Thanks. The first time you saw one of those Tonka Toys, did you think "That's not a truck..." (to paraphrase Mick Dundee)?

This one is set up for the freeway with that aero on the roof.

Vibe drivers beware.

Yes, it is not a problem to halt sales of 1, 2, 3 + year old cars!! Unless they have a real problem they have bben long sold.

True enough, your shoe accustomed feet would be more sensitive to mine, witnessed by people being unable to follow me comfortably in bare feet when walking over sharp gravel.

Maybe it is all in the mind

I think the fact that the dead skin is stuck directly to the tissue that has nerve endings makes a big difference.

I do agree that bare feet on a hot engine bay would be very hard to bear. My feet sweat a lot; if I encounter something hot enough to vaporise that sweat then it is a big problem.

Not as big as Toyota's by the sounds of things.

Is it only American Toyotas that have problems? If so anyone know why?

Part supplier issue. Japanese are supplied by Denso, the ones being assembled in NA are supplied by a company called CTS. Allegedly new design components are already in production, but it will take some time to get the required volume, hence the production slowdown/shutdown to allow the part supplier(s) to catch up.

So I wonder who makes the parts for all the Toyotas built in Australia and Thailand?

Where is this information coming from and how authoritative is it?

How can Toyota sell 2007 models?

They just don't fit the compliance plate till the car goes to the dealer.
Actually this is now illegal. Two Japanese manufacturers used to play that game in the 70s and 80s and the Government cracked down on it.
A mate of mine used to fix rust in three year old Datsuns before they went to the dealers. The cars used to sit in paddocks at Wetherill Park for ages before they were fitted with Compliance plates and sold as new.

Yeah, I guess so...

Checking a couple of news sites I see they are starting to say that 'pedals can slowly return to idle' etc.

What a lot of hogwash! My sister's experiences were all about the car simply taking off on her... and not abating very quickly at all.

Probably happens after you've rear-ended a 40ft container.

What stops them? Why wouldn't/couldn't they? There are often, around here at least, last year's models on the lot, sometimes well beyond the introduction period of the "current" year models. I know of Harley dealers that still have new-in-crate unsold 2006 model year bikes in their inventory.

From the horse's mouth.

I'm wondering what Toyota plans to do with its workers while the production facilities are idled.

My previous statement is that if Toyota still have 2007 build cars instock they are sicker than GM. They should be all sold in 90 days from build date at the latest

That one mentions wear again... 'become worn' and 'does not occur suddenly' are their statements...

Lies! My dad's Corolla was a very low mileage September 2007 model and it was doing it ever since my sister began driving it at the beginning of 2009. It was 'suddenly' taking off on her, it was not old or used enough to be significantly 'worn'.

They are still lying and covering up.

It's also clear in their instructions on 'what to do' that they don't believe the above themselves. They are discussing serious emergency procedures there and telling people not to drive the car again.

It's not really surprising Ray, they are hardly going to hold their hands up and admit they screwed up. However, the important thing is that they recognise, at last, that there is a problem, and are doing something about it.

No need t stop selling new cars if it's only "worn" ones with the problem.

It was mentioned on Oz radio this morning it MAY be a LHD issue only so you would think mainland Europe would also be involved if thats the case.

I think in the context of this recall, the 2007 refers to the year of introduction of the model rather that the build-year of a particular car.

Uhm, yes. Where does it say they are selling 2007 year-model vehicles?

Maybe this is their way of choking off supply to create pent-up demand so they can inflate their prices when they start selling again.

Or maybe not.

Sure, because a few fatal accidents never damaged a brand's reputation...

Saw a quick news item on TV tonight... from the US, of course...

Mentioned a crash into a lake somewhere in Texas, and had a grab of a phone call about a stuck accelerator. They're starting to get serious with this, especially when the car that went into the lake had its front floormats in the boot.

They were giving Toyota drivers advice on the CBC this morning; "If you can't control your speed don't pump the brakes, press them as hard as you can until you come to a complete stop".

There are going to be greaaaaat deals on Toyotas in the near future!!!

Who is getting serious? I heard somewhere that Toyota had to notify the US Government about its plans to stop domestic US sales of 8 models of Toyota. I've also heard that Toyota has shut down the plants that make these vehicles. Considering that the Camry is the #1 seller in the United States (or damned close), I'd say that the cessation of production and sales alone is going to cost Toyota millions (billions?) of dollars.

Furthermore, I've heard that some consider the "floor mat excuse" to be Toyota's attempt to divert blame based on possible knowledge of a product deficiency. I presume that if this is proven in court, Toyota is going to get sued for millions more dollars.

The finacial figures alone are extremely serious.

I wonder how seriously the US Government is taking this?

I thought he meant the media is starting to take this seriously.

Thanks to 60 Minutes, I bought a couple 4 year old Audis for a total of $8,000 in the late '80s. One of them was a quattro with 35,000 miles and an audiophile stereo that had cost about what I paid for the car. Both of them were 5-speed manuals, so there was no way to even simulate unintended acceleration, but their resale values still went into the toilet. Too bad Toyota hasn't made anything lately of any interest. If the public turns on Lexus too though, an IS250 6-speed with heated and cooled seats would make a nice commuter car. Or maybe I'll buy my mom a RAV4 for her gardening projects.

This could be a good time for Toyota to downsize their North American operations. Our economy still might not survive the progressives, and there won't be much point waiting around for nationalization and UAW organization.

The US government officials ( the NTSB) have now said publically that they advised Toyota to stop production as that was what the law required. They also praised Toyota for doing so.

It is difficult to know the truth on things like this. The NTSB may be trying to get some good press but if they did have to insist on the production shutdown then that does not reflect very well on Toyota.

I have this feeling that a modern road car ( Toyota or otherwise ) is now much more complex than a small aircraft ( like a Cessna). The problem is that the rate of design change now seems much faster than for aircraft and the QC standards are not as exacting because Aerospace quality control is simply unaffordable in a volume consumer product.

The way I see it nobody has made anything interesting lately. Might as well get a Matrix.

Aside from the expense argument why do you need aerospace levels of QC for a non-aerospace product?

Both the media and Toymotor, actually...

The media in their treatment of things, but they're still to at least some degree reflecting what Toymotor tell them. The fact that their website described what to do in an UA emergency (which I feel sure I mentioned yesterday morning) says plenty, in my view. They're not admitting anything, and they're blaming premature wear, but they're at least saying it's not necessarily floor mats.

One wonders, however, why they are now making this admission. Did the police or the owner or someone on the spot report to the papers that the Texas 'in the lake' car's mats were in the boot? Does anyone know?

Yes, I did mention it yesterday (why can't we read back a whole page while we're posting any more?)...

Another point, looking back to my previous post. My sister, as mentioned, has had this happen in Dad's Corolla more or less ever since he died. It was 16 months old at that time and seeing as his previous Camry did only 45,000kms in nine years or something it was nothing to do with wear.

But my sister also told me that the floor mats were in the boot when she got the car. "That was just so unlike Dad," she said to me. "He always had everything where it should be and particularly took care to protect the new car in every way." And so he did.

So did Dad hear about this way back then? Was he warned, perhaps when he took it in for service, that floor mats were causing UA? Were the mats in the boot because he was warned? Or, maybe, had it happened to him too and he asked the dealer about it and was told it was the floormats?

Wish he was still here to ask...

When I was a teenager, I cut grass for someone who had a 4WD turbo diesel Kubota garden tractor that may have been your absolute dream vehicle, if that van was anything to go by. I think I've seen another one that was also 4WS. Personally, I think the just-killed Honda S2000, current Civic Si, and some Mazdas are nice. Mazdas that also just went out of production, but nonetheless. As for Toyotas, I'd be interested if someone was giving away Tacomas. My friend bought a new one a year or two ago to drive while his BMW is in the shop, and he wound up driving it even when the BMW isn't broken.

Actually the Mazdaspeed3 is close to perfect, now that you remind me.

I drove one of those kei class vans the other day. I was surprised at how cramped and gutless it actually is, but I still prefer it over 99% of the crap out there now.

Excerpt:

Ditto the Lexus dealer whose response to a complaint from the customer who returned the runaway loaner was to promptly loan it out again the next day.

I'm just a bit wary of all this being put entirely on a dodgy mechanical part. Practically everything in the car is controlled by the ECU, including accelleration, which means someone who is not in the car with you, doesn't know you from Adam, and has never driven the road you're on, is in partial control of your car: the computer programmer.

The more complex the instructions you load onto a chip, the more lines of code, the more likely a cockup. A catastrophic example of a digital cockup was when the Lauda Air Airbus decided to apply reverse thrust on one engine, at cruising speed, at cruising altitude. The plane disintegrated in seconds. It was an "uncommanded" reverse thrust, and a whole bunch of system redesigns had to be done to prevent it happening again.

I have had stuck accellerators on cars, all I did was hook my shoe welt behind the pedal and hook it back. The only time this didn't work was when a throttle return spring broke, but turning off the key worked fine. And, believe it or not, an "occy strap" was substituted and got me home.

Toyota Found Fix For Stuck Pedals

Well I'm sure we're all reassured by the official Toyota position, or whatever your point is. FWIW I am quite happy to jump into a T car tomorrow (as I probably will, since we need a lowest common denominator), and if the throttle sticks or whatever, I fully expect to be able to cope with it. So rather than reposting other stuff, what exactly are you trying to prove?

Well, there are many more passenger cars in the direct vicinity of mine than satellites, and they are operated by (nearly) untrained laypeople, which do not even follow any procedures on what to do with the machinery in certain situations ;)

Zoe

Actually it was a Boeing 767, not an Airbus AFAIK it was more a design problem in the hydraulics than the electronics, but the end result was sadly the same...

Zoe

If it's the same one as I'm thinking of, as mentioned just above it was a B767 and the cause was a leaky o-ring that gradually let oil pressure into the reverser mechanism. I can't remember the details but I think the crew ignored the warnings and the procedure (to shut the engine down or at least bring it back down to idle) and it suddenly went to reverse thrust at cruise thrust. The engine then pulled the wing off ....

One thing I've been reminded of with all this is one of my favourite sayings - Use the most simple machine to do the job.

Getting back to Toymotor and their problems...

This is the latest release in Australia relating to the issue:



So why did my father's car take off on my sister?

Yes it was a 767, sorry, I was running on memory. The aircraft had been giving spurious signals on the EICAS (Engine Indication and Crew Alert System) screen for some time. (The report I have says the very informative screen said L REV ISLN VAL). The plane was being progressively serviced between flights to solve the annoying and recurring fault. The message came on yet again on this flight, and the crew immediately began trawling through the manual. This took a few minutes, as they tried to understand why the thrust reverser warning would come on yet again when the reverser clearly wasn't deployed (and theoretically it was impossible to be deployed) the plane flying normally; then suddenly the reverser deployed. Twenty-odd seconds later the plane distintegrated.

It was so appallingly sudden (just 26 seconds!) that the flight deck crew spoke just a few words:

"Reverser's deployed!"
"***"
"Here, wait a minute - "
"***"
"***"

There was no non-digital non-computer way of killing the reverser instantly. The thrust reverser system for the 767 with that engine configuration (Pratt and Whitney) was modified afterwards to make absolutely sure there could be no uncommanded deployment.

Now in the Good Old Days, you had to push a big lever to reverse thrust, and it weas hydraulic and under the pilot's command; now, on fly-by wire, you push the lever and the computer does the work. There is no physical link.

I'm not knocking progress, just pointing out that you never know what's likely to happen when you put all of your motoring eggs in a digital basket.

Couldn't they have shut down the engine? Maybe it had a START button instead of a key.

Well, on my co-worker's BMW, the start/stop key shuts off the engine even on a short push on the button.......

Zoe

Toyota recalls 1.8mill cars in europe. AYGO, iQ, Yaris, Auris, Corolla, Verso, Avensis og RAV4. models

http://www.berlingske.dk/verden/toyota-bil...er-trukket-hjem
in danish

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