Or even Jiggs Alexander, Keith Laney and Peter Moloney
Looks as if you've been relying on one particular source too much
But I have to admit you've got the correct spellings for a lot of other tricky names

"Giggs" Alexander came from RCN and I thought it had been checked against the 1970 Levin entry list but maybe not. Peter "Maloney" came from Lawrence Wilkinson but it's possible that Lawrence was quoting from Vercoe because I notice it's wrong there too.

The Laney business is more of a puzzle as somebody told me the "Keith" Laney in Vercoe was wrong but I can't find anything in my notes about where "John" came from. Probably just my screw-up!

I always trust you completely on these things so I'll change all three.

Thanks

Allen

Thanks Mark for the update.
Maybe in ten years when I have the time I will do Australian v8 touring cars.

Alexander's initials were G W, so I suppose someone heard his name and guessed the spelling. His first name was actually Gerald. I suspect he was G W in race programmes.
Laney was J K - maybe someone knew his first name was John (or guessed it). But he was always called Keith, and I'm sure I can find lots of programme listings to that effect.
I'm equally sure about Moloney - he and I did our National Service in the same unit

Alexander's initials were G W, so I suppose someone heard his name and guessed the spelling. His first name was actually Gerald.
Laney was J K - maybe someone knew his first name was John (or guessed it). But he was always called Keith, and I'm sure I can find lots of programme listings to that effect.
I'm equally sure about Moloney - he and I did our National Service in the same unit

According to a thread in TrackForum Russ Klar has died.

BTW: The first post over there puts in doubt the birth date that is given by Richie.

Sorry to hear this. Not a good week at all.

I'm away at the moment from my normal notes, pages etc so I will have a better look at this & some other queries this weekend or early next week & try & sort something out. I have a WATN update to do as well & the final stage of the Indy 500 etc. so a good, thorough check will be made about Klar.

Okay, latest updates are up - for a brand new F1 season. This is likely to be the last regular "normal" update for a little while, as F1 is inked, F3000 no longer exists & the Indy 500 doesn't happen for a few months & work & of course, having the chance to do a proper update for many all add to the reasons - but we'll see.

THANKS
Matt the Cat, Mike Thomson, Allan Brown, Mark Alan Jones, Mac Lark, Michigan Hall of Fame & a big thanks to Tim Considine.

NIGGLES/BITS & PIECES
Spellings etc. done & F1 years redone for current season. I seem to have missed out updating Friesacher & Monteiro for some reason?! but Karthikeyan is up there. I'll do those two for next time. I think I forgot to add them as they were already there but nonetheless


2004/2005 CHANGES
Angellelli, Artam, Alonso, Derek Bell, Burti, Briscoe, Bachelart, Bernoldi, Bruni, Bertuzzi, Brack K, Colciago, Caffi, Collard, Chaves, Campos, Dare, Davidson, da Matta, Enge, C Fittipaldi, E Fittipaldi, Fisischella, Fama, Formato, Ghinzani, Guerreri, Hynes, S Hattori, Haywood, Henzler, Inoue (yes, he's back ), Jourdain M, Keen, Kerr, Klien, Liuzzi, Langhorne, Luyendyk, Larrauri, Monfardini, Meneghello, J Muller, Nguyen, Plata, Piccini, Pizzonia, DLRosa, Raikkonen, Salo, Sospiri, T Stewart, Skaife, Ro. Sperafico, Spataro, Tesini, Tracy, van Hool, J Ward, Weaver, M Wilson, Wendlinger, Watt, Witherill, Yeley, Zanardi

Other New WATN
Antonioli is not the Systemcraft bloke as I thought...
Ballabio - car designer
Blundell & Brundle - more joint projects
Chitwood - grandson's changed role
de Tommaso (note extra M) - coach/school
England - updated infro
Duncan - Presidental chaffeaur
Englehart - cranes
Galica, Heimrath jr & Natili - still going strong
Favre - racing school
Greenfield - industrial casting
Gardner S - racing "experience"
Guerra - tin top maestro
Lees - retired
Kempton - motorcycle man
G McRae - on the mend
Pavicevic - ill
Reese - still alive
Said - more info
Stephens - pilot
Siedel - garage owner
Warren - gravel & sand

New Data - Births, deaths etc.
Bill Boyd's full details have now been found after a bit of a digging
Burke - change of birthplace
Karthikeyan in
Klauser's birthplace
Klar has sadly died
A Knepper's deathplace
Luptow's birthplace
Morand's birthplace
Al Miller's corrected deathplace
Nissany's birthplace
Romano's nationality corrected
Said's corrected deathplace
Schroeder changed to Bob as this seems to be the name used throughout his career.
Saldana's birthplace
Scherrer's deathplace
Stephens - pilot
Schell's deathplace corrected after it was pointed out by Adam F that the part of the circui he died on is in another county all together - one of those funny little quirks!
as almost everyone should now know, Trintignant died recently.
M (Doc) Williams' birthdate & Place added
C Williams - birthplace & deathplace
Dale Whittington - appears to have died.

You may be interested to know that Graham McRae's speedster Replica business is currently being auctioned on www.trademe.co.nz.
Graham built forty odd Porsche replicas, but his health has caused him to decide to sell the entire operation. If any one is aware of potential interested parties I am sure Graham would be grateful.

trintignant died 12 feb or 13 feb?

13th February. Died about 1am on the Sunday.

Christijan Albers not Christjian Albers

da Matta 28 Gp not 26

Thanks for information about Trintignant.

You're welcome - thanks for those. You're quite right - I'm amazed I didn't see it before.

In addition to the Indy lot, there has been a small update -

alnica & Huw's posts have been included & that Freisacher & Monteiro thing is sorted.
2005 updates: Camathias, Colciago, Doornbos, Deletraz, J Davies, Henzler, Lauda, Kiesa, Kane, Janis, Montanari C, Noda, Ruberti, Policand, Piccini, De Simone, Takagi


John Cannon - change of birthplace & birthdate - please note! Thanks to Adam for this - his superb findings are also responsible for the new birth details of Justin Keen & the birthplace of James Taylor.


Jim T has also helped with some of the Indy drivers, including Durant, Rasmussen etc.

Also Randy Lanier was born in Florida - I'm working on where precisely.


Just a small one but that's to be expected with 3/4 weeks only.

takagi 32 gp not 2 gp

That might be me - I had to make a quite a few changes to the web pages rather rapidly this afternoon after we spotted some problems. I may have damaged something else in the process. Anything else wrong?

Allen

Mika Hakkinen born in Martinlaakso, Vantaa (Finland) near Helsinki

from http://www.clarinet.fi/~spitkane/

It's part of Vantaa, is that correct?

While reading DCN's BRM book, I found some info that might be useful here. (Sadly that is not good news, but one must not conceal the truth.) There's a capture of Peter Walker resting after the 1951 British Grand Prix which says "Poor Walker - the once wealthy farmer/driver - would end his days as an alcoholic derelict in London streets and hotels..."

I take it from this article at grandprix.com that Art Cross has passed on, although it doesn't actually say so.

http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns14609.html

Art Cross, the first-ever Indianapolis 500 Rookie of the Year in 1952 and a runner-up finisher in the 1953 race to Bill Vukovich, died April 15 in La Porte, Ind. He was 87.

from www.charlotte.com/mld/charlotte/sports/motorsports/11412510.htm

A very sad, but entirely expected death after his wife's recent passing (very much like British statesman Jim Callaghan) & his recent ill-health. Another 50's link gone in a sad year.

Right folks - latest updates are up with a lot of new information

2005 WATN
Andre, Aguas, Auinger, Bartels, Berton, Chiesa, Dumas, de Ferran, P Friesacher, Firman, Gianmaria, Glock, Giebler, F Giaffone, Grasotto, Inoue, Hewitt, D Hamilton, Heylen, Jabouille, Lehto, B & J Lazier, Lancieri, Lamy, Langhorne, Morbidelli, Moreno, Mikola, Monti, Mauricio, Prost, Pantano, Rugolo, Roth, de la Rosa, N Simon, Ri Sperafico, B Smith, Toccacelo, Van Hooydonk, Verdonck, Tielemans, Verstappen, Wurz, J Ward, Walfisch, Wirdheim

Other WATN
Alley, Basle, Bourbonnais, Holland, Klien A, Kuhnke, D Murphy, Olivero, Pullen, Shambaugh, Souders, Stirling, Weyant

New Information
Albertson, L Anderson, Belcher, Buzane, B Chandler, Decker, J de Palma, Fetterman, Frayer, Horan, Herr, Le Cain, - death information
Cliff Allison & Art Cross - have sadly died
Albertson, Belcher, L Brayton, Buick, Cagle, J Cooper, Caliva, Dave Coyne, Christiaens, E Devore, H Endicott, Dawson, Eldridge, Ferguson, M Fox, Garza, Hancock, Horan, Kerr, Momota, JJ McCoy, Mais, Palmroth, Pilette Theo, Zbrowoski - birth info
Baker - revised deathdate
Benefield - removed deathdate
W Crawford, Hakkinen, Jagersberger, H Robson, Ruckstell, - revised birthplace
Eaton K, Hawkes, Moorhouse - full birth & death details
Daly, Johns, Kennedy, McGarrity, G Smith - revised birthdate
D Lewis, van Raalte, - revised birthplace, deathplace & WATN
H MacDonald - full birth details & WATN

Other
Burman - revised WATN
Small changes/amendements as suggested here
Spelling mistakes corrected
All added 2 GP's bar Sato & Montoya & Liuzzi, Wurz, DLR & Davidson adjusted re. F1
Added names or added to categories so new are:
Weiss, Tattersall, R Shuman, Beale, Borkowski, K Schrader, Russing, J Miller, Mattson, Firestone, Tyler, Dockery, Horvath, Bonnett etc.
Removed are Alderson, B Shuman & C Peterson


Thanks
Some of these deserve medals:-
Russ Creason, Michael Ferner, Mike Tanney, Robert Dick, John Blazier, Michael O'Leary, LB, Gerrit Stevens, Disco Stu, Mike Thomsen, Rick Kelly, Adam Ferrington, J-L Otero, Alnica, Toine Pilette & Jim Thurman - thanks to you all

Here's a correction for you!

The Bob Frey that is on your list has nothing to do with NHRA drag racing. That is a different Bob Frey.

The Bob Frey who tried to qualify for the Indy 500 was big in USAC sprint car and supermodified racing. And yes he is/was an embalmer. He actually currently owns and operates a mortuary in Wickenburg, Arizona in the United States. I actually drove by it not too long ago.

Hope that will help you out. Keep up the good work!

Much appreciated, thanks

Sad News!

Dave Strickland, 67, passed away Tuesday morning in Colorado following an extended illness. A member of the National Midget Auto Racing Hall of Fame, Dave won 25 USAC Midget races during his career, which included a runnerup points finish in 1970 and a pair of thirds and a pair of fifths in the standings. He was unsuccessful in his bid to start the 1969 Indianapolis 500, but did start four Indy car events in 1969 and 1970, finishing seventh at Phoenix in his 1969 debut.

Yet another death - very sad indeed. Thanks for letting me know - I plan for an update very soon indeed.

Latest updates - there are compartively very few actually


K Brack is back, Berton is in some Italian F3000, J Davies FIA GT, Doornbos dropped, Leinders a la Davies, Junqueira injured, Montagny in for Doornbos is the 2005 news

Dead:
Too many. David Cook's has been amended after his dad's death & also gone is John Love, AJ Shepherd & Dave Strickland.

Only other bit of news is Ian Raby died in Lambeth, London - most other info is above.

Of course, this is the Indy 500 time update so there are some new faces & some old familiar names in there now (Bucknum, anyone )

Thanks to Adam Ferrington, IndyRichie, Russ Creason for their help this time out.

AJ Shepherd died 8 May 2005

Whoops

It says Tomas Scheckter has started 1 Indy 500 from 2004-2005. His rookie year was 2002. He nearly won the race that year driving for Cheever but hit the turn four wall in the late stages. He had a top 5 finish with Ganassi in 2003, and ran for Panther Racing in the 2004 and 2005 Indy 500's. So that gives him four starts in his career.

And your spelling of Bryan Tyler is incorrect. The actual spelling is Brian Tyler.

Indy Richie

Jesus Ricardo Iglesias died yesterday in Pergamino FYI

Just stumbled over a sentence on
http://8w.forix.com/vaccarella-bondurant.html
where it says about Vaccarella:

"Sometimes mistakenly identified as a lawyer (even by some commanding sources), the Sicilian was a steady driver whom team managers could count on for bringing the car home."

Those commanding sources would include you

Any comments on Diepraam and Muelas' blasphemous accusations?

Ahem. To answer my own question :-)

A quote from an interview with Nino from
http://www.velocetoday.com/people/people_25.php

"ED: There seem to be different stories about your work…that you were a lawyer, a professor, a teacher……what is the real story?
NV: I have a ‘Dottore Juris Prudensa’ which means I studied law at the University, but I never practiced or taught law. I bought a private school which I used to run with my sister, and I was known as the ‘presidente volante’ – the flying director!"

Pedro Chaves is still listed in the "Where Are They Now" list as racing in GT racing, when he returned to rallying over two years ago:

2002 - Spanish GT Champion with Miguel Ramos (Saleen)
2003 - Drove Saleen in FIA GT with Miguel Ramos and Ni Amorim, quit before the end of the season to join Renault's Portuguese Rally Championship program
2004 - Portuguese Rally Championship (Renault Clio S1600)
2005 - Portuguese Rally Championship (Renault Clio S1600)

Ben Pon's birthplace is Amersfoort which I believe is about an hour's drive away from Leiden.

The source is the biography on his winery's website:
http://www.bernardus.com/bw/biographies/bw5a.html

Ben Pon was actually born in Leiden and I had this confirmed by his secretary. I was convinced that it was Amersfoort after reading his bio on the winery website, after all there shouldn't be a mistake on his own company website, surely. But after many claims from Dutch journalists that Leiden was his place of birth I decided to check and found they were right all along.

I'm therefore a little cautious about info on websites from now on, especially after confirming with Vitantonio Liuzzi that he was born in 1980 and not '81 as claimed on his website.

You just can't trust what you read on the world wide web!

Ben Pon was born in Leiden - he's told me (via at least two people) himself.

A lot of websites (including some very normally reliable ones) have Liuzzi's birthplace wrong as well....


One additional one is Jud Larson, born in Texas, not Missouri. Thanks to Rick Kelly on this one.

David & I have discussed Alfonso Thiele in a bit of detail, and I now think the basic 1986 on FORIX listed as his death is probably accurate in some sense. I really don't think he's with us any longer.

Lol. Hope drinking that excellent red wine he grows hasn't confused him regarding his birth :-)

Hi folk, latest update is now up - mostly updating mid-season news but with a few extras.


2005 stuff
Boullion, Bert, T Bell, Chaves, Cochet, Doornbos, A Fernandez, E Fittipaldi, P Friesacher, Foyt IV, Hancock, Haberfeld, Kristensen, Kerr, Kiesa, Keohane, Kolby, Lehto, B Lazier, Marques, Moreno, Morbidelli, Manning, Mollekens, Mansell, Pescarolo, Pizzonia, Piccolo, g Rees, R Riberio, Roe, Rangoni, A Sperafico, J Scheckter, Schmidt, Y Schroeder, Trulli, Tichy, Verdonck, Verstappen, van der Merwe, Zonta

Other WATN
Herbert - Jordan
D Hill - GP2 development
D Jones - consultancy
Natili - villa
Pesenti-Rossi - living
Paul Jr. - health
Vaccarella - lawyer corrected

Other Data
Iglesias - death.
Liuzzi's birthyear changed
J Larson's birthplace changed
Shepherd's deathdate corrected
Thiele - I am presuming that he is now dead following advice & much research.

Thanks & Tit-bits
Corrections & updates for the F1 totals.
Thanks to David Holland, Alnica, IndyRichie, Matt the Cat, Rick Kelly

Hi Richie,

Is it kosher to "cross pollinate a message I sent on th [RH] Yahoo thread?

To save you the time to look up this message, also relevant to this thread - My response to Gordon White's query re Charles Crawford.

Does anyone have anything to add to my research, which reaches slightly different conclusions than is shown for this subject in the Indy 500 list?

********* in reverse order of transmission = start at the end and work upwards ************


Gordon,

This is what I have come up with re: Charles Crawford.

From the late Phil Harms' files on champ cars:

Charles Crawford started 25th and finished 16th in the 1934 Indy 500. He finished in 25th place in the national championship that year.

He was a no-show in the seasons of 1935, 1936, 1937, 1939, 1940, 1941, and 1946, not showing up at any of the national championship races.

In the years 1938 & 1947 he was a DNQ at the Indy 500.

Also in 1947 he was a DNQ at Milwaukee and Springfield, IL.

- - - - - -

Scanning the US Federal Census for 1900, 1910, 1920 and 1930, I came up with one interesting possibility, in the 1920 Census. A Charles Crawford, in Chattanooga, Tennessee, was born in 1898, and he was shown to be a "repairman, automobile", born in Georgia.

This doesn't match Richie Jenkins' data,

BUT: In the Lincoln (Nebraska) Star of Wednesday, 30 May 1934, there was a very thorough report on the Indy 500 race, on page one, continued on page twelve. On page twelve there was this interesting sentence:

"Before the cars had gone 25 miles, the machine driven by Charles Crawford, Chattanooga, Tenn., was forced out because of a broken steering arm."

Additionally, the 1920 census indicated that this Charles Crawford was born in Georgia. Thus, there are enough connections that I would say that there is a solid possibility that this is our man.

His wife's name was Edna, born in Tennessee, and they had a son, Charles L. Crawford, Jr., who was four years and nine months old. In 1920 Charles was shown to be 22 and Edna was shown to be 20. These folks were pretty young to have a family!

A fast operator at age 15 ...

And fast enough to make it into one Indy 500.

By the time he was 49, his last appearance at the Indy 500, he had probably slowed down too much to be competitive.

That is far as I can go, unless you want to buy me a ticket to Atlanta or Augusta, GA, to check out their historical society records!

And by the way, did you see that Crocky Wright was inducted into the National Midget Auto Racing Hall of Fame, and was presented his plaque by some young whippersnapper going by the name of Tony Stewart.

The other three inductees were Floyd Alvis, Vic Edelbrock and the late Danny Caruthers.

Rick Kelly




----- Original Message -----
From: Erskine Kelly
To: RacingHistory@yahoogroups.com
Cc: erkelly2@cox.net
Sent: Monday, August 29, 2005 6:04 PM
Subject: Re: [RH] Re:Charlie Crawford


Hello Gordon,

The Tribute Project does not show a Chuck, Charlie or Charles Crawford.

The excellent Richie Jenkins opus, The Indy 500 drivers - Where are they now? at www.oldracingcars.com shows the following:
Charles Crawford; dob: 1898;
Birth place: Nashville, TN;
dod: 09 Jan 1961.

Crawford was not shown in the now moribund pages Pilotos Muertos. Give me a few more hours to massage my other sources and I will let you know what, if anything else, I can find. In general, the fairly common surname of Crawford does not bode well for a search, but I will try.

Rick Kelly, researcher, Motorsport Memorial - www.motorsportmemorial.org.

PS:

Take a look at Frank Shearer (died 09 Sep 1903; spectator) and Frank Day (died 12 Sep 1903; driver).

Is this episode known about Barney Oldfield?

And is Frank Day the earliest known race driver fatality in the U. S.?

I have Andrew Fetherston (died 31 May 1902) as the first spectator fatality in the U.S., killed by a Baker Electric Car on Staten Island, NY, while it was trying for a world speed record, sanctioned by the Automobile Club of America.

Do you, or our eavesdroppers from [RH], have any additional information about these people?

K




----- Original Message -----
From: Gordon White
To: RacingHistory@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, August 29, 2005 10:35 AM
Subject: [RH] Re:Charlie Crawford


Anyone know anything about driver Charlie Crawford? Drove at Indy
1934-1947? Supposed to have lived in Indianapolis but is buried in
Calhoun, Georgia? Dates of birth or death? He drove a de Soto-based AAA
"big car" car at the Chicago Fairgrounds, River Road and North Avenue,
in 1937. Any information at all would be of interest. (I do have his
Indianapolis data from the Jack Fox book.)

- Gordon

Rick, excellent work

Of course, the problem remains which Crawford, Wesley or Charles, died in 1961 as it is clear one of them did, but I've never been sure which one. Still, I guess there's a possibility as it appears that he died in Georgia & there are ways round these things...!

I'm happy enough with the findings.



Incidentially, there will be a new & improved, more complete 1920 census up soon with EVERYONE a la 1930, up on Ancestry. At the moment, it only lists heads of the family. I suspect, that when that comes up, a heck of a lot more gaps will be filled.

Comes the troublemaker again -

Re: Roger McCluskey

According to the New York Times, 30 August 1993, page B7:

"He was 63."
"Mr. McCluskey began racing in his home town of Tucson, Ariz., in 1947 and ..."

He must have fudged on his age so that he could race at age 17.

According to the Texas Birth Index, 1903-1997:

Roger Frank McCluskey was born on 24 August 1930 in Bexar County, which includes San Antonio.
His father was Jack M. McCluskey. His mother was Zelma Margerite McCluskey, nee Porter.

How about that?! Do you suppose that he was double-checking USAC drivers' birth certificates? Or was he afraid to throw stones from his glass house?

Rick Kelly

I could have sworn I sent the McCluskey info off to Richie some time ago...Richie?

Rick, you bring up a great point. When McCluskey ran USAC, did he check more carefully, or less...or perhaps he just passed it along to someone else.

On another front...

Marvin Burke b. Mar. 15, 1918

born Contra Costa County, California (which Pittsburg is in).

Feeling grouchy - When I went to preview a long message just sent, the machine erased everything.

In short, I offer this:

Re: Bruce Miller

Killed on 04 July 1928 at the Milwaukee Mile.

Watch for his page to pop up in the next few days at Motorsport Memorial.

Jim, great stuff - I will contact you soon.

Rick Kelly

McCluskey's dates that I have are definite - I thought that was already settled after many arguments....

many thanks for the info guys

Jim, many thanks as, at last, we have Marvin Burke sown up.

born, as you said, died on the 23rd February 1994, in Richmond, California.

I should get a little while soon to check some of the other American "Living" drivers then depending on work, I will be having a big overview of the whole "Missing" "Blank" & "Obscure" drivers to see what I can find, before I even attempt any other projects online (F2, CART, Welsh drivers -all on file but on back burner)

Progress at last on some after a quick check

One of the few remaining F3000 mysteries was Cary Bren - no longer.

Cary Donald Bren b. 8 May 1959, Santa Ana, California


Now having checked Charles Crawford in more detail, I am now confident that the 1961 death date is Wesley's.
I believe that Charles Crawford died on the 29th February 1964, aged 66, but this is being double checked.

Other quick search revealed no major developments but every little helps....

Latest updates are once again up.
As I will be moving back permamently to the UK next month, this will probably mean a lot more mysteries will begin or partially begin to be solved. Certainly, i can devote a bit more time to the obscurities & missing data than I have been able to since April.

Here's what is in the latest batch:


2005
Bleekemolen, Bruni, Aiello, Alonso, Arnoux, de Cesaris, Danner, Enge, Firman, E Fittipaldi, Heidfeld, Ghinzani, Janis, J Lazier, Lammers, Lauda M & N, Monfardini, Mikola, Patrese, Pizzonia, Noda, Toccacelo, Zanardi, Zampredi, Wheldon

Other WATN
Leinders - team boss

Important Data
Bren's birthdate found
Full birth & death date for Marvin Burke
Charles Crawford dates amended.
Bruce Miller death date

Thanks & Other
Maldwyn, Jim Thurman, David Holldand, Rick Kelly & Allen for putting up with my lack of computer skills.

This'll be the last update for a while, even though I do one at the end of the season normally. However, I hope to have lots packed into an update late Nov/Early Dec.

*****
I also realise I have failed to update current GP totals. This'll be amended next time, cheers.
*****

Good morning at all. I want to indicate little mistake in the excellent work of OldRacingCars.

In Natili Massimo, WATN info "Mille Miglia" rather than "Mille Migilia"

In Piquet Nelson, birthplace, "Rio de Janeiro" rather than "Rio de Janiero"

In Robson Hal, birthplace is "Mount Dennis, Ontario" (CDN) but in WATN there is "...although like George, he was born in England..." ??? Birthplace is Ontario or England? and his nationality was English, Canadian or Usa?

In Lewis-Evans, deathplace is "West Sussex" rather than "Sussex" because there are two Sussex county, East & West Sussex.

In Purley, birthplace and deathplace is "West Sussex" rather than "Sussex".

In Scarfiotti, deathplace is "Roßfeld" rather than "Rossfeld"

In Taylor John, deathdate is "06 september 1966" rather than "08 september 1966" as indicate by www.motorsportmemorial.org and by Peter Higham in his book "The guinness guide to international motor racing" 1995 edition.


finally a question, Templeman Clark (Shorty) is father of Templeman Clark jr?

bye