Help - Search - Members - Calendar
Full Version: Renault 2010 (merged)
The AUTOSPORT Bulletin Board > Forums > Racing Comments
Pages: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37, 38, 39, 40, 41, 42, 43, 44, 45, 46, 47, 48, 49, 50, 51, 52, 53, 54, 55, 56, 57, 58, 59, 60, 61, 62, 63, 64, 65, 66, 67, 68, 69, 70, 71, 72, 73, 74, 75, 76, 77, 78, 79, 80, 81, 82, 83, 84, 85, 86, 87, 88, 89, 90, 91, 92, 93, 94, 95, 96, 97, 98, 99, 100, 101, 102, 103, 104, 105, 106, 107, 108, 109, 110, 111, 112, 113, 114, 115, 116, 117, 118, 119, 120, 121, 122, 123, 124, 125, 126, 127, 128, 129, 130, 131, 132, 133, 134, 135, 136, 137, 138, 139, 140, 141, 142, 143, 144, 145, 146, 147, 148, 149, 150, 151, 152, 153, 154, 155, 156, 157, 158, 159, 160, 161, 162, 163, 164, 165, 166, 167, 168, 169, 170, 171, 172, 173, 174, 175, 176, 177, 178, 179, 180, 181, 182, 183, 184, 185, 186, 187, 188, 189, 190, 191, 192, 193, 194, 195, 196
bankoq
It never looked very promising for me, but that's just my opinion.
eREr
QUOTE (TURU @ Feb 28 2010, 11:04) *
Well, you can't know it, but there have to be some huge changes to the car, because I suppose that changing front wing does not take 2 hours rolleyes.gif


The car should be prepared for the next day during the evening and if it is needed during the night and not when the car should be on the track. If the setup of the car was wrong 3rd times in a row, then either the quality of the engineers are not the best or the car is a dog and unpredictable.
PompousJester
It doesn't look good.
Let's wait a little bit longer.
Buttoneer
Please restrict testing discussion to the testing thread or live chat.
barteks
At last!



Metal
So long for the new wing frown.gif
bankoq
Certainly no new wings and nose cone.
korzeniow
Competition of who first will post picture of Reno's new nose just started smile.gif GO GO GO
RF1 fan
According to RMC,new diffusor at Bahrain.
New braking system at Barcelona,drivers are happy now.The team didn't want to change the system but Eric Bouiller forced the team to change the system.
eREr
QUOTE (RF1 fan @ Feb 28 2010, 13:03) *
According to RMC,new diffusor at Bahrain.
New braking system at Barcelona,drivers are happy now.The team didn't want to change the system but Eric Bouiller forced the team to change the system.


Good news! smile.gif If this braking problem is finally solved this way, then the limited running in the last couple of days is more acceptable.
Carlo's
QUOTE (RF1 fan @ Feb 28 2010, 13:03) *
According to RMC,new diffusor at Bahrain.
New braking system at Barcelona,drivers are happy now.The team didn't want to change the system but Eric Bouiller forced the team to change the system.


Give me link RF1 up.gif

Where is the new FW frown.gif
korzeniow
QUOTE (Carlo's @ Feb 28 2010, 13:08) *
Where is the new FW frown.gif


In the garage, I suppose.
Carlo's
korzeniow, I suppose you didn't understand me properly. I want to win your competition cat.gif

Interesting that team didn't want to change the brake system but Boullier insisted on it.
bankoq
That's strange because Renault insider said braking problems are BS. Somebody's lying here.

Or maybe we have misunderstanding and they haven't changed braking pedal settings to Kubica's liking until Barcelona (which is strange as the problem was known from the very first day of Valencia test).
RF1 fan
QUOTE (Carlo's @ Feb 28 2010, 13:08) *
Give me link RF1 up.gif

Where is the new FW frown.gif



There is no link just look there tonight :http://www.rmc.fr/podcast/podcast.php?id=42

It's in french radio show.
barteks
QUOTE (Carlo's @ Feb 28 2010, 13:08) *
Give me link RF1 up.gif

RMC = Radio Monte Carlo wave.gif
RF1 fan
QUOTE (bankoq @ Feb 28 2010, 13:15) *
That's strange because polish insider from Renault said braking problems are BS. Somebody's lying here.

Or maybe we have misunderstanding and they haven't changed braking pedal settings to Kubica's liking only until Barcelona (which is strange as the problem was known from the very first day of Valencia test).



Yeah it's the pedal system.
bankoq
Why did they have to wait with this issue till Barcelona? It was known from Valencia.
barteks
QUOTE
RF1: And what about today? Well, the sun has come out and it’s warming up nicely. But it has been a slow start to the day as the car had technical issues after the install lap, which had to be fixed. So we’ve been in the garage for almost the entire morning. Now the problem is solved Robert will get on with the set-up programme and try out our new front wing for the first time. So it’s gonna be a busy afternoon.


rolleyes.gif
bankoq
No new FW on the pictures so far, but afternoon session has just started.
korzeniow
New front wing:

http://twitpic.com/15ud2h

Am I first?

Nosecone looksthe same. But let's wait for better pictures.
barteks
Great to take shot of the front wing from the rear of the car cat.gif
Captain Tightpants
QUOTE (korzeniow @ Mar 1 2010, 00:08) *
Nosecone looksthe same. But let's wait for better pictures.

You can actually see the nosecone?
korzeniow
QUOTE (barteks @ Feb 28 2010, 14:10) *
Great to take shot of the front wing from the rear of the car cat.gif


Still, it's the best what we have at themoment.

QUOTE (Captain Tightpants @ Feb 28 2010, 14:11) *
You can actually see the nosecone?


Part of it.
barteks
A bit zoomed in photo:

barteks
Google translated:

QUOTE
The Renault F1 R30 could be fitted with a diffuser says ''extreme''if one believes Stephane Samson, a journalist at RMC. It will be available at the Bahrain Grand Prix, with the arrival of the new package expected on the French car.

The broadcaster, however, could create controversy, since according to CMJ, Renault could be summoned by the FIA in two weeks to justify the validity of this element vis-à-vis the Regulation 2010.

Furthermore, still according to French radio, Robert Kubica and Vitaly Petrov has requested a modification of the brake pedal. A change imposed by Eric Boullier, despite the reluctance of engineers on this point, still relied on the preferences of Fernando Alonso.


http://translate.google.fr/translate?hl=fr...ault.fr/?id=552
korzeniow
Kubica is doing race simulation. He made 18 laps with 1m26s, now he is making 1m25s times. He made 34 laps already.
korzeniow


Nosecone is the same.

Changes aren't so big.
bankoq
More photos here: http://motorsport.nextgen-auto.com/gallery...D=68&page=6

There's a picture with new FW, and then there are pictures with old one. I hope they are just doing comparisons and it doesn't mean new wing is garbage.
Metal
The major changes are on the plates on the sides of the wing, with a few small plates and huge hole that u can see on the right side of the wing in the front pic and u can see very well in the pic from the back, probably the most complex side plates so far this year in F1(you can judge the complexity of them better on the pic from the back).

Also the upper flap's attachments is higher, as high as it can possibly be.
barteks
I guess that Robert already finished race sim. Waiting for some quali laps.

PompousJester
RF1PaddockPass: "Long runs over for now. Time for some set-up work in the final hour."

We will not see quali pace it seems.
CaptainJackSparrow
Like the front wing changes, as in they look McLaren level complicated so you gotta assume they do something clever;)
korzeniow
QUOTE (Metal @ Feb 28 2010, 15:11) *
The major changes are on the plates on the sides of the wing, with a few small plates and huge hole that u can see on the right side of the wing in the front pic and u can see very well in the pic from the back, probably the most complex side plates so far this year in F1(you can judge the complexity of them better on the pic from the back).

Also the upper flap's attachments is higher, as high as it can possibly be.


The most comlex endplates? Bold thesis.

Williams had similar endplates at their launch (I don't knew what they look now because I don't follow FW32 so closely)

http://www.gurneyflap.com/Resources/F011.jpg

http://www.gurneyflap.com/Resources/F010.jpg

edit:

Just saw that Sauber has similar solution:

http://www.motorsport.com/photos/f1/2010/t...tes-xp-2142.jpg

edit:

And Mercedes:

http://www.motorsport.com/photos/f1/2010/t...tes-xp-2252.jpg
barteks
PompousJester
I like new front wing.
Muppetmad
The front wing looks the most interesting of the field so far...
Lukin83
QUOTE (korzeniow @ Feb 28 2010, 16:17) *
The most comlex endplates? Bold thesis.
[..]


If I recall correctly Brawn and Toyota had similar solutions last season. Still, the Renault's one seems the most sophisticated.
Gemini
Shame they did not do proper race simulation...

One long 35+ laps stint with most laps in 26s and high 25s, but then followed with shorter stints and car in garage...

And the morning completely wasted.

I have to say I expected different things from these 4 days. The realiy is that Renault the shortest distance in Barcelona among 'old' teams and scored worst best laptimes among 'old' teams.

Some here will quckly comment "well it does not mean anything" and I will reply in advance "well it does not mean anything good for sure".



barteks
QUOTE
The Renault F1 Team completed its final day of winter testing in Barcelona with Robert Kubica.

Circuit: Barcelona

Length: 4.6 km

Driver: Robert Kubica

Chassis: R30-03

Total Laps: 107 laps

Fastest Lap: 1:23.175

Summary of the day: Dry and sunny weather in Barcelona gave good testing conditions. The team lost some track time in the morning with a technical problem, but covered good mileage in the afternoon.

Robert Kubica: “In the morning we lost a lot of track time with a technical problem. In the afternoon we tried to do a race distance, which was interrupted, but we did cover a lot of laps. Afterwards we just did a couple more runs for set-up work to try and improve the car a bit more.”

Alan Permane, Chief Engineer: “Our final day of testing was a mixed one as we suffered a problem with the gearbox on the installation lap, which limited our running. We managed to get back out at the end of the morning to evaluate some new aero parts and also worked on improving the set-up of the car. For the afternoon we tried to cover a race distance, and although it was interrupted, we did cover the desired number of laps. To end the day we returned to our set-up programme.”

First Grand Prix of 2010
Bahrain 12-14 March


kls
QUOTE (Carlo's @ Feb 28 2010, 13:14) *
korzeniow, I suppose you didn't understand me properly. I want to win your competition cat.gif

Interesting that team didn't want to change the brake system but Boullier insisted on it.


I guess this Renault insider posts on some other forum, would you mind send us a link to it?
I am not EB hound sent after him , I would just like to know more
If you are not sure send me a pm ,
thanks
barteks
Know more? Just read this thread and you will know everything smile.gif And if you're not a Pole, you won't understand a word.
ForMules
Robert Kubica got his first taste of the updates that his Renault team had brought to the car for this week's Barcelona test as he ended up 10th overall – but he focused on a race run and never bothered with an all-out qualifying run when the track was at its best.
bankoq
First glimpse on lap-times tells me Renault are about 0.6-0.8s slower than McLaren on long runs ambivalent.gif
swiniodzik
Since I've spent the whole day ahead of that Russian live-timing data and here are some nice numbers and graphics:

Kubica's race simulation apparently consisted of 49 laps with stints 18-18-13 respectively, with an average lap-time of 1:25.483.
Hamilton did 61 laps with stints 20-20-21 and an average of 1:24.437.
Schumacher did 56 laps with stints 20-19-17 and an average of 1:25.190.
Sutil did 62 laps with stints 29-18-15 and an average of 1:25.876.
While Sutil did his simulation in the morning, the rest did theirs in the afternoon.



Of course it's only testing, we don't really know how much fuel and which tyres everybody run etc etc. But hey, I got bored today and had to do something, hence the 'analysis'. With today's 'competitivenes', Hamilton would win a 66 laps race being 49,7 seconds ahead of Schumacher, 69,0s ahead of Kubica and 95,0s ahead of Sutil.

Mind you, I won't be accepting complaints when things don't go that way in real, so don't bet your house relying on my data lol.gif
Lukin83
QUOTE (swiniodzik @ Feb 28 2010, 19:57) *
Since I've spent the whole day ahead of that Russian live-timing data and here are some nice numbers and graphics:

Kubica's race simulation apparently consisted of 49 laps with stints 18-18-13 respectively, with an average lap-time of 1:25.483.
Hamilton did 61 laps with stints 20-20-21 and an average of 1:24.437.
Schumacher did 56 laps with stints 20-19-17 and an average of 1:25.190.
Sutil did 62 laps with stints 29-18-15 and average of 1:25.876.
While Sutil did his simulation in the morning, the rest did theirs in the afternoon.



Of course it's only testing, we don't really know how much fuel and which tyres everybody run etc etc. But hey, I got bored today and had to do something, hence the 'analysis'. With today's 'competitivenes', Hamilton would win a 66 laps race being 49,7 seconds ahead of Schumacher, 69,0s ahead of Kubica and 95,0s ahead of Sutil.

Mind you, I won't be accepting complaints when things don't go that way in real, so don't bet your house relying on my data lol.gif


Great work! Two things though:
1) I believe it was Greek live-timing smile.gif
2) I think Kubica had longer first stint, possibly interrupted by a red flag (note that huge spike on Hamilton's line). As Gemini said the stint lasted about 35 laps, that too would fit your chart. If so, you can't compare Kubica's pace to Hamilton because the latter changed the tyres twice. Once Bob got a fresh set of tyres he was quite close to Hammy again. McLaren is ahead, but certainly not as far as the chart suggests.

On slightly another note, Renault looks faster than Mercedes, which I find very encouraging. That's the planned Top 4 biggrin.gif But seriously, both teams are planning to introduce significant updates in Bahrain, while McLaren already mounted some new parts. It's very close between everyone now and will be even closer.
MadYarpen
dunno, i think Q3 will be success...
bankoq
How do you see Mercedes slower than Renault, I see them 0.3-0.5s faster in race sims (and it corresponds to swiniodzik analysis)? Also my first look at McLaren lap-times is more or less same as swiniodzik.

Guys look at Alonso's 40 laps stint: http://f1tests.mine.nu/!/!/test2.php (laps 80 - 120)

That's ****ing mighty, Renalt can't touch this.
Walsingham
QUOTE (swiniodzik @ Feb 28 2010, 19:57) *
Since I've spent the whole day ahead of that Russian live-timing data and here are some nice numbers and graphics:

Kubica's race simulation apparently consisted of 49 laps with stints 18-18-13 respectively, with an average lap-time of 1:25.483.
Hamilton did 61 laps with stints 20-20-21 and an average of 1:24.437.
Schumacher did 56 laps with stints 20-19-17 and an average of 1:25.190.
Sutil did 62 laps with stints 29-18-15 and an average of 1:25.876.
While Sutil did his simulation in the morning, the rest did theirs in the afternoon.



Of course it's only testing, we don't really know how much fuel and which tyres everybody run etc etc. But hey, I got bored today and had to do something, hence the 'analysis'. With today's 'competitivenes', Hamilton would win a 66 laps race being 49,7 seconds ahead of Schumacher, 69,0s ahead of Kubica and 95,0s ahead of Sutil.

Mind you, I won't be accepting complaints when things don't go that way in real, so don't bet your house relying on my data lol.gif



Great job up.gif

I have mixed feelings about Renault form before Bahrain. There were some positive signals and some negative signals. Same way you could read these data. First and last part looks good, middle part not very good. If it was race sim with race fuel than fact that Kubica's sim was interrupted earlier than others would negatively effect his average pace. We'll see in two weeks anyway.
swiniodzik
QUOTE (Lukin83 @ Feb 28 2010, 20:21) *
Great work! Two things though:
1) I believe it was Greek live-timing smile.gif
2) I think Kubica had longer first stint, possibly interrupted by a red flag (note that huge spike on Hamilton's line). As Gemini said the stint lasted about 35 laps, that too would fit your chart. If so, you can't compare Kubica's pace to Hamilton because the latter changed the tyres twice. Once Bob got a fresh set of tyres he was quite close to Hammy again. McLaren is ahead, but certainly not as far as the chart suggests.

On slightly another note, Renault looks faster than Mercedes, which I find very encouraging. That's the planned Top 4 biggrin.gif But seriously, both teams are planning to introduce significant updates in Bahrain, while McLaren already mounted some new parts. It's very close between everyone now and will be even closer.


The Greek site is good, but it often misses occasional lap-times here and there. On the Russian one you have everything complete. You can see there Kubica's run was a two-stopper, as the confirmation here are some snippets from Autosport's live coverage:

13:45 Kubica recently made a tyre stop during what looks like a race simulation, which has been pretty much entirely in the 1m26s.
14:04 Kubica has done 37 laps and is just making another tyre stop following a 17 lap mid-race-simulation stint. He's been lapping in mid-1m25s.

Hamilton's strange peak during his first stint is just a very slow one lap, traffic, a mistake, whatever. It's better visible when I use a scatter plot:



Regardless of any data, I think Renault is somwhere in the pursuit group with the likes of Williams and Force India. I don't see them fighting with Ferrari, McLaren, Red Bull or Mercedes frankly, unless they were the biggest chameleon of the winter this time. How big exactly are the gaps is anyone's guess, but advancing through to Q3 will be a hard task for Renault in Bahrain I'd imagine. The comments from the other drivers and engineers on the pecking order, which are always the best winter-form guide, suggest as much.
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.
Invision Power Board © 2001-2012 Invision Power Services, Inc.