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Who ruined the champagne fight!?


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#1 Dolph

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Posted 30 June 2008 - 21:53

A tradition that started with champagne bottles accidentally uncorking themselves (in the 1967 Le Mans it was?). The champagne celebrations used to be fights with champagne bottles, spraying the unfortunate who happened to stand near by, bottles turned upside down in someones race suit (I vaguely remember RS having a bottle in his suit) and over the head (remember Senna in Monaco - unforgettable pictures). Now it's all squirt a little on the team and then drop the bottle to them. Sometimes the drivers forget themselves and it gets a bit out of hand. But that's more and more the exception. Where's the excitement in that!? I personally blame Michael Schumacher for this as he most likely started this tradition with his love the team image. You gotta appreciate the team, but there is no excuses for ruining a nice tradition such as this (who ever it was, if it was not MS) :down: :down: :down: Discuss! (Flame suit on)


http://lh6.ggpht.com...30328MRP001.jpg

http://lh5.ggpht.com...20817MRP001.jpg

http://lh5.ggpht.com...11020MRP002.jpg

http://newsimg.bbc.c...2belgium416.jpg

http://newsimg.bbc.c...chumassa416.jpg

http://www.tribunein...0020722/sp8.jpg

http://www.mschumach...p-champagne.jpg

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#2 Sébastien

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Posted 30 June 2008 - 21:57

Just take Kimi's advice: put it in the mouth, not in the eye ;)

#3 BMW_F1

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Posted 30 June 2008 - 22:04

Originally posted by Dolph
A tradition that started with champagne bottles accidentally uncorking themselves (in the 1967 Le Mans it was?).


yep.. Dan Gurney started it after winning the race with his teammate with A.J Foyt.

Posted Image

#4 KWSN - DSM

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Posted 30 June 2008 - 22:32

It was lost when it became a mandated choegraphed event by the FIA (or is it FOM mandating this), if the drivers do not partake, they are fined.

Something which is no longer a pur of the moment, is no longer interesting. Like the victory laps in track and field, holding your national flag high, when it first happened at the 1976 when John Aki Bua for the sheer delight and pleasure did it, it was new, fresh and interesting, and the Ugandian (Ugandan??) flag was thrown to him from the stands. Now they have handlers standing ready to hand them out, and on occasion they have even Commercial logos on them.

The Champagne 'fight' outlived itslef many many many years ago. Before Schumacher, before Senna and before Prost. So if you want to place blame, go further back.

:cool:

#5 Mauseri

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Posted 30 June 2008 - 23:24

I think it's actually quite stupid to see drivers play with champagne like little kids with water weapons..

Just have a sip and let your team have their sips...

#6 KWSN - DSM

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Posted 30 June 2008 - 23:29

Originally posted by micra_k10
I think it's actually quite stupid to see drivers play with champagne like little kids with water weapons..

Just have a sip and let your team have their sips...


I agree, but that is against the rules how stupid that may seem though.

:cool:

#7 KWSN - DSM

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Posted 30 June 2008 - 23:40

Well I may stand corrected part of the way:

2. PODIUM
a) ROSTRUM AND DAIS
The dimensions of the dais must follow those found in the FIA graphic design manual.
The distance between the edge of the winner's dais and the retaining barrier of the podium should
be a minimum of 120cm to provide a walkway.
The place where each person presenting a trophy should stand must be marked on the floor of
the podium.
Trophies must be laid out on a single table on one side of the podium. The champagne must be
on the dais.

.......

c) When the champagne shower begins, music should be played. This should not start until the
presenters have left the podium.


I have in the back of my mind 'someone' possibly Michael Schumacher being fined Usd 10.000 for not participating in the Champagne fight, but can not find a rule actually saying that.

But at least per the regulatory body a champagne shower will take place.


:cool:

#8 Vitesse2

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 08:18

Originally posted by BMW_F1


yep.. Dan Gurney started it after winning the race with his teammate with A.J Foyt.

... or not ;)

Graham Hill at the 1966 Australian GP:

Posted Image

Pic taken from a TNF thread called Squirting. See also Doug Nye's comments about Les Leston .... :)

#9 RedBaron

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 08:36

You blame Michael Schumacher for the bottle dropping and ruining a tradition of spraying champagne? Was that a joke... because it seems the guy in most of those pics is Michael Schumacher and he seems very much to be holding up the tradition.

#10 Perigee

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 09:00

Originally posted by RedBaron
You blame Michael Schumacher for the bottle dropping and ruining a tradition of spraying champagne? Was that a joke... because it seems the guy in most of those pics is Michael Schumacher and he seems very much to be holding up the tradition.

Don't you know this forum would implode if there were not several Schumacher-bashes included each day?  ;)

#11 pRy

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 09:53

Perhaps the drivers just got sick and tired of having to deal with stinging eyes due to getting Champagne in them. I don't see a problem with the champagne being given to the team to drink after the race.. they deserve it just as much as the drivers.

#12 F1Fanatic.co.uk

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 10:49

Originally posted by RedBaron
You blame Michael Schumacher for the bottle dropping and ruining a tradition of spraying champagne? Was that a joke... because it seems the guy in most of those pics is Michael Schumacher and he seems very much to be holding up the tradition.

With apologies to Matt Stone and Trey Parker.

Times have changed
F1 is getting worse
Drivers won't spray champagne
And we think that is perverse!
Should we blame the FIA?
Or blame Max Mosley?
Or should we blame the staff at ITV?
NO, blame Schumacher
Blame Schumacher
With his irritating skills
He is the casue of F1's ills
Blame Schumacher
Blame Schumacher
We need to form a full assault
It is Schumacher's fault!


#13 armchair expert

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 12:07

Originally posted by pRy
Perhaps the drivers just got sick and tired of having to deal with stinging eyes due to getting Champagne in them. I don't see a problem with the champagne being given to the team to drink after the race.. they deserve it just as much as the drivers.


Watch MotoGP, Stoner, Rossi, et al put on their sunglasses and spray away! No stinging eyes. :smoking:

#14 Peter

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 12:13

But was it Champagne at the French GP?

The bottles were unmarked and I belive the French have some "thing" about this - different from other countries.

Was it the same for LeMans?

#15 kar

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 12:15

Personally I think they should ban the champagne dropping thing, and just have a magnum presented to the podium team's gathered beneath after the trophies have presented and the drivers are spraying their bottles.

Can't be too hard that?

#16 Suntrek

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 12:17

It's not MS fault, many things may be his fault (global warming, energy-crisis etc etc) but not this. :)

It's a rule - you MUST spray champagne or you'll be fined - and that doesn't exactly encourage spontaneous outbursts of champagne-spraying joy, I think. Plus it's a bit silly really. It may have been fun in the playboy- F1driver-image of the 60's and 70's, but today it's outdated and sometimes you can even feel that the drivers are a bit embarrassed that they HAVE to do it.

Who started the tradition of dropping the bottle to the team, btw? MS? In my opinion that's a nice tradition, much more fitting for modern F1, since it gives credit to the team.

#17 glorius&victorius

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 12:56

Originally posted by RedBaron
You blame Michael Schumacher for the bottle dropping and ruining a tradition of spraying champagne? Was that a joke... because it seems the guy in most of those pics is Michael Schumacher and he seems very much to be holding up the tradition.


by looking at the pictures I thought the same... he seems like the last to go after others with champagne

#18 glorius&victorius

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 12:58

Originally posted by kar
Personally I think they should ban the champagne dropping thing, and just have a magnum presented to the podium team's gathered beneath after the trophies have presented and the drivers are spraying their bottles.

Can't be too hard that?


too expensive... who will pay for that???

#19 kar

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 12:59

The FIA can just raise the drivers super-licenses by another 50% :)

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#20 Andy Donovan

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 13:21

Originally posted by Peter
But was it Champagne at the French GP?

The bottles were unmarked and I belive the French have some "thing" about this - different from other countries.

Was it the same for LeMans?

The French have restrictions on alcohol advertising, when Williams was sponsored by Veltins beer they had to alter the logos at the French GP like they do with tobacco.

Originally posted by Suntrek
Who started the tradition of dropping the bottle to the team, btw? MS? In my opinion that's a nice tradition, much more fitting for modern F1, since it gives credit to the team.

I agree, I like to see a good champagne fight but dropping the bottle to the mechanics has an air of real team spirit about it. I wonder if the reason everyone does nowadays is because once one driver gives his champagne to his mechanics the others have to follow suit to not look mean and piss their mechanics off!

#21 rolf123

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 13:42

I agree. Schumi killed it. He used to go straight to his team and never celebrate with the others on the podium who were then left looking clueless. Eventually, everyone just sprays the team.

In days of Senna and Mansell, drivers had rivalries but at the end of the race they would still have a good champagne fight. The aim of the game is to drench the face of your opponents not spray it on the team.

Give me a champagne bottle and tell me its mandatory and I'll still have a great time.

I would post some great podiums here but knowing Bernie, he will get them taken down from Youtube so I won't.

#22 Youichi

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 13:58

Originally posted by glorius&victorius


too expensive... who will pay for that???


The same champagne compnay that pays Bernie to have their brand of champane on the podium ?

If you think the F1 spraying has become a joke, don't watch the podium ceremony for the British 125cc Motogp race, where some jobsworth decided that 15 yearolds weren't allow to spray champagne.....and only the 20 yearold was given a bottle. :down:

#23 Mauseri

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 14:07

Originally posted by KWSN - DSM
I agree, but that is against the rules how stupid that may seem though.

:cool:

Yeah... 'a champagne attack' may be fun once in a while, but after every race? A worn joke.

#24 OfficeLinebacker

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 18:33

Didn't some driver wear goggles to a champagne fight recently?

Speaking of which, just another sponsorship opp--

Speedo brand goggles seal the best and with the most comfort!

#25 Jones Foyer

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 20:30

THE champagne bottle that started it all in the hands of Dan Gurney at LeMans was at the Petersen Museum in Los Angeles the last time I was there.

Amazing little piece of history, considering that the spraying of champagne is now a celebration at all sorts of victory events.

#26 Dolph

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 20:35

Originally posted by RedBaron
You blame Michael Schumacher for the bottle dropping and ruining a tradition of spraying champagne? Was that a joke... because it seems the guy in most of those pics is Michael Schumacher and he seems very much to be holding up the tradition.

Originally posted by Perigee

Don't you know this forum would implode if there were not several Schumacher-bashes included each day?  ;)

Originally posted by F1Fanatic.co.uk

With apologies to Matt Stone and Trey Parker.

Times have changed
F1 is getting worse
Drivers won't spray champagne
And we think that is perverse!
Should we blame the FIA?
Or blame Max Mosley?
Or should we blame the staff at ITV?
NO, blame Schumacher
Blame Schumacher
With his irritating skills
He is the casue of F1's ills
Blame Schumacher
Blame Schumacher
We need to form a full assault
It is Schumacher's fault!


I was a MS fan since the day he joined Benetton and he was my favorite driver and still is. Not everyone is out there to bash. I am allowed to have an opinion. And you all, as is now very clearly evident, are just plain wrong.

#27 Dolph

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 20:39

Originally posted by rolf123
I agree. Schumi killed it. He used to go straight to his team and never celebrate with the others on the podium who were then left looking clueless. Eventually, everyone just sprays the team.

In days of Senna and Mansell, drivers had rivalries but at the end of the race they would still have a good champagne fight. The aim of the game is to drench the face of your opponents not spray it on the team.

Give me a champagne bottle and tell me its mandatory and I'll still have a great time.

I would post some great podiums here but knowing Bernie, he will get them taken down from Youtube so I won't.


Hear-hear :up: :up:

#28 RedBaron

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 21:01

Originally posted by Dolph
I was a MS fan since the day he joined Benetton and he was my favorite driver and still is. Not everyone is out there to bash. I am allowed to have an opinion. And you all, as is now very clearly evident, are just plain wrong.


No-one said you cannot have an opinion... but use your brain :p

You are by use of your own photographic evidence just plain wrong :D

Clearly a man who doesn't spray champagne or take part in podium celebrations:

http://www.mschumach...p-champagne.jpg

http://newsimg.bbc.c...chumassa416.jpg

(pssstt, you posted those photos)

#29 Dolph

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 21:10

Who ever said they are photographic evidence? Stop putting words in my mouth. I looked for the best pictures I could find of champagne fights and for sure of all the zillion times MS has been on the podium, he must have had quite a few. That does not mean that he did not start the bottle dropping and the team spraying. :rolleyes:

And if you assume I posted those two pictures as evidence then you really have no common sense at all.

http://newsimg.bbc.c...chumassa416.jpg

http://www.mschumach...p-champagne.jpg

P.S. The links that done work are with Senna

#30 Jones Foyer

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 22:20

Eddie Irvine and Mika have a friendly waterfight in the post race interview.

This is good natured celebration! I miss Mika.

#31 Jones Foyer

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 22:22

Better view!

#32 RedBaron

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 22:29

Originally posted by Dolph
Who ever said they are photographic evidence? Stop putting words in my mouth. I looked for the best pictures I could find of champagne fights and for sure of all the zillion times MS has been on the podium, he must have had quite a few. That does not mean that he did not start the bottle dropping and the team spraying. :rolleyes:

And if you assume I posted those two pictures as evidence then you really have no common sense at all.

http://newsimg.bbc.c...chumassa416.jpg

http://www.mschumach...p-champagne.jpg

P.S. The links that done work are with Senna


haha wow you're touchy! My line about photographic evidence is clearly in jest, referring to your statement where you say everyone but you is wrong. Lighten up, the people to 'blame' for boring podiums are the people on the podium, no-one else. I don't see Schumacher (or anyone else) standing there with a gun forcing bottle dropping :D

Originally posted by Jones Foyer
This is good natured celebration! I miss Mika.


:(

#33 y2cragie

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Posted 01 July 2008 - 23:22

Personally I'd say if anything has "killed" it, its the sponsors and team owners.
These days teams are at war with each other, especially after last year, but in general the last few years, and its not really seen as PC to be enjoying a laugh with the guy from the other team. Team bosses dont like seeing their guy enjoying the fact that he only finished 2nd behind the other guy.

#34 giacomo

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Posted 02 July 2008 - 17:52

The champagne fight has become mandatory and thus painful boring. Just like the whole orchestrated podium ceremony.

I prefered the podiums of the 70ies, crowded with drivers, mechanics, groupies and random hangarounds.

#35 R Soul

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Posted 02 July 2008 - 18:02

What I find worse is the announcer who shouts "Champaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa....gne". It goes on for far too long and is typical of something organised by someone in a suit who long ago forgot what it's like to be a normal human.

#36 Dragonfly

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Posted 02 July 2008 - 19:25

They banned driver celebrating in the cockpit and occasionally taking a national flag with him. Recently they even can't congratulate their team and express their feelings. They are steered like sheep right from the cockpit to the inside of the paddock. No excitement, no joy. Only cold corporate image and Bernie counting the money.
But what is a race without the excitement and without the public and TV viewers sharing it with drivers and teams? A dull ceremony.

#37 pingu666

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Posted 02 July 2008 - 21:27

one of the things superbikes and nascar/IRL get much better than f1.... remmber your not allowed to doughnut anymore either...

#38 HP

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Posted 03 July 2008 - 05:54

Originally posted by pingu666
one of the things superbikes and nascar/IRL get much better than f1.... remmber your not allowed to doughnut anymore either...

Didn't Kimi do a doughnut last year after winning the WDC?

#39 Henri Greuter

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Posted 03 July 2008 - 07:24

Originally posted by BMW_F1


yep.. Dan Gurney started it after winning the race with his teammate with A.J Foyt.

Posted Image




In modern days perhaps....

I have read the book "Thunder at Sunrise" about the 1904-1916 Vandebilt cup, Grand Prize races and Indy 500's from that era and I remember (must look it up again if challenged) that on one of the races described in that book there was a report about drivers drinking chamapgne during the race (other than Jules Goux at Indy 1913) and celebrating the win with champagne therafter.

As for the one who was one of the the first to kill the tradition: Clay Reggazoni: Silverstone 1979.
In the years when Frank Williams had his arabic sponsors his drivers didn't do a thing with Champagne on the podium.
In one race in 1979 Williams scored a double, I believe that Arnoux was third and he was the only one touching the champagne that occasion.

I know that Alan Jones fisinshed second one race late in the 1978 season but I don't know if he didn''t participate within the champagne ceremony already by then. But in '79, it was very notable that Williams drivers didn't participate.



henri

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#40 gerry nassar

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Posted 03 July 2008 - 07:27

Originally posted by HP
Didn't Kimi do a doughnut last year after winning the WDC?


IIRC he did it after winning Spa. Perhaps because in Spa you cant do a victory lap. Was fun to see :up:

#41 petri

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Posted 03 July 2008 - 07:56

Originally posted by Jones Foyer
Better view!


A classic! Schumi ruined the water fight? ;)

#42 repcobrabham

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Posted 03 July 2008 - 08:37

i'm sure the drivers are prepared to suffer the impost of an UNSPONTANEOUS champagne fight if it means getting on the podium ;) (obvious but true)

#43 Dragonfly

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Posted 03 July 2008 - 10:37

Originally posted by HP
Didn't Kimi do a doughnut last year after winning the WDC?


He said he lost the car ;)