1912 AAA Championship

I was looking at this last night, and have a few questions.

The Haresnipe champion for this year was Ralph de Palma (source: Peter Higham's Guinness International Guide to Motorsport). However, in Phil Harms' data, Ted Tetzlaff has 20 more points than de Palma over the year. So how come Tetzlaff wasn't declared champion? Is this because

a) Higham is wrong
b) Harms' is wrong - perhaps he included more events that Haresnipe did? Can't count (I haven't checked this by adding up points totals)?
c) the declared champion didn't depend on absolute points totals?

In addition, in the Indy 500 that year there were 29 entrants (source: Indianapolis website 1998). Harms lists 24 starters (agrees with the website here), and has 3 non-starters (Romine, Shambaugh and Oldfield). Who were the other two entrants, presumably who didn't turn up?

Darren, there was no 1912 AAA Championship. Many years later, Val Haresnape and Russ Catlin independantly compiled their own chmapionships, and you shouldn't lose sleep over that - you can create your own, if you want!

As for the Indy 500, I believe there were only 27 entries: #1-31, without #11, 13, 20 and 30. I have also seen the figure 29, but this may be a typo - I have never seen other entries mentioned anywhere.

Since there was no AAA National Championship in 1912, this is largely a "non-issue." The only actual question being asked is about the International Sweepstakes, which I am sure we can sort ot.

Which is why I said that the Haresnipe champion was de Palma. I was wondering how Harms came up with a different points leader, and how Haresnipe decided which events to count. Are Harms and Haresnipe using the same events, different points, whatever? I know that this was done retrospectively after WW2, but I was just trying to understand........

Darren, you are wasting your time on something that simply does not matter. Harms seems to have found several minor variations in various race results and made adjustments as needed. I always asked him why he wasted his time on this stupid points nonsense when there were more pressing issues needing attention.

Catlin was post-WW2, Haresnape did his damage in the 1928/1929 period.

Question about the championship. There was no official championship but some people are calculating whatever, something I like to do either. Therefore very unofficcially my try.

http://www.champcars...m/year/1912.htm gives 2000 points fo2 DePalma and 1900 for Tetzlaff.
However calculating Tetzlaff points by looking at his results gives him 2020 points
There seems to be one possibility why Tetzlaff gets 120 points less. Apparently he was relieved by Caleb Bragg during the Indy 500. In this race Tetzlaff got 520 points. Maybe 120 og them were stripped. Anyway they did not go to Bragg.

Since there is no championship why are these race called championship events. And the American GP is explicitly called a non-championship event.

About the 29 entrants.
I have searched through my Indy books which could give statitistical information.

Jack C. Fox: The Indianapolis 500 (1967); 24 drivers and 3 non-qualifiers. In stead of Romine, Fox gives George Fuller as driver however with the same car number (27).
Floyd Clymer: Indianapolis 500 Race History does not give a start list at all.

And also Phil Harms gives only 27 entrants.
Couldn't the website be wrong.


Gerrit Stevens

I wouldn't call it damage, but it gets a bit annoying when people treat these "Championships" like something which they quite obviously weren't. That is not to say "Don't you do that!", Darren, don't get me wrong - of course you're perfectly entitled to research the subject, it's just that I can't be of any help in this matter. Years ago when I first looked into it, I found that these points tables didn't make much sense to me - in fact, I think they're pretty amateurishly compiled! I ignore them ever since. But you pays your money...

Originally posted by billthekat
I always asked him why he wasted his time on this stupid points nonsense when there were more pressing issues needing attention.

And what did he say?

I don't suppose there is a missing race somewhere of top line quality...

Okay, one more time....

In 1908, the AMA asked the AAA to bring a bit of order to the increasing chaotic world of American motor racing. This is discussed in this article Rear View Mirror coumn on the AAA several years ago.

Here is a very relevant quote from the column:

1909 was an important year in the racing history of the AAA. In late 1908, the AAA was approached by a group of automobile manufacturers to develop a better mechanism to police racing. Although the manufacturers had an organization in place, its abilities and impartiality was sorely tested by the end of 1908. After a series of discussions, there was the establishment of the Manufacturers Contest Association with the AAA creating the Contest Board to sanction and regulate American racing. The AAA established what was to be called "The National Championship Trail," with the small issue of there not being a championship at stake conveniently being overlooked in the short term. The Championship Trail was basically the events which the AAA's new Contest Board sanctioned as, well, "Championship" events.

There is material I took directly from the AAA materials that Gordon White compiled and made available which I can expound upon later when I get home. In essence, the phrase "National Championship Trail" had a nice ring to it and that is what was wanted by the AMA. Not until the Winter of 1915/1916 did the idea of actually creating a "championship" surface.

Phil dicked around with it and said since the points were an obvious fallout of the other corrections he was making to the record, why not. We had more than a few exchanges over this. Also, there were major event which were not included on the NCT for reasons that continue to baffle and puzzle folks even to this day. Just one of many possible examples, in 1916, the Corona race was certainly a major event and not part of the NCT.

Well, Corona was a 450 CID race and the Championship was exclusively for 300 CID cars (although the Grand Prize was included, but by then there were virtually no 450 CID cars competing anymore). That is explainable, and that was a Championship with a capital "C". But why the earlier championships included all sorts of classes at some events, only one or two at others, some Touring Car events but not some major Racing Car events (Grand Prize!), some races in one year but not in others (LA - Phoenix!), that to me is a mystery I have not the slightest interest in solving, because you know what? It's totally insignificant!

Entries/starters Indianapolis 500/1912 :
according to "Motor Age", May 30, 1912, there were 27 entries and 24 starters :
# 26 Shambaugh (Shambaugh) withdrew,
# 27 Continental (Romine) did not qualify (68.5 mph),
# 31 Mason (Oldfield/Kilpatrick) did not start - no reason specified.

Could it be that the Grand Prize and the International sweepstakes were excluded from the National Championship Trail because they were international events?

What we seem to be having here is a non-discussion about a non-existing championship.

What seems to be overlooked in the case of the Grand Prize event is that the usual AAA-ACA ill will surfaced and that the Contest Board Chairman, William Stimpf, who already had enough problems on his hands in 1912, did not react well to some carping from the ACA blazers -- whose disinterest in motor sports was difficult to overlook at this point -- and apparently deliberately relegated the status of the event to a support race to the Vanderbilt Cup. Glad that there is not any politics in motor racing....

The International Sweepstakes for 1912 was not on the National Championship Trail? Really?

Michael, Corona was intially a contender for the 1916 Grand Prize event, but got out-maneuvered by Santa Monica. The event was then opened to Class D cars, with no restriction on displacement, so not strictly a "450" race as you infer. Many of the cars were apparently "300" cars since they showed up later on it seems. However, it is a situation much like figuring out whether a GP/F1 event not part of the championship is really a GP/F1 event to those only interested in championships and their events. However, I do agree that the bickering over "points" and their distribution for a championship which never existed seems a bit over the top.

Originally posted by billthekat
~
The International Sweepstakes for 1912 was not on the National Championship Trail? Really?

~

I obviously misread what was written above, I thought someone mentioned Indy as well as the Grand Prize

How many angels are on the head of a pin?

1920sracing

Originally posted by 1920sracing
How many angels are on the head of a pin?

1920sracing

Dancing or Standing?

Forty-two.

Originally posted by robert dick
Entries/starters Indianapolis 500/1912 :
according to "Motor Age", May 30, 1912, there were 27 entries and 24 starters :
# 26 Shambaugh (Shambaugh) withdrew,
# 27 Continental (Romine) did not qualify (68.5 mph),
# 31 Mason (Oldfield/Kilpatrick) did not start - no reason specified.

Ahhh, Charles "Charlie" Shambaugh! While I never knew him, as he died when I was a small boy, his shadow, and that of his brother was pretty large around Lafayette, Indiana (I grew up across the Wabash River in West Lafayette), where Charles Shambaugh owned and operated a Packard Dealership until his death (Shambaugh Packard closing for good in 1955). Shambaugh's widow, Gertrude, was quite a figure in the social life of Lafayette through the early 1970's, when she finally fell prey to the ravages of super-annuation, being quite a patron of the arts, a benefactor of many organizations, including both the Girl Scouts and Boy Scouts, the YMCA, and a lifetime honorary member of Lafayette Indiana Historic Auto Club.

Charles Shambaugh was one of the earliest automobile dealers in Lafayette, having had a Buick dealership for several years until taking on Packard. At its peak, the Shambaugh Garage was the largest dealership facility in Lafayette, encompassing fully 1/2 city block downtown. He was known for his offering racing people "down on their luck" jobs in the off-season, and for at least a couple of years each, two Indianapolis 500 winning drivers worked as salesmen there: Ralph DePalma and George Souders (I have seen a business card reading "Ralph DePalma, salesman. Shambaugh Packard).

Charles Shambaugh was quite a "developer". While he was periodically trying to get a car into the Indianapolis 500 in the 'teens", he bought 500 acres of farmland on the southern edge of Lafayette and built the first airport there, aptly named "Shambaugh Airport", which operated until the early 1930's when it was overtaken by another private field, and ultimately supplanted by the new airport built by Purdue University. Along with his brothers, who ran a very successful "rigging" business, Charles built numerous specialized cranes and other machinery for construction and demolition projects around the city, and Shambaugh Trucking was in constant demand in the 1940's and 50's to install heavy machinery in factories.

Getrude Shambaugh, in her later years, tended to dismiss her late husband's attempts at building race cars, and even more his penchant for trying to drive them--those must have been a considerable bone of contention in their household, so I never did seriously ask her to talk about them. But, by all accounts, he was a very colorful character.

Art

Thanks for that, Art. It was great to read.

Further questions, this time about the venue's and a driver or two:

1) In the 1912 Tacoma First Montamara Fiesta Race, there is a driver named "Sebastian". Does anyone know his full name?

2) I have the following details for these circuits used in 1912. Can anyone supply any more - history, map etc?
Columbus, Ohio - 1 mile dirt oval. Only used in 1912?
Milwaukee - 7.88 mile road course.
Brighton Beach, NY - 1 mile dirt oval.

3) Tacoma - listed as a 5 mile board oval by Phil Harms. Did they do board ovals this big? This oval would seem to predate the Tacoma Speedway and Pacific Coast Speedway, so is it a different venue? Does anyone have a map etc?

4) The 1909 LA-Phoenix point-to-point race - what was the route?

5) Venues from other years I have no further details for - can anyone supply anything else?
Portland - 14.6 miles, used 1909
Crown Point, Indiana - 23.27 miles, used 1909
Denver - 14.5 miles, used 1909
Riverhead, NY - 22.75 miles, used 1909
Philadelphia - 8 miles, 1909 (is this the same as Fairmont Park, used in 1911?)
San Francisco/San Leandro - 21.18 miles, used 1909
Atlanta Motordrome - 2 mile oval used in 1910. Is there a map?
Jacksonville, FL - 5 miles, used 1911
Bakersfield, CA - 7.9 miles, used 1911
Briarcliff, NY - 30 miles, used 27th April 1908

6) Hillclimb venues used in 1908. Does anyone have any further details on these?
Pasadena-Altadena. 1 mile, used 29th Feb 1908. Had 3 turns, gradients between 3 and 14 degrees.
Ft George Hill, Jamaica, NY. 0.36 miles, average 11 degree gradient, used 9th April 1908.
Albany, NY. Used 23rd May 1908.
Cincinatti, Ohio. 0.45 miles, used 23 May 1908. 11% gradient,

Briarcliff 1908 :
http://www.yorktownh...ges/april99.htm

1) Driver Sebastian: non-starter on #14 Cole 300CID (injured in practice, car driven by Frank Blizzard in race), no further info

2) Columbus Driving Park: 1-mile dirt oval, used from 1909 to 1915
Milwaukee Wauwatosa Circuit: 7.88-mile street circuit, only used in 1912 (Grand Prize & Vanderbilt)
Brighton Beach Race Track, Coney Island: 1-mile dirt track, used from 1907 to 1912

3) there were five different Tacoma circuits!
- Lakeview: 5-mile road course in 1912
- Lakeview: 3.5-mile road course in 1913
- Pacific Coast Speedway: 2-mile dirt oval in 1914
- Pacific Coast Speedway: 2-mile board oval from 1915 to 1919 (actually 1 mile and 1654 yards long, it appears)
- Tacoma Speedway: 2-mile D-shaped board oval from 1920 to 1922

Not 100% positive on track names; all five circuits appear to have been at roughly the same location. There is a circuit map of the last one in Dick Wallen's Board Track book "Gold, Guts & Glory".

Let me list all the venues used for the 1916 season with relevant information from the AAA 1916 Automobile Contests booklet:

Speedway races:

Ascot One Mile Speedway -- Los Angeles, California / One mile asphaltum speedway / Ascot Speedway Association

Sheepshead Bay Speedway -- New York / Two mile board speedway / Sheepshead Speedway Corporation

Speedway Park -- Chicago / Two mile board speedway / Speedway Park Association

Indianapolis Motor Speedway -- Indianapolis, Indiana / Two and one-half mile vitrified brick speedway / Indianapolis Motor Speedway

Des Moines Auto Speedway -- Des Moines, Iowa / One mile board speedway / Des Moines Speedway Company

Twin City Motor Speedway -- Fort Snelling, Minnesota / Two mile concrete speedway / Twin City Motor Speedway Company

Tacoma Automobile Speedway -- Tacoma, Washigton / Two mile (approximately) speedway / Tacoma Speedway Association

Sioux City Motor Speedway -- Union County, South Dakota / Two mile dirt speedway /

Kansas City Motor Speedway -- Kansas City, Missouri / One and one-eighth mile dirt speedway / Kansas City Speedway & Exposition Company

Omaha Auto Speedway -- Omaha, Nebraska / One and one-fourth mile board speedway / The Auto Speedway Company

Cincinnati Motor Speedway -- Cincinnati, Ohio / Two mile board speedway / Cincinnati Speedway Company

Uniontown Speedway -- Uniontown, Pennsylvania / One and one-eighth mile borad speedway / Uniontown Speedway Association


Road Races:

Fresno -- Fresno, California / 7.00927 miles / Raisin Classic Trophy Association

Gardena -- Gardena, California / 2.2 miles / Gardena Valley Strawberry Day Association, Inc.

Visalia -- Visalia, California / 3.15 miles / Tulare County Automobile Association

Hibbing -- Hibbing, Minnesota / ??? / Automobile Club of Hibbing

Tucson -- Tuscon, Arizona / 4.298 miles / Southern Arizona Fair Association

Douglas to Phoenix, Arizona / 273 (approximately) miles / Arizona State Fair Association

Santa Monica -- Santa Monica, California / 8.401 miles / Santa Monica Chamber of Commerce


Boulevard races:

Corona Boulevard -- Corona, California / 2.76895 miles / Citrus Belt Racing Association of Corona, Inc.

Panama-California International Exposition -- San Diego, California / 1.136 miles /


Track races:

Bakersfield -- Bakersfield, California / One mile dirt track / Kern County Fair Association

Olympic Park -- Newark, New Jersey / One-half mile dirt tarck / Olympic Park Auto Racing Association

Elmira -- Elmira, New York / One-half mile dirt track / Elmira Automobile-Motorcycle-Bicycle Racing Association

Galesburg -- Galesburg, Illinois / One mile dirt track / Galesburg District Fair Association

Waterville -- Waterville, Washington / One-half mile dirt track / Automobile Club of Waterville

Alan -- Couer d'Alene, Idaho / One mile dirt track / Northwest Auto Racing Association, Inc.

Berrien County Fair Grounds Track -- Benton Harbor, Michigan / One-half mile dirt track /

Comstock Park Track -- Grand Rapids, Michigan / One mile dirt track / Automobile Business Association

Westmoreland Fair Grounds Track -- Youngswood, Pennsylvania / One-half mile dirt track

Rose City Speedway -- Portland, Oregon / One mile dirt track / Northwest Auto Racing Association

Kalamazoo - Kalamazoo, Michigan / One mile dirt track / Kalamazoo County Recreation Park

Flemington Fair Grounds -- Flemington, New Jersey / One-half mile dirt track / Flemington Fair & Carnival Association

Butler -- Butler, Pennsylvania / One-half mile dirt track / Butler Driving Park & Fair Association

Pulaski Fair Grounds Track -- Pulaski, Pennsylvania / One-hald mile dirt track /

Spokane -- Spokane, Washington / One-half mile dirt track / Inland Auto Association

Bennings Race Track -- Washington, D.C. / One mile dirt track / American Automobile Association, Inc.

Washington State Fair Track -- North Yakima, Washington / One mile dirt track / Yakima Automobile Club

Fair Grounds Track -- Du Bois, Pennsylvania / One-half mile dirt track /

Trenton Fair Grounds Track -- Trenton, New Jersey / One-half mile dirt track / Inter-State Fair

Fresno -- Fresno, California / One mile dirt track / Fresno District Fair

Dodge City Motor Speedway -- Dodge City, Kansas / Two mile dirt track / Dodge City Speedway Corporation

Fair Grounds Track -- Indiana, Pennsylvania / One-half mile dirt track /

Fair Grounds Track -- Richmond, Virginia / One mile dirt track / Richmond Automobile Club

Fiar Grounds Track -- Canfield, Ohio / One-half mile dirt track /

Phoenix -- Phoenix, Arizona / One mile dirt track / Arizona State Fair Commission


Hill Climbs:

Monroe Street Hill Climb -- Spokane, Washington / 2,139 feet, max grade 17.9%, average grade, 7.55%, elevation, 165 feet / Spokane Auto Show

College Hill Climb -- Oriskany Falls, New York / seven-eighths of a mile, max grade 14%, minimum grade 3 %, average grade 7 and one-quarter per cent

Pikes Peak Hill Climb -- Pikes Peak / 12 miles 2,200 feet, max grade 10 one-half percent, average grade 7%, elevation at start 9,197 feet, at finish 14,091 feet

Giants Despair Mountain Hill Climb -- Wilkes-Barre, Pennsylvania / 6,000 feet (approximately), rise 691 feet, max grade 202%, minimum grade 10%, average grade 12%

Tacoma, July 1912 :
According to "Motor Age", July 4, 1912, it was a road race on a (more or less) rectangular course, length exactly 5 miles, "on the new 5-mile course at Lake View. The course has cost $6,000 and it has taken less than 2 months to build it. Sprinklers and steam rollers, oilers and packers will continue to iron out all wrinkles and soft places until the day before the race."

Originally posted by fines

3) there were five different Tacoma circuits!
- Lakeview: 5-mile road course in 1912
- Lakeview: 3.5-mile road course in 1913
- Pacific Coast Speedway: 2-mile dirt oval in 1914
- Pacific Coast Speedway: 2-mile board oval from 1915 to 1919 (actually 1 mile and 1654 yards long, it appears)
- Tacoma Speedway: 2-mile D-shaped board oval from 1920 to 1922

Not 100% positive on track names; all five circuits appear to have been at roughly the same location. There is a circuit map of the last one in Dick Wallen's Board Track book "Gold, Guts & Glory". [/B]

I disagree slightly with this. Having looked at Gordon White's "Lost Circuits" book, the 2 mile dirt oval used in 1914 was known as Tacoma Speedway - the board oval was indeed Pacific Coast Speedway. I'm afraid that I don't have a copy of the Wallen book - any chance that you do Michael?

Originally posted by Darren Galpin
2) I have the following details for these circuits used in 1912. Can anyone supply any more - history, map etc?
Columbus, Ohio - 1 mile dirt oval. Only used in 1912?
Milwaukee - 7.88 mile road course.
Brighton Beach, NY - 1 mile dirt oval.

3) Tacoma - listed as a 5 mile board oval by Phil Harms. Did they do board ovals this big? This oval would seem to predate the Tacoma Speedway and Pacific Coast Speedway, so is it a different venue? Does anyone have a map etc?

4) The 1909 LA-Phoenix point-to-point race - what was the route?

5) Venues from other years I have no further details for - can anyone supply anything else?
Portland - 14.6 miles, used 1909
Crown Point, Indiana - 23.27 miles, used 1909
Denver - 14.5 miles, used 1909
Riverhead, NY - 22.75 miles, used 1909
Philadelphia - 8 miles, 1909 (is this the same as Fairmont Park, used in 1911?)
San Francisco/San Leandro - 21.18 miles, used 1909
Atlanta Motordrome - 2 mile oval used in 1910. Is there a map?
Jacksonville, FL - 5 miles, used 1911
Bakersfield, CA - 7.9 miles, used 1911
Briarcliff, NY - 30 miles, used 27th April 1908

6) Hillclimb venues used in 1908. Does anyone have any further details on these?
Pasadena-Altadena. 1 mile, used 29th Feb 1908. Had 3 turns, gradients between 3 and 14 degrees.
Ft George Hill, Jamaica, NY. 0.36 miles, average 11 degree gradient, used 9th April 1908.
Albany, NY. Used 23rd May 1908.
Cincinatti, Ohio. 0.45 miles, used 23 May 1908. 11% gradient,

(a) I have tracked down the site of the 1912 Cup/Prize events and have maps of both the contemporary circuit and how it is today on a topo map.

(b) I have found something which gives the location of the Brighton Beach track and Sheepshead Speedway as well.

© No sure as to the exact route for the LA-Phoenix event, but there really weren't all that many options at the time....

(d) I have the Fairmont Park information.

(e) White has a diagram of the Atlanta Motordrome overlaid on the current site, ATL as it is known in the air travel trade..... I have yet to find good view of the overall track, but a few pictures are out there....

(f) The California road courses and tracks, such as Bakerfield are another opportunity for someone to take the Osmer project one more step....

(g) I will see what I can dredge up from my files on the Tacoma issue.

Originally posted by Darren Galpin


I disagree slightly with this. Having looked at Gordon White's "Lost Circuits" book, the 2 mile dirt oval used in 1914 was known as Tacoma Speedway - the board oval was indeed Pacific Coast Speedway. I'm afraid that I don't have a copy of the Wallen book - any chance that you do Michael?

As I said, the name issue is far from settled - there's a poster from the 1922 event proclaiming "Tacoma Speedway". Perhaps the "official" name was Pacific Coast Speedway, while it was usually refered to by its location; perhaps the Pacific Coast thingy is just a red herring?

I have the Wallen book but, alas, do not own a scanner! I will try to keep this in mind until I get a chance to use someone else's - or, perhaps someone else will come to the rescue?

Originally posted by fines

...I have the Wallen book but, alas, do not own a scanner! ...

Fines - I thought you finally got one last Christmas. You can buy a compact Canon for less than €100.

Darren,
There is a history of the Tacoma tracks here:

http://www.historyli...fm?file_id=5639

And a map of the 5 mile circuit.

Originally posted by Darren Galpin

Further questions, this time about the venue's and a driver or two:

2) I have the following details for these circuits used in 1912. Can anyone supply any more - history, map etc?
Columbus, Ohio - 1 mile dirt oval. Only used in 1912?
Milwaukee - 7.88 mile road course.
Brighton Beach, NY - 1 mile dirt oval.

Columbus Driving Park operated from July 4, 1903 - 1925. Was torn down in 1926 and became housing.

Milwaukee (actually located in Wauwatosa) held races October 1, 1912 through October 5, 1912.

Brighton Beach operated Aug 10, 1902 - c. July 10, 1915. Trotter horse track, torn down 1970.

5) Venues from other years I have no further details for - can anyone supply anything else?
Portland - 14.6 miles, used 1909
Crown Point, Indiana - 23.27 miles, used 1909
Denver - 14.5 miles, used 1909
Riverhead, NY - 22.75 miles, used 1909
Philadelphia - 8 miles, 1909 (is this the same as Fairmont Park, used in 1911?)
San Francisco/San Leandro - 21.18 miles, used 1909
Atlanta Motordrome - 2 mile oval used in 1910. Is there a map?
Jacksonville, FL - 5 miles, used 1911
Bakersfield, CA - 7.9 miles, used 1911
Briarcliff, NY - 30 miles, used 27th April 1908

Portland course hosted races from 1907 - June 13, 1909 hosted first AAA sanctioned race.

Crown Point - June 18 & 19, 1909 races known as "Cobe Trophy Races".

Denver - September 7, 1908; July 5, 1909; September 5, 1910.

Riverhead - Louis Chevrolet won.

Oakland/San Leandro - known as Portola Road Course - 21.5 mile course 1906 - 1910
10.923 mile course February 22, 1911

Jacksonville (Pablo Beach) - 5 mile beach oval from March 28, 1911 - November 30, 1911

Bakersfield - July 4, 1911 - 1915. I know it's not much, and not a map, but from living there and local history pieces, the course ran North of town into the oil fields and climbed the bluffs overlooking the Kern River via China Grade Loop. I'm not so sure about the dates other than the 1911 date.

Briarcliff - listed as Ralph DePalma's first start. April 24, 1908 - April 27, 1908

All of this information from Allan E. Brown's "The History of America's Speedways - Past & Present" 3rd edition (well not all of it, the Bakersfield entry is my recollection).

Darren, I realize these aren't course maps, but it's the best I can offer. I've seen course maps of Atlanta and of Wauwatosa (Milwaukee), but that's about it.

Originally posted by billthekat
(f) The California road courses and tracks, such as Bakerfield are another opportunity for someone to take the Osmer project one more step....

Thanks for posting the 1916 list. The fairgrounds locations I am quite familiar with, less so some of the roads used in the public road courses. Visalia held a historic recreation, thanks to the local historical society, and I saw a television show on a local PBS outlet about it. I don't know the route of the Fresno road race and Gardena was utterly new to me.

It occurs to me that even Allan E. Brown's book did not have a listing for the Bakersfield-Taft course. When I lived in Bakersfield, I found some good local histories that covered the race in some depth (most notably a book on local oil history done by longtime Bakersfield Californian oil industry writer Bill Rintoul). The Californian had plenty of items and references to Bakersfield racing history (road races, old fairgrounds, Sportland Park midget track) in the late 1980's.

I've always thought it would be great to do Central and Northern California in the same format as Harold Osmer did for the greater Los Angeles area. For that matter, it would be great to see folks around the country follow a similar path and format.

Seek and ye shall find... (my memory is pretty good for something I read about in 1987)

Automobile race revved up notoriety for Bakersfield
April 27, 1999
BILL RINTOUL Oil columnist

In the spring of 1911, a group of Kern River oil men put forward a scheme they said would make the oil field and the city of Bakersfield known from coast to coast.

The proposal called for a 150-mile automobile race to be held over a course to be constructed through the Kern River field and the outskirts of the city, with entries solicited from the fastest cars in the country.

The time to hold the race, they suggested, would be on the Fourth of July, normally observed with riotous vigor in the oil fields.

Reaction to the proposed race was enthusiastic, but there was a major problem. The proposed race course along China Grade Loop, across Kern River at Gordon's Ferry, through Bakersfield and north again on Chester Avenue existed in large part only on promoter's maps.

It took a great mobilization of effort to secure rights of way, arrange with the Southern Pacific rail company to halt traffic on the spur line crossing the race course, build bridges and straighten and realign sections of roadway. The Kern River oilmen went to work with characteristic enthusiasm, and they managed to secure sanction for the race from the Automobile Association of America.

Various oil companies put more than 200 men to work on the course, and dust rose in clouds along the route.

Excitement mounted as reports reached town that such famous drivers as Harvey Herrick, Bert Dingley and Frank Seifert would participate.

Dingley arrived with a 50-horsepower Pope Hartford racer, which he claimed could reach speeds of 100 mph on good stretches. Parts of the race course served as general thoroughfares in town, but they were reserved for exclusive use of the racing cars for two hours each day. On the day of the race, work came to a standstill in the Kern River oil field, train traffic stopped on the spur line and a crowd estimated at 10,000 lining the bluffs and the path of the race.

Dingley's Pope-Hartford was the bettors' favorite in the four-car field, but Herrick wound up winning, finishing the 14-lap race in 2 hours, 58:58.5 minutes. The Daily Californian described the race through the Kern River oil field as "Bakersfield's greatest day."

Originally posted by Arthur Anderson


Ahhh, Charles "Charlie" Shambaugh!
Getrude Shambaugh, in her later years, tended to dismiss her late husband's attempts at building race cars, and even more his penchant for trying to drive them--those must have been a considerable bone of contention in their household, so I never did seriously ask her to talk about them. But, by all accounts, he was a very colorful character.

Art

I second Darren's comments. A very enjoyable read about a man who so little is comparitvely known outside Indiana.

Thanks for all of that! Please keep digging.....

Sebastian (from "Motor Age, July 1912) :
- couldn't find the first name;
- drove # 14 Cole in Tacoma medium car event on July 5, 1912 (150 miles), covered 15 miles in 16' 34" (= second), withdrew after 30 miles (burnt out - broken connecting rod);
- drove # 45 Cole in Tacoma Free-for-all on July 6, 1912 (250 miles), covered 5 miles in 10' 25" (= last), 25 miles in 39' 54", 50 miles in 82' 02", withdrew (trouble with new cylinder).

= = = = =

Cincinatti - from "Motor Age", September 10, 1911 :
"Cincinatti's first attempt at road racing was carried through very successfully Saturday as a climax to the weeks celebration of the opening of the Fernbank dam across the Ohio river. The races were run over the Silverton-Blue Ash-Montgomery triangle near the town of Rossmoyne, about 15 miles out of the city. The course was a triangular one with one very sharp turn. The length was 7.9 miles and the road none too well prepared for fast work."

Would the Cincinatti circuit be here: http://www.multimap....&multimap.y=197

Blue Ash Rd to Cooper Rd, Cooper Rd to Montgomery Rd, and then follow Montgomery Rd south until it joins Plainfield Rd/Blue Ash Rd.

The 1912 Tacoma course can be seen (roughly!) here:

http://www.multimap....up.x=292&up.y=8

The route is Lakeview Avenue (to the left of the railway), then along Steilacoom Boulevard, down Gravelly Lake Drive, then back along 112th Street to Lakeview.




Some further venues I am interested in, from 1908:

Shingle Hill, New Haven, CT. This was a 0.91 mile venue used on the 27th May 1908. Harms mentions that it also had a 1 mile "race", although this looks more like a sprint. Was a slightly different length hillclimb used? Does anyone have a map or know where the start/finish line was?

Sport Hill, Easton (Bridgeport), CT. This hillclimb was used on the 30th May 1908. Harms' named it Port Hill, but I think that this is a typo. What was the length of the climb, where did it run from and to (only a section of Sport Hill Road should have been used)?

Denver, CO. A 32 mile circuit which went from Denver-Barr-Brighton-Denver. Due to its distance, I'm having problems picking out on a modern map where it might have gone. Can anyone shed any light on this?

Wilkes Barre, PA. A 1.08 mile hillclimb used on the 30th May 1908 - the climb went through 666 ft vertically. Where in Wilkes Barre was this? Which road? etc.

Originally posted by Darren Galpin
The 1912 Tacoma course can be seen (roughly!) here:

http://www.multimap....up.x=292&up.y=8

The route is Lakeview Avenue (to the left of the railway), then along Steilacoom Boulevard, down Gravelly Lake Drive, then back along 112th Street to Lakeview.

Correct.
Run clockwise - start and grandstand on Lakeview Avenue (more or less in the middle of the map), exactly 1 mile distance to the first right-hand corner in the south.

Don,

A late follow up one of your postings above where you said that you had information.

(a) 1912 Wauwatosa circuit. Please could you let me have a copy of what you have.

(b) You said that you had something which gives the location of Brighton Beach and Sheepshead Speedway. What is this something? Please could you let me have further details.

© You said that you had information on Fairmont Park. Please could I have a copy of this.

Many thanks,

Darren

Originally posted by Darren Galpin
Don,

A late follow up one of your postings above where you said that you had information.

(a) 1912 Wauwatosa circuit. Please could you let me have a copy of what you have.

(b) You said that you had something which gives the location of Brighton Beach and Sheepshead Speedway. What is this something? Please could you let me have further details.

© You said that you had information on Fairmont Park. Please could I have a copy of this.

Many thanks,

Darren

When I get home this evening I will:

(1) send you the graphics I have on the Wauwatosa

(2) sen you the graphics I have on this section of Brooklyn

There is an excellent book on the Fairmont Park races which I recommend to everyone since I was pleasantly surprised by what a good job the author did. It has been mentioned here on TNF somewhere.

Send me an email to remind me since I am in the middle of about a dozen firefights right now.

1912 Wauwatosa course/Milwaukee = parallelogram - anticlockwise - length 7.8 miles :
- start/finish/grandstand on Burleigh road (= south leg),
- (via Sherman Park turn = around 145 degrees) North (Old) Fond du Lac road,
- (via Mud Creek turn = around 45 degrees) Town Line road (= north leg),
- (via Sommerville turn = around 145 degrees) South (New) Fond du Lac road,
- (via turn at Wanderer's Rest cemetery = around 45 degrees) back to Burleigh road.

The Greenfield course (Milwaukee county) was abandonned on June 1, 1912, and replaced by the Wauwatosa course.
Originally the length of the Wauwatosa course was quoted as 8.2 miles and start/finish located on North Fond du Lac road.
After mitigating/straightening the turns and asphalting the course the length was quoted as 7.8 miles.

Further courses I'm looking at - can anyone supply any maps or further information?

1) Dead Horse Hill, Worchester, MA. 1 mile hillclimb used on the 6th June 1908.
2) Sport Hill, Cleveland, OH. 0.7 mile hillclimb used on the 13th June 1908.
3) Point Breeze, Philadelphia, PA. 1 mile dirt oval, used on the 13th June 1908.
4) Hyde Park, Readville, MA. 1 mile dirt oval, used on the 17th June 1908.
5) Skippack Hill, Norristown, PA. 1.19 mile hillclimb, between 3 and 10 degrees. Vertical climb of 352ft in 6270ft. Used 27th June 1908.
6) Pimlico, Baltimore, MD. 1 mile dirt oval, used 30th May 1908.
7) Agriculture Park, Los Angeles, CA. 1 mile dirt oval, used 30th May 1908.
8) Wildwood, NJ. 1 mile section of Central Avenue used as a sprint/drag race, used multiple times in 1908. Where did it start/finish?
9) Elm Ridge, Kansas City, MO. 1 mile dirt oval on a trotting course, used on the 4th July 1908.
10) Elkwood/Monmouth Park, Long Branch, NJ. 1 mile dirt oval, used on the 4th July 1908.
11) Sonoma Co.Fairgrounds, Santa Rosa, CA. 1.125 mile dirt oval. Interesting problem here - it was used on the 22nd-23rd August 1908, but race distances were not fixed multiples of the lap distance, so were start and finish in different places?
12) Wilbrabham Hill, Springfield, MA. 1 mile hillclimb, gradient average of 8.5%, reaching 22% near the end. Used on the 11th September 1908.
13) Tanforan, San Francisco, CA. 1 mile dirt oval used on the 22nd September 1908.


A further question regarding "Amateurs". At the meeting at Elkwood/Monmouth Park, there was a separate race for Amateur Drivers. What is the definition of an amateur in this case, as I had assumed that most would have been amateurs at that time?

Amateurs = perhaps non-(AAA-)registered drivers?

Even in 1908, there were those drivers who were considered as "professional" drivers and those who were "amateur" drivers, the latter being those whose status was exactly as stated, an amateur -- either not competing for prize money or lacking experience. When the AAA Contest Board was established the following year replacing the AAA Racing Committee, they did issue separate licenses for those registering as "amateurs."

To compete in ANY AAA event, you needed a AAA license, whether as driver or car owner, amateur or professional.

Originally posted by robert dick
The Greenfield course (Milwaukee county) was abandonned on June 1, 1912, and replaced by the Wauwatosa course.

Does this mean that there were events on the Greenfield course in 1912? If so, they were not part of the AAA Championship Trail. Do you have any further details on these events? Also, could you please tell me more about the Greenfield Course.

The Greenfield course was the original proposition for the Vanderbilt/GP meeting/October 1912 - was not used - located a few miles in the south-west of Milwaukee - a little bit longer than the Wauwatosa course, around 10 miles - more or less rectangular.

Do you know where it was - what roads were proposed at all?

1912 Greenfield course (if run anticlockwise) :
south leg = W. Cold Spring Rd.
- (45 degrees) W. Forest Home Ave.
- (45 degrees) S. 43rd Str.
- (90 degrees) W. Greenfield Ave.
- (45 degrees) W. Beloit Rd.
- (45 degrees) S. 92nd Str.
- (90 degrees) back in W. Cold Spring Rd.

Thanks - I've since found it on the map.

More questions:

1) Long Island. There was a 23.46 mile variant used in October 1908, for local races on the 10th October, and then later in the month for the Vanderbilt races. This seems to be yet another variant in the same area - does anyone know the route of this one? It definitely differs from the versions used 1904-1906.

2) Ascot Park. This was a 1 mile dirt oval used on the 31st October 1908, and the 26th-27th December 1908. This is not Legion Ascot, which was built in 1924. So, is it in the same area? Any other information?

3) Solomon Hill, St Louis, MO. A 0.6 mile hillclimb used on the 6th November 1908.

4) St Louis, MO. 1 mile dirt oval used on the 7th November 1908.

Ascot Park was a 1-mile dirt oval in the south of Los Angeles, at the intersection of Florence Ave. and Central Ave. It's official name may have been "California Ascot Park Speedway", and as location I've also seen San Bernardino mentioned - I'm not firm enough in So. Cal. geographie to know if this can be correct!? It was active from around 1908 to 1919 and was superseded by the "Los Angeles Speedway" at Beverly Hills, then Culver City.

In 1923 a new Ascot track was built in the northeast area of LA, Lincoln Heights. This was 5/8-mile banked dirt oval, operational until 1927. In 1929 it was reopened as Legion Ascot, and in 1934 (~) a half-mile oval was built inside the old track. Those were the halcyon days, and when the track closed for good in 1936, Ascot was a househeld name and as such reused several times: there was a "Southern Ascot" and a "New Ascot" around WW2, though I don't recall the particulars atm.