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jeze
So, since a couple of weeks has the 2010 IndyCar schedule been confirmed: http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/77472

But how would you do in order to get an ideal mix between tracks, at the best places, taking realistic arrangements into account? Here's my schedule

1, Brazil (Rio de Janeiro): (Perfect market, and a street track in Rio would make perfect sense. We'll see how it goes!)
2, St Pete (No reason to withdraw it, seems to be a very well organised event
3, Long Beach (The Monaco of the west. A symbol fort street racing in the US)
4, Barbers' (Let's keep our fingers crossed for a good crowd, a fantastic course)
5, Kansas (In place of something better, would love to see IndyCar at Pocono, but somehow I doubt it)
6, Indy 500 (Nothin' need to be said)
7, Milwaukee (can't understand why it was dropped, has tradition and good ticket sales)
8, Texas (One of the big-hitter events)
9, Iowa (The ideal short track for open wheelers)
10, Michigan 500 (In between the NASCAR races, a classic race that must be back)
11, Watkins Glen (The best track in America)
12, Toronto (One of the crown jewels)
13, Edmonton (Always a tremendous crowd there, and at least one aiport race)
14, Mid-Ohio (Technical track and well visited)
15, Infineon Raceway (Monaco without walls, a great challenge, and good crowd capacity)
16, Road America (Seriously IRL, you can't leave this one out?)
17, Chicagoland (Extended to a 400 mile race)
18, Motegi (Don't like it, but Honda does)
19, Kentucky (Better racing than Homestead, allright weather in September (I think?)
20. Phoenix (Good weather for an Ocotber finale, is a mile course, quite ideal, Homestead mixes bad racing with no crowd whatsoever. Could imagine New Hampshire in this slot as well)
Atreiu
1 race in Australia, 2 or 3 in Canada, the rest in the US.
Just like the mid 90s.
up.gif
Kooper
I'd want to add the airport at Cleveland and Laguna Seca to your list.

At Barber I heard they're going to limit the crowd to around 30,000.

It will be a sad day for me if Milwaukee is indeed dropped. Surely there has to be a way for a promoter to make a little money or break even...
lustigson
I'd like an IndyCar schedule to have a good mix between street and road courses, short (1, 1.5 mi) and long (2, 2.5 mi) ovals, as well as one additional 500 mile race alongside Indy.

Races should be a bit more spread-out across the globe, with 1 in Japan, 1 in Australia or New Zealand, 1 or 2 in South America and 1 or 2 in Europe.
Alfisti
You do surfers surely? Always a great crowd (packed) and the teams a drivers just love it. Should be the last race and the gold coast is a good place for a year end party ;)
jeze
QUOTE (Alfisti @ Aug 18 2009, 17:27) *
You do surfers surely? Always a great crowd (packed) and the teams a drivers just love it. Should be the last race and the gold coast is a good place for a year end party ;)


Surfers is indeed a great place for a race, but the trouble is that the Americans don't want it to end the season, because they want the champion to be crowned in the USA. I could imagine having Surfers there, but by then a Phoenix season finale would be difficult, due to a collision with the NASCAR race, and I'm unsure whether a second race in Texas (like the old days) is any good idea. But I spare a thought for the organisers, who have done a brilliant job the last 18 years!
jeze
QUOTE (Kooper @ Aug 18 2009, 15:44) *
I'd want to add the airport at Cleveland and Laguna Seca to your list.

At Barber I heard they're going to limit the crowd to around 30,000.

It will be a sad day for me if Milwaukee is indeed dropped. Surely there has to be a way for a promoter to make a little money or break even...


Well, Cleveland is allright, but I'd rather have the Glen and Road America on the schedule. Laguna has capacity problems as well ohwell.gif I think Sears Point is a very good track, so for me there is no problem having Sears on the schedule instead. I really thought Barber had a bigger capacity than that, I doubt it'd break even with less than 50 000 spectators? At least it's good promotion for road course racing in the South, but Road Atlanta would be a better choice still. But I doubt it'll ever happen!
crooky369
If it's an ultimate schedule why don't you look further a field than the Americas.

Rockingham speedway (England), EuroSpeedway Lausitz superspeedway (Germany), you have to have Surfers and why not throw in Spa Franchorchamps?
jeze
QUOTE (crooky369 @ Aug 18 2009, 18:18) *
If it's an ultimate schedule why don't you look further a field than the Americas.

Rockingham speedway (England), EuroSpeedway Lausitz superspeedway (Germany), you have to have Surfers and why not throw in Spa Franchorchamps?


You know, I've been thinking about this for a while now, and those tracks have come across my mind, but even though we're Europeans (well most of us here) it doesn't mean that IndyCar gains most money from racing here. I think Rockingham can hold 40 000 spectators or something like that, Belgium is no big market, and Lausitzring's eceonomy has been worrying in the past. How's your ultimate schedule?
johnap
Heres my ideal:

1. Phoenix
2. Mexico City
*Sebring Weekend*
3. Interlagos
4. Miami Street Circuit - ideally on a beachfront and on wide streets
5. Texas - an airport track somewhere, think Cleveland in the south
6. Long Beach - with ALMS
7. Indianapolis - on Memorial Day Weekend as tradition dictates
8. Milwaukee
9. Watkins Glen
*Le Mans Weekend*
10. Rockingham UK
11. Cleveland - Independence Day Weekend
12. Road America - with ALMS
13. Mid-Ohio - with ALMS
14. New Hampshire
15. Toronto
16. Mosport - with ALMS
17. Michigan - Labour Day Weekend, 500 miles
18. Portland - with ALMS
*Petit Le Mans Weekend*
19. Surfers Paradise
20. Laguna Seca - with ALMS
21. Fontana - 500 miles
Rob G
1. Phoenix
2. Long Beach
3. St. Pete
4. Barber
5. Kansas
6. Indy
7. Milwaukee
8. Cleveland
9. Watkins Glen
10. Toronto
11. Edmonton
12. Portland
13. Road America
14. Michigan
15. Chicagoland
16. Mid-Ohio
17. Kentucky
18. Surfers Paradise
19. Mexico City
20. Laguna Seca
21. Las Vegas (street course)

You'll probably notice Texas is missing. That's because since we're dreaming up schedules, I'm also dreaming up faster cars that would be even more unsuitable for Texas than the current ones.
jeze
QUOTE (Rob G @ Aug 19 2009, 01:45) *
1. Phoenix
2. Long Beach
3. St. Pete
4. Barber
5. Kansas
6. Indy
7. Milwaukee
8. Cleveland
9. Watkins Glen
10. Toronto
11. Edmonton
12. Portland
13. Road America
14. Michigan
15. Chicagoland
16. Mid-Ohio
17. Kentucky
18. Surfers Paradise
19. Mexico City
20. Laguna Seca
21. Las Vegas (street course)

You'll probably notice Texas is missing. That's because since we're dreaming up schedules, I'm also dreaming up faster cars that would be even more unsuitable for Texas than the current ones.


Yeah, that was a problem back in 2001 with the bankings and stuff. Nevertheless it looks more like a Champ Car calendar, with just seven ovals out of 21? Oval racing is what separates American motorsport from the rest of the world, so why not go halfway? Surely Las Vegas oval could be used instead of your mooted street race, and why not Fontana instead of Laguna? May I even suggest a race at Darlington? Thumbs up for Portland by the way, it was always a great event up.gif
pingu666
if you go to japan for the oval, may aswell do suzuka aswell while your there?
Option1
What the f*** is the fascination some have with street courses?!?

They invariably look incredibly ugly - miles of concrete and wire. See next to nothing of the city they're supposed to publicise.
They invariably race badly - usually bugger all places to pass and usually very badly designed layouts.
They invariably end up with endless yellows - people only have to touch the concrete and whammo full-course yellow.

Can't think of a single street course in any series that commends itself to me - Monaco included, Gold Coast included, Long Beach included, none of 'em. I can understand retaining in their respective series Monaco and Long Beach as tradition, but beyond that, nahhhhhh.

Neil
jeze
QUOTE (Option1 @ Aug 19 2009, 20:34) *
What the f*** is the fascination some have with street courses?!?

They invariably look incredibly ugly - miles of concrete and wire. See next to nothing of the city they're supposed to publicise.
They invariably race badly - usually bugger all places to pass and usually very badly designed layouts.
They invariably end up with endless yellows - people only have to touch the concrete and whammo full-course yellow.

Can't think of a single street course in any series that commends itself to me - Monaco included, Gold Coast included, Long Beach included, none of 'em. I can understand retaining in their respective series Monaco and Long Beach as tradition, but beyond that, nahhhhhh.

Neil

I agree with you, street races are quite ugly, but unfortnately the make money, so we won't get rid of them. For IndyCar, I'd love to see only ovals and road courses, because natural tracks like the Glen and Road America should form the backbone of racing.
Rob G
QUOTE (jeze @ Aug 19 2009, 05:12) *
Yeah, that was a problem back in 2001 with the bankings and stuff. Nevertheless it looks more like a Champ Car calendar, with just seven ovals out of 21? Oval racing is what separates American motorsport from the rest of the world, so why not go halfway? Surely Las Vegas oval could be used instead of your mooted street race, and why not Fontana instead of Laguna? May I even suggest a race at Darlington? Thumbs up for Portland by the way, it was always a great event up.gif

I didn't keep a tally of ovals versus roads & streets, I just picked my favorite racetracks and then filled in the holes with other races that I thought the series needed most. I found it tough to keep it to around 20 races, and I found it even more difficult to weed out natural terrain road courses. One of my hardest choices was picking between Laguna Seca and Sears Point, but I eventually went with the classic over the modified NASCAR venue. I originally had the Vegas oval, but then I remembered that the 2007 street course was actually decent and might serve as a good venue for the season finale.

There were plenty of street courses that I left out, like Denver, Houston, Detroit, Miami, the ubercrappy San Jose track, and any rumored but unused tracks like Philadelphia and Phoenix. But Long Beach is a classic, St. Pete is a good layout, Toronto is usually highly entertaining, and the crowds are huge at Surfers.
jeze
QUOTE (Rob G @ Aug 20 2009, 05:52) *
I didn't keep a tally of ovals versus roads & streets, I just picked my favorite racetracks and then filled in the holes with other races that I thought the series needed most. I found it tough to keep it to around 20 races, and I found it even more difficult to weed out natural terrain road courses. One of my hardest choices was picking between Laguna Seca and Sears Point, but I eventually went with the classic over the modified NASCAR venue. I originally had the Vegas oval, but then I remembered that the 2007 street course was actually decent and might serve as a good venue for the season finale.

There were plenty of street courses that I left out, like Denver, Houston, Detroit, Miami, the ubercrappy San Jose track, and any rumored but unused tracks like Philadelphia and Phoenix. But Long Beach is a classic, St. Pete is a good layout, Toronto is usually highly entertaining, and the crowds are huge at Surfers.


I just remember the Vegas race in 2007 for the Las Vegas International Air... sorry chicane lol.gif To be honest it looked like a really interesting course, but I'd rather damn it all and bring back the Caesars Palace track! I don't know why people seem to hate that one! I think the F1 drivers in the 80's weren't fit enough to tackle it! Look at the layout here
http://theracingline.net/racingcircuits/ra...ates/index.html Go to C and you'll find it!
At least four high-speed turns, wide track, and one very glamorous location! That would do as an IndyCar finale, especially considering that the temperature in Vegas is not that boiling in November. Maybe a good solution, maybe not, but I still find it a cool idea!
Victor_RO
QUOTE (jeze @ Aug 20 2009, 11:27) *
I just remember the Vegas race in 2007 for the Las Vegas International Air... sorry chicane lol.gif To be honest it looked like a really interesting course, but I'd rather damn it all and bring back the Caesars Palace track! I don't know why people seem to hate that one! I think the F1 drivers in the 80's weren't fit enough to tackle it! Look at the layout here
http://theracingline.net/racingcircuits/ra...ates/index.html Go to C and you'll find it!
At least four high-speed turns, wide track, and one very glamorous location! That would do as an IndyCar finale, especially considering that the temperature in Vegas is not that boiling in November. Maybe a good solution, maybe not, but I still find it a cool idea!


As far as I know, the parking lot where the track was laid out no longer exists.
jeze
QUOTE (Victor_RO @ Aug 20 2009, 10:58) *
As far as I know, the parking lot where the track was laid out no longer exists.


Are you really sure? Time to build it up then wink.gif
crooky369
QUOTE (jeze @ Aug 18 2009, 17:25) *
You know, I've been thinking about this for a while now, and those tracks have come across my mind, but even though we're Europeans (well most of us here) it doesn't mean that IndyCar gains most money from racing here. I think Rockingham can hold 40 000 spectators or something like that, Belgium is no big market, and Lausitzring's eceonomy has been worrying in the past. How's your ultimate schedule?


Sorry it's taken me so long to reply but anyway Rockingham can hold 52,000 people seating and 125,000 max that's beyond insane in a country where oval racing isn't that popular and is also more seating than two of the biggest football clubs in England. (Chelsea and Liverpool) When it comes to Spa it isn't about the country its in trust me its such a good track that people will come from loads of other countries.

I don't really know much about Lausitzring, I only realised the other day it was used in the 2001 CART championship but I guess they never went back because of the Zanardi horror smash?
jeze
QUOTE (crooky369 @ Aug 21 2009, 00:51) *
Sorry it's taken me so long to reply but anyway Rockingham can hold 52,000 people seating and 125,000 max that's beyond insane in a country where oval racing isn't that popular and is also more seating than two of the biggest football clubs in England. (Chelsea and Liverpool) When it comes to Spa it isn't about the country its in trust me its such a good track that people will come from loads of other countries.

I don't really know much about Lausitzring, I only realised the other day it was used in the 2001 CART championship but I guess they never went back because of the Zanardi horror smash?


They didn't come back in 2002 due to financial problems for EuroSpeedway, but instead they held the second and final German 500 in the spring of 2003 in a European double header comprising of Brands Hatch Indy layout and the 500 mile race. Both races were won by Sébastien Bourdais, and they were his first Champ Car wins, in a year when he finished fourth in the overall standings. I seriously doubt the interest for an oval race in England would be enough to persuade sponsors to pay for it, it'd be more attractive with a race at Brands or Silverstone in terms of bang for the buck. That said, a race at Rockingham would strenghten European oval racing and the prospect of more ovals in Europe in the future, but from IndyCar's perspective, it can't be very attractive having to few oval races in the USA, especially considering the roots of the IRL.
highdownforce
Rio de Janeiro's Major, Eduardo Paes, had rulled out the possibillity of the event in the city, also financial problems.
The Brazilian race is rumored to take place at Salvador-BA, also in a street circuit [pics].

For now, there isn't a strong sponsor for the event and everything indicates that there will be no race at Brazil next year.
Ralliart
If I was in charge of organizing a schedule, I'd take into account:
1 Weather. When are the best and worst times to hold a race at any particular circuit.
2 Traffic. What is the situation with any given circuit
3 Spectators. Will they be safe in any given area and will they be able to see?
4 Other events being held the same weekend at any given track. Conflicts that will affect the race?
5 Media. Friendly, unfriendly or indifferent to motor racing in any given city? Very important to have accurate and effective race propaganda leading up to race and extensive coverage of race and reportage, next day, in the papers. Celebrity or 'media' races - at each race.
6 Whether or not the powers that be want to expand into different markets. Japan, Australia, Europe, Canada, China, Mexico - several adequate circuits. Create a European Cup and/or an Australian Cup or Asian Cup - most points scored during, say, three races in Europe, three races in Canada, etc.
7 That thinking outside the box - especially when it comes to promotion - should be encouraged. Got a great product? Good, now get out there and sell it to the public.
8 That it's logical, on several fronts, to schedule races at the most convenient times - have say, a race in California followed by, say, races in Australia and Japan. On returning Stateside, schedule the next race in California - like LB, Surfers, Motegi and Sonoma. The next races would be, all things being equal, in Arizona or Nevada. Work eastward, or northward, or southward. Have it make sense, not nilly willy. More cost-efficient.
9 That Long Beach, Laguna Seca, Sonoma, Cleveland, Watkins Glen, Gilles Villeneuve, Ricard y Pedro Rodriguez, Phoenix, St. Jovite, Mosport Park, Brands Hatch, Rockinham, Lauzitz Ring, Suzuka, Mt Fuji, Twin Motegi and Fontana should be considered as some of the circuits to hold races on.
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