Spanish Forum : same passion, different language

Posted 16 June 2003 - 14:08

Dear all,

For a couple of months now I have been playing with the idea of a Forum in Spanish.

The reasons for it are obvious to me: there are incredibly valuable researchers, people with long memories and gentlemen with an astonishing ability to write and tell extremelly interesting stories that cannot use English. They might be able to read English but they will refrain from writing in English. They prefer Spanish, another quite well-accepted language

Some of them, of course, are friends of mine ;)

I will like to extend my invitation to any Spanish-speaking members of this Forum to visit this place and, if you feel it might be of interest, register as members and contribute.

If I can handle that project just half as succesfully as how Bira, Don and all of us have done with TNF, I will be extremelly happy.

Wish me luck.

un abrazo

Felix

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Posted 16 June 2003 - 14:27

Hey - they're talking about me!

Originally posted by Felix Muelas
... Pero Allen Brown -unos de los pocos investigadores amateurs con respecto al cual yo suelo pronunciar, sin pretender sonar herético, "palabra de Dios" ante sus conclusiones- no tiene dudas ...

According to Babelfish, that says "blah, blah, blah ... Allen Brown ... blah, blah, blah ... Word of God ... blah, blah, blah ... ". Or it might say "blah, blah, blah ... Allen Brown ... blah, blah, blah ... amateur ... blah, blah, blah ... ". Not sure which

Allen

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Posted 16 June 2003 - 14:54

Of course, my dear Mr Brown, I was -without trying to sound heretic- comparing your ability as researcher with some other very serious things!

Thanks for paying the visit, you are always welcome!

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Posted 16 June 2003 - 14:55

I noticed that Felix calling you an amateur didn't put you off registering there Allen ....

Seems like a nice place, Felix. Best of luck with it. Great oaks and all that .....

The sooner auto-translation software is perfected, the better. I can get by in French and German and get the gist of most of the Romance languages: what would be wonderful would be if eventually we could have a multilingual forum with simultaneous translation into idiomatic language. From working with Alessandro, I know just how difficult it can be to express what you want to say in anything other than your mother tongue - English-speakers will understand when I say that I had to change what Alessandro probably thought was a perfectly acceptable phrase describing one Swiss driver as the "special friend" of another (no - it was nothing to do with Raymond Mays, but you get my drift!)

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Posted 16 June 2003 - 15:11

Originally posted by Vitesse2
...what would be wonderful would be if eventually we could have a multilingual forum with simultaneous translation ...

Let´s tell Bira to start working on it
From my experience, if she decides to do it, we will have it sooner rather than later ;)

Thanks for registering, Richard. With both Allen and you now registered it is difficult to imagine that it won´t be a successful place!

un abrazo

Felix

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Posted 16 June 2003 - 15:36

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Posted 16 June 2003 - 15:58

Hey Félix, I see you have relayed my spare car info about the '74 Spanish GP, but made a mistake there: Denny Hulme's car still had #56 in the race, I have a pic to prove it!

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Posted 16 June 2003 - 17:09

I'll take a look Felix, I've been following Spanish beginner's classes for a year now. But since we haven't had the past tense so far it will be difficult for me to post any historical information

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Posted 16 June 2003 - 17:52

OK, you got me hooked, even though my Spanish isn't very good. I'll just use bumblefish

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Posted 16 June 2003 - 20:09

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Posted 16 June 2003 - 20:16

Originally posted by dretceterini
OK, you got me hooked, even though my Spanish isn't very good.

You are a gentleman, doc! Thanks for registering...

Originally posted by Frank de Jong
...I'll take a look Felix...

Thank you Frank!. I guess we will touch things like Escudería Montjuich any day now...

Originally posted by fines
...Denny Hulme's car still had #56 in the race, I have a pic to prove it!

Are you sure? I mean, I cannot prove you wrong, as the two pics I have found of Hulme in the race do not allow me to see the number but my recollection is that he definitely used #56 in practice -I have some sensation that there was actually an accident involving a marshall and maybe Hulme, although that information is mixed up in my brain with Merzario actually overturning his car on the right of the Pegaso ramp, also in practice- but I am unsure he used it at the race.

Is the picture in the rain? That would be a good tip in favour of the picture being in the race...I still remember being soaked that day :

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Posted 16 June 2003 - 20:19

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Posted 16 June 2003 - 21:13

Dammit, ANOTHER forum? I've wanted to learn Spanish for some time but never have the time off work guaranteed. This will give me some impetus...

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Posted 16 June 2003 - 21:53

Felix,

¡presente!... I'm a new registered member. The only one problem is the lack of time: as you perfectly knows, TNF is an "all-the-time-of-the-world" consuming forum...

See you there,

Carles.

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Posted 17 June 2003 - 03:59

Félix,

I thought you were offline for a year, taking a "sabbatical"; has that time gone by?

Anyway, I´m no stranger to thef1.com since its inception some years ago, and can only rest assured that "this time" it can only get better.

I see lots of familiar names there, mostly knowledgeable and educated fellas, good starting point

I´ll take a deeper look into it. Count me in.

Best of lucks.

Carlos

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Posted 17 June 2003 - 04:05

Darn, I knew I should have picked Spanish as one of my "other" languages..... This is a superb effort, Felix.

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Posted 17 June 2003 - 07:03

Best of luck, Félix. I have checked into your site, even tried to register just for kicks and I don't even know if I have succeeded. As I told you before, an excellent effort.

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Posted 17 June 2003 - 07:54

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Posted 17 June 2003 - 18:26

Well Felix, you've really done it this time.
Since I joined TNF last October I have spent more money on books and other material than ever before.
But those costs pale in comparison to the latest item I will need for this hobby, undoubtedly the most expensive automobile accessory ever. That's right, none other than "The Spanish Girlfriend."
Good luck and thanks a lot....

Ron Scoma, on the bullet train to Poverty

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Posted 17 June 2003 - 22:24

Ron : sorry Thanks for registering !

Darren : you should be ashamed of what can only be described as your extremelly lamentable spanish! On the other hand, you never needed it when you were around here, so who can blame you?

Hans : will you please find another 5 minutes for next try? Your presence as Registered Member will make my Forum look important (PS : I spoke to Angel Elberdín this morning and our books are on their way. ONCE he checks that I have sent the money, that is... )

Don: Any comment wishing luck to a project coming from you I will regard as a blessing. And I will be on duty to ensure IT HAPPENS, Sir.

Carlos: Paula is now almost four months old and life comes back slowly...as you know yourself. I am counting on you...

Carles: I know the problem related to time. But please do as tonight...pay a visit, write some lines, make someone out there happy with an accurate answer...and then come back to TNF or go to sleep

Ensign14: looking forward to it

The theme of the day is Roberto Mieres. Some of you will be able to have fun with the texts whilst others will just enjoy the pictures, but I am pretty sure that the Monomill race that Gustavo Morales writes about in Albi 1954 -that Mieres won- is not a very well known episode of his carreer...and that is what the Forum intends to be about!

Felix

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Posted 17 June 2003 - 23:36

I have just registered

I don't think I can apport a lot there, but I'm sure I'll enjoy so much the amount of wisedom that people has.

... and I can practice my spanish!;) (I hope it is better than my pityful english)

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Posted 18 June 2003 - 00:14

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Posted 18 June 2003 - 00:23

Nice job Felix - I'm in the opposite situation...I can read Spanish no problem (as I'm fluent in Portuguese which is extremely similar) but writing is a different story Maybe if I post in Portuguese though most Spanish speakers should be able to read it OK?

Michael.

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Posted 18 June 2003 - 08:29

Michael,

As I told Jorge Felix yesterday -who apologized, unnecesarily in my opinion, for his "poor Spanish"- I do not think it will be a problem for people who feel more at ease writing in Portuguese doing so. Or in Italian, for that matter.

The design of the Forum involves at least two and possibly three groups of people , as I have explained. On the one hand, people who can read English but cannot write in it -and have stories to tell- finding a suitable place where to do that. Jose Luis Otero de Saavedra, Gustavo Morales or Gerardo Sabaris would fit in that group.

A second group will be the ones that, not being able to write in Spanish, can actually read Spanish and those will be "beneficiaries" of the stories that would otherwise pass unnoticed or be restrained to a smaller audience.

Of course the odd comment in Portuguese, in Italian or in French here and there will hurt nobody (and if needs translation, I would take care of that)

Finally, there are the TNF Spanish-speaking members (Carles Bosch "jarama", cjpani or Arturo Pereira to name just three) that would be the "bridges", as they are perfectly bilingual. Well, these people will NOT have the time, but I will pretend they do

So welcome everybody...;)

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Posted 18 June 2003 - 08:55

Originally posted by Felix Muelas
Are you sure? I mean, I cannot prove you wrong, as the two pics I have found of Hulme in the race do not allow me to see the number but my recollection is that he definitely used #56 in practice -I have some sensation that there was actually an accident involving a marshall and maybe Hulme, although that information is mixed up in my brain with Merzario actually overturning his car on the right of the Pegaso ramp, also in practice- but I am unsure he used it at the race.

Is the picture in the rain? That would be a good tip in favour of the picture being in the race...I still remember being soaked that day :

That is the clincher - the pic is taken in a driving rain! Yes, I also recall the accident in practice (I believe the marshal died ), which is the reason (I believe) he switched to the spare car for the balance of the weekend. I just wonder why he kept #56 when Depailler obviously used #4...

Anyway, this is not about 1974, this is about 2003 and your new "job" Congratulations, this looks very interesting, and the article about the 1922 Grand Prix is simply outstanding!! I just wish my Spanish was better... then again, on second thoughts... well, I spend too much time here already!

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Posted 18 June 2003 - 09:45

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Posted 18 June 2003 - 10:33

Felix,
my very best wishes for your new enterprise!
Unfortunately I belong to the group of people who read, but don't write Spanish and Portuguese ... Surely I will keep a close look on what is going on, not the least because your forum may well be the right instrument to solve the many open questions in regard of South American racing which give me so much headache! Do you already accept requests in this direction?

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Posted 18 June 2003 - 10:36

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Posted 18 June 2003 - 10:39

Originally posted by O Volante
...may well be the right instrument to solve the many open questions in regard of South American racing which give me so much headache! Do you already accept requests in this direction?

I was not aware until today that you can actually read my mind!

Of course!

um abraço

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Posted 18 June 2003 - 11:22

Oh, very quick response ...
Well, the fate of the various late 1950s Ferrari-Corvette single-seaters in Argentina, Brazil and Uruguay currently investigated by Humphries would be a nice starter! Last year Sr. Bacque mailed me that he was researching GP-car based South American "Specials" for some articles in his magazine. These may have been published by now, and somebody has read them ... But probably there are also people out there with original source material ...
Other topics I'm VERY much interested in:
- the Interlagos 500 kilometre race, 1957-1967
- the Torneiro Triangular Series, 1958-1961
- Alfa Romeos and Maseratis (single seater and sports cars) in South America
- Meccanica Nacional/Meccanica Continental races in Argentina, Brazil and Uruguay, 1930s-1960s
All info is appreciated (I still know so little!), so if you could give these themes a try in the future ... thank you very much in advance ...

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Posted 18 June 2003 - 17:08

Thanks, OV, for saving me making a similar request

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Posted 18 June 2003 - 21:32

Originally posted by David McKinney
Thanks, OV, for saving me making a similar request

How similar? The FIVE themes?

As I was telling someone yesterday, you might not need a Forum, you might actually need a house-elf!"

I think I need to get in contact with Jorge Augé Becqué the sooner rather than the later...

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Posted 19 June 2003 - 05:40

If I ever needed a house-elf (don't I?) I'd go for something prettier and more female in appearance... But then I realise, you're a married man!

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Posted 19 June 2003 - 06:17

Originally posted by Felix Muelas

How similar? The FIVE themes?

They'll do for a start
Belated congratulations on the effort BTW

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Posted 19 June 2003 - 07:49

Originally posted by Felix Muelas
Again, if we put enough pressure on Bira, she might end up setting up something similar to what Vitesse2 described some posts above as "...what would be wonderful would be if eventually we could have a multilingual forum with simultaneous translation..."

Felix, that reminds me of the vision you once shared with me while traveling back from Goodwood to Gatwick - to create a multi-lingual 8W that would allow all the non-Anglosaxon expertise to shine on the Web. I can still hear myself saying that it was an idea as farfetched as I could imagine, and yet you have persevered and got on top of the Spanish side of things.



Excellent - hope it will flourish in time, with the best Spanish knowledge crossing over to here. Trying to read Spanish as if it's Italian is not the best idea of understanding what is being said!

BTW, nice to see the logos in the top left corner ;)

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Posted 19 June 2003 - 08:04

The idea looks good only problem is that I can not read Spanish But having a look at the post on the BRM H16 and the engine pics is quite good well done

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Posted 19 June 2003 - 09:32

Originally posted by Racer.Demon
...traveling back from Goodwood to Gatwick - to create a multi-lingual 8W that would allow all the non-Anglosaxon expertise to shine on the Web...
BTW, nice to see the logos in the top left corner ;)

That is exactly the point, and the logos are there to prove it . For the trained eye, anyway ;)

The logical step in the future might be to move it to within the 8W / Forix / Atlas F1 "frame". But really that would only be envisaged if the product is succesful. The reason for not having done so from the start lies in a combination of factors that I do not deem appropriate to discuss in depth now...whilst I wish to thank Cristobal Rosaleny (father and son) and Sergio Romagosa García -a colleague of mine from school days- for betting on it.

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Posted 19 June 2003 - 09:57

The thread called Tortellini alla bolognese deals with the first victory of the Scuderia Ferrari, namely the Trieste-Opicina hillclimb on June 15th, 1930.

The name of the thread makes reference to the first item on the menu of the meal they had thereafter at the Savoia Excelsior Palace Hotel in Trieste....

Do you know who won this hillclimb?

Felix

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Posted 19 June 2003 - 10:04

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Posted 19 June 2003 - 10:14

Ray,

And no, it is NOT "restricted to Spanish"!

It's me again using the english wrongly, I guess.

The question above was intended to mean something like : "If you do not remember or do not know who was the driver that gave Scuderia Ferrari its first victory, you might click on the link, take a look and maybe, even without speaking Spanish or even reading Spanish, maybe just looking a the picture (s) you might discover who was!"

You will agree that I managed to make it REALLY shorter than that, alas losing what I intended to say!

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Posted 19 June 2003 - 10:23

Felix, I've read that thread, but I shan't spoil the surprise

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Posted 19 June 2003 - 17:48

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Posted 28 August 2003 - 22:45

A thread that intends to deal with the Formula 1 Argentina and other Mecanica Nacional races was started some days ago in the Spanish Forum

Whilst the skeleton is still pending completion, some pictures have been posted and, between them, there is quite curious Maserati 250F with a Tornado engine that is shown racing in 1969, in the 500 Miles of Rafaela.

As I have decided to delay my acquisition of the David McKinney book until next week --and try to get it signed by him at The Chinese TNF Meeting ;) - I do not know if the whereabouts of that Maserati 250F are known...but I reckon it´s curious to say the least.

Pay a visit, you don´t have to speak Spanish to take a look at a picture

un abrazo

Felix

BTW, Hans !
I almost forgot...

We have established a thread where we are writing discrepancies / additions / surprises to your fantastic job on the Hillclimbs...you can access it HERE

Just feel free to request translation of whatever you find ununderstandable ;)

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Posted 28 August 2003 - 23:39

Felix, what an astonishing collection of machinery! Fantastic photos!!

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Posted 29 August 2003 - 00:36

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Posted 29 August 2003 - 02:45

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Posted 29 August 2003 - 07:14

Originally posted by Ray Bell
...And the de Dion rear end caps it all...

I knew you would love them, Ray

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Posted 29 August 2003 - 07:16

Originally posted by Felix Muelas
...BTW, Hans !
I almost forgot...

We have established a thread where we are writing discrepancies / additions / surprises to your fantastic job on the Hillclimbs...you can access it HERE

Just feel free to request translation of whatever you find ununderstandable ;)

Felix - thanks for all good intentions!
Trouble is that I might remember more words in Zulu (my 10 yrs in South Africa ;) ) than in Spanish, which I never took the time to learn . To straighten out existing contradictions of the various hill climb results will be a time-consuming affair in itself and I have no problem doing so in German or English. All other languages constitute a real dilemma to me and require translation by others into either one of the two languages I feel comfortable with.

To the post in the thread by "Franky" Francisco Ortiz:
It seems to me that he compares his own collection of data with mine and the bold black letters must be referring to the information presented at the hill climb list. Therefore I was surprised that Franky changed my information of the 1948 event by naming the driver Hans Von Stuck. The first and last paragraph I do not understand but I believe the last may give reference to his source/s.

Before I forget, let me remind you, that data without a source has little value to me. Actually the source information sometimes is more relevant than the data itself and my source information of the hill climb list takes almost double the space than the actual data. It would have been too cumbersome to also show this information on the Internet but I do make this source information available if so requested.

I scanned only briefly through the other posts of this Spanish thread but there was too much that I did not understand . I therefore would appreciate a translation of the posts. This does not have to be a concise job as long as I can understand the meaning of the post and the exact source information. These translated contributions can be posted in this thread , time permitting, of course.

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Posted 30 August 2003 - 14:15

Here's another Spanish reader but seldom a writer, Felix

The tech forum is my "natural environment" but the TNF is very nice to read and very impressive in its research achievements.

Just in case there are another spanish readers around I'll point two large forums:

Foto Todocoches, where you can find some of Gus' works mentioned by Felix

Pedro de la Rosa Forum, a truly classic one


Saludos

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Posted 31 August 2003 - 03:22

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