my rating of kubica is incomplete at the moment. From what i've seen from him I think he would be great if he had a winning car. His consitency is at Alonso's level much better than Vettel. I would also take kubica over Button - but that's just a gut feeling and opinion from what i've seen from the two drivers.

Really? Couldn't it mean that Kimi was simply overrated? I thought Massa looked very good in 2008 and the beginning of 2009, but I can't shake the feeling that Kimi and Ferrari was just a bad fit that couldn't maximize his performance.

Massa is very popular on this board, which is great for him, but take away the emotion and it's hard to understand. In his seven seasons in F1, he's outscored his teammate only twice. He's had VERY good teammates, but if was really a top tier driver he'd have won another one or two of those. I doubt there is a team principal that would take Massa over Button if they were presented with such a choice.

Hehe, and in fact Kimi has better results from his time at Ferrari compared to Massa... but hey people don't let that disturb your mind ommm ommm

LOL. I guess he can say whatever he wants now and people will just chalk it up to the head injury. Could turn out to be a sweet deal for him!

Anyway, my ranking is

Alonso
Hamilton
Button
Raikkonen

I think Raikkonen turned out to be a bit of a traction control specialist. I still rank him higher than any non-champion, though.

what are you smoking?

yeah, it's completely the oppositte.

Huh. I notice a lot of support for him here. Sure, there are plenty of people that don't like him, but it seems about 50/50 to me.

Yeah I think he has a lot of support. He's not as popular as Lewis, Kimi or Fernando are. But he is one of the most popular drivers in F1.

He's a bit of a funny man when he speaks and I guess I am not alone when I don't take him very seriously. But I recognise many people do seem to like him a lot. It's just a matter of preference isn't it.

This is the kind of post which makes me even more anxious to see racing starting again, it cant start soon enough, if you ask me.

I am already rolling on the floor laughing out loud when I think all those excuses Alonso fans will come up with after they found out that Massa isnt going to be number two and he even dares to keep beating Alonso on regular bases. Hah.

Fernando isnt exactly popular anywhere if I have understood it correct (except in Spain, ofcourse). He just have some Spanish fans who make so much noise out of nothing in order to make everyone believe Alonso is best driver out there, they would also like us to believe that Alonso is best driver and has biggest amount of fans all over the world.

Button had the hype and results when he came into F1. But he made some career choices that lead him to tier two. Is it reality or illusion? I dont know where Button stands today. Why? He hasnt been in a top team since 2009. Thats exactly why it would be a good thing to wait two seasons before trashing his bottom.

When he starts winning for Ferrari, he will have the biggest amount of fans all over the world.

if he gets beaten by Massa so be it.. The excuses are mostly expressed by Kimi fans.

for sure everyone in the paddock must be Spanish then..

Maybe some stats would change your mind. Jenson had an average 'MS score' versus Rubens if you count whole season.

Before Button signed up to take on Hamilton, the Alonso vs. Massa intra-team battle was the one we were all most curious about. While it's been relegated to the undercard somewhat, it's still quite intriguing. If Massa equals or beats Alonso he simply must be considered top tier. No doubt about it. We're going to find out whether Alonso really learned from his experience at McLaren, because if he can't get the guys behind him it might get difficult for him to beat Felipe.

My gut feeling is that he has that covered this time, and will do what he needs to do. Massa will still have his days when he's ahead, but I predict he will play Barrichello to Alonso's Button in 2010.

The bigger fear for Alonso is if the car isn't up to snuff. We all expect McLaren to get it together for next year based on the progress they made this year (the whole Flo-vis saga where they clearly didn't understand the problem all the way to a very competitive car). Many of us expect them to come out of the gate fastest. But I have my doubts about Ferrari and whether they can produce a WCC-level car a few years removed from the Ross Brawn era. If I had to guess I would say no - I expect them to be behind McLaren, Red Bull and Mercedes. That means wins will be very hard to come by for Fernando, which will add pressure. That said, such a scenario should help him against Massa, who is more of a Damon Hill type that can dominate from the front but sometimes struggles in the pack.

I still think the Alonso/Massa pairing is the one with the most potential for fireworks. It's going to be fun waiting to see who throws their toys first.

Can't argue with you on that one. There will be fireworks one way or another. These two guys don't hold their tongues very well.

I do not agree on that - hard to predict, but I believe that Ferrari will have a car capable of winning WDC next year.

Have only read the first page, but this is why I respect Button for going to McLaren and giving it a crack.

Brawn were upset by his loss btw, they won't let him test (or use simulator) until the contract expires. Always a sign of unhappy departure. A friendly parting lets the driver get familiar with his new team even before the contract ends. Williams let Webber do this for example in 2006 offseason.

Button's reputation is like this probably throughout the paddock. Massa is just more honest (out spoken) about it. If Button can go into McLaren and match Lewis, then his stock will rise a great deal. It's really the only way he can do it, if Button beat Lewis on track in 2010 in different teams, people would blame the car. This way it's a fair fight. If you consider back in 2008 Button daring Lewis to race him in triathalon because they couldn't have a fair fight on track.. Button's done very well for himself in the last 12 months. He could fail at McLaren but at least he is dreaming big and giving it a go.

I've never rated Button's smooth style. It's a stupid crappy marketting term to seperate him from the rest. It doesn't make him better or worse, it's just a different style. It's like if one person is really tall and the other is really short. They are both good in different areas, the tall guy better in basketball for example, the shorter guy better at soccer/futbol. I've always preferred more aggressive styles, sometimes it ends in misery but it's more exciting to watch and the drivers appear more fearless. But on the days of a hot track with a long stint, Button can shine more. Forgetting styles, Button is a good accurate driver with good racecraft and has a WDC in the cabinent. You know with Button he's not going to chuck it into the wall. If he beats Lewis it won't be because of his style, it will be because he is a good driver.

People think that Button's WDC isn't as good because he had the best or most reliable car. What did Alonso have in 05/06? What did Schumacher have in earlier years? What did Lewis have in 2008? Even if it wasn't the best car it was top 2 with a BIG gap to the rest. Oh but those guys beat the best guys in the other top car? They were only considered the best guys because they drove top cars in previous years. Alonso and Kubica were considered top guys but were anyonomous in 09 because of the car. Massa was nowhere until he drove for Ferrari, and after 2 years is considered a top driver. Webber and Vettel will go into 2010 considered top drivers. Fisi and Kovi are the only two in recent history who have failed while in a top car. There is something else about Button's WDC which was impressive as well. In 07 and 08, there was 2 top cars and then a big gap to the rest. On a bad day they could still come 3rd or 5th if a BMW got in between them. On a bad day in 2009, you would be lucky to score a point or two because the field was so close. In 2007 and 2008 for most races, Ferrari and McLaren were only racing each other. In 2009, it was changing so much, Brawn were racing Toyota one race, Ferrari the next race, McLaren the next race. Even Force India popped some surprises. Brawn were quickest in the first half of the season, but Redbull weren't second. They was Toyota, Williams, and a Ferrari or McLaren on some tracks. When Redbull were quickest after Silverstone, Brawn wasn't 2nd best teams they were back in the midfield and Kimi and Lewis were stealing points. It was a very unpredictable season.

But Button's an easy target because he had never won a race in a straight fight before - I'm a huge fan and even I will admit that he lucked into his Hungary 2006 victory. A lot of people keep saying that Button is an unworthy champion because he didn't win a single race between Turkey and his sealing the title in Brazil (and I bet that if he won every race, people would complain about that in equal measures, too). But guess what? All of the races count towards the championship. And I might add that JB was the only driver to score points in every race he finished - and if Grosjean hadn't wiped him out in Belgium, he probably would have picked up some there, too. How is he unworthy when he was clearly the best driver in 2009? People look upon Kimi Riakkonen as if he's some kind of god who could win on a race on a scooter - but how is he more worthy than Button when he was finishing down in tenth and lower?

Racing drivers only criticize other drivers they fear ,especially British drivers , who despite being so called inferior winners seem to win a lot of Championships .Its called gamesmanship .Massa fears Button otherwise he wouldnt open his mouth.Didnt see Massa pulling off any miracles in that Ferrari this year .