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tommi34
QUOTE (Cenotaph @ Oct 20 2009, 15:16) *
Then Renault, dog of a car, he didnt do that bad, bad for his standards, but good for anyone else's standards. Last year he won two races (ok, one race fairly) and Japan's win was very impressive.
The problem with Alonso is all these scandals that surround him, he could definitely be better off the track.

I don't think Japan win was impressive at all. Hamilton and Kovalainen ruined Kimi's race at the start.
aditya-now
20 Grosjean
19 Nakajima
18 Kobayashi
17 Alguersuari
16 Sutil
15 Kovalainen
14 Fisichella
13 Buemi
12 Glock
11 Heidfeld
10 Rosberg
9 Trulli
8 Webber
=6 Barrichello
=6 Button
=4 Kubica
=4 Vettel
=1 Hamilton
=1 Raikkonen
=1 Alonso

Which means, the top three make up a group with little between them, 4 - 8 make up a slightly differentiated group, and the rest declines gradually.

Massa we don't know yet, I hope he comes back his old self!

aditya-now
Hey, V8 Fireworks, thanks for the initiative!

Are you coming up with a total standings? Would be quite interesting to see!
lbennie
QUOTE (Just waiting @ Oct 20 2009, 12:53) *
good attempt--the problem most are overlooking is that the way things are now, all one is doing is ranking driver-car combos, nothing more

and as proven by the first half vs the second half of the season at brawn, one can not say because one teamate is beating the other, that this driver is superior, only that the car-driver combo suits him better than it does his team mate........


it's the way things have always been, quicker car, easier to drive on limit => you look better


for what it's worth, my rankings:

Alonso
Hamilton
Vettel
Button/Webber/Kubica/Raikkonen
Barrichello/Rosberg
Sutil
Heidfeld/Trulli
Glock
Kobayashi/Buemi/Fisichella
Nakajima
Alguersuari/Kovalainen/Grosjean
V8 Fireworks
QUOTE (aditya-now @ Oct 20 2009, 15:56) *
Hey, V8 Fireworks, thanks for the initiative!

Are you coming up with a total standings? Would be quite interesting to see!

Could do that.

What points system would be best?

Average position?
maccaFTW
I don't like ordinal rankings. There are too many factors in driver ability that we just can't observe or measure.

I think we can get a more general sense of where drivers are in terms of classes of drivers. I can try doing that from worst category to best:

Worst drivers out there

Nakajima
Grosjean
Alguersuari

These guys just aren't doing a very good job despite being in decent equipment. The fact Rosberg has probably underachieved in scoring 34.5 points in the Williams this year (considering that they had the DDD before a bunch of teams did) really puts Nakajima's scoreless season into perspective for how poor it's been. That's inexcusable of a second year driver.

Grosjean is just way too ragged right now. He needs a lot more testing. Alguersuari was put in the car way too quickly and, while he's done a decent job in a few races of taking car of the car, he still needed more testing and more experience in a lower formulae. He should have done a year of GP2. Red Bull may have already screwed his career, though.

Pretty good, but the jury's still out

Buemi
Liuzzi

Both have shown talent and pace, but they need more time. Liuzzi impressed to come back and do what he did at Monza despite not being in a F1 car for more than a year and a half.

Good drivers who can win races in the right car

Trulli
Fisichella
Sutil
Glock
Kovalainen
Rosberg
Heidfeld

Trulli, Fisichella, and Kovalainen have shown they can win races in a good car if they put it all together. Sutil, Rosberg, and Glock haven't had the opportunity, but they will and will probably win. Heidfeld may not ever get the chance, sadly.

Good drivers who can compete for championships in the right car

Barrichello
Webber
Kubica

Barrichello and Webber have had championship-quality parts of this season. Kubica really took it to McLaren and Ferrari last year in an inferior BMW chassis and even led the Constructor's standings last year. If BMW had continued developing the car, he may have been close, especially given how inconsistent Hamilton and Massa were last year.

Proven champions/elite talents

Alonso
Raikkonen
Hamilton
Button
Massa
Vettel

The top-5 have already shown they can be champions or take the fight to the wire. You can say all you want in a subjective evaluation of talent, but the fact is all of these guys have either won it or lost it due to luck on the last corner.

Vettel has given some far-out planet demonstrations of talent to worthy being considered in this group.
Sakae
P3 - S. Vettel
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