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The Cup of Peace and Friendship

Started by Alexey Rogachev , Aug 11 2003 07:39

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657 replies to this topic

#401 Bonde

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Posted 03 March 2009 - 16:47

Ferdi,

Indeed some of us know that book - Michal Velebny is also a TNF member!

I can very highly recommend the book, even though I don't read Czech!

#402 GrzegorzChyla

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400 posts
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Posted 03 March 2009 - 20:41

Originally posted by ferdi

Grzegorz,
What was the colour of this racecar in 1982?
The same blue, like in your photo -http://czajla.republ...1983-jurzak.jpg - from 1983?

I found one more photo of Jacek Jurzak:
http://img185.images...19830141eq6.jpg
Here:
http://www.autosport...duszki,239.html

AFAIR it was the same blue metallic in 1982 and later on.
The 'one more photo' of Jurzak is also mine, and the autosportretro forum thread you found is a memorial to those racing drivers who are no longer among us...

#403 ferdi

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Posted 04 March 2009 - 12:09

Alexey & Bonde,
Thanks!
I am a rookie on this forum.
That was a question from a rookie....

#404 ferdi

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Posted 04 March 2009 - 13:17

49th Schleizer Dreieck Rennen 6-8 August 1982
http://www.puru.de/DDRsch82.html
http://www.unser-sta...ten/Schleiz.htm

26 - Jan Veselý CS RAF 80-05 finished 4th (edited - info from sat)
Posted Image

72 - Toomas Napa SU Estonia 20 finished 5th
Posted Image

http://www.toomasnapa.com/gallery/

Posted Image

24 - Jiri Cerva CS MTX 1-06 finished 6th (edited - info from sat)
Posted Image

22 - Vaclav Lim CS Avia finished 7th
Posted Image

87 - Wolfgang Günther GDR SEG-Lada finished 8th
Posted Image

28 - Karel Jilek CS MTX1-06 finished 9th
Posted Image

96 - Manfred Günther GDR MT77-1 finished 12th
Posted Image

79 - Alexander Medvedchenko SU Estonia-20 finished 11th (edited - info from Alexander M)
Posted Image

2 - Josef Kielbania PL Promot finished 16th
Posted Image

56 -Frigyes Turán H SRG MT77 finished 18th (edited - info from sat)
Posted Image

53 -Csaba Asztalos H SRG MT77 finished 23rd (edited - info from sat)
Posted Image

21 - Jiri Moskal CS MTX 1-06 retired
Posted Image

27 - Jiri Micanek CS MTX 1-06 retired
Posted Image

58 - Csaba Kesjár H MTX 1-06 retired (edited - info from sat)
Posted Image

66- Werner Juppe GDR
Posted Image

#405 ferdi

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Posted 04 March 2009 - 13:26

Originally posted by GrzegorzChyla
and the autosportretro forum thread you found

Thanks Grzegorz!
I tried to registrate to autosportretro-forum, but I could not....

(I have hundreds of old photos from Rajd-Polski 1973-88)

#406 ferdi

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Posted 04 March 2009 - 16:18

Originally posted by ferdi
[B]Do you know where & when ?

" der Zastava von Peter Mücke "
http://www.unser-sta...ubergrennen.htm
And this car nowadays:
http://flickr.com/ph...okissig/page12/

#407 ferdi

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Posted 04 March 2009 - 18:58

One of my favorite shots from Schleiz 1982:

Vaclav Lim's "naked" Avia AE3 (edited - info from Alexey Rogachev)
Posted Image

http://www.euromonta...e=Avia&type=AE2

Posted Image

#408 sat

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Posted 05 March 2009 - 07:17

24 MTX 1-06
58 MTX 1-06
26 Jan Veselý RAF 80-05
53 Csaba Asztalos SRG MT77
56 Frigyés Turan SRG MT77

#409 Alexander M

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Posted 05 March 2009 - 09:42

#79 - Alexander Medvedchenko, Estonia-20.

#410 ferdi

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Posted 05 March 2009 - 13:04

Originally posted by sat
24 MTX 1-06
58 MTX 1-06
26 Jan Veselý RAF 80-05
53 Csaba Asztalos SRG MT77
56 Frigyés Turan SRG MT77

56 Frigyes Turán

sat,
Thank you for the additional infos!

#411 ferdi

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Posted 05 March 2009 - 13:07

Originally posted by Alexander M
#79 - Alexander Medvedchenko, Estonia-20.

Alexander, Thanks !
Which is the correct version of his name in English ?
Medvedchenko or Medwetschenko http://www.puru.de/DDRsch82.html

#412 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 05 March 2009 - 14:28

Hmm, people didn't waste time here while I was temporarily away

"Medvedchenko" is correct in English, while "Medwetschenko" is correct in German.

#413 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 05 March 2009 - 14:49

Originally posted by ferdi
One of my favorite shots from Schleiz 1982:
Vaclav Lim's "naked" Avia AE2

This is not AE2 but AE3. 1982 was its first racing season, although it was built two years earlier.

#414 Alexander M

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Posted 05 March 2009 - 18:18

As Alexey has already mentioned, both variants are acceptable. Although there are always some problems with writing Russian names ans surnames with Latin letters for me, as sometimes they appear to become almost twice longer and harder to read :lol:

#415 ferdi

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Posted 05 March 2009 - 19:19

Originally posted by ferdi
Schleiz 1976

71 - ?

" 71 Schäfer,Matthias Dresden Shiguli "
http://www.motorrenn...201970-1990.htm
Is this right ?

#416 Alexander M

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112 posts
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Posted 05 March 2009 - 19:24

Originally posted by ferdi
" 71 Schäfer,Matthias Dresden Shiguli "
http://www.motorrenn...201970-1990.htm
Is this right ?

Shiguli (or Zhiguli) is a domestic name for rear-wheel drive Lada cars, so in this case it means the engine installed in this formula.

#417 ferdi

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Posted 05 March 2009 - 19:48

Originally posted by Alexander M

Shiguli (or Zhiguli) is a domestic name for rear-wheel drive Lada cars, so in this case it means the engine installed in this formula.

Alexander,
I am Hungarian, my first Soviet-made car was a Zhiguli, later many Lada - the last was a Samara in late 80s...

My question was about the unknown driver and race-car.
I found the start-No. 71 on the 1976 Schleiz-list, but this - "Shiguli" - is not too informative.
I would like to know the exact type of this "rennwagen".

#418 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 05 March 2009 - 20:32

The one from countless numbers of East German Eigenbau's, I think... It's a question very hard to answer - as hard as identification of a Soviet ASK of the sixties...

#419 Alexander M

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Posted 05 March 2009 - 20:38

Originally posted by ferdi
Alexander,
I am Hungarian, my first Soviet-made car was a Zhiguli, later many Lada - the last was a Samara in late 80s...

My question was about the unknown driver and race-car.
I found the start-No. 71 on the 1976 Schleiz-list, but this - "Shiguli" - is not too informative.
I would like to know the exact type of this "rennwagen".

I see your point

http://www.puru.de/ddrclassic2.html#R2
The site above (already several times linked here) mentions some 'HTS Shiguli' car. Another HTS was seemingly entered by some Volker Worm (the white formula in the background of your photo could be that one, I'd say - they are quite similar).

#420 anjakub

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Posted 05 March 2009 - 20:48

HTS = Hartmut Thassler Spezial or Hartmut Thassler Shiguli

#421 Alexander M

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Posted 05 March 2009 - 21:02

Was it made in more than one example then? Rather unusual for specials.
I've also found two photos of HTS car, and it seems to be different one. Look up this photo from 1975 Cup of Peace and Friendship round and the next one in the same album:

http://racinghistory...ovaja_0019.html

Although the car pictured here and said to be an 'HTS Wolfgang Kuether 1976' have some obviously similar traits.

http://www.easter43....ath=../../sound

As does this one, not identified but possibly the same as the above model (shot in 1977 in Sternberk).

http://www.euromonta...-1977-07-03-086

After all, I've found that HTS is also mentioned here:

http://www.home.no/m...n.html#Thassler

But a great leak of Swedish language knowledge doesn't allow me to read that article. I can only suppose that there were several modifications of HTS car.

#422 anjakub

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Posted 05 March 2009 - 21:42

Alexander, special means one?
Look up - photos of Promots, almost each is diffrent.

#423 Alexander M

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Posted 05 March 2009 - 21:48

Originally posted by anjakub
Alexander, special means one?
Look up - photos of Promots, almost each is diffrent.

No, of course no, but they most often were.

#424 Steffe Ornerdal

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Posted 05 March 2009 - 22:42

But a great leak of Swedish language knowledge doesn't allow me to read that article. I can only suppose that there were several modifications of HTS car.

Alexander, It's actually Norwegian, but there is not much difference so I will give it a try:

Collection name for many East German racing cars with Lada engines, built in Hartmut Thasslers work-shop. One of the cars had a Trabant engine. These cars were known as:

HTS
Küther-HTS
RTS
BR
SEG
Freitag
Weiss-Juppe
HTS-MT
Jungnickel
MT (Melkus-Thassler)
SB

#425 ferdi

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Posted 05 March 2009 - 23:15

Gents,
Thanks for your comments!

I found one more shot on my Schleiz-76 negs:

86 - Wolfgang Küther
Posted Image

I am confused again:

" 86 Küther,Wolfgang Dresden HTS 1200 "
http://www.motorrenn...201970-1990.htm

" Kuether,Wolfgang DDR Dresden-SEG Shiguli "
http://www.puru.de/d...assic2.html#r2c

#426 Alexander M

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Posted 06 March 2009 - 09:29

Stefan, thank you!

That can also explain why Wolfgang Kuether's car is called HTS and SEG at the same time.

#427 ferdi

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Posted 06 March 2009 - 13:11

Originally posted by humphries Following dates found:-

22/07/63 Gliwice
18/06/63 Sachsenring
25/08/63 Brno ( I think this was the Czech round, not certain.)
Was there an Hungarian round?

1963. 11-12 May Budapest "Népliget", Hungary
International Race, there were no foreign entries in Formula Junior category(only bikers).
1. Ferenc Demmel H Wartburg 19m30.9s
2. Ferenc Kiss H Wartburg
3. Antal Németh H Fiat
4. Miklós de Sorgo Dr. H Wartburg
5. ... Katona H Skoda
(edited - info from anjakub)

Budapest Grand Prix - June 1963::

As I know it was not a round of the Peace-Cup, but there were some entries from Warsaw-Pact countries:
Jankowski(start no.24) PL, Lehmann(start no.99) GDR, Melkus GDR, Ferenc Kiss H, István Sulyok H, Tibor Széles H

#428 ferdi

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Posted 06 March 2009 - 21:19

Do you know the other data(start No. - names) ?

19.5.1974 Haviřov

All Formula-Easter:

21-Norbert-Jacob
23-... ...
24-... ...
27-... ...
28-... ...
45-... ...
47-... ...
49-... ...
52-... ... MTX
59-... ... MTX
72-... ... MTX
66-... ... MTX
90-... ...
93-... ...
98-Dieter Lindner
108-Wolfgang Küther
Posted Image

...nice piece of engineering...

#429 anjakub

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Posted 06 March 2009 - 21:29

1. Ferenc Demmel H Wartburg 19m30.9s
2. Ferenc Kiss H Wartburg
3. Antal .. Németh H Fiat
4. Dr. Miklos .. de Sorgo H Wartburg
5. ... Katona H Skoda

#430 ferdi

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Posted 06 March 2009 - 22:03

Thanks anjakub!

...prototype from Havirov - 1974...

#431 ferdi

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Posted 07 March 2009 - 11:44

Originally posted by ferdi
51 -

66 -

72 -

87 -

96 -

97 -

105 -

155 -
[/B]

Photos - 1982 Schleiz

These notes are from other years:
http://www.motorrenn...201970-1990.htm

What do you think ?

" SLD1980-14 51 Karg,Ference HUN WAS "

" SLD1984/102/5/15 66 Serov,Juri SU Lada "

" SLD1984/102/5/7 72 Kacai,Juri SU Lada "

" SLD1983/100/1/54 87 Krug,Wolfgang DDR Lada "

" SLD1983/100/2/32 96 Sonntag,Sieghard DDR Lada "

" SLD1976/76/7/73 97 Kuhn,Manfred Berlin Shiguli "

" SLD1989/118/2/12 105 Dinu,Sylvyn ROM Dacia "

" SLD1981/88/2/32 155 Hahnel,Gerhard DDR Lada 1300 "

#432 ferdi

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Posted 07 March 2009 - 12:05

Grzegorz Chyla wrote it:
" But - there were two Formula Ester races on Hungaroring in 1986. One was earlier (june is possible) and second was as a support race on saturday afternoon (in august). IIRC for the second race only Czech and Polish drivers were invited (in addition to Hungarians). "
here:
http://forums.autosp...ungaroring 1986

Photos from the second - the support-race 1986:

Posted Image

Grzegorz,
Can you tell me the names of the drivers ?

#433 GrzegorzChyla

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Posted 07 March 2009 - 20:02

Originally posted by ferdi
Photos from the second - the support-race 1986:

Can you tell me the names of the drivers ?

Are you sure it was 1986? I would date this cars about 5 years later

#434 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 07 March 2009 - 20:40

The first photo is Andras Gergely's car. There are some photos from the 1988 CPF Soviet round with it: http://www.racinghis...Riga/index.html. BTW, what was the name of this single-seater?

#435 ferdi

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Posted 07 March 2009 - 22:21

Originally posted by Alexey Rogachev
The first photo is Andras Gergely's car. There are some photos from the 1988 CPF Soviet round with it: http://www.racinghis...Riga/index.html. BTW, what was the name of this single-seater?

I think the name of András Gergelys car was - Forma-Easter Vasért G-01.
I am not sure, it is from a 1988 hill-climb start-list.

" Sróf Forma Easter " - the first entirely self-designed car in 1986
Constructeurs Zoltán 'Sróf' Szabó has a web-site:
http://www.srofauto.hu/startEN.php

Posted Image

1989 version:

Posted Image

" Are you sure it was 1986? I would date this cars about 5 years later "
Grzegorz,
The date of my photos - 1986.

#436 ferdi

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Posted 08 March 2009 - 16:33

1977 Schleizer Dreieck Rennen, 29-31 July
http://www.puru.de/ddrclassic1.html
" 16 Biernacki,Marcin PL RAK Polski Fiat "

2 - Marcin Biernacki PL RAK Polski-Fiat finished 16th
Posted Image

Grzegorz,
Do you have any details of this single-seater that you can share ?

#437 Tigaracing

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Posted 22 March 2009 - 12:55

Hey,
it is amazing how many old and fantastic pictures you guys found!!! :clap:

I wonder if you may know of Pictures from the HTS first owned by Wolfgang Wöhner,
then by Bernd Rauscher who transfered the car from a Formel Easter to a Formel
e600, where it was driven by Kai Kögler until the end of the DDR. I could use any
information, because I do not know in which year in between 1974-77 it was build.
You may know how to find out.;)
Thanks
Tigaracing

#438 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 25 March 2009 - 14:28

Originally posted by ferdi
1977 Schleizer Dreieck Rennen, 29-31 July

Grzegorz,
Do you have any details of this single-seater that you can share ?

I believe this is the car of the same type. The photo was taken at Minsk circuit in 1974, no. 6 was Stefan Jagielski. Unfortunately I cannot say exactly what type of Promot (Rak-Promot?) this is. Isn't it the 1971 F. Polonia car (http://forums.autosp...718#post1888718)?

#439 GrzegorzChyla

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Posted 28 March 2009 - 23:00

Poznań 1983

Jacek Szmidt and his mechanic Leszek Jamiński

Jacek Szmidt

Jerzy Mazur, Toomas Napa

64: Toivo Asmer

Vaclav Lim

6: Hieronim Kochański, 7: Jacek Jurzak

Jiri Cerva, Jiri Moskal

2: Józef Kiełbania

7: Jacek Jurzak / JJ-01

6: Hieronim Kochański

Ulli Melkus, Toomas Napa, Jan Vesely

72: Toomas Napa

me and car of Jacek Szmidt, second from left is Hieronim Kochański

Jan Vesely

Jacek Szmidt's car and my backpack :-)

Made on Orwo-chrome UT-21 positive film, with a Zorki 7 camera (standard lens and no meter...)

#440 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 29 March 2009 - 20:52

Originally posted by GrzegorzChyla
Poznań 1983
64: Toivo Asmer

79 - Alexandr Medvedchenko, Estonia 20
71 - Edgard Lindgren, Estonia-MADI 02

Great pics! :up:

#441 ferdi

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Posted 07 June 2009 - 12:36

http://www.rallyspor...p...sc&start=15

Do you know where, when, who ?
Posted Image

#442 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 07 June 2009 - 16:11

The single-seater is a MTX 1-03, which were widespread not only in Czechoslovakia but also in Bulgaria and Poland in the early 80's. Going by the name on the cockpit panel in front of the car, the driver must be Bulgarian.

#443 ferdi

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Posted 08 June 2009 - 17:07

The Bulgarian F-Easter:
http://sainzfan.live...l.com/2783.html

Debut 1978 Bulgaria - Zlatni Piassatzi - with Boncho Dunev(?)

Edited by ferdi, 08 June 2009 - 17:13.

#444 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 08 June 2009 - 17:27

Yes, the VMGI 01, or else Bulgaria 1300, and Boncho Dunev was its designer and driver. This car was was mentioned in this thread three years ago: http://forums.autosp...84#entry2277184.

#445 ferdi

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Posted 17 June 2009 - 23:06

1976 Schleiz

http://www.fotocommu...isplay/15887715

http://www.fotocommu...display=7743705

#446 Puru001

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Posted 19 August 2009 - 12:01

'Sapporoshez' should mean 'Zaporozhets' (Запорожец ) - the car produced at ZAZ factory (http://en.wikipedia....iki/Zaporozhets ). To be honest, if you didn't mention the name you have for it, it would be hard for me to recognize it. I see this car for the first time, and I don't know why Lada is mentioned, as for production cars there was no connection. The only thing I can suppose could be Lada engine inside. But since it ran in 1150cc category, there's no Lada engine that would meet the demand, while standard Zaporozhets engine was a 1198cc one. There was a ZAZ 966V modification equipped with a 887cc MeMZ-966 engine, though.
Speaking about Greiz, I would assume that to be a name of German city - as far as I know, it was Bernd Mueller's hometown.

I've also found some 'Lada KLG' (or would it be better to call it KLG-Lada?) car mentioned, as driven by Sandor Kovacz. Is it the #100 formula you've posted above?

If I remember me right, there was a LADA engine inside. The engine located in the passengers cell. The oxygene comes from the air scoop on the roof of the car.
The car are racing on the HAIGO last year. But only in one practice. And I was not on the track.

#447 Alexander M

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Joined: December 08

Posted 26 August 2009 - 20:30

If I remember me right, there was a LADA engine inside. The engine located in the passengers cell. The oxygene comes from the air scoop on the roof of the car.
The car are racing on the HAIGO last year. But only in one practice. And I was not on the track.

It sounds logical, but at the moment I can't unfortunately remember any VAZ engine that would fit in 1150cc class before the Samara's 1100cc unit was made in eighties.
It is great to hear that the car is still alive, although its condition and packaging might have changed seriously.

Edited by Alexander M, 05 September 2009 - 15:25.

#448 Puru001

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 11:45

Edgar Lindgren is back in an Estonia race car:

http://www.epidemia....o...&Itemid=496

Finished at 4th on Chayka Raceway (1 lap behind the winner)

Does everyone know the current job of Edgar?

BR
Ray

#449 Alexey Rogachev

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908 posts
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Posted 29 October 2009 - 11:58

Back into racing, in his almost 74!!! :eek:

Since 1970, Lindgren has worked in MADI Laboratory of Racing Cars, and the official title of his current position in the institute is 'P.T. department senior coach'.

Edited by Alexey Rogachev, 29 October 2009 - 12:01.

#450 RobertS

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Posted 24 November 2009 - 10:29

1986 Hungaroring

Posted Image

Back to Historical Research, in memory of David McKinney

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The Cup of Peace and Friendship

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