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Half season Winners and Losers


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#1 Most Fastest

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Posted 23 June 2008 - 05:02

OK, ok, one more race until half season, but some trends are already emerging and I just started thinking about 07 versus 08 comparisons right now, so bollocks to the one race missing to be 50% exactly. After almost 45% of the racing, we are faced with this situation at the top of the crop (forgive odd commentary) :

+ 30 Robert Kubica - Looks like the Pope's art on his helmet is finally paying off. The kid needed a little time but he is ending Heidfeld' s career and is making Lewis look like he shouldn't have won in GP2....
Maybe it was the Canada's bang that woke him up

+ 16 Mark Webber - OK, bad luck and always being at the wrong place at the wrong time, but not even Mark could keep up with the Bad Luck Award of the Year requirements. Finally, he is showing he is not just a one lap wonder. He and Jarno are finally showing race pace. Finally a Newey's car not breaking down every other lap. A record for the last decade (last Newey's car to go anywhere....1999!!!). Also, he is an Aussie and that is kool in itself. Now, if I could understand a word he says........

+ 11 Jarnoooooo!!!! The villified Italian is finally taking revenge. First screwed by fellow Italian backstubber Flavio Briatore, he run into more trouble at Toyota when management somehow assumed that a certian Ralphie was goingg to lead them to glory because his last name was Schumacher. Once they rectified their missunderstaning and fired the lousy German and hired a capable German instead, the team has followed Jarno's demands for the car and the team has enjoyed good results. Imagine they had hired Ross Brown.....

+ 9 Heikki K. - OK, it was very easy to score + 9 with a McLaren. But the dude had a massive accident and some shitty luck. He should be given credit for being so close to Lewis in a new team and new car. Beating Lewis 2-3 times already is more than what McLaren expected

+ 3 Niko Rosberg - Tough last 2 races, but still 3 points more than 07. He is a solid driver, his career in F1 is garanteed. Now, can Williams up it to the big boys anymore? to be decided.....

+ 1 Felippppe!!!!!! Massa was already dead and burried after 2 races. He is now leading the championship!!!! Today he was truly gifted the win, but the guy has never been lucky, so for once WTF!!!! Keep trying, buddy!!!

- 1 Kimster. OK, doesn;t sound too aweful, but 1 point is what gave him the 07 title. So, it could be a big enough loss. Bad luck though should have been entirely been used, so maybe better days are coming

- 2 Nick Heidfeld - OK, not a big gap, but Kubica is setting the field on fire and Nick is falling asleep. He will lose his seat if he keeps racing like this weekend while his teamate keeps comfortably running in the points

- 26 - Lewis Hamilton. stunning deficit, he cannot rely on Kimi's bad luck excuses. He had a Las Vegas style good luck after crashing into the wall in Monaco, losing a tire and still winning. Last two races showed the same brain farting syndrome of China and Brazil. Dennis is still pulling the strings ("I will not join drivers' association"; "strike is not even something I would consider"; "puppet string got stuck, Ron"), but Lewis is more and more pulling his dick. Canada's brain fade was reinforced by passing Vettel off course today. As soon as the pressure mounts, his brain short circuits. Just like his father Ron. I mean, his boss Ron.....

- 40 - Fernando Alonso. So, you thought that Renault's problems were Fisichella? Think again. Yes, you are good, but a shit car is a shit car. And today NP Jr. beat you. In a way it is some form of poetic justice. The two head bangers, cheap backstubbers from the 07 Mac' s camp are both struggling massively in 08. For once, the jerks are punished and the rest is triving. Gotta love that.

Meritable note to Vettel after a career killing start (finally people seem to avoid his car) and Suttil for a phenomenal drive in Monaco.

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#2 color

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Posted 23 June 2008 - 14:10

Originally posted by Most Fastest

+ 30 Robert Kubica - Looks like the Pope's art on his helmet is finally paying off. The kid needed a little time but he is ending Heidfeld' s career and is making Lewis look like he shouldn't have won in GP2....
Maybe it was the Canada's bang that woke him up


1. Kubica had Pope's name on 2006 helmet. It doesn't appear on his 2008 and 2007 helmets, i think (correct me if I'm wrong).
2. He never raced in GP2 series. He raced Hamilton only in karting (and he was faster than LH).
3. 2007 "boring" BMW suited Nick, not Robert. strangely enough 2008 BMW suits extremely aggressive style of Kubi better, Nick struggles. it is as simple as that.
4. Canada "big bang" did not "wake up" Kubica. It had nothing to do with his motivation and speed. The car he drives is the only thing that has an impact on him - see 2008 Canada BIG heights and 2008 France BIG lows.

#3 Frank Booth

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Posted 23 June 2008 - 15:07

My big surprise this year has to be Toyota as a team. What a huge benefit getting rid of Ralf was.

#4 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 23 June 2008 - 15:09

They havent had as much success as the first year Ralf was there, so...

#5 D.M.N.

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Posted 23 June 2008 - 15:11

Originally posted by Most Fastest
+ 1 Felippppe!!!!!! Massa was already dead and burried after 2 races. He is now leading the championship!!!! Today he was truly gifted the win, but the guy has never been lucky, so for once WTF!!!! Keep trying, buddy!!!

- 26 - Lewis Hamilton. stunning deficit, he cannot rely on Kimi's bad luck excuses. He had a Las Vegas style good luck after crashing into the wall in Monaco, losing a tire and still winning. Last two races showed the same brain farting syndrome of China and Brazil. Dennis is still pulling the strings ("I will not join drivers' association"; "strike is not even something I would consider"; "puppet string got stuck, Ron"), but Lewis is more and more pulling his dick. Canada's brain fade was reinforced by passing Vettel off course today. As soon as the pressure mounts, his brain short circuits. Just like his father Ron. I mean, his boss Ron.....


You've told us you hate both Ferrari and McLaren.

Massa, has been much more better than Raikkonen, and you put him 2 points ahead ONLY.

And Hamilton's on -26, well he's only made one mistake. Give him a break...... :mad:

#6 FAUST!!!

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Posted 23 June 2008 - 15:22

Originally posted by D.M.N.


You've told us you hate both Ferrari and McLaren.

Massa, has been much more better than Raikkonen, and you put him 2 points ahead ONLY.

And Hamilton's on -26, well he's only made one mistake. Give him a break...... :mad:




This is the actual difference between accumulated driver points in 2007 and 2008 until Round 8 of the championship.

#7 Tigershark

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Posted 23 June 2008 - 16:04

Unless an error crept into the calculation, this is the full list. I'll leave the commentary to Most Fastest. ;)

Kubica +29
Webber +16
Trulli +11
Kovalainen +8
Barrichello +5
Rosberg +3
Coulthard +2
Button +2
Raikkonen +1
Massa +1

Heidfeld -2
Sato -4
Fisichella -16
Hamilton -26
Alonso -40


#8 jonpollak

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Posted 23 June 2008 - 16:08

pfft...
no chance of any unbiased assessment then huh.. :

Mid season Winner...Kyle Busch
Mid season Loser.....Max Mosley

Jp

#9 patgaw

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Posted 23 June 2008 - 16:19

Originally posted by color
[B]

1. Kubica had Pope's name on 2006 helmet. It doesn't appear on his 2008 and 2007 helmets, i think (correct me if I'm wrong).


he removed that after Canada 07, cos of media's BS.

#10 hello86

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Posted 23 June 2008 - 16:21

Originally posted by D.M.N.


You've told us you hate both Ferrari and McLaren.

Massa, has been much more better than Raikkonen, and you put him 2 points ahead ONLY.

And Hamilton's on -26, well he's only made one mistake. Give him a break...... :mad:


Where has Massa been much better than Kimi?
Kimi had bad luck the last 2 races which cost him 10-12 points!

#11 Fausta

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Posted 23 June 2008 - 17:19

Childish flame war thread. Stupid!

#12 wrighty

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Posted 23 June 2008 - 17:27

Originally posted by jonpollak
pfft...
no chance of any unbiased assessment then huh.. :

Mid season Winner...Kyle Busch

Jp


oh you devil, fancy introducing 'the real world' to a good quality 'there is no life outside F1'-style discussion......hang your head in shame :lol:



:up:

#13 Oversteer1

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Posted 23 June 2008 - 19:47

Unless F-1 is going back to the best finishes in each half of the season, this matters little. I don't believe
they're too many surprises except BMW etc.......


Mark

#14 Risil

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Posted 23 June 2008 - 20:13

Some winners:

Tony George, for having the remnants of the CCWS fall into his lap, although his biggest challenge will come over the next half-decade. Sponsors should return to the reunited OW scene, Indianapolis will undoubtedly remain the star of the show, and the racing isn't that bad; but George needs to realise that retaining the American character of his series is about more than keeping them running on ovals. Americans need to be funnelled into open-wheel racing from an early age, and George will need to work with, rather than against, other series in order to help this happen.

Robert Kubica. Probably the only driver in F1 to emerge from 2008 (so far) with an enhanced reputation, the man who is to film star good looks what Brad Pitt is to faithful, intelligent interpretations of Classical Texts has taken numerous podiums and a victory against the still-crushing dominance of McFerrari. Heidfeld either needs more time or a new car (he definitely deserves both) but both Kubica's results and his ease at running Formula One's established stars put have put him on the verge of becoming one himself. The fact that, at half-distance, Kubica is still a realistic title challenger illustrates the emergence of another Senna-like (think 1986) talent.;)

Valentino Rossi has a decent lead in the MotoGP points standings, and has won more races than anyone else. Even after last year he was hardly in crisis, but this year was arguably crucial in proving that he could still run with Pedrosa, Stoner and even Lorenzo. Rossi seems to get very nervous when out of the competition - his somewhat rash switch to Bridgestone and apparent deliberation over signing on with Yamaha demonstrates this - and another year riding outside the leading pack (of one) might've ended his career.



Losers:

Marco Melandri. :(

Renault have suffered few technical disruptions after their tremendous 2005-2006 World Championships - Alonso has returned to little noticeable effect, other than to the occasional smug pundit; it seems that the team is simply unable to keep pace (or, more likely, spending) with the top two, or BMW. The cost-reducing effect of the simplified 2009 design regulations, and the proposed spending caps, offer probably the last chance for Renault - but one suspects without immediate signs of improvement next year Renault, and possibly one or two other teams, will depart from Formula One. Good riddance. :cat:

Dario, Sam, AJ, even Juan. You can't say that a second year of firmly running midfield in NASCAR represents a successful move for Montoya, and Stock Car racing's more recent open-wheel acquisitions show no signs of making an improvement on Juan Pablo's achievements. The whole foray smacks slightly of Michael Jordan; all we need now is a kidnapping by the Loony Toons. Even so, an F1-based version of Space Jam would still be a hundred times better than Driven.



Max Mosley claims a draw - his personal and professional reputation has been destroyed (although with that surname Max is surely used to it), but on the other hand, he and the teams seem poised to take Bernie and CVC down with him. :lol:

#15 Massa_f1

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Posted 23 June 2008 - 22:11

Originally posted by D.M.N.


You've told us you hate both Ferrari and McLaren.

Massa, has been much more better than Raikkonen, and you put him 2 points ahead ONLY.

And Hamilton's on -26, well he's only made one mistake. Give him a break...... :mad:


Hamilton has made sevreal mistakes not just one.


He ran into Alonso at Bahrain.
He cliped the wall in Monaco
He Hit Kimi in pits in Canada
and in general he is driving very ragged and on the edge.

#16 osoul

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 10:03

Winners:

Kubica - after a disappointing season he bounced back in fashion. Outqualified Heidfeld every time this year, and proven to be a WDC material.

Massa - after 2 bad races at the start and a common opinion that he can't drive without TC, he bounced back, and now leads the WDC with some stunning drives, and most wins in the bag.

Trulli - he seems to have a good year. I doubt he can drive will throughout the whole season, but so far, so good.

Webber - same as Trulli. Now he manage to get points consistently and not just a one-lap-wonder. Ironically like we saw in the previous years, Coulthard got all the glory with a fluke podium. Typical.


Losers:

Heidfeld - plain awful. He lost all of his edge, and he is nowhere this year. Good start in Melbourne and a solid race pace in Bahrain, but consistent qualifying woes and now he couldn't even match Kubica's race pace.

Button - what can I say? his old and faded teammate manage to beat him consistently. His only point finishing race was a simple fluke, and generally anonymus in the whole season.

Alonso - where are the 6 tenths? OK, he can beat Piquet jr., but apart from fake PR laps and a flukish result in Melbourne, nothing we can remember.

Glock - nowhere. His only point finishing race was overshadowed by a bad mistake, which costed Trulli a position. Canada is a redeeming track for him.

Hamilton - very inconsistent. Some brilliances, but awful rookie mistakes as well. Now he must start to perform.

Piquet jr - not as bad as many says, but still bad. OK, he had 1 great race in France, but what we have seen so far before it, well oh well.

Sutil - exclude Monaco, his awesome (although cheated) performance, and he is nowhere near to his faded teammate.

Raikkonen - some great races, and some bad ones. Not at all impressive.

Kovalainen - disappointing, and sometimes, very slow.


This season has more losers unfortunately.

#17 osoul

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 10:06

Oh, I forgot Coulthard. He is a loser as well. Way too many crashes and mistakes.

#18 donald29

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 10:26

Originally posted by Ross Stonefeld
They havent had as much success as the first year Ralf was there, so...


:up: I still think Ralf is overly criticised.

Fisichella has to be a big loser halfway. He should retire.

Massa and Kubica definite winners.

#19 osoul

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 10:29

Originally posted by donald29


:up: I still think Ralf is overly criticised.

Fisichella has to be a big loser halfway. He should retire.

Massa and Kubica definite winners.


Why Fisichella is a loser this year? He is consistently overperforming his young and prospering teammate.

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#20 Ruf

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 10:39

Originally posted by osoul
Oh, I forgot Coulthard. He is a loser as well. Way too many crashes and mistakes.

Don't forget the podium! Not bad for Old Dave, definitelly not a loser.

#21 wingwalker

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 10:49

Originally posted by MiPe


[Kubica] is an uninspiring lazy cruiser and luckiest SOB on the grid who is occupying a seat that was denied to more deserving drivers of true blue BMW heritage




Yeah, they BWM should definitely send him to Toro Rosso and get Vettel instead, as SV would really deliver and beat Ferraris on regular basis. Totally.
:rolleyes:

#22 ex Rhodie racer

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 11:25

I really thought Heikki would be a lot better in the Mac. He has under performed badly IMO. Ron would do well to think about waving a contract under Robert Kubica´s nose. He would be perfect for their team.
Rosberg to BMW. He deserves a much better car than the one Williams are giving him at the moment.

#23 mursuka80

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 11:27

Originally posted by ex Rhodie racer
I really thought Heikki would be a lot better in the Mac. He has under performed badly IMO. Ron would do well to think about waving a contract under Robert Kubica´s nose. He would be perfect for their team.
Rosberg to BMW. He deserves a much better car than the one Williams are giving him at the moment.


And be No2 to Lewis? Robert doesnt deserve that shit :down:

#24 Gemini

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 11:32

Originally posted by color


1. Kubica had Pope's name on 2006 helmet. It doesn't appear on his 2008 and 2007 helmets, i think (correct me if I'm wrong).
2. He never raced in GP2 series. He raced Hamilton only in karting (and he was faster than LH).
3. 2007 "boring" BMW suited Nick, not Robert. strangely enough 2008 BMW suits extremely aggressive style of Kubi better, Nick struggles. it is as simple as that.
4. Canada "big bang" did not "wake up" Kubica. It had nothing to do with his motivation and speed. The car he drives is the only thing that has an impact on him - see 2008 Canada BIG heights and 2008 France BIG lows.


Ad.1 Correct

Ad. Kubica raced Hamilton in F3 in 2004. Hamilton ended 5th with 69 points, Kubica 7th with 53 points. They also raced in 2004 in Macau together. Lewis got pole, Robert got fastest lap.

#25 ex Rhodie racer

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 11:46

Originally posted by mursuka80


And be No2 to Lewis? Robert doesnt deserve that shit :down:


Obviously not. I believe Robert would establish himself as the #1 before the season´s half way through. At least he would have a winning car, which is not the case now. Well, not unless people eliminate other people in the pits and all that.

#26 donald29

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 11:48

Originally posted by osoul


Why Fisichella is a loser this year? He is consistently overperforming his young and prospering teammate.


As he is a veteran of 200+ GP's and is trundling around half a second behind everyone else, and I don't see the point in him doing that.

#27 bankoq

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 12:02

Originally posted by Gemini
They also raced in 2004 in Macau together. Lewis got pole, Robert got fastest lap.


Yeah, that was the only situation they raced for the same team in higher formulas than karts. It was Manor Motorsport and they were like family for Lewis because he raced with them for about 2-3 years (in F3 but also in some lower series), and this was a new team for Robert. I've read some interview with one of the team's engineer and he said that Robert was immediately on the same pace as Lewis or even faster and it was tough to handle this situation for Briton, actually team members were afraid that he's going to crash during practices and qulification run trying to be faster than Robert.

In the end Robert had pole position in qulification run (edged Lewis by about 0.15 AFAIR), but lost several positions in sprint race (which determined the start positions for the proper race) which was won by Lewis. Then in the main race Lewis was overtaken by Nico Rosberg at the start, but soon they both made the same mistake finishing their races. Robert finished 2nd with fastest lap.

I hope Robert gets a competetive car and we'll see these guys fighting each other like in karts and Macau.

Here are some stats from the F3 2004 Macau race: http://www.motorsm.c...04_Macau_GP.asp

#28 osoul

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 13:05

Originally posted by donald29


As he is a veteran of 200+ GP's and is trundling around half a second behind everyone else, and I don't see the point in him doing that.


He is driving a Force India. He is still driving faster than Adrian Sutil, and was a lot faster than the Aguris when they were still around. In Sepang, Bahrain, Barcelona he outperformed drivers with better cars. Hardly a loser.

#29 Beyond

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 13:34

The real winner so far is Kubica. The loser is Hamilton.
Massa and Raikkonen had both good and bad races, massa reacted well after a bad start while raikkonen was unlucky in the last races and lost the lead.
Heidfeld is a loser for sure, no comparison with his teammate, as Piquet. kovalainen has still to prove he's fast.
Very challenging championship for the outsiders trulli and webber.

#30 color

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 13:42

Originally posted by Gemini


Ad.1 Correct

Ad. Kubica raced Hamilton in F3 in 2004. Hamilton ended 5th with 69 points, Kubica 7th with 53 points. They also raced in 2004 in Macau together. Lewis got pole, Robert got fastest lap.


Informative as always, thank you :)

One other user has pointed something else 'bout 2007 helmet, but it doesn't matter that much.
I should have used the expression "lower formulas" instead of "karting" - this is what I really meant. My bad.

#31 Alfisti

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 13:54

Originally posted by ex Rhodie racer
I really thought Heikki would be a lot better in the Mac. He has under performed badly IMO. Ron would do well to think about waving a contract under Robert Kubica´s nose. He would be perfect for their team.


Couldn't disagree more. Firstly I think HK is perfoirming exactly as expected and that is exactly what McLaren weant from him. He has career number II written all over him and that is just what Dennis wanted, essentially another DC to support the main man.

kubica would be too close to Hamilton and upset the apple cart.

#32 ex Rhodie racer

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 13:58

Originally posted by Alfisti


Couldn't disagree more. Firstly I think HK is perfoirming exactly as expected and that is exactly what McLaren weant from him. He has career number II written all over him and that is just what Dennis wanted, essentially another DC to support the main man.

kubica would be too close to Hamilton and upset the apple cart.

Oh, sorry, I thought Dennis wanted results. How silly of me.

#33 Ruf

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 14:10

Originally posted by ex Rhodie racer

Oh, sorry, I thought Dennis wanted results. How silly of me.

Yup. That's precisely the reason he decided to dump that Fernando rookie deadweight for the experienced Heiki.

#34 ex Rhodie racer

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 14:14

Originally posted by Ruf
Yup. That's precisely the reason he decided to dump that Fernando rookie deadweight for the experienced Heiki.

Stroke of genius that was. :lol:

#35 Spunout

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 14:18

Originally posted by ex Rhodie racer

Oh, sorry, I thought Dennis wanted results. How silly of me.


Nope. The main goal of any F1 team is to make their Golden Boy look good.

Stuff like wins or WCC points...less important.

#36 color

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 14:25

Originally posted by Spunout


Nope. The main goal of any F1 team is to make their Golden Boy look good.

Stuff like wins or WCC points...less important.


hmm... they have achieved their goal then... they have one "golden boy" instead of a lead in WDC and WCC points.

#37 z2z

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 14:32

Originally posted by Fausta
Childish flame war thread. Stupid!


actually decent topic.. but first post..!

#38 yr

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 14:52

Originally posted by ex Rhodie racer
I really thought Heikki would be a lot better in the Mac. He has under performed badly IMO. Ron would do well to think about waving a contract under Robert Kubica´s nose. He would be perfect for their team.
Rosberg to BMW. He deserves a much better car than the one Williams are giving him at the moment.


While I agree that Heikki hasn´t shown much yet, it can´t be denied that there has been some bad luck too. No, I´ll take that back, he has had one of the worst luck I´ve ever seen, he is making Mika Häkkinen look like a luckiest driver ever. Still, he has been quite good - counting the fuel he has had - in most quals, but in race after race he has crashed/started in mid-pack/got screwed by SC etc. really, come to think of it, has he had even one "normal" race where something out of his control wasn´t hampering him?

#39 4MEN

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 15:08

Originally posted by Risil
Some winners:

Tony George, for having the remnants of the CCWS fall into his lap, although his biggest challenge will come over the next half-decade. Sponsors should return to the reunited OW scene, Indianapolis will undoubtedly remain the star of the show, and the racing isn't that bad; but George needs to realise that retaining the American character of his series is about more than keeping them running on ovals. Americans need to be funnelled into open-wheel racing from an early age, and George will need to work with, rather than against, other series in order to help this happen.

Robert Kubica. Probably the only driver in F1 to emerge from 2008 (so far) with an enhanced reputation, the man who is to film star good looks what Brad Pitt is to faithful, intelligent interpretations of Classical Texts has taken numerous podiums and a victory against the still-crushing dominance of McFerrari. Heidfeld either needs more time or a new car (he definitely deserves both) but both Kubica's results and his ease at running Formula One's established stars put have put him on the verge of becoming one himself. The fact that, at half-distance, Kubica is still a realistic title challenger illustrates the emergence of another Senna-like (think 1986) talent.;)

Valentino Rossi has a decent lead in the MotoGP points standings, and has won more races than anyone else. Even after last year he was hardly in crisis, but this year was arguably crucial in proving that he could still run with Pedrosa, Stoner and even Lorenzo. Rossi seems to get very nervous when out of the competition - his somewhat rash switch to Bridgestone and apparent deliberation over signing on with Yamaha demonstrates this - and another year riding outside the leading pack (of one) might've ended his career.



Losers:

Marco Melandri. :(

Renault have suffered few technical disruptions after their tremendous 2005-2006 World Championships - Alonso has returned to little noticeable effect, other than to the occasional smug pundit; it seems that the team is simply unable to keep pace (or, more likely, spending) with the top two, or BMW. The cost-reducing effect of the simplified 2009 design regulations, and the proposed spending caps, offer probably the last chance for Renault - but one suspects without immediate signs of improvement next year Renault, and possibly one or two other teams, will depart from Formula One. Good riddance. :cat:

Dario, Sam, AJ, even Juan. You can't say that a second year of firmly running midfield in NASCAR represents a successful move for Montoya, and Stock Car racing's more recent open-wheel acquisitions show no signs of making an improvement on Juan Pablo's achievements. The whole foray smacks slightly of Michael Jordan; all we need now is a kidnapping by the Loony Toons. Even so, an F1-based version of Space Jam would still be a hundred times better than Driven.



Max Mosley claims a draw - his personal and professional reputation has been destroyed (although with that surname Max is surely used to it), but on the other hand, he and the teams seem poised to take Bernie and CVC down with him. :lol:

:up:

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#40 secessionman

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 15:22

Originally posted by yr

....come to think of it, has he had even one "normal" race where something out of his control wasn´t hampering him?


I'd love to see an analysis of Heiki's season (from someone with more knowledge than me), factoring out the bad luck he has suffered, and allowing for relative fuel loads etc to determine how the Championship table would otherwise look if his races had been allowed to pan out. I would suspect his points total would not be much different to his team-mates.

I can only re-call one driver error (Melbourne) which cost him one point, and (unless I have forgotten something obvious) Montreal was the only race he hasn't been compromised by something outside of his control. Maybe Sepang also as, although he was compromised, that was largely his own fault as with LH.

#41 HoldenRT

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 17:27

It's funny because in the last 4 years I've thought Trulli and Webber are the two most underrated. Webber has his Aussie contingent, but Trulli has NO fans. It's like I'm semi impressed with his driving every season and yet feel like his biggest fan because there is no one else. Even Ralf has more fans even now. So anyway, it's good to see these two getting some results. And for Kubica, he hasn't been in F1 as long but I thought he was very unlucky last year with reliability. And the biggest factor from last year to this year imo, is that since all the cars are reliable there is less luck involved and random results. It's a strange season when the top cars are just as unreliable as lower ones. And imo the cream is rising to the top. If Button and Nico had cars on terms with RBR and Toyota they'd be up there too. And there's Alonso, but I'm not a fan of his approach at the moment but of course he is still one of the top guys.

For Heiki I wasn't expecting much to be honest, and despite the fact that he's only 2 points ahead of Webber and Trulli, he's done pretty well imo. Most people (unless your a fan) usually forget alot of the unlucky moments, and then just fill in the blanks with "oh he must of been off the pace then". I can name 4 races off the top of my head where he's been well and trully screwed and I'm sure McLaren aren't too upset about it. Melbourne with SC, Spain with failure and crash, Turkey with turn 1 puncture and Monaco with engine stall before lights even went green (Whitmarsh said not his fault). As always in F1 no one cares about the hard luck stories, they only acknowledge results, but he has shown enough so that when things do go his way he can do what he needs to. And let's not forget he is always on the heavy strategy and despite that has outqualified Lewis at times.

Fisi's done pretty good, only.. he's in a car so bad that even when he has a good day it's not noticable. Which makes you wonder why he's still in F1.

#42 donald29

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Posted 24 June 2008 - 18:22

Originally posted by HoldenRT

Fisi's done pretty good, only.. he's in a car so bad that even when he has a good day it's not noticable. Which makes you wonder why he's still in F1.


Exactly, I don't see why he is there still, so consider him a loser from this season. He impressed with some potential pace at the start, but FI have just fallen further behind, and he should just retire IMO. He was only ever solid when he finally did get in a top car anyway (although shone in mid field cars)