As note by the poster below, the thread title should be: Bruno Senna. Should a big team in F1 risk it and give him a seat in 2009?
Looking at Senna's performance in Monaco, I think it's pretty obvious this will be his only season in GP2 before he makes the jump into Formula One. I, however, think that Bruno shouldn't jump straight into a BMW, Ferrari, McLaren or a Renault, instead, I think he should head for a up and coming team down the pitlane, maybe Red Bull or Toyota to get Bruno started.
I don't think Bruno should take the "Lew-esque" route and go into a big team, as that could potentionally wreck his career. I think he could jump into a mid-field team and make his way up.
Do you think Senna should go straight into a front-running team, or squabble out in the mid-field.
Bruno Senna. Should a big team in F1 risk it and give him a seat in 2009?
Started by
D.M.N.
, May 30 2008 19:36
95 replies to this topic
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#2
giacomo
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 19:42
Improper thread title.
Here the correct version:
Bruno Senna. Should a big team in F1 risk it and give him a seat in 2009?
Here the correct version:
Bruno Senna. Should a big team in F1 risk it and give him a seat in 2009?
#3
Gecko
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 19:43
I don't think Senna has shown anything yet that would merit him a seat in a top F1 team.
#4
D.M.N.
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 19:44
Originally posted by giacomo
Improper thread title.
Here the correct version:
Bruno Senna. Should a big team in F1 risk it and give him a seat in 2009?
Sorry, I can't change the title now.
#5
Lazarus II
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 19:47
If he could get a "big seat" I think he should be all over it like a duck on a junebug. Better to be given a good solid car than a POS and be told to make a front runner out of it.
#6
BMW_F1
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 19:49
Top team is the way to go , if available of course..
#7
Crazy Ninja
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 19:50
Three years would be too many in gp2 he'll end up like pantano.
Imo it would be best for him to do a years testing with an f1 team before he races, even though it hasnt yet worked for piquet (give the poor lad a wee bit more time) i think the experience in driving an f1 car for a year would be invaluable and prepare him better for his debut, cos the attention around him when he finally does start an f1 race will be immense.
Imo it would be best for him to do a years testing with an f1 team before he races, even though it hasnt yet worked for piquet (give the poor lad a wee bit more time) i think the experience in driving an f1 car for a year would be invaluable and prepare him better for his debut, cos the attention around him when he finally does start an f1 race will be immense.
#8
Juan Kerr
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 19:51
In the old days it would be best to jump into a lower team an muscle the car up the grid to a grid slot and performance that out-weights the car's potential. That's what Schumacher and Senna and various other greats have done but these days its completely different. Bruno Senna in a team with brilliant seup engineering would excel as opposed to a lower team that could contribute to him not breaking the surface.
Look at Bourdais and Vettel only circumstances seperate them but hardly anyone notices that they're probably driving their hearts out.
The team are so important these days to the drivers' speed you'd always be better off in a top team.
Look at Bourdais and Vettel only circumstances seperate them but hardly anyone notices that they're probably driving their hearts out.
The team are so important these days to the drivers' speed you'd always be better off in a top team.
#9
Josta
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 19:57
Originally posted by Crazy Ninja
Three years would be too many in gp2 he'll end up like pantano.
Imo it would be best for him to do a years testing with an f1 team before he races, even though it hasnt yet worked for piquet (give the poor lad a wee bit more time) i think the experience in driving an f1 car for a year would be invaluable and prepare him better for his debut, cos the attention around him when he finally does start an f1 race will be immense.
I think a couple of years ago, you would be spot on. The thing is that the current testing restrictions mean that test drivers don't actually test that much. I think Piquet is a prime example of the results of these restrictions.
Give him a seat in a McLaren and he will beat Lewis. That is my opinion anyway.
#10
KWSN - DSM
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 19:58
I think that any driver should jump at the chance for a F1 race set regardless of which team offer it.
However he and many other GP2 drivers must be cursing Piquet Jr every day, he is putting all of them on the back foot. A driver who could win in GP2, who could be fast in GP2, who could be involved with the battle for the Championship in GP, and who were groomed as a F1 driver for a full season, before being placed in a top teams (admitted not very good) car.
And Piquet is the biggest negative surprise driving wise this season, a lot of posters here were sceptical at best, and have all been proven 100% correct. Piquet is simply not good enough, and all current GP2 drivers will carry his stigma instead of Rosberg, Hamilton.
Senna will to some be:
"Another hyped Brazilian, who may be looking better than he is due to the resources that his name alone give him"
I may be leaning that way myself, not that he is a poor racer. he is obviously very capable, but for all my vitrol about Piquet Jr. so is he, it is just that being a capable driver is no longer enough to warrant a F1 seat.
I see no reason that any top team offer Senna a race seat.
However he and many other GP2 drivers must be cursing Piquet Jr every day, he is putting all of them on the back foot. A driver who could win in GP2, who could be fast in GP2, who could be involved with the battle for the Championship in GP, and who were groomed as a F1 driver for a full season, before being placed in a top teams (admitted not very good) car.
And Piquet is the biggest negative surprise driving wise this season, a lot of posters here were sceptical at best, and have all been proven 100% correct. Piquet is simply not good enough, and all current GP2 drivers will carry his stigma instead of Rosberg, Hamilton.
Senna will to some be:
"Another hyped Brazilian, who may be looking better than he is due to the resources that his name alone give him"
I may be leaning that way myself, not that he is a poor racer. he is obviously very capable, but for all my vitrol about Piquet Jr. so is he, it is just that being a capable driver is no longer enough to warrant a F1 seat.
I see no reason that any top team offer Senna a race seat.
#11
peroa
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 20:06
Originally posted by KWSN - DSM
I think that any driver should jump at the chance for a F1 race set regardless of which team offer it.
However he and many other GP2 drivers must be cursing Piquet Jr every day, he is putting all of them on the back foot. A driver who could win in GP2, who could be fast in GP2, who could be involved with the battle for the Championship in GP, and who were groomed as a F1 driver for a full season, before being placed in a top teams (admitted not very good) car.
And Piquet is the biggest negative surprise driving wise this season, a lot of posters here were sceptical at best, and have all been proven 100% correct. Piquet is simply not good enough, and all current GP2 drivers will carry his stigma instead of Rosberg, Hamilton.
Well, I`m not a fan of Piquet jun., but he chose the wrong team with the wrong team boss to start his F1 career.
#12
Josta
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 20:12
Originally posted by KWSN - DSM
I see no reason that any top team offer Senna a race seat.
You may be right. But goddamit, I really want to see the name Senna in the winners circle again.
#13
Risil
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 20:12
If he wins the GP2 title, so long as Gerhard Berger's around he'll get a seat.
IMO Piquet should be given a little longer to prove himself. It took Kovalainen longer than this to get on terms with Fisichella, and Nelsinho has to deal with Fernando. Not even Hamilton managed that all at once, in a car that was in some way driveable.
IMO Piquet should be given a little longer to prove himself. It took Kovalainen longer than this to get on terms with Fisichella, and Nelsinho has to deal with Fernando. Not even Hamilton managed that all at once, in a car that was in some way driveable.
#14
Risil
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 20:13
[Also, where's the "GP2 title or it's sports cars or America for you sonny Jim" option?]
#15
KWSN - DSM
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 20:22
Originally posted by peroa
Well, I`m not a fan of Piquet jun., but he chose the wrong team with the wrong team boss to start his F1 career.
Which would not be an issue if he was just somewhat close to the other driver in the team, but obviously he is far far away.
He should have gone to Force India, eaten Sutil for lunch, and all would think that he was something. Now that he started his career being measured against a true yardstick, all can see that he is nothing special, and the very reason that Hamilton is where he is now, is that he was measured against the same yardstick, and at worst came out even.
Them are the breaks. Piquet will not be the first driver entering F1 with great expectations, who will then leave having proved himself not being that good a F1 after all.
His additional issue may be his less than sunny disposition.
#17
postajegenye
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 20:43
No big team would hire him I guess.
#18
jb_128
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 20:45
Originally posted by D.M.N.
I think it's pretty obvious this will be his only season in GP2 before he makes the jump into Formula One.
Why are you trying to decide what's best for him when you know nothing about him? It's his second season in GP2 and he did a season of British F3 and less than half a season in Formula Renault before that. No serious karting.
So his learning curve has been extremely steep and he still has quite a few rough edges to smoothen out, although I think it's fair to say that he has already risen considerably above the expectations that many people had when he started off a couple of years ago. This season is a bit of a make or break season for him and his Monaco performance was certainly an important step in showing that he should be taken seriously. But he'll need a few more races like that before your question becomes relevant.
Although personally I don't think you question is meaningful either way. I see no reason to believe that for a young F1 driver there might actually be any advantage in joining a lower ranked team than possible. If anything, a top team will be in a much better position to help the driver make the most out of himself than a lower team.
A more interesting question would be: where can he go if he doesn't make it to F1 next year? A third GP2 season? Probably the only way to go if you're going for F1. For a while it looked like DTM might be an alternative route to F1, with lots of talent like Green, Paffett, di Resta, Premat and Jarvis going there, but since Paffett failed to get into F1 with Prodrive, McLaren and that team Alesi was trying to set up it doesn't look that way anymore.
#19
dutra
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 20:50
At least one more solid year in GP2. Even with the title this year it would be too soon.
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#20
Arion
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 21:12
Originally posted by KWSN - DSM
However he and many other GP2 drivers must be cursing Piquet Jr every day, he is putting all of them on the back foot.
I think they should be cursing Glock, Piquet at least have excuses like the Flav factor, 2XWDC teammate. And Glock actually won the GP2 title.
I don't see any top team seats become available next season, so nope.
#21
scheivlak
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 21:13
Another poll with only stupid alternatives 
It's not up to him to choose, it's the teams who have to decide.
It's not up to him to choose, it's the teams who have to decide.
#22
giacomo
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 21:55
Its never to soon to enter F1, big talent provided of course.Originally posted by dutra
At least one more solid year in GP2. Even with the title this year it would be too soon.
Compare Raikkonen or Hamilton.
#23
dutra
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 22:01
Originally posted by giacomo
Its never to soon to enter F1, big talent provided of course.
Compare Raikkonen or Hamilton.
Yes, but it depends of your options. I don't see good seats available to Senna next year on F1.
#24
giacomo
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 22:03
If there isn't a good seat available, you have to be content with a midfield seat. Or forget about F1 at all.Originally posted by dutra
Yes, but it depends of your options. I don't see good seats available to Senna next year on F1.
Remember, Raikkonen started in a midfield team.
#25
dutra
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 22:08
Well, I partially agree with you. Better be in F1 anyway.
#26
KWSN - DSM
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 22:09
Originally posted by Arion
I think they should be cursing Glock, Piquet at least have excuses like the Flav factor, 2XWDC teammate. And Glock actually won the GP2 title.
I don't see any top team seats become available next season, so nope.
Glock is not showing quite as good as I had expected, but he is not being humiliated by Trulli, so not in agreement there.
#27
pingu666
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 22:19
goto indycar and do the odd sportscar race too, forge his own destiny
#28
jimm
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Posted 30 May 2008 - 22:29
It is hard to know how good he really is.
This year he looks very good but has not really made you think he was his uncle's calibre. That said, he has not raced that long compared to most at this level as he started much later and so is doing relatively well considering that...does not seem to have Aryton's determination or personality but who does.
I think his biggest problem is that because of his name, he will always be compared to Ayrton especially in Brazil so I am voting mid-level team. In a top team, anything less than a season like LH's last year will be a disappointment.
This year he looks very good but has not really made you think he was his uncle's calibre. That said, he has not raced that long compared to most at this level as he started much later and so is doing relatively well considering that...does not seem to have Aryton's determination or personality but who does.
I think his biggest problem is that because of his name, he will always be compared to Ayrton especially in Brazil so I am voting mid-level team. In a top team, anything less than a season like LH's last year will be a disappointment.
#29
mclarensmps
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Posted 31 May 2008 - 00:23
I couldn't quite say I'm fond of the man, maybe he's not ready for F1 yet in my eyes, or he's just one of those "names".
#30
Bob Nomates 2nd
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Posted 31 May 2008 - 00:35
Senna was the greatest driver but in order to do it right, i should start with a mid team.
#31
wingwalker
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Posted 31 May 2008 - 09:50
I don't follow GP2 enough to give an answer. But it's a tough time to be a rookie in F1 - Rosberg, Kubica, Hamilton all entered F1 within a year and now every new comer is expected to be as good as them, which ain't easy.
#32
Mika Mika
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Posted 31 May 2008 - 10:05
I've only caught a couple of GP2 races this year, Bruno, whilst pretty good, didnt seem on the same caliber as Rosberg/Kovo or Ham/PK....
#33
postajegenye
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Posted 31 May 2008 - 10:06
Nelson Piquet Jr. almost won the title in 2006, was ahead of Hamilton a number of times, scored impressive wins.
Bruno Senna has scored two wins so far, and a couple of podiums.
Do you think Piquet deserves a seat in a top F1 car?
If no, why do you think Bruno would deserve it ?
He may be better than Piquet. He may become a good F1 driver one day. He's done a decent job in GP2 this year.
But if his name wasn't Senna, I'm not sure we would be even talking about an F1 drive here, let alone a big F1 team.
Bruno Senna has scored two wins so far, and a couple of podiums.
Do you think Piquet deserves a seat in a top F1 car?
If no, why do you think Bruno would deserve it ?
He may be better than Piquet. He may become a good F1 driver one day. He's done a decent job in GP2 this year.
But if his name wasn't Senna, I'm not sure we would be even talking about an F1 drive here, let alone a big F1 team.
#34
Josta
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Posted 31 May 2008 - 10:10
Originally posted by Mika Mika
I've only caught a couple of GP2 races this year, Bruno, whilst pretty good, didnt seem on the same caliber as Rosberg/Kovo or Ham/PK....
I predict Grosjean will win the GP2 title with Senna 2nd. Having said that, this would buck the trend of Renault taking on the runner up. Every year of GP2, Renault have signed the runner up as a test driver.
#35
BuzzingHornet
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Posted 31 May 2008 - 10:16
Why on earth Bruno adopted the name Senna beats me.. he's got enormous boots to fill and while he's obviously a very good driver, is he really 'special' in any way?
Its a good marketing ploy but the nearer to F1 you get the bigger fool you're going to look if you carry that name and are rubbish... Notice there's no talk of him going to McLaren... only to Berger's team...
Its a good marketing ploy but the nearer to F1 you get the bigger fool you're going to look if you carry that name and are rubbish... Notice there's no talk of him going to McLaren... only to Berger's team...
#36
glorius&victorius
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Posted 31 May 2008 - 10:17
By all means he should never go under Flavio Briatore's wings.
I'd say one year under Gerhard's guidance, and then a top team placement. Williams wouldn't be bad as well.
A the same time B.Senna doens't look very tough and hard to me... he looks like a very nice guy... and his entry in F1, if every would be more symbolic.
In fact it would be cool if he arrives in F1, does one race and hangs up the helmet out if respect for his great Uncle. Just for the fans to have the Senna name one more time on the grid. That would be a real class act.
but then again that is just a personal wish.... (its his life his career, his name....)
I'd say one year under Gerhard's guidance, and then a top team placement. Williams wouldn't be bad as well.
A the same time B.Senna doens't look very tough and hard to me... he looks like a very nice guy... and his entry in F1, if every would be more symbolic.
In fact it would be cool if he arrives in F1, does one race and hangs up the helmet out if respect for his great Uncle. Just for the fans to have the Senna name one more time on the grid. That would be a real class act.
but then again that is just a personal wish.... (its his life his career, his name....)
#37
postajegenye
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Posted 31 May 2008 - 10:17
Originally posted by Josta
I predict Grosjean will win the GP2 title with Senna 2nd. Having said that, this would buck the trend of Renault taking on the runner up. Every year of GP2, Renault have signed the runner up as a test driver.
Yeah, and every title winner got a drive in F1 the following year. I think this trend will be broken if anyone but Grosjean wins the title this year.
#38
primer
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Posted 31 May 2008 - 10:41
First let Mr. Senna win the GP2 title okay although it must be said that because of sheer marketability of his name, some F1 teams might be motivated to pick him over other GP2 drivers.
although it must be said that because of sheer marketability of his name, some F1 teams might be motivated to pick him over other GP2 drivers.
#39
Man of the race
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Posted 31 May 2008 - 11:02
I would let him have his GP2 phase first and gain new experiences, then think about going further.
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#40
mursuka80
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Posted 31 May 2008 - 11:32
Anything that bruno has done doesnt scream F1 to me 
Nepotism **** off!
Nepotism **** off!
#41
noikeee
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Posted 31 May 2008 - 12:03
Originally posted by BuzzingHornet
Why on earth Bruno adopted the name Senna beats me..
Not this **** again. : Seriously, do a search or something, there have been huge flame wars just because of this insignificant detail.
That been said, some people here think he's the reincarnation of Ayrton. No, he's a different guy, just happens to be related.
I think he's in a bit of a dilemma now, because it's not clear if he's 100% ready for F1, but at the same time doing a 3rd season of GP2 is a risk, F1 teams don't tend to look at 3rd-year-guys, if you don't win the title in your 3rd year everything's over. However, since the start of the regular GP2 season I've noticed an improvement by him, I think he's been driving better than in GP2 Asia. Winning at Monaco will be a big boost in confidence, and so will the fact he's leading the championship now. If he can keep this run of form, then yes, he'd be ready for F1 and there'd be no point in doing another GP2 year.
But all of this depends on the teams and not on the driver, it's not like he can go to Ferrari and say "i'm ready to drive for you, give me a seat". It doesn't even make sense to think of a top team next year, there are no open seats, and there are much better available drivers who are already part of the F1 grid. It's obvious that if he gets a seat, it won't be with a Ferrari, McLaren or a BMW.
#42
wingwalker
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Posted 31 May 2008 - 12:31
I don't think he is in any kind of dillema. If he will get an offer from F1, race or test driver, he will accept it. Everyone in GP2 would.
#43
noikeee
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Posted 31 May 2008 - 12:37
Originally posted by wingwalker
I don't think he is in any kind of dillema. If he will get an offer from F1, race or test driver, he will accept it. Everyone in GP2 would.
Yeah, I suppose you're right, I'm just pointing out to moving to F1 if you're not ready for it isn't an ideal situation, although nobody would prefer staying in GP2.
#44
wingwalker
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Posted 31 May 2008 - 12:41
Oh, that's for sure. Espacially with NR RK and NH setting standards for new comers, as I said already.
#46
BuzzingHornet
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Posted 31 May 2008 - 13:28
Originally posted by paranoik0
Not this **** again. : Seriously, do a search or something, there have been huge flame wars just because of this insignificant detail.
I don't care about flame wars, i'm really not interested... 'seriously'
Basically the guy's name isn't really Senna.
#47
noikeee
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Posted 31 May 2008 - 13:48
Originally posted by BuzzingHornet
I don't care about flame wars, i'm really not interested... 'seriously'
Just as much as Ayrton's name wasn't really Senna.
#48
lustigson
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Posted 31 May 2008 - 14:35
As much as I would like to see Bruno Senna (née Lalli) make it into Formula One, I believe he does not have the talent of his uncle. Bruno seems to be more of a Mansell: a hard-working, hard-charging racer, who can get the job done, but not as easily as Ayrton made it seem, sometimes.
The driver market actually doesn't revolve around drivers, especially with only 20 seats left on the grid, so any drive to come Senna's way, he should seriously consider. A third season in GP2 would be his worst bet, so one could say that Bruno is at a crucial point in his career: will he or won't he be in frame for an F1 seat for 2009. Otherwise, DTM, IndyCar or (American) Le Mans series beckon, I'm afraid.
The driver market actually doesn't revolve around drivers, especially with only 20 seats left on the grid, so any drive to come Senna's way, he should seriously consider. A third season in GP2 would be his worst bet, so one could say that Bruno is at a crucial point in his career: will he or won't he be in frame for an F1 seat for 2009. Otherwise, DTM, IndyCar or (American) Le Mans series beckon, I'm afraid.
#49
SeanValen
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Posted 31 May 2008 - 15:28
If he was really good, it'l be cool. But maybe were always going to be a bit obessed with Senna.
Alot of people will always miss Senna, and his nephew is a blood link, so of cource I'll be rooting for him if he's capable of it, and if he isn't, well still some claps for trying, why not, not everyone is meant to be great, but you can respect the effort.
Alot of people will always miss Senna, and his nephew is a blood link, so of cource I'll be rooting for him if he's capable of it, and if he isn't, well still some claps for trying, why not, not everyone is meant to be great, but you can respect the effort.
#50
Man of the race
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Posted 31 May 2008 - 19:04
IF Bernie is involved, F1 audience undeniably will soon have funkyzeit mit Bruno.
