Looks very much his style Ibsen

Different BRM, 1962 by Gordon Bruce

known as "Stackpipe" or such I believe

Well, it is English, if not BRM ... the Allington Lotus 25 with the Climax V8, as printed in Car & Driver, December, 1963.
Tom West

And now for something completely different ... sorta.
Some of the more interesting cutaways are the full-bodied sports and production cars, even though I really dug through the F1 and other racing drawings. The extra textures and features that would go into these were just as impressive.
This is the James Allington version of the Triumph TR4, as I got it out of Car & Driver, October, 1961. Seems like a long time ago, doesn't it?
Tom West

Another full-bodied car, the Lotus 30 sports racer. If I am not mistaken, this would have been a pre-CanAm type of road racer, wouldn't it? Out of the April, 1964 issue of Car & Driver.
Tom West

Going to throw in one more for today, this one from Sergio Baratto. Not sure if the car was ever actually built or run, but it was a combination of efforts from Ferrari and Gilera Motorcycles for a Formula car, as seen in the June, 1962 issue of Car & Driver. Rather simplistic drawing after looking at those works of James Allington, but it is something a little different.
Tom West

OK, speaking of simplistic, back to some of my early stuff. This was number eight on my list, and was one of the more successful funny cars of the time. Note the sophisticated aero on that Dodge Dart body. This was the second drawing that I made for Dodge News Bureau, who were very big in the promotion of the large number of top racers who had gone over to Dodge and Mopar at the time. It was also the last drawing that I made prior to moving over to Car Craft and taking over a series that had actually inspired me to get into doing my own cutaways a couple of years earlier ... more on that with the next post ...
This was originally done with pretty much constant weight pencil on vellum, and drawn at about 36-inches in length, so it was fairly empty looking compared to later stuff. Was still probably the best of my earlier material ...
Tom West

This illustration probably represents the largest transitional step in my technique, or whatever you wish to call it, in the 70 or so illustrations that I have done. I was brought into Car Craft magazine to be considered for the Cut-A-Way of the Month series, and asked them if I could get a couple of the earlier Steve Swaja drawings just to look at the style. They gave them to me (still have them), and after looking at them, almost stopped doing these completely. What I was doing was so far below what he had done that I was close to just quitting. Instead, I picked up a couple of things, changed from vellum to mylar, downsized the drawings a bit to tighten them up, which made things much easier for me, and ended up with this illustration of the Frantic Ford Mustang. It was to have been the first of my CCM illustrations, but they forgot to arrange for the photo shoot of the car so the team headed back East, and the drawing was never published.
This was also the one where I tried to do that pencil stipple effect, which just looked like the front tire needed a shave. With Photoshop, I was able to clean that out so the drawing isn't quite so cringe-worthy for me now.
Anyway, this is the "big step" for me, and I am probably still just evolving this look to this day.
Tom West





OK, will leave you alone for a couple of days now ...

Alan,
I had intended to respond to your illustrations earlier ... always liked this kind of work, as the purpose of tech illustration is never better served than in actual instructional use. Having been in the modelkit business, I started doing exploded views for some of my car projects, and directed instruction sheets for everything from dinosaurs and World War I aircraft, to 1/16 scale Drag Racing and reissues of those beautiful Heller Sailing Ships. If you make the drawings work, you shouldn't be able to miss with the product. Even did some things in 1:1 world for multi-disc clutches, Fuel Injector units, and a Harley Carburetor. Really good to see this kind of thing honored here in this august group.

Tony, that Helmet was really cool, too ... would never have considered it was anyone's work but yours.

Thanks to both of you.
Tom West

Something different. Fraser GT, K9, 1967, Tom Killeen design which failed to get beyond the prototype stage; the proposed BRM 2l V8 would not fit the engine bay, IIRC, and the car was just too heavy to support any Imp engine derivative. Intriguing design, none the less..........

Image taken via the Imp website, artist unknown

BTW, those drawings earlier remind me of the wonderful drawings which Theo Page used to do after le Mans etc. in the early 60s.
Roger Lund

That's cool Marc.

Tony
Is the Mclaren M26 anything close to the original, the lighting effects on the red makes me wonder. I'm beginning to obsess if the red is too blue or too green or saturation is correct or ..................!
http://img198.imageshack.us/i/matthewsmclarenm26.jpg/

My contribution to the Allington engine folio. I think there is more drawing associated with this engine than meets the eye looking at the way the fuel line just stops and the ground(?) on the distributor is rudely left hanging.
http://img63.imageshack.us/i/allingtonferrari250tren.jpg/

Al

Hi everyone.

just stumbled upon this forum by coincidence through google.

its realy cool to see so many people appreciating technical art work! and Tony Matthews is here too, how cool is that! earlyer this year i met Norbert Schäfer at his home studio in frankfurt, which was obviously cool. the two biggest influences in my early years that got me into technical illustration!

i personly am a traditionaly trained technical illustrator, but unfortunatley the cross over from the drawing board to computer took place pretty much at the exact time i trained, and my first job after training was staight onto the computer and have never touched a pencil since.
not even sure where my aerograph is anymore!

i dont have anything traditional to show but you are welcome to view my comersial 3D illustration work on my web site. www.glenjohnson.de

the 300 sl is a personal project ive been working on for about 5 years in my spare time, all constructed in 3D from photos taken from google. i personly love the construction side of technical illustration and this project serves as an antidote to boring CAD DATA rendering!


Regards
glen

Welcome Glen. The Merc 300SL images are superb What software were they done in?

Good to see there are still some of plugging away illustrating, even if it is on a computer. I notice your based in Germany. How's the market out there? It's pretty dead here, although I'm still doing some. Todays it's a hinge for a shower enclosure. Exciting or what

That's interesting! I had to adjust a shower door the other day, and thought at the time - if only these spacers were eccentric I'd have another degree of adjustment! As it was they were concentric, but I managed - just - to do the job!

Just to keep this subject on Motor Racing. The manufacturer of said Shower Enclosures sponsor a Classic Historic race meeting in America

I work with the design engineers as I do all the fitting instructions. It's good to see that even if they do the design drawing on Solidworks they still start with good old engineering principles with bits of paper and anything they can find in the corner of the workshop

hi Allan
thanks for the kind words. all my 3d work is done with Cinema 4D. i think its a great piece of software thats perfect for thickos like me. i tested others out such as max and maya but they are just to complicated for illustration.

with regards to the SL, its still a long way from finished, finding reference is the biggest hurdle to getting it done, well that and my almost dangerous obsession with detail, i had to draw the line at putting threads onto the bolts for my own sanity!

the market here is pretty stable realy, germany has such a massive manufactoring sector. there still isnt realy that many good illustrators here so its not to hard to find work, although now with computers and 3d software more and more germans are picking it up.

work is work ;) i wont bore you with some of the crap i have to do sometimes, powerpoint presentation anyone!?

and jeasus, Tony Matthews is fitting kitchens, what has happend to the world!

cheers
glen

I worked in Wolfsburg in the 80's. There were very few German illustrators so it was rich pickings for the likes of us. I think one or two of the UK guys I worked with are still there. Happy times and it's good to hear that Illustration is still popular. I seem to have lost a lot of work to dull, boring renditions from AutoCad. Trying to change 3D AutoCad linework is horrendous as everything, including ellipses, seems to be made of straight lines

yeah theres a ton of work always coming out wolfsburg, i was making for a while their engine cutaways. but that was under employment with an acredited firm and as im freelance now its as good as impossible to get a foot through the door, so they wont even talk to you.
I also spent around 2 years in ingolstadt, but that was the bread and butter stuff, parts catalogues and repair manuals.

ah yes autocad, its been a while since having to work its output, but i feel your pain. that said im recieveing a delivery in the next few days of 2d autocad files of every last part for 200m long production line that needs to be constructed into 3D. i have a head ache already!

Were working at Eckard's?

no, that was with VAW, headquarters near düsseldorf, but had offices by all the VW group factories. its been swallowed up now by Bertlesmann and is a shodow of its former self.

Well fitted, quality kitchens, that's what! But not just kitchens...

My colleague pretending to work, actually trying to prevent the fence sliding down hill.

im actualy quite jealous that you get to work outside! aparently they tell me thats what that thing is on the other side of my windows!. and also to be honest if i did not have the chance to illustrate anymore then i would be more than happy to do manual work.

did you ever illustrate the 300SL, or know anyone that did?

Hi glen,

I didn't - I tried hard to do the SLR, as one was being re-built in the UK several years ago, but the person doing the re-build was a complete pain to deal with, so, as I had yet to have any dealings with MB so couldn't exert any small influence, I dropped the project. However, James Allington owned one and I'm sure he did a cutaway. I did quite a few miles in it as a passenger, it was neat being on the right, as it was a real show-stopper, and being able to raise a regal hand and smile at all the girls who practically tripped over on seeing it/me - Oh well, dream on! Funniest moment - for me - was when my door flew open at about a ton on the A1 into London - Jim's face as he sawed at the big cream Bakelite* wheel! He was surprisingly restrained in mentioning that I had obviously not shut my door properly. Macaron, Ibsen or Tom West should be able to make your dreams come true - the Fairy Godfathers of Cutawayland.

*OK, it may not have been actual Bakelite, but it was cream-coloured!

Hi Glen,

Here is a Mercedes Benz 300 SL cutaway by unknown artist. (low resolution only)



Mercedes Benz W194 300 SL 1952 by S. Wesner (?) - page 50
Mercedes Benz 300 SL engine by Vic Berris - page 60 and
Mercedes Benz 300 SLR chassis by Max Millar - page 60

Ibsen

found a better 33 to compare to the 25

now to get rid of the other post !

I should have one somewhere, just don't remember by whose hand it is. I'll try and dig it up asap

Oooo !!
If I had me 'andbag with me .......

It is very difficult to make anything of the signature, but surely that is a Betti - the use of colour and the way it is cut away means Betti to me...

'And me me 'andbag and call me Betti!

Well that doesn't look as good as the first scan to me! However, I can't make a direct comparison as you've removed the original post. Do you think I should delete my comment about it? If we're really naughty we could delete every post in turn right back to Ander's opening post!

Another Lotus 25 cutaway by Jim Allington

This one with carburetors.

Scan not sharp enough (my old scanner - a rubbish). I will rescan it later.



Ibsen

Edit, add it in again

Saw that one on Sergio's site, and wondered what was going on !, I don't think it ever passed the cutaway stage !
http://www.sergiobaratto.com/indexen.html

That's interesting - it says '91 after the signature - I think it must be one of Jim's last drawings. I wrote quite a lot about the illustrations that Tom W posted, and ABG's Ferrari engine post, but managed to delete it all on the point of 'submitting' and didn't have the energy to re-write it all, but I will do it soon. Unless I decide it really wasn't very interesting, or I forget, or I get waylaid by some red wine or I'm told to give the computer a rest...

Just noticed that as well !.........looked for it actually .........as I had seen 83 behind his sig on the Ferrari engine/gearbox.
Which, by the way is one of the few drawings that Jim signed "in" the drawing rather than beneath it.
Also, going back to the BRM engine/gearbox cutaway, Jim put his copyright "C" exactly in one of the casting lugs of the gearbox !

Yes, we both signed outside the illustration nearly every time - I went through a short phase of signing inside when I got fed-up with my name being removed, but I didn't like doing it. Jim liked to drop it under a radius arm or something, I used to avoid that, and anyway, suspension systems changed, there weren't so many tubes! Jim started adding the copyright symbol and date quite late - and in fact I've just realised that he may have re-drawn the 25 because he couldn't use the first drawing for legal reasons.

Marc,
Having looked through the Baratto website, is there anything where he talks about prints or anything on this artwork. Seems like he has done every Grand Prix car out there (at least, for a long span of time), and just having them up to look at in super-low resolution is pretty unsatisfying. Do you know of anything more than this that shows his material?
Thanks for the tip, if there is one.
Tom West

I have those exact hinges on my shower enclosure! What the illustration doesn't show is all the extra spacers I had to put in to get the doors (which curve through 90 degrees) to shut evenly.

the SLR would have been awsome to draw! shame you didnt get the chance.
i chose to co with the SL purly because refence is easyer to find. although im coming to the point that its getting realy hard to find refence for certian areas/parts.
wow your so lucky to has spend so much time in an SL. like you say its a real head tuner. theres a guy here in my town in germany that has a perfect beutifull jet black roadster and that turns more heads than when hes in his 722!
ive always wondered how stable an SL would be with the doors open, i though maybe up to 20/30 mph, not a ton!!!! was he a bit grumpy for a while!?
im pretty sure ive read somewhere they have bakelite steering wheels.

thanks ibsenop for the links. appreciated. dont be affraid to post more when you see something!. especialy if you can see the pedals. unbelievable, ive got about 6gb of photos of everything, just not the pedal mechanism!! oh and a wireing diagramme would be nice;)

If anyone knows the answer to this question it will be you gents :-

Can you please confirm what colour code the fluoro red is that Mclarens were painted in the mid to late 80s. I have been told its RAL 3024 but that seems a bit too orange, they seem to have more red in them but I cannot find a redder fluoro red in the RAL range

appreciate your help

cheers

PAUL

I'm sure I read in Jenks' book that when he drove to the arctic circle in one that they sometimes drove with the doors open on the hotter days. It's a great account of a very adventurous trip. I'll see if I can find out how fast they were going - knowing Jenks I'm sure he'd have tried to do an in depth study of how having the doors open affected the handling at high speed.

Yes indeed - here's what he wrote:



I wonder if that film still exists.

There is no tip Tom. It looks like Baratto is still very active commercially,so the only way to get a look at large
prints is to tip them in the shopping cart.
I considered mailing him some time ago to ask him to join us here, but thought better of it, as some of his work
has been aired here.
So I waas pleasantly surprised to see your posting of the Gilera engined "Ferrari".

It probably also depends on what material the colour is applied.
When I supervised the erection of the Fruehauf exhibition stands at the Amsterdam RAI halls, we always used RAL 3020 on the exhibited trailers.
In the glaring exhibition hall lights the finish looked closest to Marlboro red. I believe the McLarens are just a slight bit more "orangey", not covered
in the RAL range.

Marc,
Thanks. I am going through a lot of those old Car & Drivers, Sports Car Graphics, etc., from back in the 50s and 60s, and have something like 70 of the cutaways pulled for everyone. Putting some of those things together is a real pain, but it is sort of cool to have this kind of stuff available. Will be completing the assembly of the few more that I have scanned, but I have another pile of magazines to go yet, and there are yellow sticky notes all over the things.
I took a look at that Baratto site, and the reason that I asked about how to get prints was that I did not see a shopping cart ... doesn't look like there is any selling going on except for promotion of his new illustration work. And, there haven't been all that many new cutaways from the look of it ... I am sure that Tony can relate to that phenomenon.
I figure that I am pretty luck to have some modelkit projects going, and there are a few new cutaways that might get done for car owners and restorers, so that could at least get me through the next while.
Will keep looking for interesting material ... although I find almost any of these things interesting, as do most of you on this board, I presume.
Tom West

Tom, do you by chance have a copy of CSG for 11/64 with the double page cutaway of the Webster 2 ltr sports racer?. I have it, but as 2 separate pages, although there is a bit of overlap so Marc could no doubt "stitch" it for us. The marque is fascinating.
Roger Lund

Roger If my memory still serves me as it should, do those pages have a red background and thick black "framing"
I think it is the sport racer job where Webster even cut/shaped and rivetted his wheel rims from sheet ?

I have to have it somewhere...............

Damn work takes up so much time

Otherwise you know the way to reach me Roger

I first saw the Baratto site quite some time ago, and one could "shop" then..........now that you mention it, the site seems to have changed and
it seems orders are only being taken by mail now.

Marc,
I was wondering about that Shopping Cart thing ... glad you confirmed my observation. Any idea how much he charges, just so I am not completely shocked if the price is too high for my current budget ... which isn't going to take much.
On the Webster, I already have it pulled and pieced together. Those things are really tough to work with as the printing is so bad, the registration so far off with all the color and screen enhancements, and the crap that seems to have been printed on the plates. Like they were doing it with sponge printing in a creek somewhere (that's stream, I think, for you English folk). Really full of dust and problems, and this stuff is practically archival compared to the early Hot Rod material ... that stuff was really horrid.
Anyway, enough ... I have the Webster ...
Tom West

Creek will do Tom, it sounds more romantic. If you were English and used the word 'sponge' an Australian would say "I didn't know a Pommie knew what a sponge is!"