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kar
At the end of the day, things wont change much, which is not a bad thing really (despite my moaning). The main thing that is important is the circuit itself which is without question one of the best circuits in F1 (despite the nature of it not suiting overtaking with modern cars).

So as long as the BRDC can pay the bills it should be all okay.
Owen
up.gif Well done Damon up.gif
undersquare
QUOTE (Suzy @ Dec 7 2009, 11:13) *
Not quite. They forced Bernie to back down on amound of compound interest being paid. Bernie's tried to make it look as if it was all his idea but I think you'll find that wasn't necessarily the case.


James Allen says £12m rising to £16.8 by 2015, that's a 7% compound escalator. Then a break clause for 2019.

Are those correct? Or does the escalator change after 2015?
Slowinfastout
up.gif
Suzy
QUOTE (undersquare @ Dec 7 2009, 13:47) *
James Allen says £12m rising to £16.8 by 2015, that's a 7% compound escalator. Then a break clause for 2019.

Are those correct? Or does the escalator change after 2015?


It should be 5% and not 7%.

undersquare
QUOTE (Suzy @ Dec 7 2009, 13:53) *
It should be 5% and not 7%.


Ah up.gif that was my wild guess. That's £15.3m in 2015 and saves a very spendable £60m over the 17 years cool.gif .
stevvy1986
Hill mentions in the Q&A on the Autosport website that as the facilities improve, people will still (in his opinion) be prepared to pay higher prices for it (knowing what British motorsport fans are like, he's probably right, we almost always sell out Silverstone, and if you look at any sport, if you move somewhere with better facilities/improve your facilities you do pay more for that, and people in this country do seem to be prepared to pay extra for improved quality/facilities).
Snap Matt
I think we'd actually continually pay higher and higher prices even if the facilities started rusting away to scrap. It's the only F1 race we can visit without a passport. If you want to see the cars in person it's the easiest way to do it for most of the UK.

In my experience it isn't much cheaper or the facilities much better, if at all, at other races I've been to. Monaco, Montreal and Spa all cost a fortune just for tickets and provision for the paying public is basic even compared to Silverstone. Of course, a programme or item of other merchandising that costs £10 at Silverstone costs €10 on the continent and $10 on the other side of the Atlantic, but my attitude is that I'm there to watch the cars, not to go shopping.
EVO2
QUOTE (Snap Matt @ Dec 7 2009, 14:49) *
If you want to see the cars in person it's the easiest way to do it for most of the UK.


No it's not : Go to Goodwood Festival of Speed and see the cars, the drivers and all the guys working on them from a distance of less than 5m - and see them in action on the hill.

You also see a selection of other machinery old and new that you simply will never see anywhere else in the world.

And because it's not run by Bernie, you can easily afford a ticket.

As for the GP, watch it on TV - you always know what's going on and you see all the action close up.

kar
QUOTE (stevvy1986 @ Dec 7 2009, 14:21) *
Hill mentions in the Q&A on the Autosport website that as the facilities improve, people will still (in his opinion) be prepared to pay higher prices for it (knowing what British motorsport fans are like, he's probably right, we almost always sell out Silverstone, and if you look at any sport, if you move somewhere with better facilities/improve your facilities you do pay more for that, and people in this country do seem to be prepared to pay extra for improved quality/facilities).


Prices have gone up a fair bit, like a lot of things did in the UK from 2004-2009. However with the tax rises and borrowing cost hikes that are coming next year, I'm not sure people are going to be able to fork out half a grand to go to a motor race.
Demo.
QUOTE (pgj @ Dec 7 2009, 11:11) *
In some respects I am very happy that the British GP has been saved. Along with other posters, I am concerned that Silverstone has bitten off a little too much. We will just have to trust the deal makers at the BRDC. There was some talk if Silverstone 'twinning' with the Abu Dhabi circuit to provide services, training and consultancy. Maybe some funding will come from this kind of association.

Now can we have a rescue package for Donington please Bernie? You have contributed to an act of wanton vandalism that has robbed local club racing of its Wembley, how about a cash donation that will help rescue the circuit? Donington cannot even make money from its GP Collection. It is 'closed until further notice'. Thank you Bernie.


Do you really think it was Bernie rather than a greedy Simon Gillett that caused the whole fiasco.
Heres a clue if SG had not got greedy do you think Donnington would be in the mess its in now?
I suggest its your clear bias rather than any sort of fact that makes you post such a silly comment.
But its great my local track has secured the rights to the British GP and for atleast 10 years with the right to extend to 17.
And for the bashers of the cvc looks like a deal was cut as the escalator is down from 7 to 5%.
I still think thats steep far too steep but it shows in the end they were more intrested in keeping the BGP than making the maximum amount of money which of course would have been to sell the spot on the calendar to a government back race in some far off country.
Red 5
Great news Silverstone will have the F1 for at least 10 years but I cant help thinking all will not be rosy and the escalator will come back to bite them mid way through.
Snap Matt
QUOTE (EVO2 @ Dec 7 2009, 15:01) *
No it's not : Go to Goodwood Festival of Speed and see the cars, the drivers and all the guys working on them from a distance of less than 5m - and see them in action on the hill.

You also see a selection of other machinery old and new that you simply will never see anywhere else in the world.

And because it's not run by Bernie, you can easily afford a ticket.

As for the GP, watch it on TV - you always know what's going on and you see all the action close up.

Even Goodwood won't work under the current regulations if you want to see the current year's cars running, but you would certainly see other things that you just will never get at a Grand Prix. Personally I'm happy to pay the extra £200 for the spectacle of the whole grid starting the race. While it isn't cheap, it doesn't feel like wasted money.
Tenmantaylor
Happy to hear this at last. Bernie says he's happy. Is he happy at the roundabout way its comeabout? Did Doningtons finances falling through help Silverstone get a better deal in the end or was Bernie really willing to pull it? I hope Damon and the BRDC got what they were asking for monetarily.
Buttoneer
QUOTE (kar @ Dec 7 2009, 15:07) *
Prices have gone up a fair bit, like a lot of things did in the UK from 2004-2009. However with the tax rises and borrowing cost hikes that are coming next year, I'm not sure people are going to be able to fork out half a grand to go to a motor race.

There will be some who might normally spend on an away trip who will go for the home race instead. Maybe enough to make up the void.
robracer
QUOTE (Tenmantaylor @ Dec 7 2009, 17:03) *
Happy to hear this at last. Bernie says he's happy. Is he happy at the roundabout way its comeabout? Did Doningtons finances falling through help Silverstone get a better deal in the end or was Bernie really willing to pull it? I hope Damon and the BRDC got what they were asking for monetarily.


Who cares about that, at least there is a british gp next year and for 17 years. clap.gif
Clatter
QUOTE (stevvy1986 @ Dec 7 2009, 14:21) *
Hill mentions in the Q&A on the Autosport website that as the facilities improve, people will still (in his opinion) be prepared to pay higher prices for it (knowing what British motorsport fans are like, he's probably right, we almost always sell out Silverstone, and if you look at any sport, if you move somewhere with better facilities/improve your facilities you do pay more for that, and people in this country do seem to be prepared to pay extra for improved quality/facilities).


Has anyone actually asked the fans if they want to pay more? Personally I'm happy with the current facilities and would rather see the costs stay down.

It isn't so much that people are prepared to pay more, but the only choice is take it or leave it. Football grounds are nice and comfortable these days, but for me the price is prohibitive and there is no way I can afford to take my kids, plus no matter how nice the facilities are it's the actual show that counts.
Clatter
QUOTE (Demo. @ Dec 7 2009, 15:11) *
Do you really think it was Bernie rather than a greedy Simon Gillett that caused the whole fiasco.
Heres a clue if SG had not got greedy do you think Donnington would be in the mess its in now?
I suggest its your clear bias rather than any sort of fact that makes you post such a silly comment.
But its great my local track has secured the rights to the British GP and for atleast 10 years with the right to extend to 17.
And for the bashers of the cvc looks like a deal was cut as the escalator is down from 7 to 5%.
I still think thats steep far too steep but it shows in the end they were more intrested in keeping the BGP than making the maximum amount of money which of course would have been to sell the spot on the calendar to a government back race in some far off country.


If Bernie had done proper due diligence it would have been obvious the Gillett could not fund the GP. It's not a hindsight thing either, as many of us questioned the finances from the moment it was announced.
BullHead
clap.gif The set is complete now for 2010 - Come on!!! Better save my pennies now. I'm doing copse this year.
Burai
QUOTE (EVO2 @ Dec 7 2009, 13:18) *
As it's a 17 year deal I would really like to know what is in the agreement after 2012.

Has Bernie ensured that the BRDC can't host a re-named FOTA series if the teams decide to walk away from FOM ?

I hope not.


Jesus, you don't honestly still believe that a breakaway could ever happen do you?
stevvy1986
QUOTE (Clatter @ Dec 7 2009, 17:39) *
Has anyone actually asked the fans if they want to pay more? Personally I'm happy with the current facilities and would rather see the costs stay down.


That's all good and well, but we know that Bernie has had it in for Silverstone for many years, and he'll have insisted on improved facilities.
Clatter
QUOTE (stevvy1986 @ Dec 7 2009, 18:41) *
That's all good and well, but we know that Bernie has had it in for Silverstone for many years, and he'll have insisted on improved facilities.


Not for the fans he won't, just the names and hangers on.
Muz Bee
QUOTE (Clatter @ Dec 8 2009, 00:33) *
I don't think they would have put pen to paper if they thought it would leave them in trouble.

I would have said "I don't think they would sign if there was no chance they could break even"!

This (BRDC) is an organisation which exists primarily to see motorsport flourish - there's nothing wrong with that. But I see trouble ahead with arguments like

ticket prices are prohibitive for the average British family
the British Government need to be supporting this event in it's hour of greatest peril
Bernie is milking the sport for his own greed

In other words, little change. The 17 year deal may sound like security but I would queston who has the security - the BRDC or Bernie? Isn't it obvious that this a deal which is a no-lose for BE? If they fall over in the pursuit of escalating fees, he still has all the options, the BRDC are toast.

The fees start at ridiculous level and get worse and the income potential is marginal. I wish them well, I really do, but it can't be assumed the British GP is safe. For 2010 it is, beyond that, we are likely to be having similar conversations.
wave.gif
JPW
QUOTE (Muz Bee @ Dec 7 2009, 22:36) *
In other words, little change. The 17 year deal may sound like security but I would queston who has the security - the BRDC or Bernie? Isn't it obvious that this a deal which is a no-lose for BE? If they fall over in the pursuit of escalating fees, he still has all the options, the BRDC are toast.

The fees start at ridiculous level and get worse and the income potential is marginal. I wish them well, I really do, but it can't be assumed the British GP is safe. For 2010 it is, beyond that, we are likely to be having similar conversations.

At last a realist Bernie runs no risk at all, if the BRDC can't cough up as per contract he'll axe them immediately and if they can he'll axe them at the 10 year breakoff point and ask a higher price.

So yes the GP is safe for 2010 and maybe 2011 but after that confused.gif
Demo.
QUOTE (Clatter @ Dec 7 2009, 17:41) *
If Bernie had done proper due diligence it would have been obvious the Gillett could not fund the GP. It's not a hindsight thing either, as many of us questioned the finances from the moment it was announced.


I agree with you as regards the funding but the simple fact is it was Simon Gillett who went to the FIA not the other way round.
It was SG who was telling everyone he would be able to sort out the money.
and lets not forget as most moaned about here it was the FIA who kept on giving him more time to sort it out.
In the end whether you like it or not the reason for the whole stupid mess was SG trying to get the BGP if he had not been so greedy this would never have happened and while we are at it lets not forget that its also the FIA who have disregarded the massive fines they could have applied for his breach of contract. Don't you think that in some ways is trying to help what is left of the mess that is Donnington and trying to ensure whoever takes it over in the end has a better chance of being able to restore a once great track back towards its former glory days?
Demo.
QUOTE (Muz Bee @ Dec 7 2009, 21:36) *
I would have said "I don't think they would sign if there was no chance they could break even"!

This (BRDC) is an organisation which exists primarily to see motorsport flourish - there's nothing wrong with that. But I see trouble ahead with arguments like

ticket prices are prohibitive for the average British family
the British Government need to be supporting this event in it's hour of greatest peril
Bernie is milking the sport for his own greed

In other words, little change. The 17 year deal may sound like security but I would queston who has the security - the BRDC or Bernie? Isn't it obvious that this a deal which is a no-lose for BE? If they fall over in the pursuit of escalating fees, he still has all the options, the BRDC are toast.

The fees start at ridiculous level and get worse and the income potential is marginal. I wish them well, I really do, but it can't be assumed the British GP is safe. For 2010 it is, beyond that, we are likely to be having similar conversations.
wave.gif


Muz Bee i would agree with you if you take just the GP in isolation but that happily for most f1 and also MGP fans is not the case.
When you add in the fact of that little thing called motogp all of a sudden you have to look at economics of scale.
Now the improvements the BRDC and Silverstone are doing are not just for one event a year they are for two.
Yes the prices still rise and yes we still end up paying more each year but i dont see it as you see it in isolation.
Also lets not forget if the new layout gets the FIA approval i am certain that will end up with the ability for even more fans to see the race live and at the home of motor racing clap.gif clap.gif clap.gif
It wont be easy and a lot of traders will see their licence fees shoot up but i dont see it as all doom and gloom as some here only seam to be able to see with anything to do with F1.
For now lets just be happy we know we have a gp and its at the right track.
The BRDC are not fools IMHO stupid maybe fools never
Ensign
Bernie is the winner, again

QUOTE
...Deadlines appear to mean little to Ecclestone perhaps because, having total dominion over grand prix racing, he can do what he likes. He controls not just the venues but the world championship calendar. If he wants to allocate Silverstone a race for a waterlogged April weekend, as in 2000, which caused untold but utterly predictable inconvenience to tens of thousands, he can just go ahead.

And it could happen again. The 2010 race is fixed in the calendar for the date on which the World Cup final is due to be played – an unmissable appointment with the television for many people who would not want to take the risk of extricating themselves from Silverstone's car parks in time for the kick-off. The date of the match in Johannesburg was established a considerable time before Ecclestone sat down with next year's Formula One diary, and it would have been easy to plan around it. Perhaps the date can still be changed. As things stand, however, it could be another bargaining chip.

Amid the general mood of rejoicing, no one was giving much thought to that at the BRDC lunch. But there has already been collateral damage from Ecclestone's decision to give a long-term deal for the grand prix to Donington Park and then withdraw it when – again, very predictably – the promoters failed to raise the money for essential improvements.

A partially excavated Donington now lies unusable even to the local racers who held their meetings there. So the sum total of British tracks has effectively been reduced by one – unless a saviour comes up with the million quid or so required to restore the circuit to its earlier state. In the present economic conditions, that may be asking the impossible. As for Silverstone, it is hard to put much credence in the suggestion that Ecclestone's attitude was softened by the prompting of Jean Todt, the newly elected president of the FIA, the international motor sport federation, who is said to have emphasised the historical importance of the British grand prix. Todt is to the tradition and romance of motor sport as Kate Moss is to cream buns.

The whole farrago is irresistibly reminiscent of the events of almost a decade ago, when Ecclestone tried to double Silverstone's race fee. Turned down by the BRDC, he gave Nicola Foulston, the owner of Brands Hatch, a 16-year deal to hold the grand prix. On the strength of that contract she sold her company to Octagon, a US-based leisure group, and left for a new life in Switzerland with a cheque for £30m.

When it proved predictably – sorry to keep using the word – impossible to redevelop the Kentish circuit, Octagon discovered that even agreeing a deal for them to run the race at Silverstone would not be a paying proposition. With a contract to honour, it was forced into an exit strategy that cost it a further fortune – £27m to the BRDC and $90m to Ecclestone's Formula One Administration.

Britain's legion of motor racing enthusiasts will be celebrating yesterday's good news. But the BRDC would be wise to remember that, for Bernie Ecclestone, one deal is always just a step on the path to another.


Captain Tightpants
I think his point is not that Silverstone stuck it to the man and won, but that Ecclestone got his way and that there will be costs associated with it.
Demo.
i think i answered that with the hope that as some missed that its not just about one race now
With MGP too its two races sharing the same common costs.
In the end i hope those costs will be shared by two sets of fans and in the end both get more but for less of a ticket price increase each.
But i could be wrong BRDC could shove it to each of us twice but i hope not.
WorldChampion
OMG, THEY ARE MICKEY MOUSING THE SILVERSTONE TRACK!!!!!!

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/80477
Clatter
QUOTE (WorldChampion @ Dec 8 2009, 08:29) *
OMG, THEY ARE MICKEY MOUSING THE SILVERSTONE TRACK!!!!!!

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/80477


No their not.
WorldChampion
QUOTE (Clatter @ Dec 8 2009, 09:32) *
No their not.


read between the lines, they say they will use the INFIELD section. do you know how twisty infields are?
Ali_G
Weren't they planning those changes at least 5 years ago.
Snap Matt
Another year, another tier of grandstands added to confuse the situation. Gold ticket holders can roam within the three gold stands for the first two days (big deal). Platinum ticket holders can roam within the Platinum stands, and presumably slum it in gold too. The new Platinum plus stand has a fixed seat for all three days - does that mean they don't want you roaming off, say, to watch quali from the pit lane stands? The description makes it sound like you pay more but get less.
stevvy1986
QUOTE (WorldChampion @ Dec 8 2009, 08:40) *
read between the lines, they say they will use the INFIELD section. do you know how twisty infields are?


That's not a Mickey Mouse section, and you're just assuming the infield will be mega twisty. Look at it. It isn't a Mickey Mouse section, or full of horrible slow twists and turns. It has a fast right left, a couple of corners you'd expect to see on most tracks in terms of the degree and so won't be terriby quick but that's no big deal, and a long straight before connecting back up with what we know as the current layout. If that's Mickey Mouse and terribly twisty, I'd dread to think what you'd call Indianapolis then.
One
QUOTE (Ali_G @ Dec 8 2009, 09:55) *
Weren't they planning those changes at least 5 years ago.




I guess so, or at least three years a go. 2006, doest this sounds right? I thought they had abandoned the initial plan to sell piece of ground for developer.


Never the less, the arena track looks great, cool.gif , and I hope that BrDC will built HUGE grand stand there for 20000 more audiences...
Buttoneer
QUOTE (Ali_G @ Dec 8 2009, 08:55) *
Weren't they planning those changes at least 5 years ago.

Yup.

Tilke drew up a plan which created a much wider arrowhead into the circuit from the same point. This liberated land to be used as tech and industrial centres right where the best access roads were and existing industrial areas. It was a smart idea. Another set of architects came up with a different idea which used a long Malaysia-style hairpin coming in from the Stowe end of the circuit, utilising the runways.

At the time, for developers, serious money was up for grabs with the potential for mega-casino's etc too. These days the numbers are nowhere near as good.
Clatter
QUOTE (WorldChampion @ Dec 8 2009, 08:40) *
read between the lines, they say they will use the INFIELD section. do you know how twisty infields are?


Have you even bothered to look at the plans?
One
QUOTE (Buttoneer @ Dec 8 2009, 11:33) *
These days the numbers are nowhere near as good.



The time will come, like five years after? It is no problem when you look at the longer plan. Keeping it as the vacant ground as long as possible gives move value, at least at this point of time.
wewantourdarbyback
QUOTE (WorldChampion @ Dec 8 2009, 08:40) *
read between the lines, they say they will use the INFIELD section. do you know how twisty infields are?


Not a fan of Rallycross then?
wewantourdarbyback
QUOTE (One @ Dec 8 2009, 11:10) *
The time will come, like five years after?


Considering the governments plan to allow megacasinos in certain areas has fallen by the wayside, I'm pretty sure it won't.
Conny_Mary
Wonderful news! clap.gif clap.gif
17years up.gif
kar
Interesting, last British Grand Prix I went to was in 2006. Cost me £99 for the 3 days. _Advance_ tickets now for the same ticket are on sale for £117.

I'd hate to see what the full price GA weekend tickets are costing then!
kar
Managed to check, full weekend price, GA is £130.
stevvy1986
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/80489

Just under 6500 tickets sold in 24 hours. That's pretty good going considering it's coming upto christmas and there's been uncertainty for so long.
kar
QUOTE (stevvy1986 @ Dec 8 2009, 17:12) *
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/80489

Just under 6500 tickets sold in 24 hours. That's pretty good going considering it's coming upto christmas and there's been uncertainty for so long.


That's a lot to do with pent up demand though.

What will be telling is the January sales.
BullHead
Bloody hell boys and girls, leave a couple for me!
robracer
Silverstone to use new track for 2010 GP
Brawn BGP 001
QUOTE (robracer @ Feb 11 2010, 14:40) *

Good news up.gif

I was never a fan of the Priory complex.
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