Fellow NFEr's,
While glancing through David Hodges "A-Z of Formula Racing Cars", one of the colour pictures mentioned in the caption the wide variery of starting grid formations that were used during the 1965 F1 World Championship. The following variations were used during that year:

2-2-2: Monaco, Watkins Glen, Mexico City
4-3-4: Silverstone, Nurburgring

Could other NF members provide examples of other grid arrangements from other
courses? I also have a couple of questions:

a) when was 2-2 made mandatory in all F1 WC races
b) was there an even split between "staggered" and "even" grid rows?

Snetterton used a 5-4-5 grid for its non-championship F1 race around 1960.

Monza was traditionally 3-2-3, but in 1958 when Vanwalls occupied slots 1-3 the grid was mysteriously changed to 4-3-4 so a red car could be up front. I think Monza experimented with a 2-2 in about 1961 when there were about 32 starters.

The first mass start I think was in the 1921 ACF Grand Prix, and was 2-2. Certainly around that era.

When Steve Hirst published his Grand Prix Chronology back in 1972, he included code letters for the most common grid patterns up to that point. There were 11 basic layouts, plus a few one-offs which didn't fit the patterns.

This is just a hazy memory, but from reading Grand Prix! years ago, the last of the non-2-2 F1 grids seems to be around 1973. I don't think they were "staggered" until a few years after that.

A quick trawl through Lang generally showed a mix of 3-2-3 with some 4-3-4, presumably depending on the track width.

3-2-3 Monaco, Berne, Spa, Reims, Sebring, Zandvoort, Aintree, Porto, Morocco, Lisbon, Riverside
3-3-3 Indianapolis
4-3-4 Silverstone, Nurburgring, Barcelona, Buenos Aires, Avus
and the first 2-2-2 was Watkins Glen


I've always heard this when I looked through Lang I began to have doubts.

The Monza grid has varied over the years. It was 4-4-4 or 4-3-4 when using the road circuit and 3-3-3 or 3-2-3 when using the combined circuit. So it looks as if the the change from 3-3-3 in 1956 to 4-3-4 in 1957 was because of the change in circuit rather than to avoid an all green front row.


How did he possibly come up with 11 layouts? I can only think of 7.
5-5-5, 5-4-5, 4-4-4, 4-3-4, 3-3-3, 3-2-3, 2-2-2
or do we include echelon (Le Mans style), singly (Mille Miglia style)


When did the change from side by side pairs to the present staggered singles?

The Monaco GP used it starting in 1975, but the rest of F1 didn't adopt it until the start of the 1980 season.

Thank you for mentioning Grand Prix!. His Volume 3 shows the grids of the first half of the 1979 season like this:

1-2
3-4
5-6

instead of this:

1-2-
-3-4
5-6-

Were the cars arranged in a zig-zag fashion throughout 1979, or were they all neat and tidy as shown in the first example?

I think we are talking about two different kinds of stagger.

First we have side by side not staggered
2-1
4-3
6-5

Then we have side by side staggered transversely
-2-1
4-3-
-6-5

Then we have staggered longitudinally (the present arrangement)
-1
2-
-3
4-
As the spacing from 1-2 is the same as 2-3, this is really line ahead, but staggered. People persist in talking about "first row, second row, etc" presumably for old times' sake.

I'm at work at present but will check my books for photos this evening

Should have made clear some were just reversed ....

I remember after the accident of Ronnie Peterson in 1978, FIA made same changes in the grid formation, which change was?

May be...

1-2-
-3-4

thru

1-2-
3-4-

I think that was one of the post-von Trips things at Monza... the track in front of the pits was narrowed by putting down witches hats and there was a 2 - 2 - 2 grid. If I'm recalling correctly, DSJ made reference to it all and mentioned that the drivers were told, "If you hit a witches hat it is the same as you hit a brick wall and you are out of the race... Graham Hill should have picked one up after he won the event and worn it on his head..."

Warwick Farm was changed from 3 - 2 - 3 to 2- 2 - 2 for the International (Tasman) race of 1968, IIRC, while other races that day my memory is telling me used the old pattern. The pressure from the International drivers won out, though, and (again IIRC) from the next meeting 2 - 2 - 2 grids were there to stay.

Leyburn had a 5 - 5 - 5 grid.

I believe the exact date was 6th August 1973, the day after the German GP. As I recall a meeting of key parties was held in the wake of Roger Williamson's Zandvoort accident to discuss the implementation of various safety changes. I believe this effort was co-ordinated and pushed forward by Louis Stanley.

The results included the elimination of future grids larger than 2 by 2 and also the immediate introduction of the pace car at the next event at Zeltweg. I believe, given the random grid formats then being utilised, that the first race actually impacted by this grid change was actually that year's Canadian GP, which was of course the first race impacted by the use of a safety car.

I believe it is correct that the GP grid formations remained unstandardised thru the end of the 1979 season, when today's staggered longitudinal columns became standard, although staggered rows of pairs predominated.

I agree that the present longitudinal staggering was first seen at Monaco in 1975, as a safety response to the accidents in the prior race in Spain, but I believe the following year they reverted once more back to staggered rows.

However in 1977, I believe Monaco provided the only example we ever saw in F-1 of staggering both the rows and columns on a 2x2 grid. Can anyone confirm this?