McLaren was really dissapointing. Awful in sector 2 and Button made it even worse. He's not on the pace he should be.
Lewis is 4th but that could have easily been 6th or lower. The big gap is infront of him, not behind.
Full Version: McLaren - MP4-25 Thread [merged]
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can you please stop the "since we lost Newey ...." bs, Newey didnt have influence on a mclaren car for many years, and they worked well over the kerps
QUOTE (pit5bul @ Mar 13 2010, 12:24) 
Your point being ?? ok were not 2 seconds of the pace.. were only one sec ?? NOT GOOD ENOUGH ! McLaren has to aim for being the best car not to play catch-up .. I really feel that Hamilton talent is going to waste in a McLaren
Lewis was 0.5s slower in Q3, we're about 0.5-0.8s off the pace not 1sec.
QUOTE (mclarenproject4 @ Mar 13 2010, 13:26)
I've given up hopes of the WCC. Its better if we start concentrating on 2011, at least start off with a decent advantage.
Ah come on!
QUOTE (pRy @ Mar 13 2010, 12:26)
I disagree. Button actually sounded quite positive although he tailed off towards the end. Hamilton had his "Oh god the car is rubbish" face on again and seemed to have his head down.
I didn't think Lewis was that bad, he was just being realistic about the car issues in S2, its not like he could hard them and he was happy with p4, and will try and grab a podium, what more do people want?
The car has a issue with bumps, lets hope that it is setup like that due the fuel it has to carry tomorrow.
QUOTE (pRy @ Mar 13 2010, 12:26)
I disagree. Button actually sounded quite positive although he tailed off towards the end. Hamilton had his "Oh god the car is rubbish" face on again and seemed to have his head down.
You must have been watching a different tv programme to me.
QUOTE (Simon Says @ Mar 13 2010, 13:23)
The car has alot of potential. Despite these handling problems, Lewis still put in on the 2nd row. If Mclaren fixes this issues, I bet Lewis can put the car on the front row on a regular basis with a few wins this season. Maybe even the WDC like in 2008 when Mclaren didn't have the fastest car 
So, not the very best car, but the very best driver?
QUOTE (mclarenproject4 @ Mar 13 2010, 13:26)
I think its time to stop being over optimistic. We are over a second behind Ferrari & Red Bull. I know this car ain't a dog like last year & its certainly not a mp4-20. Its more like the 2006 car which failed to win any races.
I've resigned to the fact that we will be regularly in the points & an occasional podium when Lewis out drives his car. Race wins seem an impossibility with this car.
And why is it that we always want to play catch up?? When was the last time we started with a advantage over Ferrari? 98 eh? I've given up hopes of the WCC. Its better if we start concentrating on 2011, at least start off with a decent advantage.
I've resigned to the fact that we will be regularly in the points & an occasional podium when Lewis out drives his car. Race wins seem an impossibility with this car.
And why is it that we always want to play catch up?? When was the last time we started with a advantage over Ferrari? 98 eh? I've given up hopes of the WCC. Its better if we start concentrating on 2011, at least start off with a decent advantage.
2008, Mclaren started as arguable the 3rd or 2nd best team since BMW was even able to beat the Mclaren's. But ended up winning the WDC. Don't underestimate Mclaren. They usually start weak but finish strong. And I'm sure Lewis can put up a good fight despite a poor season start.
And it's only 1 seconds in this track. The Mclaren doesn't like the bumps, it handles bad. I'm sure Mclaren will fix the handling problems
Lot of trolls here, i wonder why...
Pretty disappointing qualy, how well Macca do tomorrow depends on whether Lewis and Jenson can preserve the tyres. Luckily the car is pretty handy in terms of top speed, so that should help LH and JB overtake the cars in front.
QUOTE (TheArmchairCritic @ Mar 13 2010, 13:29)
Lewis was 0.5s slower in Q3, we're about 0.5-0.8s off the pace not 1sec.
Sebastian Vettel - 1:54.101
Lewis Hamilton - 1:55.217
- 1.116
Face the facts.
QUOTE (Lights @ Mar 13 2010, 12:31)
Sebastian Vettel - 1:54.101
Lewis Hamilton - 1:55.217
- 1.116
Face the facts.
Lewis Hamilton - 1:55.217
- 1.116
Face the facts.
Low fuel, we don't know if they have being setup different so that they are better with full load rather then empty.
Huge disappointment but as I said earlier, Bahrain never suited McLaren.
Things should look different by Malaysia
Things should look different by Malaysia
One must keep last year in perspective, from the bottom to the top of the grid is good.
But McLaren were the biggest disappointment in qualifying, no doubt about it. They don't have the pace it seems.
Let's find out how they perform with fuel and worn tyres so of course, plenty of hope left.
Button is on the back foot...
But McLaren were the biggest disappointment in qualifying, no doubt about it. They don't have the pace it seems.
Let's find out how they perform with fuel and worn tyres so of course, plenty of hope left.
Button is on the back foot...
QUOTE (bond @ Mar 13 2010, 13:30)
Lot of trolls here, i wonder why...
Indeed. Full of trolls.
QUOTE (TheArmchairCritic @ Mar 13 2010, 23:59)
Lewis was 0.5s slower in Q3, we're about 0.5-0.8s off the pace not 1sec.
mate... look at the Q3 lap times ?
Vettel 1.54.101
Hamilton 1.55.217
thats over 1 second
QUOTE (Lights @ Mar 13 2010, 13:31)
Sebastian Vettel - 1:54.101
Lewis Hamilton - 1:55.217
- 1.116
Face the facts.
Lewis Hamilton - 1:55.217
- 1.116
Face the facts.
Dear god, Vettel will make us his lapdog. Three or four laps down. We are doomed, time to concentrate for 2011......
Seriously..............WTF
And I¨m a troll feeder
QUOTE (Jose Mourinho is Special @ Mar 13 2010, 12:22)
one word to describe McLaren's season
DOOMED
DOOMED
The odd Red Bull will suffer mechanically in the coming races and possibly chew its tyres giving Mclaren and Mercedes a chance to gain extra points, until the big upgrades come at Barcelona. Like I said earlier I was right about Mclaren being 0.4-0.7 behind. Its only 1 second at Bahrain because the track is so long and sector 2 just killed us. Its about damage limitation and development speed. Personally I think Vettel just nailed a mega lap like Hamilton did in Abu Dhabi, because Webber was over 1 second behind. What gives me hope is the Mclaren handling looks a handful and in the slow twisty bits, JJscale and Heidfeld were spot on. Fixing those issues will make us a big gain, because Ferrari and Red Bull have little room for improvement in that area.
QUOTE (Anomnader @ Mar 13 2010, 13:32)
Low fuel, we don't know if they have being setup different so that they are better with full load rather then empty.
You're right, it's possible McLaren went for a qualy setup while Red Bull went for racepace.
.. we simply don't know that, so the gap is 1,1 second. That's it.
I'm still not sure what tyres we start on. I thought Hard, Rain said soft, I can't see a 100% accurate answer.
Vettel won't win tomorrow he will destroy his tyres after 10 laps.
Mclaren will be better in the race, car looks stiff and i think Lewis will finish 3rd and Jenson in the top 5.
Mclaren will be better in the race, car looks stiff and i think Lewis will finish 3rd and Jenson in the top 5.
QUOTE (Lights @ Mar 13 2010, 12:31)
Sebastian Vettel - 1:54.101
Lewis Hamilton - 1:55.217
- 1.116
Face the facts.
Lewis Hamilton - 1:55.217
- 1.116
Face the facts.
I suggest that you wait until the end of the race tomorrow before counting McLaren out of the running.
QUOTE (meddo @ Mar 13 2010, 13:33)
Dear god, Vettel will make us his lapdog. Three or four laps down. We are doomed, time to concentrate for 2011......
Seriously..............WTF
And I¨m a troll feeder
Seriously..............WTF
And I¨m a troll feeder
What's wrong with a fact? The things you say aren't supported by anything.
QUOTE (Lights @ Mar 13 2010, 12:34)
You're right, it's possible McLaren went for a qualy setup while Red Bull went for racepace.
.. we simply don't know that, so the gap is 1,1 second. That's it.
.. we simply don't know that, so the gap is 1,1 second. That's it.
Think you mean the other way round?
QUOTE (OnyxF1 @ Mar 13 2010, 13:35)
I suggest that you wait until the end of the race tomorrow before counting McLaren out of the running.
Where exactly do I count McLaren out of the running?
well mclaren said they found a sec in the last test with its new parts, Azeem said they would gain another .5 before this race thats 1.5. If we didnt have that we would be just as bad a s last year I know its not funny, im just so dissapointed.
I know its not funny, im just so dissapointed.
QUOTE (Anomnader @ Mar 13 2010, 13:35)
I'm still not sure what tyres we start on. I thought Hard, Rain said soft, I can't see a 100% accurate answer.
All 10 in Q3 were using softs
QUOTE (GoonerLewis @ Mar 13 2010, 13:36)
Think you mean the other way round?
No, I did not mean that. It could be either way. We do not know the exact settings. Fact is, they were 1,1 seconds off pace.
QUOTE (The Ragged Edge @ Mar 13 2010, 13:34)
The odd Red Bull will suffer mechanically in the race and possibly chew its tyres giving Mclaren and Mercedes a chance to gain extra points. Like I said earlier I was right about being 0.4-0.7 behind. Its only 1 second at Bahrain because the track is so long and sector 2 just killed us. Its about damage limitation and development speed. Personally I think Vettel just nailed a mega lap like Hamilton did in Abu Dhabi, because Webber was over 1 second behind. What gives me hope is the Mclaren handling looks a handful and in the slow twisty bits, JJscale and Heidfeld were spot on.
Webber just messed up, that's it. He was pretty much equal with Vettel untill Q3. If it wasn't for his mistake, Lewis would have been 5th.
There goes a possible Monaco and Singapore win which are tracks that Lewis is usually good at.
QUOTE (undersquare @ Mar 12 2010, 18:25)
Must admit I didn't hear him say anything that definite about an agreement. I thought his main beef was with the FIA for having several rules obviously aimed at outlawing wing stalling but then allowing the snorkel workaround.
Below are a couple of BEll quotes from another page.
“I totally disagree with the FIA's view on it,” the man who acted as stand-in team principal at Renault last year – following the departure in disgrace of Flavio Briatore and Pat Symonds over 'Singapore-gate' – told the BBC. “It's fundamentally clear in all the discussions that have taken place over many years that the sport did not want stallable rear wings, whether it was through physical deflection or any other mechanism.
“The fact that somebody has turned up and just driven a horse and cart straight through the rule that teams cannot use moveable aerodynamic devices on their cars, through the spirit of the regulations, the intent of the regulations and everybody's understanding, to me is just a complete joke.
“It may conform to the letter of the rules, but I don't think in an instance like this that that's sufficient, because there has been plenty of precedent for concepts where it has just quite plainly been said that the intention with the sport is to prevent stalling of rear wings – and this flies in the face of that. It is fundamentally illegal.
Bahrain is not a traditional circuit, completely different from Barcelona, just because the car isn't so good here doesn't mean it's bad
Great job by Lewis.
I think that sector 2 is a bit of a freak section of track when it's all said and done - and it's clearly not in tune with the MP4-25's strengths.
It's also a very long race tommorrow. If any driver can pull a result out of the bag then it's Hamilton.
PS: Well done Massa!
I think that sector 2 is a bit of a freak section of track when it's all said and done - and it's clearly not in tune with the MP4-25's strengths.
It's also a very long race tommorrow. If any driver can pull a result out of the bag then it's Hamilton.
PS: Well done Massa!
QUOTE (Simon Says @ Mar 13 2010, 12:37)
Webber just messed up, that's it. He was pretty much equal with Vettel untill Q3. If it wasn't for his mistake, Lewis would have been 5th.
There goes a possible Monaco and Singapore win which are tracks that Lewis is usually good at.
There goes a possible Monaco and Singapore win which are tracks that Lewis is usually good at.
Yeh because the car will be exactly the same as in Bahrain.
What is wrong with people!!!!!!!!!!!
I don't think it is too bad. This track doesn't suit us anyway. If we get a podium it will be great. The 1 sec of pole is a bit disconcerting but maybe we had different tradeoff for quali position vs race pace compared to Vettel. Hopefully tommorow we can get a bit ahead.
QUOTE (Alx09 @ Mar 14 2010, 00:03)
Indeed. Full of trolls.
And some of you cant face reality period... i was looking forward to this year... hoping McLaren will have a competitive car ( and i mean even if we were 10th today.. if its only .4 difference its ok but not 1.1 ) but hey i guess that being disappointed with McLaren and expressing it makes me a troll.
QUOTE (Mclaren4ever @ Mar 13 2010, 13:32)
Huge disappointment but as I said earlier, Bahrain never suited McLaren.
Things should look different by Malaysia
Things should look different by Malaysia
Lewis got 4th last season in that crappy car they had in the start of the season.
QUOTE (meddo @ Mar 13 2010, 13:36)
All 10 in Q3 were using softs
sutil on hard, but otherwise, dont know why mclaren didnt try and send button out on hards,
QUOTE (meddo @ Mar 13 2010, 13:36)
All 10 in Q3 were using softs
edit
How many points were awarded today?
This is ONE qualifying session.
This is ONE qualifying session.
It¨s a long, hard, very hot race tomorrow, let us just wait and see. I think everything from first place till tenth place is possible, but nobody can yet tell is car set for one, two or three stopers, and that can make or break a hell of a lot place in the race.
QUOTE (Lights @ Mar 13 2010, 13:31)
Sebastian Vettel - 1:54.101
Lewis Hamilton - 1:55.217
- 1.116
Face the facts.
Lewis Hamilton - 1:55.217
- 1.116
Face the facts.
How do you explain Webbers time then? Was he driving different car ? He was over a second slower then Vettel too.
QUOTE (pit5bul @ Mar 13 2010, 13:39)
And some of you cant face reality period... i was looking forward to this year... hoping McLaren will have a competitive car ( and i mean even if we were 10th today.. if its only .4 difference its ok but not 1.1 ) but hey i guess that being disappointed with McLaren and expressing it makes me a troll.
Indeed, I don't get it either. Face reality, this isn't testing or practice. It's qualy. And a gap of 1,1 seconds isn't exactly what any McLaren fan hoped for.
The people calling trolls in this topic are trolling themselves.
Webber only did a single fast lap, and he made a mistake. Given that he so often seems to struggle to get the best out of the car in qualifying, it seems strange not to make him have two attempts.
QUOTE (GoonerLewis @ Mar 13 2010, 13:38)
Yeh because the car will be exactly the same as in Bahrain.
What is wrong with people!!!!!!!!!!!
What is wrong with people!!!!!!!!!!!
Well, if you had taken a look at the trend mood-graph below, you would have noticed that today a new low would be reached
QUOTE (RoutariEnjinu @ Mar 11 2010, 15:37)
QUOTE (Anomnader @ Mar 13 2010, 12:35)
I'm still not sure what tyres we start on. I thought Hard, Rain said soft, I can't see a 100% accurate answer.
Soft
QUOTE (propercare @ Mar 13 2010, 13:41)
How do you explain Webbers time then? Was he driving different car ? He was over a second slower then Vettel too.
Yeah, and he lost the whole 1 second in sector 2. 60.7 - 61.7. He made a mistake. That's it.
As a sporting gesture from Red Bull I offer this token of friendship. 
QUOTE (slideways @ Mar 13 2010, 12:44)
As a sporting gesture from Red Bull I offer this token of friendship.
To all alonso's fans...
QUOTE (Simon Says @ Mar 13 2010, 12:30)
2008, Mclaren started as arguable the 3rd or 2nd best team since BMW was even able to beat the Mclaren's. But ended up winning the WDC. Don't underestimate Mclaren. They usually start weak but finish strong. And I'm sure Lewis can put up a good fight despite a poor season start.
And it's only 1 seconds in this track. The Mclaren doesn't like the bumps, it handles bad. I'm sure Mclaren will fix the handling problems
And it's only 1 seconds in this track. The Mclaren doesn't like the bumps, it handles bad. I'm sure Mclaren will fix the handling problems
I know that is always the case. They always start weak. They've sorta adopted it as their policy to start weak. Look at all those years after 1998. We never manged to win as many races as we should have at Melbourne,Sepang & Imola( usually the first 3 race before the rescheduling) We finally leave ourselves with a lot to catch up, classic example being 2005. Why does it have to be like that? We need to start strong in order to win the WCC & we've not done it this year as well.
1 sec off pace!! & we want to win the WCC? Yeah we may end up having the fastest car by the season end, but the points deficit to Ferrari & possibly Red Bull would be very high.
QUOTE (meddo @ Mar 13 2010, 12:40)
It¨s a long, hard, very hot race tomorrow, let us just wait and see. I think everything from first place till tenth place is possible, but nobody can yet tell is car set for one, two or three stopers, and that can make or break a hell of a lot place in the race.
I think Mclaren and Ferrari will 1 stop and Red Bull will 2 stop because they seem to be harder on their tyres on the long runs.
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