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RoutariEnjinu
Feb 19 2010, 20:01
QUOTE (senna da silva @ Feb 19 2010, 21:54) *
No, it means that it's difficult to find consistency on a 130Kg delta in weight.





I know that's the idea he was trying to convey... I was on about the exact figures he mentioned, and why he only said down to 20kg.


senna da silva
Feb 19 2010, 20:05
QUOTE (RoutariEnjinu @ Feb 19 2010, 20:01) *
I know that's the idea he was trying to convey... I was on about the exact figures he mentioned, and why he only said down to 20kg.


A guess would be that 20Kg is the start of Qualifying fuel load and 150Kg is the start of the race fuel load.
RoutariEnjinu
Feb 19 2010, 20:08
Are they not allowed to refuel during qualifying either then??
Bonaventura
Feb 19 2010, 20:23
QUOTE (The Big Guns @ Feb 19 2010, 20:42) *
Jenson isn't being favoured, the testing schedule was made up a while ago, and they will stick to it, unless something catastrophic happens, I think.

Two more wet & rainy days?
Wouter
Feb 19 2010, 20:42
QUOTE (mp4-a @ Feb 19 2010, 21:40) *
Im sorry if this has already been asked before but McLaren are still sponsored by Santander and their logo appeared on the rear wing on the 24. Have they just taken it off the 25 so they can get a clearer picture of the flow on the wing or has the logo disappeared for good? Ild have thought that McLaren is 'too big' a team not to have a rear wing logo sponsor confused.gif

Or is Santander not paying enough :confused: ohwell.gif

Apparently, Santander is only on the driver overalls. The decals were not on the car during presentation, so nothing to do with flow-viz. I guess they are simply not paying enough, and Mclaren has lost most of their money from 2008.
Owen
Feb 19 2010, 20:43
QUOTE (mp4-a @ Feb 19 2010, 20:40) *
Im sorry if this has already been asked before but McLaren are still sponsored by Santander and their logo appeared on the rear wing on the 24. Have they just taken it off the 25 so they can get a clearer picture of the flow on the wing or has the logo disappeared for good? Ild have thought that McLaren is 'too big' a team not to have a rear wing logo sponsor confused.gif

Or is Santander not paying enough :confused: ohwell.gif

Nothing has been said about that officially. Santander are staying on but as yet the logo has only appeared on the overalls.
Dalton007
Feb 19 2010, 20:45
QUOTE (maccaFTW @ Feb 19 2010, 19:40) *
Umm... Jenson? Why is it so important to the development of the car that YOU are happy with it? Lewis hasn't had any trouble keeping up with the Ferrari's in testing.



It's not about keeping up with the Ferraris in testing because they don't know the fuel weights (I'm sure they've worked it out), it's all about finding set-ups and tyre consistency. Fast times come later.
Owen
Feb 19 2010, 20:50
QUOTE (femi @ Feb 19 2010, 18:13) *
Jenson's verdict

Interesting. Looks like this 'phase' of testing we're in now is all about adding performance and honing the set up. Hopefully reliability is good and we're finished with the aero measurment / verification appendages.
GoonerLewis
Feb 19 2010, 20:59
QUOTE (Owen @ Feb 19 2010, 20:50) *
Interesting. Looks like this 'phase' of testing we're in now is all about adding performance and honing the set up. Hopefully reliability is good and we're finished with the aero measurment / verification appendages.


I think Jenson did well today and the team must have lots of useful data from todays test. I do want to see what Lewis can do though on a track like it was today.

He is testing last in Barca so lets hope its dry.
dabrasco
Feb 19 2010, 21:08
QUOTE (mstar @ Feb 19 2010, 18:34) *
quote from mclaren website about jensons day:

"his engineers have been extremely pleased with the extent to which he has been able to establish himself within the team, and the depth and scope of his feedback."


i can think they missed someone who can be accurate and experienced as jenson inthe car as they havn't had someone ACTUALLY know how to develop and spot areas to push hard on since alonso i think.


unnecc. and unproven Lewis bash... I guess he won the WDC and helped turned the team around last year without ACTUALLY knowing how to....gtfoh... you are the kind of fans (timba etc) that are trying to force previous Mclaren fans to dislike Jenson...


moving on, getting the car balanced and consistent with 150 and 20kg of fuel is just something I don't think can happen. No matter how well they set it up, I still think the drivers will have to do alot of adapting on raceday.
Kimiraikkonen
Feb 19 2010, 21:10
I think the car is very good. We are in disvantage in tyre use but we are quick.

Tomorrow we put in Jerez some updates, i hope the 25 will arrive at Bahrein on pace.


Go Macca Goo!!
Owen
Feb 19 2010, 21:12
QUOTE (Kimiraikkonen @ Feb 19 2010, 21:10) *
I think the car is very good. We are in disvantage in tyre use but we are quick.

Tomorrow we put in Jerez some updates, i hope the 25 will arrive at Bahrein on pace.


Go Macca Goo!!

The vibe I'm getting is that no one team has a clear advantage. So we should be in the mix up front at the very least.
mstar
Feb 19 2010, 21:19
Anyone got some ideas what the new upgrades be on the car tommorow?
Owen
Feb 19 2010, 21:22
QUOTE (mstar @ Feb 19 2010, 21:19) *
Anyone got some ideas what the new upgrades be on the car tommorow?

Just said minor upgrades.
maccaFTW
Feb 19 2010, 21:24
QUOTE (timba @ Feb 19 2010, 14:49) *
Not always. Ferrari were much faster some times.

Test 3 Day 2
Massa 1m28.879s
Hamilton 1m31.633s

Test 2 Day 3
Massa 1m21.603s
Hamilton 1m23.985s

Test 1 Day 2
Massa 1m11.722
Hamilton 1m12.256

Of course these are just raw data, but I assumed you were basing that claim on the same..


I was basing it on reports of race-stint times, an area in which Hamilton was matching Ferrari.
GoonerLewis
Feb 19 2010, 21:27
QUOTE (mstar @ Feb 19 2010, 21:19) *
Anyone got some ideas what the new upgrades be on the car tommorow?


Nothing Major, I would like to think that they will have some bigger upgrades for the barca tests.
Seanspeed
Feb 19 2010, 21:45
QUOTE (GoonerLewis @ Feb 19 2010, 16:27) *
Nothing Major, I would like to think that they will have some bigger upgrades for the barca tests.

The Barcelona test will be interesting. Most teams will have some noticeable upgrades, with some maybe even fitting on what will basically be the final race package for Bahrain.

Whatever the order is right now, might not be the order after these upgrades are put on.
alg7_munif
Feb 19 2010, 21:47
Button is certainly feeling the pressure already that he is not up to Lewis's pace.
tkulla
Feb 19 2010, 21:50
QUOTE (alg7_munif @ Feb 19 2010, 22:47) *
Button is certainly feeling the pressure already that he is not up to Lewis's pace.


How did you come to that conclusion?
mstar
Feb 19 2010, 21:54
i don't even think Barcelona will tell us the full picture as the teams as usual bring new parts ready for FP1 for the first race. The bigger teams will have updates for bahrain which they would not have tested before the season. This may bring them a little laptime.
raiseyourfistfor
Feb 19 2010, 21:55
QUOTE (femi @ Feb 19 2010, 15:13) *
Jenson's verdict


This is good news. If with Button's inferior driving the Ferrari is just slightly ahead then Lewis' superior talent will easily allow him to keep up with Alonso and pass MSC
Seanspeed
Feb 19 2010, 21:57
QUOTE (mstar @ Feb 19 2010, 16:54) *
i don't even think Barcelona will tell us the full picture

Dont think the first race will, either. wink.gif
alg7_munif
Feb 19 2010, 21:59
QUOTE (tkulla @ Feb 19 2010, 22:50) *
How did you come to that conclusion?

If he didn't feel the pressure, he won't try to blame it on the car. He could just say that he was doing the planned test and he didn't even try to set a benchmark. The fact that he is already blaming the car means that he is frustrated that he couldn't get a better time.
QUOTE
And on the performance of the MP4-25, he says McLaren is heading in the right direction but the car is not yet where he wants it.
raiseyourfistfor
Feb 19 2010, 21:59
QUOTE (Seanspeed @ Feb 19 2010, 18:45) *
The Barcelona test will be interesting. Most teams will have some noticeable upgrades, with some maybe even fitting on what will basically be the final race package for Bahrain.

Whatever the order is right now, might not be the order after these upgrades are put on.


The order is unlikely to change much other than maybe Merc since they are still using the old wings and diffuser.

Most of the time the new packages give similar improvements to lap times so the pecking order stays the same.
tkulla
Feb 19 2010, 22:02
QUOTE (alg7_munif @ Feb 19 2010, 22:59) *
If he didn't feel the pressure, he won't try to blame it on the car. He could just say that he was doing the planned test and he didn't even try to set a benchmark. The fact that he is already blaming the car means that he is frustrated that he couldn't get a better time.



That's interesting, because I read it quite differently. I think Button seems very confident in how it's going and is playing a bit of gamesmanship with Ferrari.

If you think about it, it makes sense for a driver to give the impression that other teams have the better car. That way when he beats them he did it in an "inferior" machine. Button was on the other end of this last year. People assumed that the Brawn was the best car all year, when in reality the Red Bull was likely the better car for slightly longer.
Seanspeed
Feb 19 2010, 22:04
QUOTE (raiseyourfistfor @ Feb 19 2010, 16:59) *
The order is unlikely to change much other than maybe Merc since they are still using the old wings and diffuser.

Most of the time the new packages give similar improvements to lap times so the pecking order stays the same.

It all depends on how close things are right now. If they *are* close, then there could well be major changes to the order. If things are not as close as they appear, then maybe no, there wouldn't be big changes.

Key word in my comment was 'might', though. smile.gif The point is that things can change.
Seanspeed
Feb 19 2010, 22:05
QUOTE (tkulla @ Feb 19 2010, 17:02) *
If you think about it, it makes sense for a driver to give the impression that other teams have the better car.

I think this happens all the time. Driver's egos and all....

And not completely relevant, but I totally disagree with your idea that the Brawn wasn't the fastest car for most of last season. tongue.gif I also dont think that Button is that great of a driver. While I disagree with anybody who says that Button is *showing* the pressure of facing Lewis, I'm sure he is inside, and I'm sure it will increase as the season goes on and Jenson proves unable to match him on a regular basis. I foresee lots of car complaints........
alg7_munif
Feb 19 2010, 22:27
It's way too early to play the "the car is not up for the job" card especially during testing when they don't know for sure what other teams are doing. Maybe I missed it but so far I have not seen any other driver saying that the car is not where he wants it to be, they might say others are fast but they never blame it on the car so early.
Slartibartfast
Feb 19 2010, 22:36
Who do I apply to for one of these mail-order Psychology doctorates?
craftverk
Feb 19 2010, 22:38
6000 posts
PassWind
Feb 19 2010, 22:47
QUOTE (Slartibartfast @ Feb 19 2010, 23:36) *
Who do I apply to for one of these mail-order Psychology doctorates?



Off the top of my head, I would say Eddie Jordan then Jackie Stewart in that order.
Grenada
Feb 19 2010, 23:08
QUOTE (GoonerLewis @ Feb 19 2010, 20:59) *
I think Jenson did well today and the team must have lots of useful data from todays test. I do want to see what Lewis can do though on a track like it was today.

He is testing last in Barca so lets hope its dry.



That's interesting. How do you know Lewis is testing last in Barcelona? I think he has had the real rough end of the stick in testing. It is really unfair - he's just not getting the running Button is. They must have known what the weather was going to be (just look at a reputable online weather forecast) so you'd think they could have given Hamilton at least one dry day.
Bonaventura
Feb 19 2010, 23:22
QUOTE (Grenada @ Feb 20 2010, 00:08) *
That's interesting. How do you know Lewis is testing last in Barcelona? I think he has had the real rough end of the stick in testing. It is really unfair - he's just not getting the running Button is. They must have known what the weather was going to be (just look at a reputable online weather forecast) so you'd think they could have given Hamilton at least one dry day.

Only 3 dry laps on Thursday isn't really much
I hope "Team- Lewis" will have 2 dry days in Barcelona, i think they need them
If its going to be wet again, this would be problematic
The fairest test-time- sharing is at Mercedes GP
dhill39
Feb 19 2010, 23:29
As a fan of lewis ,I just think he his getting a raw deal,You can tell by reading their press release,even on their website,its all jenson.I just think that the team is going way over board to make jenson feel comfortable.If they keep it up,they will alienate lewis and he will leave.Fernando his not even getting that type of treatment from ferrari.
alg7_munif
Feb 19 2010, 23:34
QUOTE (dhill39 @ Feb 20 2010, 00:29) *
As a fan of lewis ,I just think he his getting a raw deal,You can tell by reading their press release,even on their website,its all jenson.I just think that the team is going way over board to make jenson feel comfortable.If they keep it up,they will alienate lewis and he will leave.Fernando his not even getting that type of treatment from ferrari.

I won't worry much since Lewis has an experience with Fernando, he knows that his performance on track is more important than anything else. This could help him too since this will put less pressure on him but more on Button since Button is now the reigning world champion, I'm sure that he doesn't want to be beaten by his team mate who is using the number 2 instead of 1.
Bonaventura
Feb 19 2010, 23:37
QUOTE (dhill39 @ Feb 20 2010, 00:29) *
As a fan of lewis ,I just think he his getting a raw deal,You can tell by reading their press release,even on their website,its all jenson.I just think that the team is going way over board to make jenson feel comfortable.If they keep it up,they will alienate lewis and he will leave.Fernando his not even getting that type of treatment from ferrari.

The silence around Lewis is deafening
since Button arrived
Have you noticed the same thing as me?
dhill39
Feb 19 2010, 23:51
QUOTE (Bonaventura @ Feb 19 2010, 18:37) *
The silence around Lewis is deafening
since Button arrived
Have you noticed the same thing as me?


Yes i have,I just finds it a little weird,when driver is a world champion and establish he should be respected.
FSLIV
Feb 20 2010, 00:08
QUOTE (dhill39 @ Feb 19 2010, 18:51) *
Yes i have,I just finds it a little weird,when driver is a world champion and establish he should be respected.

This is my first post. 1st wanted to say hello to everyone. I am also a die-hard LH fan and I also notice how, not much was coming form the Macca camp the last four days of testing in which LH was the test driver. I don think this has anything to do with favoritism within ht Macca camp. The only difference today was that JB chose to speak out. Maybe LH is just choosing to not speak out. I also expect more press to be on JB because he is the reining champ. Just 2 cents
Bonaventura
Feb 20 2010, 00:27
QUOTE (dhill39 @ Feb 20 2010, 00:51) *
Yes i have,I just finds it a little weird,when driver is a world champion and establish he should be respected.

I dont think it's a lack of respect
They are very (too?) proud of their new toy, and Button seems to be very good, in selling himself well.

But something seems to disappear at McLaren, what made "us" something special the last years.

http://www.itv-f1.com/ImageLibrary/56197_2.jpg
GoonerLewis
Feb 20 2010, 00:31
QUOTE (Bonaventura @ Feb 20 2010, 00:37) *
The silence around Lewis is deafening
since Button arrived
Have you noticed the same thing as me?


Lewis will do his talking on the track. I think he will be better than ever and just wants to get on with it. Jenson is a world class driver and i don't care what anyone says but we all know Lewis is better and he knows it.
Buttoneer
Feb 20 2010, 00:37
Button is the current WDC so of course he gets a higher profile from the press generally this winter rolleyes.gif
Hephaistos
Feb 20 2010, 00:51
QUOTE (dhill39 @ Feb 20 2010, 00:51) *
Yes i have,I just finds it a little weird,when driver is a world champion and establish he should be respected.


I'm a big Lewis fan too. I just hope he really beats Button. Not that I don't like Button but if he doesn't, he might find it hard to justify his much higher salary. For now, Hamilton is more marketable. To stay that way, he needs to pile up victories. Otherwise he might find himself under pressure from the team, which will inevitably affect his performance and he may get into the same situation as Kimi in ferrari.
I don't really see Button beating him though.
craftverk
Feb 20 2010, 01:03
is this the mclaren thread or what? feels like a lewis love-fest right now
Pingu Pi
Feb 20 2010, 01:05
i have no problems with the press being on button. lewis doesnt need it, and im sure he prefers it like this. he can just concentrate on his driving and the car. come bahrain, the crazy test season will be over and what happens on the track will make the stories. Hamilton Hatrick Hero in Bahrain (Pole, win, fastest lap) biggrin.gif

though personally the press really hasnt been on very many of the major teams if you ask me, everything seems to be pointed at the new ones, rightfully so ofcourse.
tkulla
Feb 20 2010, 01:19
QUOTE (FSLIV @ Feb 20 2010, 00:08) *
This is my first post. 1st wanted to say hello to everyone. I am also a die-hard LH fan and I also notice how, not much was coming form the Macca camp the last four days of testing in which LH was the test driver. I don think this has anything to do with favoritism within ht Macca camp. The only difference today was that JB chose to speak out. Maybe LH is just choosing to not speak out. I also expect more press to be on JB because he is the reining champ. Just 2 cents


Welcome! And congrats on a rational, balanced first post. A rare find...
Demo.
Feb 20 2010, 01:50
QUOTE (FSLIV @ Feb 20 2010, 00:08) *
This is my first post. 1st wanted to say hello to everyone. I am also a die-hard LH fan and I also notice how, not much was coming form the Macca camp the last four days of testing in which LH was the test driver. I don think this has anything to do with favoritism within ht Macca camp. The only difference today was that JB chose to speak out. Maybe LH is just choosing to not speak out. I also expect more press to be on JB because he is the reining champ. Just 2 cents



hello and welcome to the mad house.
Demo.
Feb 20 2010, 01:52
QUOTE (Hephaistos @ Feb 20 2010, 00:51) *
I'm a big Lewis fan too. I just hope he really beats Button. Not that I don't like Button but if he doesn't, he might find it hard to justify his much higher salary. For now, Hamilton is more marketable. To stay that way, he needs to pile up victories. Otherwise he might find himself under pressure from the team, which will inevitably affect his performance and he may get into the same situation as Kimi in ferrari.
I don't really see Button beating him though.



not really when you consider in 3 years he has been in the running for 2 WDC's and last year no one could expect lewis to do any better than he did given what a dog of a car last years was.
bobcat
Feb 20 2010, 02:02
QUOTE (tkulla @ Feb 19 2010, 17:19) *
Welcome! And congrats on a rational, balanced first post. A rare find...


Yes, a twilight world populated by boys, alone in their underpants with a PC for company, wrestling with their conflicted feelings about good looking young F1 drivers.

These feelings are perfectly normal, and they'll soon pass.
mclarensmps
Feb 20 2010, 02:12
QUOTE (bobcat @ Feb 19 2010, 21:02) *
Yes, a twilight world populated by boys, alone in their underpants with a PC for company, wrestling with their conflicted feelings about good looking young F1 drivers.

These feelings are perfectly normal, and they'll soon pass.


What the hell are you on about lol.gif


As for people thinking that things are too quiet on the Lewis front at McLaren, it's only because JB is the champion and is going to be fronted for that, for press and sponsorship purposes. Once the racing starts, it'll go back to how it was, I am guessing.

Also, in terms of Lewis not talking much, the way I've seen it so far, the teams have alternated drivers for Press Conferences. At the first test (if i remember correctly), it was both drivers, at the next test, it was Lewis, in the most recent test it was Button, so I am expecting that at the next test, it will be Lewis once more who answers some press questions.

I may be a bit off here, in terms of getting the order correctly, but I seem to remember it being something like this.
pingu666
Feb 20 2010, 07:20
lewis should enjoy the quiet times, over the past 3 years he has been the most interesting thing in f1 (good and bad), and has had massive media attention during that time.

2010 brings him some new compertion in the most interesting stakes, shumi and kobashi biggrin.gif
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