148 replies to this topic

[bradbury west]

[i]Originally posted by Barry Boor ........... the subject came up of the Turner F.2 car, ....it had a sequential Velocette gearbox, thus making it fairly unusual for a car built so long ago

As did the second Smith F2 car, something of an Achilles heel behind an FWB, the owner fears, not to mention the bespoke diff assembly, which made for quite a concoction .
Roger Lund

[Barry Boor]

Ah! Maybe I'm getting mixed up - sorry about that. You are quite right, Alan and Brad. Senility strikes again....

[David McKinney]

Originally posted by Allan Lupton
I should know who owns the F2 Turner, but don't. It's in the Haynes museum, but may not be owned by Haynes. I shall ask a man who knows (or should know) who the owner is, and that may also give an idea of the possibility of it racing again.

Philip Walker owned one of the three F2 Turners about ten years ago. As he is based not far away from the Haynes museum, this would probably be the likeliest candidate. Last time I saw it the car was upside down at Mallory Park with the unfortunate Walker underneath.

[Silkolene]

Where all the Turner Fords MK2 fitted with GT6 front pcd 3.75 and the rears 4.25 Ford.

[F3Wrench]

For what it's worth, I owned a Turner 950cc but it was only a road car. A pretty little car but I real pain in the whatsit to maintain. Those laminated torsion bar rear springs just kept on breaking...

If someone can tell me how to put a couple of photos in a message, I'll post some pics.

[Paul Hamilton]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Silkolene
[B]Where all the Turner Fords MK2 fitted with GT6 front pcd 3.75 and the rears 4.25 Ford.


My Turner Ford chassis no 575 was originally fitted with splined knock off hubs and Borani wire wheels but used a BMC rear axle. When I later used alloy centered bolt on wheels their PCD was Triumph at the front and BMC at the rear.

[Ray Bell]

I don't know the ins and outs of Mk 2 Turners, but I'd think that the BMC rear end would have been a very popular fitment... in particular for lightness and availability of suitable ratios...

They had a 4" PCD.

[Turnersportscars]

Turners used BMC 4" PCD on BMC Front Suspension & BMC Rear Axle on the early cars & MKI.
Triumph front suspension MKII & MKIII models originally had Herald/Early Spitfire Type 12 Disc brake arrangement and Triumph PCD - but the splined hubs were manufactured to take a BMC Wire Wheel where appropriate.

GT6 & Ford systems would all be later non original modifications if fitted.

[Turnersportscars]

Originally posted by Barry Boor
Chatting to a very interesting historic racer on Friday, the subject came up of the Turner F.2 car, pictured way back at the beginning of this thread.

Despite there having been oodles of discussion about Turner cars on the three pages of this thread, very little seems to have been mentioned about this very tidy single-seater. I gather from my conversation with Mr. B that it had a sequential Velocette gearbox, thus making it fairly unusual for a car built so long ago (ducks for cover!!!)

Can anyone else add anything more about the car and are we likely ever to see it on the circuits?

I am Unsure of the current owner of the one and only F2 Turner (Chassis 007) (Turner Chassis 001 was rebuilt as a replica by Rod Jolley and is now in Italy).
The car is in the John Haynes collection and I have heard rumour that it might be going up for sale at some time in the future. I am unsure about the Gearbox arrangement on the car.

[Turnersportscars]

[Stephen W]

Originally posted by Turnersportscars

Is that Prescott hillclimb course?

[bradbury west]

Originally posted by Stephen W


Is that Prescott hillclimb course?

Perhaps the uncredited photographer, or the current copyrightholder, might be able to cast some light.
Roger Lund

[Turnersportscars]

Originally posted by Turnersportscars

Taken From the Wolverhampton History website
http://www.localhist...urnerracing.htm

[Turnersportscars]

Originally posted by bradbury west

Perhaps the uncredited photographer, or the current copyrightholder, might be able to cast some light.
Roger Lund

John Webb driving a 2 litre, Formula 2 Turner car at Prescott in 1955.
Courtesy of Jim Boulton.

[bradbury west]

Thanks for the detail, Russell.
RL

[Pist-N-Broke]

Originally posted by Turnersportscars
Turners used BMC 4" PCD on BMC Front Suspension & BMC Rear Axle on the early cars & MKI.
Triumph front suspension MKII & MKIII models originally had Herald/Early Spitfire Type 12 Disc brake arrangement and Triumph PCD - but the splined hubs were manufactured to take a BMC Wire Wheel where appropriate.

GT6 & Ford systems would all be later non original modifications if fitted.

Erm, no they didnt. The Mk2 was a BMC or Triumph option.

[simon drabble]

Richard as the current owner of your old car I sadly have to concur - however in Russell's defence he did know that as he told me that before.... I think you would be hard pushed to catch him out on anything Turner related! Even a cursory glance at the website will show that....

[Pist-N-Broke]

Simon, are you going to race it or use it on the road ??. The original plan was a road car you could take to the track. That idea went a little of track towards the end of the build. Am returning from Oz in a few weeks with a Group Sa MGA so will see you around if your racing.
Cheers Richard

[simon drabble]

It has now been inspected and the papers are in the process of being issued. We will race it mostly in FIA sport car/gt races like Flavien Marcais' series and Masters and hopefully it should have an outing at the Silverstone Classic. We have stripped it down and giving it an overhaul at the moment and giving the engine a good winter spruce up! My spanners are very impressed with the level of workmanship on the car and I have to say I think its enchanting. We are running it with a white hardtop, the blue is the same colour as my Merlyn Mk6a so it has become unofficial team colours!!
We will have it out for the Silverstone Classic Media day 6 May and then testing Silverstone 8th May and racing at Flavien's race on the Sunday 10th May if you are still around. If you are come and say hello!

[Silkolene]

Originally posted by Turnersportscars
Turners used BMC 4" PCD on BMC Front Suspension & BMC Rear Axle on the early cars & MKI.
Triumph front suspension MKII & MKIII models originally had Herald/Early Spitfire Type 12 Disc brake arrangement and Triumph PCD - but the splined hubs were manufactured to take a BMC Wire Wheel where appropriate.

GT6 & Ford systems would all be later non original modifications if fitted.

The Ex John Miles racing Turner Mk2 VUD 701 has a Ford rear English axle 4.25 pcd and on the front uses Triumph GT6 3.75 pcd,as far as it can be acertained these where on the car in 1963/4.
Going by various photos of this car in action it seems to have used spoked knock ons then went to wider alloys.
Would this mean that the Spoke GT6 hub units would have been changed for 4/Stud fit GT6 units in 1965 right to its present day.

[Pist-N-Broke]

Originally posted by simon drabble
It has now been inspected and the papers are in the process of being issued. We will race it mostly in FIA sport car/gt races like Flavien Marcais' series and Masters and hopefully it should have an outing at the Silverstone Classic. We have stripped it down and giving it an overhaul at the moment and giving the engine a good winter spruce up! My spanners are very impressed with the level of workmanship on the car and I have to say I think its enchanting. We are running it with a white hardtop, the blue is the same colour as my Merlyn Mk6a so it has become unofficial team colours!!
We will have it out for the Silverstone Classic Media day 6 May and then testing Silverstone 8th May and racing at Flavien's race on the Sunday 10th May if you are still around. If you are come and say hello!

Will be and will do.
Also I have many build pictures on file ranging from pile of scrap on floor to finished article

[Paul Hamilton]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Silkolene
[B]
'The Ex John Miles racing Turner Mk2 VUD 701 has a Ford rear English axle 4.25 pcd and on the front uses Triumph GT6 3.75 pcd,as far as it can be acertained these where on the car in 1963/4.'


I have never seen a Turner with anything other than a BMC rear axle either here in Australia or in the US when I lived there for a period. All the documentation I saw for the cars back in the 60's when I was competing in my Turner indicated that the BMC rear axle was the normal equipment in production and I seriously doubt that any of the cars was fitted from new with a Ford rear axle and/or final drive.

[Turnersportscars]

Originally posted by Pist-N-Broke


Erm, no they didnt. The Mk2 was a BMC or Triumph option.

Ammended for accuracy Richard. Turners used BMC 4" PCD on BMC Front Suspension & BMC Rear Axle on the early cars & MKI/II BMC cars.
'Triumph front suspension' MKII & MKIII models originally had Herald/Early Spitfire Type 12 Disc brake arrangement and Triumph PCD - but the splined hubs were manufactured to take a BMC Wire Wheel where appropriate.

GT6 & Ford systems would all be later non original modifications if fitted.

[Turnersportscars]

Originally posted by Silkolene


The Ex John Miles racing Turner Mk2 VUD 701 has a Ford rear English axle 4.25 pcd and on the front uses Triumph GT6 3.75 pcd,as far as it can be acertained these where on the car in 1963/4.
Going by various photos of this car in action it seems to have used spoked knock ons then went to wider alloys.
Would this mean that the Spoke GT6 hub units would have been changed for 4/Stud fit GT6 units in 1965 right to its present day.

If a Ford Rear & GT6 arrangement was fitted , It was later modification not works fitment.
A Number of racers fitted a stronger Ford rear axle - Anglia I think , but no Turners were supplied with anything other than BMC rear axle or BMC/Triumph front end , and where Triumph front end either early type Herald/Spitfire disc or Herald front Drum brakes in some cases.

[Silkolene]

Spoke to a couple of past owners from the 1960s,Jeff,Mike and Tony Broome who confirms that VUD 701 used when they owned the car,Ford Anglia type axle,with a Salisbury LSD,big shafts,5 linked with rosejoints,Coil over adjustable platforms.
Its believed that the present owner Chris Fulke-Greville has this same system,so a nice proven system to go racing with.

[simon drabble]

I had presumed from your previous posts that you were Chris Fulke-Greville! I think the point that Russell and others are trying to make is that it could well have run with that in period but they were not homologated with that configuration....
Has your mod series had its first race yet?

[andyrp26]

I had presumed from your previous posts that you were Chris Fulke-Greville! I think the point that Russell and others are trying to make is that it could well have run with that in period but they were not homologated with that configuration....
Has your mod series had its first race yet?

The perfect series to show the performance of the car has been introduced this year.

http://www.classicsp...cialsaloons.htm

[Phil Rainford]

Indeed...........looking forward to catching at least a couple of these races this year



PAR

[Sharman]

Phil
As a matter of interest only, without wishing to provoke a rant from a "famous racing driver" Tony Goodwin is not going to race the Turner, I stayed with him in June last year and the car is destined for the road
John

[BarryJohnson]

Simply Google Chris Fulke-Greville and some very interesting results appear.

[Sharman]

Simply Google Chris Fulke-Greville and some very interesting results appear.

Thank you Barry, it was very obvious he practised Onanism but I had no idea that he was such an unmitigated t--t.

[hillsprint]

I'll add my bit to this thread, though my car is already well documented on the Turner website.

I competed in hillclimbs and sprints in Northern Ireland in this car from 1989 to 1993/4 ?? The car was an English based car, and when I bought it, it had been doing speed events for several years. The previous owner was Arthur Nash from the SW of England and I believe he bought it from Dr John Coles in the Midlands and the previous owner to that was a Peter Groome. Due to the unusual surname ( Groom with an e) I tried finding him through the good old telephone directory ( remember the internet didn't exist in 1990 !!) but was unsuccessful but had some entertaining conversations on the way !! Well how would you reract when an Irishman rings up and asks for Peter who used to own a Turner ?

Anyhow back to the car, it was a BMC powered chassis, with c/r A Series 'box and back axle, which had coil over shocks. Arther had rolled it at Silverstone, I think and it had damaged the front of the shell. A cast was taken of the front of Bob Dyson's hillclimb car ( the mould actually had the castings of the "Fablon" sponsorship stickers cast into it !! )and a lift off front was created. Unfortunately the car had lost its chassis nr, which was a pity as it had the Riley 1.5 drums on the rear and a couple of other features that indicated that it might have been a "competition" model from its creation. The then Turner registrar gave me an unused chassis nr for the car so that I could get it road registered and it was given the 1960 Belfast reg of 9330 XI. I had great fun with the car and developed over the 4 years of ownership, eventually putting in a Ford 'box to cope with a 145 hp A Series engine. I also was one of the first people to use the MG Midget Frontline front suspension conversion, which replaced the lever arm shock with an A arm and a Koni damper. The car still holds class records at most of the Ulster hills, it was just a great combination of handling and power.

I traded the car in with Deryk Young for his Vision V87H chassis and he almost immediately sold the car to a chap in Belgium who had it until quite recently, I saw it for sale in 2010, with racing at Spa now added to it's history

Here it is on a wet day on the Spelga Pass hillclimb, circa 1992



Regards

Michael Beattie

Edited by hillsprint, 10 March 2012 - 21:42.

[RS2000]

Simply Google Chris Fulke-Greville and some very interesting results appear.

Interesting in that the first Google result includes the implied false allegation that least one other (than Silkolene) long standing user name from here is an internet alias of his! You can see how someone new to it reading this thread might wrongly assume that, as a "holding conversations with yourself" accusation, when in fact the post was a simple comment about a well known and often questioned bhp claim.

Edited by RS2000, 10 March 2012 - 23:04.

[D-Type]

Simply Google Chris Fulke-Greville and some very interesting results appear.

Very interesting. It puts all references to VUD 701 into a totally different light.

Edited by D-Type, 05 June 2013 - 15:42.

[Turnersportscars]

[quote name='hillsprint' date='Mar 10 2012, 21:40' post='5579803']



Hi Michael , Nice to hear from you , Your old Turner is still storming up the hills , It belongs today to Patrice Wattine in France and is in regular competition use.
You can see lots of clips from on board the car be searching Turner Sports Cars on You Tube

Best Regards Russell

[hillsprint]

Russell

Any chance of a link?

I've tried various searches and have only found a race at Zandvoort in 2000



Cheers

Michael

[hillsprint]

Russell

Re your post #79, I believe the Bob Mayfield car is now owned by the Woodside family here in Northern Ireland and has recently been restored having been hidden away almost since the hour it was bought back in the early 1990s.

Around the same time I went to see an Alexander (?) Turner in Co Antrim, which was in need of restoration, it had a semi downdraft head if I remember correctly.


Re the homologation of a Twin Cam engine, I have somewhere a set of papers for a Turner Ford 1650 and if my memory serves me correctly the twin cam head was added as an Addendum for the Ford block. The T/C being based on the Pre x Flow block ofcourse.


Regards

Michael

[andyrp26]

Russell

Any chance of a link?

I've tried various searches and have only found a race at Zandvoort in 2000



Cheers

Michael

Try these:

http://www.youtube.c...feature=related

[hillsprint]

Cheers

Great to see the old girl still in action. Pity about the modified roll hoop, looks a bit "Australian " and the Weller wheels, had a nice set of alloys on it when I sold it. The engine has an exotic set of split 45 Webers on it, hope they're still there

[Stephen W]

Cheers

Great to see the old girl still in action. Pity about the modified roll hoop, looks a bit "Australian " and the Weller wheels, had a nice set of alloys on it when I sold it. The engine has an exotic set of split 45 Webers on it, hope they're still there

The extention is probably due to a taller driver - I have noticed of late that cars are being observed on track by scrutineers to check the roll-over bar heights. I wonder why that isn't done when the car is scrutineered?

[Rupertlt1]

4357 WY is pictured in Autosport, 2 February 1962, Page 174

Turner Climax of D. A. Walker

 

RGDS RLT

[davidbuckden]

I would be Interested to hear from any former owners of Turner Sports Cars , Or see any pictures of Turners you may have - Especially period racing images.

Always looking for race results and History of Turner Cars

If you remember Turners , Please do get in touch!

These are paddock views of the ex-John Miles ‘63 Turner Mk.2 at Lydden, May 2022.  Hope they might be of interest.

 

Regards.

 

David

 

Edited by davidbuckden, 30 September 2023 - 12:26.

[Rupertlt1]

Advertisement in Autocar, 20 April 1956, Page 25

Photo of VTU 62.

"The Turner Sports Car is manufactured by Turner Sports Cars (Wolverhampton) Ltd.

Body Shell by Hill's Fibreglass Developments Ltd. in Cellobond Polyester Resin reinforced with Fibreglass."
https://classiccarca...URNER_1956.html
Are there any photographs of the factory at Pendeford Airport, Wolverhampton?

Also at 32 Merridale Street (1956)?

This car long predates the Austin Healey Sprite, with "large capacity boot".

 

#55 Alexander Turner, 6751 RO, at Oulton Park: https://www.stilltim.../abg/abg261.jpg

 

RGDS RLT

Edited by Rupertlt1, 23 January 2024 - 08:34.

[69seven]

There are some pictures on the Turner Sports Cars website, e.g.' in the 'Timeline' presentation files. Turner Sports Cars

[Rupertlt1]

Goodwood, National Meeting, Whit Monday, 10th June 1957

Event 5—Ladies' Five lap handicap

1st—Mrs. Averil Scott-Moncrieff (Lotus-M.G.), 10 Min 53.8 sec, 60.27 m.p.h.

2nd—Miss Rosemary Seers (Cooper-Zephyr), 11 Min 4.8 sec

3rd—Mrs. Jean Bloxam (Aston Martin DB2), 11 Min 16.4 sec

4th—Mrs. Margaret Ashby (Leco-M.G.), 11 Min 17.6 sec

5th—Miss Betty Haig (Turner)

6th—Miss Patsy Burt (M.G.A)

 

RGDS RLT 

[dgs]

No 46 Miss Betty Haig, (Turner  950, chassis 30/040, Reg: TSV 483)  5th, 11'43.6"

[Rupertlt1]

No 46 Miss Betty Haig, (Turner  950, chassis 30/040, Reg: TSV 483)  5th, 11'43.6"

 

That is strange, as I have 30/040 registered SUF 1?

SV is a Kinross C.C. registration? UF is Brighton C.B.C.

 

Swanden Motor Car Sales of Arundale Road, Worthing, were Turner agents affiliated to Fields Garages of Chichester and also supplied (30/040) the successful early racing Turner SUF 1 to Betty Haig (Registered 13/03/1957).— per Russell Filby.

 

Ah, see: http://www.turnerspo..._photos040.html

 

RGDS RLT

Edited by Rupertlt1, 28 January 2024 - 08:47.

[Geoff E]

No 46 Miss Betty Haig, (Turner  950, chassis 30/040, Reg: TSV 483)  5th, 11'43.6"

 

The registration series SV 1 to SV 9999 was never actually completed as vehicle sales in Kinross-shire were sparse, so there was no ASV, BSV etc before the year suffixes began there in 1964.  Accordingly, there must be some doubt over the existence of TSV 483 in 1957.

 

https://www.oldclass...trations/sv.htm

Edited by Geoff E, 28 January 2024 - 08:54.

[Rupertlt1]

The point is why would a lady resident in Sussex have a car registered in Scotland?

 

RGDS RLT