Worth mentioning that this was on the Clypse course, which was shorter and slower, and used by the 125s and sidecars in the late 50s, and doubtful that Eric Oliver would have pulled this off on the full circuit. But what a dasher he was ! And thanks Russell, for all the great sidecar pix, grist to the mill for all broadminded lovers of the art of roadracing. TNF - keeping the passion pounding !

Thanks for putting this picture on Russell -it shows you have some good taste !!! Another simple , fairly cheap to run quite competive machine for all

They were so fast they really needed those huge stoppers

This rider of this bike also raced the Greeves Silverstone alongside - anyone know who he was?

Is the brake a clue ? If so, how about Joe Dunphy ?

[QUOTE]Originally posted by fil2.8
[B] Is the brake a clue ? If so, how about Joe Dunphy ?

Yes, well done . Wasn't the Greeves prepared by Francis Beart?

Yes I think it was Probably the only time he tuned a 2-stroke who's going to prove me wrong ? See you later

I wonder what happened to Joe Dunphy? He was up there amongst the very best for many years. White helmet, black clover/shamrock; same design as journalist David Dixon.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Paul Rochdale
I wonder what happened to Joe Dunphy? He was up there amongst the very best for many years. White helmet, black clover/shamrock; same design as journalist David Dixon. [

Yes, and especially good at the Palace. Did you ever see him there? I heard from a someone a couple of years ago, who was around at that time, that he was involved in housing/ building work and is now retired. For a number of years in the early 70's he operated a brake lining service from South London.

No Russell, never been to Crystal Palace. I keep meaning to go there to walk the old circuit and to see if there's anything left of it. I read recently that someone was trying to rekindle racing there but stuck in the middle of South London like it is, I can't see it happening. Lydden Hill is miles away from anywhere and the Noise Police restrict them to only so many events a year. No, all my motorcycle racing was seen at Lydden and Brands, apart from a couple of trips to the Island. Oh yes, the Ulster GP too.

There's a superb 'where are they now' of former F1 drivers. If I knew how to create a website, I'd like to do one for motorcycle racers epsecially as the riders of 'my' era are now getting long in the tooth. Almost nothing about Joe Dunphy on Google. I wonder of Classicpics has a pic of Joe?

(Pulls on anorak...) Yellow helmet with a shamrock for Joe Dunphy........(adjusts specs...)....

Erm.....yes. OK then, what design/ colours adorned the crash hat of his great mate and rival, Griff Jenkins?

Pale green pudding basin with a red Welsh dragon ?

[QUOTE]Originally posted by GD66
Pale green pudding basin with a red Welsh dragon ?

Not bad! Peter Preston?

This is probably stale news to all you hot shot techno types, but just in case there is anyone out there who doesn't know - an impromptu interview with Derek Minter can be seen on YouTube. Its a few years old but worth watching - d'narf make you feel old though. :\

Thanks for that Russel. Derek is looking fine. What a legend, God bless him.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by ex Rhodie racer


Thanks for that Russel. Derek is looking fine. What a legend, God bless him. [

I like the bit where he says he was airborne at Ginger Hall after passing Jim Redman ! I hope the 'ol boy is well.

Can't recall Peter Preston, Russell, but operating on the Tom Thorp theory of alliteration, it'd be disappointing if he didn't have a large P on the front of his lid ! Do tell. And if you have any more of those sidecar pics...

Russell

The story about Crystal Palace and a supposed come back was in an issue of the Observer about two months ago. The Sports supplement has a section called 'Then & Now' which usually features old football stadiums with pictures in their heyday, then falling into disrepair then turned into a Tescos. They featured Crystal Palace circuit.

Derek Minter was my all time hero back in the 60s, and his book 'Racing all my Life' was the first book I ever bought. I've met Derek a few times and he still lives in the same modest bungalow in Blean, north of Canterbury, as he did during his racing days. He since signed the book and a few photos for me. About five years ago he crashed heavily and for no apparent reason whilst doing some demo laps at Darley Moor. I seem to recall talk about him having a minor stroke or something and he hasn't ridden since. I drove passed his house only yesterday and wondered how he's getting on. I have a rather nice photo of him winning the 1962 250cc TT on his Honda which I must ask him to sign. I recall talking to Phil Read at one of the Festival of Speeds when Minter's name cropped up. His put down response of "He's a bloody fool and will kill himself" still jars with me.

Hi Paul, that sounds like Readie!!! never heard him say a good word about anyone, why!!? he was one of the greatest riders ever (maybe thats why? ego's and all that!)
Re Crystal palace, I was there about 8 years a go now and walked round the track and could not believe..... is it Ramp bend (the bend the stadium almost sits on) no run off and high sleepered walls
I never saw any racing there, but I felt quite emotional thinking of all the things and people who had been round there!!(silly sod!!)
You guys may already have it? but there is a great book called "Racing at Crystal Palace" it is brilliant features cars and bikes but well worth having, its by Phillip Parfitt, published by MRP books, ISBN 0-947981-38-1.
Back to Peter Preston he wasn't a name I was familiar with but it just so happens in this book is a great picture of a race start from the 1963 August Bank holiday meeting and on the front row is .... Peter Preston!!

More to follow

As usual CP stunning pictures!! do you own them, by that I mean have you got the photo and are scanning them in for us to see?
Graham.

1. Joe Dunphy
2. Bill Ivy (you've really got his autograph??) and Griff Jenkins (obviously before he wore a red Welsh dragon on his helmet)
3. Derek Minter - a classic shot of him on his usual No11 plate.

Superb as usual, John.

Yes classicpics, lovely shots. I particularly like the one of The Mint. Jenks was also a great favourite of mine. I really thought he was destined for greatness after he won the Manx, but somehow he never quite made the final leap.

The Derek Minter pic looks like it was taken on Bottom bend (or whatever tosh they call it now) at Brands and wasn't taken near the end of his career as he rode Seeley-Matchlesses for the last couple of years. The fairing was made by Avon which as you say had a perspex pointy nose to it. The racing number was vertically placed behind it. Yes, reflections made it difficult for time keepers to see the number so the perspex was changed for a blunter GRP nose. As for the leathers, they weren't so well attired in those days. Look at the outside edge of his boots. Hailwood often duck taped his up. Both the leathers, boots and even the helmets seemed to go on for ever in those days. Still my all time hero.

Incidentally I've just discovered that a new book from that prolific writer Mick Walker is due for release on 30 April 2008 is called DEREK MINTER.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Derek-Minter-Brand...r/dp/1859836011

Hi Paul

I gonna have to disagree with you. Minter rode for Colin Seeley in 66 only. In fact I'm reasonably certain that he changed back to his Nortons before the end of that season. Again, I seem to remember him claiming that the G50/7R engines lost power as the season progressed and the weather became hotter ( I'm not making this up! ) The picture then could be 65, late 66 or his final season 67. I dont think he was quite the force he had once been when on the 7R/G50, although wouldn't you agree that he was past his best by then ? I absolutely agree that he was one of Britain's greatest around the early sixties. Someone, I think Charlie Rous, thought he was never quite the same rider after the Dave Downer incident. What do you think? As a kid he was one of my heros too.

On the boot thing: I was once chucked of the grid at Brands for having taped up boots!!

Well it seems that the Dave Downer incident happened in May 1963 at Brands. My very first motorcycle race was six weeks later at the first meeting of the newly opened Grand Prix circuit. What was astonishing was that Minter was riding after receiving a broken back. I can't say whether or not his form deteriorated after that as that was the only period I saw him ride, and he won the King of Brands title a few times and was damn near unbeatable at his other favourite circuit Oulton Park. Also Geoff Duke chose him to ride the Gileras. As for the last year or two of his career, by that time I was in the Army serving in Germany so gradually lost touch with bikes and got interested in F1. You may well be right, but I'm sure Mick Walker's new book will have all of the answers.

Going back to the Dave Downer incident - and for those who don't know, Dave Downer was an up-and-coming 23yr old rider who rode one of Paul Dunstall's Domiracers and was involved in a fatal crash with Minter - one story doing the rounds at the time (bare with me, I was only a 16yr old scrap) was that Minter overtook Downer at Dingle Dell in a reckless move and had both of them off. Probably a load of tosh though.

Yeah, but Duke had chosen him to ride the Gilera before the Downer incident. In fact he had beaten Hailwood at Imola just weeks before ( or is my memory playing tricks). If I recall, the inquest into Dave Downer's death attributed the crash to an oil line on Minter's bike becoming detached. Isn't Phil Read quoted as saying on the day he thought someone was going to die - after pulling out of the very same race?

Thank you Graham, I'm very luck to own then, I was offered daft money by a collector once, but being a nostalgic old sod I've still got them.
I scanned them in a few years ago when we had a new flatbed scanner at work. Most of my pictures are on slides and need scanning, about the only time I used film was when Malcome Carling (MCN) used to hand me a few rolls. He was a nice chap, always loaded up with cameras and lenses as big as him and me with my Konica SLR and 200mm lens. At least I could stand on the edge of the track and not get moved on!

The picture was taken in the Esses at Mallory in 1966.

I remember Derek racing his cotton with the perpex nose cone fitted, but as you say the timekeepers objected to the design! I also remember him falling off the cotton at Mallory and injuring his hand, what a mess it was, but he rode on at the meeting. It was the way he earned a living as a professional racer, no sick notes, no duvet days. I also remember he rode the Gilera not long after the big accident, it was noticable that he couldn't hold his head steady, coming down the back straight and into the Esses over the bumps it looked as if his head was on a spring bouncing up and down. Once again it could be said that he and it applies to many others, shouldn't have been racing so early, but who would pay his bills.
Roy Mayhew had a big accident at Devils Elbow and was killed at his next meeting at Crystal Palace a couple of weeks later.

I was told at the time of the incident with Dave Downer that Minter leaned over so far his footrest dug in and caused the accident. Whatever the cause it was a sad day to loose an up and coming young racer.
The other on that sticks in my mind is the loss of Fred Neville who I'm sure would have been a really great rider.

This one is at Gerrards Bend. He was a hard racer and a dedicated professional with a cheeky smile.

He was know as a home circuit rider, but went equally well at any circuit in the world. Pity he won the TT on the 250 Honda, that did him no favours, he would have been world Champion given good works bikes like the Honda, not ex works 6 year old Gileras!!

From Minter's Book "Racing all My Life" pubsihed in 1965.

I returned from Italy in high spirits after a succesful meeting, Gileras finished first and second (John Hartle) ahead of Mikes MV. I was not to know that within a few weeks I was to crash heavily at Brands in the tragic accident that would cost the life of Dave Downer. I was lucky to escape with a broken back, broken in three places, a cracked shoulder blade and a badly cut knee and cuts and bruises on all corners and later had to have grass removed from my knee and shoulder!!
I was back within three months registering record breaking speeds in tests at Monza (121 mph lap) and Oulton Park. August Monday at Oulton Park he broke the lap record at 92.86 and became the first rider to win the 500c British championship three years running. "I was still a hospital out patient at the time attending physiotherapy three times a week."
There is also a picture of him at Brands in 1964 with the plastic nose cone on the fairing of his back to front Norton.

Your absolutely right about Fred Neville, one of those guys to show natural talent almost from the start. At the time of his death he was only in his fourth season of racing and was regularly up there amongst the greats of the day. Do you have any pIctures of Fred?

I don't think so, I still have lots to sort out.

My vivid memory of him was when he crashed in the Esses at Mallory he lost it in the right hander went onto the grass, and in the early days there were some bushes in front of the grass bank, got it sort of in a straight line but slid off and Fred and bike dissapeared into the shrubbery. As the marshalls ran towards the bushes he walked out with a big grin on his face, crash hat in hand, a lucky escape.

As you probably know he was killed when leading the 61 Junior MGP , only his second year on the Island. At the NW 200 earlier in the year he at one stage overtook Mcintyre to take the lead of I think the 350 race. He was killed after crashing the 7R at Appeldene in appallingly slippery conditions. His helper at the Manx that year was his mate Cyril Jones who you may remember racing a variety of bikes in the sixties, including a 125 Tohatsu. Unfortunately, he too was killed, at Snetterton in, I think, 1972.

At the 1961 NW 200 he retired in the 350 race after lying second, but finished 3rd in the 500 behind Bob Mac and Phil Read. Beating Alister King, Ellis Boyce and Peter Chatterton

Great thread ! Russell, I think I read in Classic Racer a few years back that Ivy's oil crash on the Kirby Metisse was due to a split in an oil line dumping oil on the back tyre. They replaced the oil line, and then it happened again, I think it was only a week or two later, then they discovered they had a bad batch of rubber oil line, replaced all the lines with fresh stock and the problem was solved. For me, there would still be a small light going on in the back of your brain when tipping it into Paddock Bend next time out....

This rather dashing chap was mentioned recently. WWWW?

TDIC Yamaha - no idea who is on it. Was he a trainee cop at Hendon Police College!!

What a great collection!! and to have them signed as well!!....
With regards to the Phil Read comment after the Downer Minter accident, sadly another typical Phil Read comment taken with a pinch of salt, as I have read in a publication called "Brands Hatch 50 years of motorcycle racing" which was published in 1978!! 30 years a go I cant believe that!! comments from the people behind the scenes at Brands( you ex racer guys would know them probably? I will scan the pages in later so you can see the pictures) that that Minter/Downer dice was the greatest race they had ever scene!!
The picture of Derek Minter in CP's post earlier I would say was at the esses at Mallory.
Graham.

note to self read all the posts before replying to one!!!!!

I always though TD1A - one of the first. Photo is around '65. As to the hursuit jockey, he was well known on the national scene at the time.

My guess would be Reg Everett on a Yamaha TD1A or B around 1964 not sure of the location but I am sure some sort of town show.
cheers
Peter

This is a either an A or B, albeit with non standard fairing etc. You could be right - very early strokers are not my strong suit.

Is there a 'colonial' connection to the guy in your photo?

Reg it is. Don't know where, but as you say a show of some sort. Never quite sure of the differences between the A, B and C - all I remember is the chrome exhausts!

Scan of behind the scenes guys at Brands you may know/remember some of them?

well i won the *dave downer* trophy a few time ,it was awarded to best gravesend eagels club member performance in mgp,and derek minters name was a dirty word in that club!,as downer was a member.
but i had no bad bad opinions of minter.

Another couple of WWW's. The first too easy. The second very difficult - I suspect ex-Rhodie is the only one in with a chance!

Well done, how many Manx finishes? Did club members think the Inquest findings a bit suspect? Although I'm guessing your involvement was some years later?

Is number 42 that man Chris Vincent again?