Browsing through some old ROAD&TRACKs, I came upon a report from a race called LAS OCHO MILLAS 3 in the August 67 issue. The track, a 7,7 miles road-circuit named BOTTOMLESS LAKES, was situated near Roswell, New Mexico.
The actual event was organized by SCCA.
As the pictures and the description by the writer seems to point to a very exciting track, I would like to know more about it's history.

Tom Berge

Can't add much except that it was situated in Bottomless Lakes State Park and was first used in about 1964.

As it appears that racing on public roads was banned across the USA (check with Mike Argetsinger on that) in 1952, perhaps it was a non-public road.
What information is there about the place?

Hello,

on several websites ( like Darrens brilliant, brilliant website ) I found track maps of a circuit
called "Bottomless Lakes Raceway". The track maps look extremely interesting but
it seems to be impossible to find pictures or further informations about the track in
the www. Does anyone know something more about this track or even raced on the
circuit ? Was it a permanent racetrack ? When was it closed and why ?
Does anyone have some pictures of the circuit ?
With many thanks in advance,

Sven

I'm pretty sure we discussed this not so long ago. Try the search engine!

Somewhere I have an article about Bottomless Lakes in an old copy of Road & Track (I think). When I get a moment I'll seek it out and post again. I seem to remember it being described as exciting (and quite challenging) and fairly dangerous. Wasn't it situated in a National or State Park?? Maybe that had something to do with it's demise...

Well, I tried the search engine before I started this thread but I made the mistake
to search for Bottomless Lakes Raceway and not only for Bottomless
Lakes. I found the earlier thread now, but there only were two replys.
I really hope that there'll be some more here. Anyway, thanks a lot for your answers.
By the way, does anyone know a website about defunct tracks and how they look like
today ? I found a great website about the old Meadowdale Circuit and some pictures on
www.racingcircuit.net. Any other tips.
With many thanks.
Sven

Try here for a wealth of information on all aspects including tracks

http://www.racer.demon.nl/mrh/

Chris

I have, somewhere, an article in and old copy of R&T which describes a trip to this New Mexico track, including a map of sorts (which I think is the same one repro'ed on the silhouet.com site). Other than that, I 've seen scant reference to it.
The current official website for the State Park seems to make no reference to any motorsports history.

Does anyone have any information or stories about the place? Was it always an amateur-level venue? I get the impression it had something of reputation as being dangerous, but that may have been exacerbated by its lack of amenities maybe. The R&T article gave the impression it was isolated and difficult to reach (or was that just the feeling of an effite urbanite?). I note that it is near Roswell, which must be something of a tourist attraction itself...

http://www.datsun.org/fairlady/BrewersDatsun.htm

also check here:- http://www.datsun.org/fairlady/DickRoberts.htm

and a quote from the 2nd web page:-

"Roswell New Mexico, 1967 - a true road course which consisted of the road around Bottomless Lakes State Park. The course was 8 miles long and the event was called the Los Ochos Millas."

Thanks Geoff E . What a good story about DOC he was some COOL dude to do what he did.
Shame about the ALFA driver.

I remember the Doc Foerster story, although I couldn't have put a name to him. I also remember the same or another Bottomless Lakes report told of a part of the track where an error by one driver caused his car to leave the course in such a way that it landed on a concession stand.

Is Bottomless Lakes near Fort Sumner? Bill Hoskins, who contributed the marvelous 1950s Southern California photos on the page at KTUD, tells of riding there from West Texas in the boot of an MG TC:
KTUD

Frank S

Found while looking for something else:

The 21 May 66 issue of Competition Press & Autoweek (now AW) has 1 May race results from Roswell, NM. It mentions that it was the "first SCCA national [race] to be held on the longest [8.1 mile] road course in North America". The big-bore winner, Joe Starkey, averaged a very stout 113 mph in his 5-liter McLaren Elva-Oldsmobile. The report noted it was the second running of Los Ocho Millas.

Datsun driver D.W. ("Doc") Foerster is mentioned in the results as well.

I was running the Lotus in SCCA Nationals on the East coast at the time, and have no recollection of this track.

I thought I'd resurrect this thread and see if any more Bottomless Lakes history has surfaced during the last few years.

Joel, thanks for revisiting.

Henry



We need to huddle at the Snug for food and drink and conversation!

Thanks, Henry, for the photo. The place was obviously big and fast: the antithesis of "mickey mouse". I assume it ran clockwise.

Was there much/any elevation change?

Lotus23:

The track can actually be viewed in its entirety on Google's Street View!

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q...011982,0.018947

There don't appear to be too many elevation changes, but the track itself (from looking via Street View) was a narrow string of fast sweepers. A few sections near the face of a cliff as well (the left hander before the looping section on the north).

Thanks, Chris. Interesting place with an interesting history. I assume the 8.1 mile road is still intact and could be driven today.

113 mph was an awfully quick avg speed for an amateur road race in '66. The CP&A article mentions that most of the Big Boys were running at a USRRC (U.S. Road Racing Championship = $$$) race at Riverside, CA that day; Starkey was on the entry list for Riverside, but apparently decided to go for National Championship points at Roswell instead.

It would appear that the first SCCA National there was also the last SCCA National there.

Lotus23:

Glad the Google Street View helped you get a sense of the course. Those "Pass with Care" signs are ironic given the route's racing history, eh?

Part of the course is New Mexico State Route 409 so that portion of the track will probably be around for a while, with the west segment (Bottomless Lakes Road) clearly still being maintained as well. Two lanes with no shoulders though makes me wonder how much mettle one needed to get around this configuration, especially as fast as the race results suggested...

Interesting to see some of the old tracks I used to race at. Old and defunct (like me). My records show I ran an Alfa Veloce there in the fall of 1964. I think this event was just a Regional.

As I recall the pit straight was in the canyon floor and the only elevation change was the climb out of the canyon to the rim above, which the road followed more or less until it dived once more down into the bottom. The name Bottomless Lakes refers to a series of extremely deep sink holes which you could see as you sped along the canyon rim above. It seems silly now but at the time I remember thinking if I went off the rim into one of the holes they would never recover my car. I seem to have glossed over the fact that I wouldn't be needing a car anymore. In fact the only thing offputting about the course was being blinded by the low sun late in the afternoon while driving along the canyon rim. There were a couple of bends that were more or less obscured by the glare on my oil smeared goggles. I was driving mostly by my memory of which way and when to start those turns, since I couldn't really see them.

I can believe that the track would be extremely fast and challenging in a big car but the Alfa was wound out all the way around except for the climb and descent sections at the ends. The only accidents I remember that year was another Alfa driven by Bob Wenzel which flipped on the climb out, and an MG-B which was similarly done in.

Like much of the terrain around Roswell the canyon is pretty barren but I enjoyed the racing and the people and probably would have gone back except for a job change in 1966 interfered with my racing that year.

Phil Godwin

Phil, thanks for your reminiscences of BL. I was hoping we'd find someone who'd actually turned
a wheel in anger there. Like yourself, I marvel at the obvious risks we -- and everyone else --
blithely accepted back then.

File under The Invincibility of Youth. Like yourself, I'm a child of the "dirty thirties" and no kid
anymore. (Except inside my head, where I'm still 22!)

BTW, I see you were at Ft Ord in '59; 7 years later I was stationed some distance S of there at Ft Irwin, CA.
30 miles out of Barstow, which itself was in the middle of nowhere. (I volunteered for RVN
to get outta there. Seemed like a good idea at the time...)

Bottomless Lakes is one of the circuits featured in Pete Hylton's excellent "Ghost Tracks", published by Legacy Ink in 2007.

There's only a very brief section on Bottomless Lakes, but the glossy-style book is really worth getting for all the lost racing circuits in there.