

well you left out the global recession, swine flu & killing Kimi's career. Lets face it, Schuey is the epitome of evil

Haha
But one thing really is Schuey's fault: because of him RTL bought exclusive broadcast rights for F1 in the mid nineties. That sucked really bad. Eurosport was soooo much better when they both aired it simultaneously.
@topic:
Hm Hartley with 421 testing kilometers (according to motorsport-total) isn't very experienced either.
Seanspeed
Jul 17 2009, 17:30
QUOTE (expert @ Jul 17 2009, 11:47)

Brendon Hartley was testing over the winter in place of Mark Webber. But he doesn't have 2 million euros.
He's also not doing that hot in F3 Euro(10th) and WSbR(17th), either.....
I'm afraid this kid will blow us all out of the water and finish in the top-15.
He should be alright for the GP; he will have 2 sessions of Friday, 2 on Saturday to get himself up to par. I think he's going to have enough.
Lastly, until the GP, he can practice on simulators and on video games.
BMW_F1
Jul 17 2009, 17:59
if that is all that is needed then Kyle Busch should be able to enter some races in the IRL next year and be ready for F1 (USF1) in 2011.
Ross Stonefeld
Jul 17 2009, 18:07
Yeah because Kyle Busch has an exceptional record in single-seater road racing.
OfficeLinebacker
Jul 17 2009, 18:11
QUOTE (BMW_F1 @ Jul 17 2009, 13:59)

if that is all that is needed then Kyle Busch should be able to enter some races in the IRL next year and be ready for F1 (USF1) in 2011.
That's an exaggeration.
Run a season in a European top tier open wheel series, maybe.
Clatter
Jul 17 2009, 18:13
QUOTE (Rinehart @ Jul 17 2009, 15:58)

Name some of these other drivers that have had anything like as little testing as this kid?
The very point is he is unqualified compared to every other debutant in the modern history of F1.
The testing is the point of issue, not his championship. If he had come 2nd in the F3 championship but had 1000kms more F1 testing he would be MORE qualified.
Micheal Schumacher.
Chubby_Deuce
Jul 17 2009, 18:21
So Michael set the precedent then. Just add Bourdais' sacking to the long list of awful things that Michael has done.
sreevishnu
Jul 17 2009, 18:29
QUOTE (Clatter @ Jul 18 2009, 00:13)

Micheal Schumacher.

i laugh at everyone comparing shcumy to Alguraceeiii
Micheal Schumacher was a phenomenon back then, he won every championship in lower formula before going to sportcar.
Not like jaime
Clatter
Jul 17 2009, 18:40
QUOTE (sreevishnu @ Jul 17 2009, 19:29)


i laugh at everyone comparing shcumy to Alguraceeiii
Micheal Schumacher was a phenomenon back then, he won every championship in lower formula before going to sportcar.
Not like jaime

I call BS on that, and say that he was as equally unprepared for F1 as Alguersuari is.
sreevishnu
Jul 17 2009, 18:49
QUOTE (Clatter @ Jul 18 2009, 00:40)

I call BS on that, and say that he was as equally unprepared for F1 as Alguersuari is.
BMW_F1
Jul 17 2009, 18:51
QUOTE (OfficeLinebacker @ Jul 18 2009, 00:11)

That's an exaggeration.
Run a season in a European top tier open wheel series, maybe.
they are all open wheel - IRL now has more circuits. Maybe the experience in the European circuits is the plus factor to race in Europe. Some ex GP2 guys are now racing in Indy and they are just blend in with the rest.
Rosemayer
Jul 17 2009, 18:52
QUOTE (Clatter @ Jul 17 2009, 19:40)

I call BS on that, and say that he was as equally unprepared for F1 as Alguersuari is.
But one of a hell of a better driver.
Clatter
Jul 17 2009, 18:58
QUOTE (sreevishnu @ Jul 17 2009, 19:49)

Instead of laughing why not show the stats to back up your statements. Especially the one about winning EVERY championship in lower formula.
Clatter
Jul 17 2009, 19:00
QUOTE (Rosemayer @ Jul 17 2009, 19:52)

But one of a hell of a better driver.
Yet to be seen. JA could be a sensation or a dud, but at least wait until he has raced in F1 before judging him.
stevewf1
Jul 17 2009, 19:06
QUOTE (Kucki @ Jul 17 2009, 07:03)

I think Ross meant the situation 5 years or so ago when JPM was comfortably leading the Brazil GP and Jos Verstappen ran over him.
That was JPM's third-ever F1 race and he pulled off an "audacious" pass on one M Schumacher for the lead on a re-start after a safety-car period.
RodrigoL
Jul 17 2009, 19:06
QUOTE (sreevishnu @ Jul 17 2009, 19:29)


i laugh at everyone comparing shcumy to Alguraceeiii
Micheal Schumacher was a phenomenon back then, he won every championship in lower formula before going to sportcar.
Not like jaime

Simple disproof by counter example: Schumi never won the British F3 championship.
Not like Jaime
sreevishnu
Jul 17 2009, 19:18
QUOTE (RodrigoL @ Jul 18 2009, 01:06)

Simple disproof by counter example: Schumi never won the British F3 championship.
Not like Jaime ;)
thats because he never raced in British F3 for starters
Unlike Jaime
Schumi won Macau F3 GP
Unlike Jaime
Schumi won Formula Koing championship. (similar to F Nippon now)
Unlike Jaime
Shumi came 3rd in GermanF3
And won it next yr
Archived all these in just 3 yrs of Formula Open wheel racing
Unlike Jaime
Clatter
Jul 17 2009, 19:27
QUOTE (sreevishnu @ Jul 17 2009, 20:18)

thats because he never raced in British F3 for starters
Unlike Jaime
Schumi won Macau F3 GP
Unlike Jaime
Schumi won Formula Koing championship.
Unlike Jaime
Archived all these in just 3 yrs of Formula Open wheel racing
Unlike Jaime
So by your own admission there, he hasnt won every championship in lower formula.
It took MS 2 attempts to become F3 champ, unlike JA.
So far you haven't shown anything to prove that MS was better prepared for F1.
Rosemayer
Jul 17 2009, 19:39
QUOTE (RodrigoL @ Jul 17 2009, 19:06)

Simple disproof by counter example: Schumi never won the British F3 championship.
Not like Jaime

And that is suppose to make you a better driver?
sreevishnu
Jul 17 2009, 19:50
QUOTE (Clatter @ Jul 18 2009, 01:27)

So by your own admission there, he hasnt won every championship in lower formula.
No, he won every WDC in the lower formula which he participated completely.
QUOTE
It took MS 2 attempts to become F3 champ, unlike JA.
Unlike JA, he didnot jump straight into the top f3 team as not having a big pocket as JA.
QUOTE
So far you haven't shown anything to prove that MS was better prepared for F1.
compare this MS

to
JA
2008 British f3 wdc
2009 WSR a lonely 9th with half the season gone, no race wins no pole
the numbers speaks 4 itself.
Clatter
Jul 17 2009, 19:57
QUOTE (sreevishnu @ Jul 17 2009, 20:50)

No, he won every WDC in the lower formula which he participated completely.
Unlike JA, he didnot jump straight into the top f3 team as not having a big pocket as JA.
compare this MS

to
JA
2008 British f3 wdc
2009 WSR a lonely 9th with half the season gone, no race wins no pole
the numbers speaks 4 itself.

Prior to his debut in F1 he had done no more F1 mileage than JA has done. He was no better prepared for F1.
sreevishnu
Jul 17 2009, 20:06
QUOTE (Clatter @ Jul 18 2009, 01:57)

Prior to his debut in F1 he had done no more F1 mileage than JA has done. He was no better prepared for F1.
clutching on straws aint u
if u dont know the lower formula are preparation 4 F1
so far looking at my posts its clear that who was well prepared
MS had 3 test sessions at Silvertone and was so fast that everyone was amazed
and then only they decided to give MS the race seat...........unlike JA.
qwertyu
Jul 17 2009, 20:28
QUOTE (Clatter @ Jul 17 2009, 21:57)

Prior to his debut in F1 he had done no more F1 mileage than JA has done. He was no better prepared for F1.
It seems that depending on your nationality you have to achieve different targets before entering F1....
Clatter
Jul 17 2009, 20:55
QUOTE (sreevishnu @ Jul 17 2009, 21:06)

clutching on straws aint u
if u dont know the lower formula are preparation 4 F1
so far looking at my posts its clear that who was well prepared
MS had 3 test sessions at Silvertone and was so fast that everyone was amazed
and then only they decided to give MS the race seat...........unlike JA.
No, your acting with the benefit of hindsight. Prior to his entry he was not on anyones radar, no team had picked up on him and his CV was no more impressive than many others. The only reason MS got the race seat was because Jordan needed the money. The fact that he was so sensational came as a surprise to everyone.
Clatter
Jul 17 2009, 20:58
QUOTE (qwertyu @ Jul 17 2009, 21:28)

It seems that depending on your nationality you have to achieve different targets before entering F1....
I think the biggest problem was that in the past there was an age bias. It was deemed that no one was good enough for F1 until they were in their mid-twenties. Now it seems to have swung the other way where if you havent made it by your early twenties you have missed the boat.
alfista
Jul 17 2009, 21:06
QUOTE (sreevishnu @ Jul 17 2009, 22:18)

Schumi won Formula Koing championship. (similar to F Nippon now)
Unlike Jaime
Formula Koenig was it. And it was no similar to FNippon. In fact, original FKoenig (1988-95) was beginner's formula with Fiat Panda engine and gearbox.
Rinehart
Jul 17 2009, 21:12
QUOTE (Clatter @ Jul 17 2009, 19:40)

I call BS on that, and say that he was as equally unprepared for F1 as Alguersuari is.

Alguersuari hasn't driven an F1 car round a corner in anger yet, MS ran tests.
Rinehart
Jul 17 2009, 21:14
QUOTE (Clatter @ Jul 17 2009, 19:58)

Instead of laughing why not show the stats to back up your statements. Especially the one about winning EVERY championship in lower formula.
Pot, kettle. Prove your claim that MS had less experience prior to his first F1 race.
alfista
Jul 17 2009, 21:15
QUOTE (Clatter @ Jul 17 2009, 22:57)

Prior to his debut in F1 he had done no more F1 mileage than JA has done. He was no better prepared for F1.
MS had only brief test before his first GP but used to race sportscars. He clocked fastest lap at 1991 Le Mans 24h. JA was very good in F3 but has no comparable experience with high-speed cars. He struggles in WSR while MS was second in his first and only F3000 race in Japan.
Rinehart
Jul 17 2009, 21:21
QUOTE (Clatter @ Jul 17 2009, 21:55)

No, your acting with the benefit of hindsight. Prior to his entry he was not on anyones radar, no team had picked up on him and his CV was no more impressive than many others. The only reason MS got the race seat was because Jordan needed the money. The fact that he was so sensational came as a surprise to everyone.
Really Clatter, just quit.
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