Help - Search - Members - Calendar
Full Version: The best and the worst cars in 2009
The AUTOSPORT Bulletin Board > Forums > Racing Comments
DePortago
What is your ranking of the cars this season? I have considered the cars performance throughout the season, not only at the beginning.

Here goes mine:

1- BRAWN (Sometimes better, sometimes worse, but the beginning of the season was simply amazing)
2- RED BULL (The first of the "legal" cars, at last a good RBR car from Newey)
3- MCLAREN (they started awfully, but now they are undoubtely the third car)
4- FERRARI (Since they stopped the evolution of the F60, Ferrari have lost the third position)
5- WILLIAMS (Much better car than it looks. The problem is that the second car is driven by one of the worst drivers in F1 history)
6- TOYOTA (The car is not bad, but the drivers inconsistent)
7- BMW (Poor car, poor motivation)
8- FORCE INDIA (Excellent performance in high-speed circuits, poor in the rest)
9- TORO ROSSO (The car is not good, but this is not the main problem. Their problem are the rookies).
10- RENAULT (Slow, ugly, nervous... what is this shit? If Alonso wasn´t there, their amount of points this year would be 0.0. Piquet scored last year 19 points, and Grosjean is the great promise of the french automovilism, so I don´t think it´s a drivers problem. The scandal could affect, but it was an awful car since the beginning).
Francesc
Williams with a better engine like the Mercedes and a decent second driver would be up there battling for third in WCC... The FW31 is a very good car
Colombo
It changed sooooo much time over the season but I would say that the WCC standings reflect the averages of the cars (not the current order but the overall average one). Therefore I would agree with

1. Brawn
2. Red Bull
3. Ferrari
4. McLaren
5. Toyota
6. Williams
7. Renault

GC
Magnus
QUOTE (DePortago @ Oct 17 2009, 11:00) *
What is your ranking of the cars this season? I have considered the cars performance throughout the season, not only at the beginning.

Here goes mine:

1- BRAWN (Sometimes better, sometimes worse, but the beginning of the season was simply amazing)
2- RED BULL (The first of the "legal" cars, at last a good RBR car from Newey)
3- MCLAREN (they started awfully, but now they are undoubtely the third car)
4- FERRARI (Since they stopped the evolution of the F60, Ferrari have lost the third position)
5- WILLIAMS (Much better car than it looks. The problem is that the second car is driven by one of the worst drivers in F1 history)
6- TOYOTA (The car is not bad, but the drivers inconsistent)
7- BMW (Poor car, poor motivation)
8- FORCE INDIA (Excellent performance in high-speed circuits, poor in the rest)
9- TORO ROSSO (The car is not good, but this is not the main problem. Their problem are the rookies).
10- RENAULT (Slow, ugly, nervous... what is this shit? If Alonso wasn´t there, their amount of points this year would be 0.0. Piquet scored last year 19 points, and Grosjean is the great promise of the french automovilism, so I don´t think it´s a drivers problem. The scandal could affect, but it was an awful car since the beginning).


Pretty close to my list. Although Torro Rosso should be much higher up as its essentially a Redbull, or very close. With proper drivers it could have been near the front often. Renault probably ahead of Force India on average but thats all. A trully terrible car. Renault engineers are incompetent. Just imagine where the team would have been without Alonso. Last by miles.
ForeverF1
QUOTE (Magnus @ Oct 17 2009, 12:13) *
Pretty close to my list. Although Torro Rosso should be much higher up as its essentially a Brawn, or very close. With proper drivers it could have been near the front often. Renault probably ahead of Force India on average but thats all. A trully terrible car. Renault engineers are incompetent. Just imagine where the team would have been without Alonso. Last by miles.


Think you might like to reconsider that. wink.gif
noikeee
This is almost impossible, given that the grid has flipped backwards a couple times (Toyota has been the best car AND the worst car; almost the same for FI and McLaren!) and the cars are all ridiculously close, but trying to average all that:

1. Brawn
2. Red Bull
3. McLaren
4. Ferrari = Williams = Toyota
7. Renault
8. Force India
9. Toro Rosso
10. BMW
The Ragged Edge
1. Red Bull
2. Brawn
3= Mclaren
3= Toyota
5= Ferrari
5= Williams
5= Force India
5= Renault
9= BMW
9= Toro Roso

With the grid being so tight, its difficult to be 100% certain in your choice of where the cars rank, because this year more than most, the order has been turned on its head. Depending on what type of circuit, will jumble up the midfield in ways you cant predict until FP3 is over. If it was not for Alonso, Raikkonen and Hamilton, I would lower the rankings of their respective teams. If the Toro Rosso drivers were better, I would rank them higher. I believe the Williams is a better car than either Nakijima and Rosberg is showing it to be. The same goes with the Toyota. Both Glock and Trulli have failed to deliver with a car capable of doing better. BMW have been miss most of the year and then come Japan, they look the best of the midfield. But without fail, the Brawn and the Red Bull was the car to have. Button had a mega start, crushed all before him, but as soon as the other cars caught up, we saw the Button of old. Not being able to consistantly deliver when the odds are even. Now he has no car advantage, he is struggling to make the top 5. Brazil 2009 will be no different. I doubt he'll make top 5 on Sunday.

The Red Bull drivers have messed up their season all by themselves. Webber, Australia's favourite F1 driver, has failed to score a point since Hungary. eek.gif No-one to blame but himself. When the pressure was on, with a window of oportunity to mount a genuine WDC in a good car. Webber folded like a cheap suitcase. down.gif Vettel also p1$$ed his chances away and he's only got 9 races less experience than Hamilton. So calling him a rookie wont cut it. He didn't deliver when it was needed to, end of story. How many overtakes has he done in the dry? Spa he was missing, Monza he was non-existant, Hungary, Valencia, when he needed to step up he couldn't. Even taking his engine failures into account, they were all in races he was never going to win, or even finish on the podium. Big points went begging, allowing a faltering Button to crawl to the WDC.
grunge
the RB has improved massively on the slow corner/mec grip stuff..its by far the most versatile car on the grid
argiriano
1. Brawn = RBR (impressive cars in different ways, but both flawless engineering)

3. McLaren (unbelievable turn around from backmaker to race winner)
4. Ferrari = Williams = Toyota (all three can deliver more, but fail in many areas, like strategies)
7. Force India (unexpected move forward from a small team, they lose a win on Spa)
8. Renault = Toro Roso = BMW (worse car in last three seasons from French carmaker, experienced drivers for Bulls, and bad management for the German carmaker)
wewantourdarbyback
QUOTE (paranoik0 @ Oct 17 2009, 12:34) *
This is almost impossible, given that the grid has flipped backwards a couple times (Toyota has been the best car AND the worst car; almost the same for FI and McLaren!) and the cars are all ridiculously close, but trying to average all that:

1. Brawn
2. Red Bull
3. McLaren
4. Ferrari = Williams = Toyota
7. Renault
8. Force India
9. Toro Rosso
10. BMW



I agree with this listing, at an average over the season the Brawn and RBR's have been out in front of the rest. McLaren have been shown more ability to win races than the rest have. Williams have been the most consistent of the following group but have only one decent driver and are hampered by an engine that has no top end power for tracks like Monza and Spa. Toyota have the potential to do well but have been very up and down.
Muz Bee
QUOTE (Francesc @ Oct 17 2009, 11:04) *
Williams with a better engine like the Mercedes and a decent second driver would be up there battling for third in WCC... The FW31 is a very good car

You're sure of this?
You state this confidently as fact. Yet neither driver has been able to be benchmarked against other established F1 drivers. Isn't it a possibility for example that Rosberg has matured into one of the very quickest guys, up with the Hamiltons and Alonsos. Without making excuses for Nakajima he has been very unlucky at crucial times. He has shown real pace at certain times but never seems to be in the right place at the right time. Of course he has made some mistakes and been totally outqualified but I don't see Williams as overall 3rd best car. At some tracks yes but a others the worst like Spa, so on balance 5th or 6th.

Red Bull is the best car but Brawn is 2nd. Red Bull have not produced sound strategy consistently and Brawn has achieved great recoveries through strategy. Behind these two teams he relative merits of the cars has shifted. Remember the McLaren started as the worst car and the Ferrari just in front? The Ferrari is still poor but the McLaren is now probably 3rd best so I would rate them 3rd best overall. Force india likewise has improved and I rate them 4th best but let down by poor driver combination. I think the Ferrari is marginally better in 5th from the Williams in 6th. After that it's Toyota 7th, Renault 8th, BMW 9th and Torro Rosso 10th.
Hairpin
Really really difficult. Considering that Brawn will get the WDC and WCC in spite of a really disappointing performance from Button the last half of the season, I guess it is safe to say they had the best car over the season.
Red Bull seem to have had a faster car than Brawn the last 12-13 races or so, but reliability also counts when you want to decide twhich car is 'best'.
McLaren get's a gold star for their progress over the season, but I am not sure about Toyota. I mean, Kobayashi is not even a top driver in GP 2 and still he jumps in and make laptimes that is close to Trullis. I love Trulli, but maybe he have fallen for the JVi syndrome - "the car sucks anyway, so why should I give 100%" ? Hard to tell, Glock is also not a known quantity. I do put the Toyota ahead of McLaren considering the whole season.
For fifth spot it is even more difficult. I think Ferrari and Renault have been quite equal, but I think maybe Force India have been better than both of them. Toro Rosso? The car should, as many have said, be pretty equal to the Red Bull, so it must be the drivers... Williams have always looked good at some point of each race weekend, but they never seem to be able to turn the cars performance into points. But I think I would have rather had the Williams than the Ferrari if i was a F1 driver.

I guess that gives a list that looks like:

Red Bull
Brawn GP
Toyota
McLaren
Williams
Toro Rosso
Force India
Ferrari
Renault
BMW

Considering the drivers at Ferrari, Renault and BMW I think the only reasonable conclusion for them to be out of conetntion of any Championship basically at half season is that the cars sucks. Or, in aerodynamic terms, that they don't.
RodrigoL
QUOTE
5- WILLIAMS (Much better car than it looks. The problem is that the second car is driven by one of the worst drivers in F1 history)

10- RENAULT (Slow, ugly, nervous... what is this shit? If Alonso wasn´t there, their amount of points this year would be 0.0. Piquet scored last year 19 points, and Grosjean is the great promise of the french automovilism, so I don´t think it´s a drivers problem.


This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.
Invision Power Board © 2001-2012 Invision Power Services, Inc.