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Rob
Even in Andrew Benson's article, it still says it is subject to Ferrari agreeing it. This won't happen.
domhnall
QUOTE (Rob @ Dec 11 2009, 14:26) *
Even in Andrew Benson's article, it still says it is subject to Ferrari agreeing it. This won't happen.


Unless they agree though wink.gif
Rob
QUOTE (domhnall @ Dec 11 2009, 14:37) *
Unless they though agree wink.gif


They'd have to be idiots to agree to one of the best drivers all time, whilst under contract to them, driving for a rival team - and a rival car manufacturer at that.
WebBerK
I think it is an unproper time for Schumy to come back.

Rubens reported that MS doesn't save his tires, he uses to worn them out since the start and then try to hang on the whole race with it.
Without TC, I'm really doubt MS can do it without a massive change in driving style.
The first stint with full tanks will be very important in the race.

However, after seeing the Desafio das Estrelas kart challenge, all the Formula guys came ahead and MS seemed to have saved better his equipment to the end.

Du no... ohwell.gif

But one think is for sure, several elements of the dream team are there:
> Ross Brawn Race Tactics
> Jean Todt running FIA
> Ruben development input [I don't mean MS depends on it, but it helps]
> The best engine
> The best [decent] chassis ???
> Ferrari and McLaren on a major revolution on their cars.
klover
QUOTE (ZZMS @ Dec 11 2009, 04:23) *
Much larger sum wasn't enough for certain finnish driver...

Someone offered him substantially more than 7? That's news to me. Anyways, in both cases money would most likely not be the contract breaker. They both could drive for free and still survive. Or agree to a per point compensation.
klover
QUOTE (Rob @ Dec 11 2009, 15:26) *
Even in Andrew Benson's article, it still says it is subject to Ferrari agreeing it. This won't happen.

The article also talks about Vettel being chased by Mercedes for 2011, please not another silly season of epic proportion next summer rolleyes.gif 1 year for MS to play around might be tempting though...
ZZMS
QUOTE (WebBerK @ Dec 11 2009, 07:03) *
I think it is an unproper time for Schumy to come back.

Rubens reported that MS doesn't save his tires, he uses to worn them out since the start and then try to hang on the whole race with it.
Without TC, I'm really doubt MS can do it without a massive change in driving style.
The first stint with full tanks will be very important in the race.

However, after seeing the Desafio das Estrelas kart challenge, all the Formula guys came ahead and MS seemed to have saved better his equipment to the end.


I believe Rubens talks from his ass. Unlike Rubens Schumacher did drive in F1 before refueling return in 1994 and did just fine.
Brawn BGP 001
QUOTE (ZZMS @ Dec 11 2009, 15:30) *
I believe Rubens talks from his ass. Unlike Rubens Schumacher did drive in F1 before refueling return in 1994 and did just fine.

Rubens was around in 1993.
ZZMS
QUOTE (klover @ Dec 11 2009, 07:14) *
Someone offered him substantially more than 7? That's news to me. Anyways, in both cases money would most likely not be the contract breaker. They both could drive for free and still survive. Or agree to a per point compensation.


he would be getting way more than 7mil euro with Ferrari's money AND drive for the team of his choice (he had a chose at at least three teams, right? smile.gif ) but apparently it wasn't enough so he quit F1.
Galko877
QUOTE (WebBerK @ Dec 11 2009, 17:03) *
> The best engine
> The best [decent] chassis ???


How do you know which will be the best chassis/engine next year?
ZZMS
QUOTE (Brawn BGP 001 @ Dec 11 2009, 07:32) *
Rubens was around in 1993.


hmm, I didn't bother checking it, my bad. Still Schumi had more time in non-refueling era and fared far better than Rubens in every single year they raced together. To me Rubens is a really sad case of grudging and not been able to accept the fact that someone is superior.
glorius&victorius
QUOTE (Brawn BGP 001 @ Dec 11 2009, 16:32) *
Rubens was around in 1993.



up.gif ouch!
klover
QUOTE (ZZMS @ Dec 11 2009, 16:32) *
he would be getting way more than 7mil euro with Ferrari's money AND drive for the team of his choice (he had a chose at at least three teams, right? smile.gif ) but apparently it wasn't enough so he quit F1.

Can you name which team offered him way more than 7 mln and leave the Ferrari money out of it - he is getting it even if he doesn't drive in F1.
ZZMS
QUOTE (glorius&victorius @ Dec 11 2009, 07:34) *
up.gif ouch!


why "ouch!"? I stand corrected, Rubens is still sad little bugger talking from his ass, who's unable to come to grip with reality.
klover
QUOTE (ZZMS @ Dec 11 2009, 16:37) *
why "ouch!"? I stand corrected, Rubens is still sad little bugger talking from his ass, who's unable to come to grip with reality.

Glory Glory MS, the One who would have won Spa and Monza in 2009 but once he realized how much the Ferrari sucked, he wisely cancelled his return.
ZZMS
QUOTE (klover @ Dec 11 2009, 07:36) *
Can you name which team offered him way more than 7 mln and leave the Ferrari money out of it - he is getting it even if he doesn't drive in F1.


I do not think it is correct to leave Ferrari's money out of it. Fact is he had a choice of driving in F1 and getting much more than 7 mil and it wasn't enough. Besides wasn't it 8 mil figure widely speculated everywhere?
ZZMS
QUOTE (klover @ Dec 11 2009, 07:40) *
Glory Glory MS, the One who would have won Spa and Monza in 2009 but once he realized how much the Ferrari sucked, he wisely cancelled his return.


This seriously lacks logic. He didn't test F60, meaning he had just the same opportunity to "realize how much the Ferrari sucked" without announcing the return attempt, yet he did announce it and later withdrew. If it was for the reasons you mentioned above he wouldn't have announced it to begin with. The only logical conclusion is that he canceled the return for other reasons.
WebBerK
QUOTE (Galko877 @ Dec 11 2009, 13:33) *
How do you know which will be the best chassis/engine next year?

If parity is kept for next year, Mercedes will keep being the best engine.
The only menace is the Cossie.
klover
QUOTE (ZZMS @ Dec 11 2009, 16:40) *
I do not think it is correct to leave Ferrari's money out of it. Fact is he had a choice of driving in F1 and getting much more than 7 mil and it wasn't enough. Besides wasn't it 8 mil figure widely speculated everywhere?

I do not think it is correct to say a team offered to Kimi much more than 7 unless they really did so. If I offer you 50,000 salary to work for me and I know you are getting 1 mln from your stock portfolio which I have nothing to do with it and you are still collecting the amount regardless of whether you accept my offer or not, does it mean I offered you substantially more than 50000? No, I only offered 50000.
klover
QUOTE (ZZMS @ Dec 11 2009, 16:43) *
This seriously lacks logic. He didn't test F60, meaning he had just the same opportunity to "realize how much the Ferrari sucked" without announcing the return attempt, yet he did announce it and later withdrew. If it was for the reasons you mentioned above he wouldn't have announced it to begin with. The only logical conclusion is that he canceled the return for other reasons.

What lacked logic were the crazy expectations heaped on MS as soon as he announced his possible return - people here, yourself probably included, expected him to fight at the front with what was a pretty difficult car.
WebBerK
QUOTE (ZZMS @ Dec 11 2009, 13:37) *
why "ouch!"? I stand corrected, Rubens is still sad little bugger talking from his ass, who's unable to come to grip with reality.

ouch! = autoracing ignorant

Rubens comment was about MS trashing his tires early in the race.
The rest was MY oppinion.
Claudius
QUOTE (jonpollak @ Dec 10 2009, 23:22) *
Oh fer christs sake...maybe the idiots who blather on about this non entity will follow him out the door.

Meanwhile...back on topic...
Fry eludes to JV if MS can't make it

Not that I believe news aggregators or anything...
Jp


up.gif

Unfortunately that isn't happening, some of his fans are having too much fun bashing other drivers to vent their frustration...

Non entity, now that's a fitting name lol.gif

ZZMS
QUOTE (WebBerK @ Dec 11 2009, 07:49) *
ouch! = autoracing ignorant

Rubens comment was about MS trashing his tires early in the race.
The rest was MY oppinion.



Rubens comment is bs. Forgetting the year he entered an F1 = autoracing ignorant? Gee.
domhnall
QUOTE (Rob @ Dec 11 2009, 15:02) *
They'd have to be idiots to agree to one of the best drivers all time, whilst under contract to them, driving for a rival team - and a rival car manufacturer at that.


But what's schumacher actually gonna do for them next year?? Stand on the pit wall trying not to annoy fernando?? Drive round mugello every so often?? If he wants drive for merc next year i think it will be very awkard for ferrari to stop him.
Johny Bravo
QUOTE (Brawn BGP 001 @ Dec 11 2009, 16:32) *
Rubens was around in 1993.


And Schumacher won 7WDCs. I guess he can handle the tyre issue.
Johny Bravo
QUOTE (ZZMS @ Dec 11 2009, 16:43) *
This seriously lacks logic. He didn't test F60, meaning he had just the same opportunity to "realize how much the Ferrari sucked" without announcing the return attempt, yet he did announce it and later withdrew. If it was for the reasons you mentioned above he wouldn't have announced it to begin with. The only logical conclusion is that he canceled the return for other reasons.


Way too much sense in your post, doesnt fit here. down.gif
Johny Bravo
Concerning the salary, last time I read about - though it was before the financial crisis - Schumacher was worth around €800-850M. If that was anything close to the truth it should be rather indifferent to him if he gets 1, 7 or 17 in his possible comeback year.
WebBerK
QUOTE (Johny Bravo @ Dec 11 2009, 14:11) *
And Schumacher won 7WDCs. I guess he can handle the tyre issue.

All of them with the help of TC [w/ Slick and Groove tires], which will not be present in 2010.
craftverk
QUOTE (WebBerK @ Dec 11 2009, 16:30) *
All of them with the help of TC [w/ Slick and Groove tires], which will not be present in 2010.

That was weak.
WebBerK
QUOTE (ZZMS @ Dec 11 2009, 13:57) *
Rubens comment is bs. Forgetting the year he entered an F1 = autoracing ignorant? Gee.

Sorry, I outdid a bit... but bcs you were overaggressive. wave.gif

About Rubens, his oppinion is valid, IMO.
It's a public information that Rubens indeed raced along MS for some years. redface.gif
Maybe Rubens is the one that knows MS best as a race driver.
klover
QUOTE (WebBerK @ Dec 11 2009, 17:34) *
Sorry, I outdid a bit... but bcs you were overaggressive. wave.gif

About Rubens, his oppinion is valid, IMO.
It's a public information that Rubens indeed raced along MS for some years. redface.gif
Maybe Rubens is the one that knows MS best as a race driver.

He probably knows less about MS than the average MS fan on the forum. He only raced alongside him for what was it, 5-6 seasons?
Group B
QUOTE (WebBerK @ Dec 11 2009, 16:30) *
All of them with the help of TC [w/ Slick and Groove tires], which will not be present in 2010.

Yeh, I reckon MS would suck without TC rolleyes.gif
ZZMS
QUOTE (klover @ Dec 11 2009, 08:36) *
He probably knows less about MS than the average MS fan on the forum. He only raced alongside him for what was it, 5-6 seasons?


He came out as a very very bitter man crybaby. So what if he, for the sake of argument, he looked after his tires better and finished the race with the tires as good as new but still way behind MS who finished the race with destroyed tires. F1 is not about whose tires look better after 305km.
Galko877
QUOTE (WebBerK @ Dec 11 2009, 19:30) *
All of them with the help of TC [w/ Slick and Groove tires], which will not be present in 2010.



That's incorrect.
DEVO
QUOTE (Galko877 @ Dec 10 2009, 14:14) *
Doesn't it? Kimi, who was the most popular driver of the post-Schumacher era, is out. All of a sudden Schumacher is back. I wouldn't be surprised if Bernie had something to do with it.

It is a shame what happened to Kimi but to be honest, I think Kimi really wants a go at WRC...which I look forward to.
WebBerK
QUOTE (Group B @ Dec 11 2009, 14:38) *
Yeh, I reckon MS would suck without TC rolleyes.gif

We will see. wink.gif cool.gif
Galko877
QUOTE (DEVO @ Dec 11 2009, 20:42) *
It is a shame what happened to Kimi but to be honest, I think Kimi really wants a go at WRC...which I look forward to.



I didn't mean Bernie had something to do with Kimi going to WRC. I meant I wouldn't be surprised if he had something to do with Schumacher coming back.
umapathypon
QUOTE (WebBerK @ Dec 11 2009, 17:30) *
All of them with the help of TC [w/ Slick and Groove tires], which will not be present in 2010.

False statement.
Frans
Schumacher NEVER drove without TC against a level field in F1. HE loves to cheat, to have somthing on / in his car what others don't have, it's his edge he NEEDS to achieve wins.

He used it while everyone else in the field was driving WITHOUT it, which gave him an edge in the rain and in other races as well (preserving more of the tires and stuff) over the rest of the field.

It was totally unfair, but he has one his 1st title this way, and many at Ferrari this way as well. His Renault powered title was probably the most legal one he ever won (but needed to cheat in other ways anyway still).

So, Schumacher's biggest problem would be in 2010 in a F1 car, is to simply be FAST in it. He would suck, he would stink he would be the Muppet of the F1 circus. He knows this and he needs big help from Jean Todts new position in the sport, and Brawn's genius to come up with the new tricks he always needed. KERS, he never drove it, doesn't know it and will have a dissadvantage there as well. The new point system, it's no suprise of course, has been in the making by Michael Schumacher and Jean Todt since they were still active in the Ferrari pitstreet.

He has now to curve the "Mercedes annouces it's 2nd driver" feeling the media created.....
Schumacher, ... 2nd driver in a team in F1? ...
Is Mercedes like McLaren? 2 cars, 2 drivers both equal equipment and no team orders? .... hehehe. Probably not. If the German "super" team how they call it, would come into reality, then certainly Schumacher would never agree on a 2nd driver status.

But who will tell? ... Who can say that Bernie doesn't double his whatever salary he is going to get, just for him to come back into F1, ... or triple, or give him other extra's what could help him steal another title or at least many wins.....

Who will tell/ ....
Group B
QUOTE (Frans @ Dec 11 2009, 19:34) *
Schumacher NEVER drove without TC against a level field in F1. HE loves to cheat, to have somthing on / in his car what others don't have, it's his edge he NEEDS to achieve wins.

He used it while everyone else in the field was driving WITHOUT it, which gave him an edge in the rain and in other races as well (preserving more of the tires and stuff) over the rest of the field.

It was totally unfair, but he has one his 1st title this way, and many at Ferrari this way as well. His Renault powered title was probably the most legal one he ever won (but needed to cheat in other ways anyway still).

So, Schumacher's biggest problem would be in 2010 in a F1 car, is to simply be FAST in it. He would suck, he would stink he would be the Muppet of the F1 circus. He knows this and he needs big help from Jean Todts new position in the sport, and Brawn's genius to come up with the new tricks he always needed. KERS, he never drove it, doesn't know it and will have a dissadvantage there as well. The new point system, it's no suprise of course, has been in the making by Michael Schumacher and Jean Todt since they were still active in the Ferrari pitstreet.

He has now to curve the "Mercedes annouces it's 2nd driver" feeling the media created.....
Schumacher, ... 2nd driver in a team in F1? ...
Is Mercedes like McLaren? 2 cars, 2 drivers both equal equipment and no team orders? .... hehehe. Probably not. If the German "super" team how they call it, would come into reality, then certainly Schumacher would never agree on a 2nd driver status.

But who will tell? ... Who can say that Bernie doesn't double his whatever salary he is going to get, just for him to come back into F1, ... or triple, or give him other extra's what could help him steal another title or at least many wins.....

Who will tell/ ....

yawnface.gif
carbonfibre
QUOTE (WebBerK @ Dec 11 2009, 16:03) *
I think it is an unproper time for Schumy to come back.

Rubens reported that MS doesn't save his tires, he uses to worn them out since the start and then try to hang on the whole race with it.
Without TC, I'm really doubt MS can do it without a massive change in driving style.
The first stint with full tanks will be very important in the race.

However, after seeing the Desafio das Estrelas kart challenge, all the Formula guys came ahead and MS seemed to have saved better his equipment to the end.

Du no... ohwell.gif \
Well we all saw how well Rubens did against Michael back in 2005 when you had to use 1 tyre the entire race.....

O wait he got beaten even worse then normal.wink.gif I think Michael was one of the best in saving his equipment.
Markio
I think someone needs a hug kiss.gif
WebBerK
QUOTE (carbonfibre @ Dec 11 2009, 18:46) *
Well we all saw how well Rubens did against Michael back in 2005 when you had to use 1 tyre the entire race.....

Didn't know Ferrari build monocycles tongue.gif

Don't get me wrong, MS showed amazing driving skills with this tactic, but I question if it will work w/o TC.
But I also said MS is capable of changing.
rog
QUOTE (Frans @ Dec 11 2009, 20:34) *
KERS, he never drove it, doesn't know it and will have a dissadvantage there as well.



There is no KERS next year.
Kompressor
I wouldn't mind if Villeneuve joined Mercedes but I would hate it if Schumacher signed up. It seems like Mercedes are looking for experience.
Frans
more wishing for Villeneuve then mr Chin.....
ZZMS
QUOTE (Kompressor @ Dec 11 2009, 13:42) *
I wouldn't mind if Villeneuve joined Mercedes but I would hate it if Schumacher signed up. It seems like Mercedes are looking for experience.


I take it you're not a fan of Mercedes?wink.gif
Dragonfly
Well, those people, Brits BTW, must know something about driving and MS's driving style without TC.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uk2p2nRK-p4
One
QUOTE (Dragonfly @ Dec 12 2009, 00:22) *
Well, those people, Brits BTW, must know something about driving and MS's driving style without TC.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uk2p2nRK-p4


was this particular Benetton, was this on sale recently? smile.gif
Kenaltgr
QUOTE (carbonfibre @ Dec 11 2009, 20:46) *
Well we all saw how well Rubens did against Michael back in 2005 when you had to use 1 tyre the entire race.....

O wait he got beaten even worse then normal.;) I think Michael was one of the best in saving his equipment.


The schumacher fanboys are still bitter at Rubens for saying the truth about 2000-2005. The more problems Ferrari had with a car the more support Schumacher got over Rubens. 2005 being a case when Rubens was treated even less than an afterthought.

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