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Motorcycle racing 1969-1990 nostalgia 2


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#21701 fil2.8

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Posted 29 February 2012 - 22:37

Sorry to hear that matey :( hope your on the mend soon, re MT125 yes! want to see pics of before & after!! :up: :wave:


They are on FB , can't seem to post piccies on here now , it's the ex John Blanchard m/cycles one , ridden by Robin Riley , Tony Smith , still got the original fi/glass !!! :love:

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#21702 picblanc

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Posted 29 February 2012 - 22:48

right clic direct link on your photo, right clic on 4th box on the right above posting box, paste in your photo link & as if by magic it will appear!

#21703 fil2.8

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Posted 29 February 2012 - 23:13

right clic direct link on your photo, right clic on 4th box on the right above posting box, paste in your photo link & as if by magic it will appear!



photo , photo , you need a photo :blush: , silly me :confused: , didn't realize that , i'll try tomorrow , what with a new ' puter as well ........................my piccies seem lost ................. :lol:

#21704 Robin127

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Posted 01 March 2012 - 02:55

OK, just pointed the pic out to Alex Hammond of Oxford Products (formerly Oxford Fairings) and he confirms that it is John's bike
with John behind Mick and Alex himself on the left of the group. John, who is now 70yrs young, still has the bike and apparently
gives it a run out occasionally.


That does explain something. At the time I couldn't work out how a novice had managed to secure what was obviously pretty good sponsorship going on the paintjob and the reputation of Oxford Fairings. :D


#21705 joeninety

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Posted 01 March 2012 - 19:47

Rod, as you are well aware Mick is great guy and never lost his roots and let stardom take over, he's coming over to see Dad again in a couple of weeks time.


#21706 picblanc

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Posted 07 March 2012 - 15:44

Kenny on the full factory Yamaha OW48? in 1978.
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But what was Ron Haslam riding here, as the TZ500G did not arrive till 1980? here he is in 1978 @ the Silverstone GP.
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#21707 picblanc

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Posted 07 March 2012 - 15:45

PS hopefully a few of you are still alive out there!? :rolleyes: :D

#21708 Rennmax

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Posted 07 March 2012 - 15:53

Alive and kicking :wave:

Sleeved down TZ 750??


#21709 picblanc

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Posted 07 March 2012 - 15:55

Alive and kicking :wave:

Sleeved down TZ 750??


Hi Rupert, good to hear! :wave: thank you. :up:

#21710 Rennmax

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Posted 07 March 2012 - 16:16

Hi Rupert, good to hear! :wave: thank you. :up:


It's only an assumption that Ron is on such a bike, but I remember some of those modified TZ750s in the Senior TT in '75 ( the RG had not yet arrived), I don't know whether they used cylinders of the TZ 250 which means they were running without reed valves and thus delivering a fierce power output?

Edited by Rennmax, 07 March 2012 - 16:22.


#21711 tonyed

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Posted 07 March 2012 - 17:24

It's only an assumption that Ron is on such a bike, but I remember some of those modified TZ750s in the Senior TT in '75 ( the RG had not yet arrived), I don't know whether they used cylinders of the TZ 250 which means they were running without reed valves and thus delivering a fierce power output?


It would have been a TZ750 with two TZ250 top ends, just the same as the sidecar boys used. '78 would have been two 'E' barrels so could be quite peaky but I guess not too fierce.

I was marshalling at the BGP, but must say though I don't remember smokin' the rear boot, but then these days I don't remember much anyway.

Now which way to the toilet :confused:

#21712 picblanc

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Posted 07 March 2012 - 18:02

It would have been a TZ750 with two TZ250 top ends, just the same as the sidecar boys used. '78 would have been two 'E' barrels so could be quite peaky but I guess not too fierce.

I was marshalling at the BGP, but must say though I don't remember smokin' the rear boot, but then these days I don't remember much anyway.

Now which way to the toilet :confused:


Thanks Tony. :up:

#21713 bobness

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Posted 07 March 2012 - 19:22

Presumably that pic is from a halcyon, long forgotten time when the Yamaha factory team had no spare black front mudguards?
And thuis had to borrow a red one?
There must be a story about that?

#21714 Classicpics

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Posted 07 March 2012 - 20:22

Posted Image

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Photo: John S Nowell

Could be the same bike taken at Mallory that year, I think. (Not that easy these days!)

Edited by Classicpics, 07 March 2012 - 20:25.


#21715 Robin127

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Posted 07 March 2012 - 23:19

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Photo: John S Nowell

Could be the same bike taken at Mallory that year, I think. (Not that easy these days!)



And without the red front mudguard that he'd lent to Kenny Roberts :D

#21716 tonyed

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 06:58

And without the red front mudguard that he'd lent to Kenny Roberts :D


This is the 750 - see the pipes.

Can't see the pipes on the 500 but the swop from 750 to 500 is only the pipes and top end as the crankshaft is the same whatever the capacity and gearing change to suit.

Easy, if you've got the money, now where is my pension book :(

#21717 Hasselhoff

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 12:53

......the swop from 750 to 500 is only the pipes and top end as the crankshaft is the same whatever the capacity and gearing change to suit.

I think Warren Willing was doing that to his 750 in Europe to earn extra start money, he would convert it with 2 x TZ250 top ends and his own pipes, must have been exhausting for him.

#21718 picblanc

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 16:35

I think Warren Willing was doing that to his 750 in Europe to earn extra start money, he would convert it with 2 x TZ250 top ends and his own pipes, must have been exhausting for him.


:D

#21719 picblanc

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 16:37

Thats a superb shot of Ron there John (as usual!) :wave:

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#21720 picblanc

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 16:38

Thats a superb shot of Ron there John (as usual!) :wave:


Its from the 1978 Trans Trophy.

#21721 tonyed

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 17:34

I think Warren Willing was doing that to his 750 in Europe to earn extra start money, he would convert it with 2 x TZ250 top ends and his own pipes, must have been exhausting for him.


Some riders also just had a 250 or 350 and swapped top ends to suit the class.

Easiest conversion was the 350 to 351 Yamaha. Sod the 0.5 mm stepped crank pins, just change the blue plates for yellow and low and behold a 351 TZ :cool: :smoking: :eek: :rolleyes:

#21722 Russell Burrows

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 18:11

Some riders also just had a 250 or 350 and swapped top ends to suit the class.

Easiest conversion was the 350 to 351 Yamaha. Sod the 0.5 mm stepped crank pins, just change the blue plates for yellow and low and behold a 351 TZ :cool: :smoking: :eek: :rolleyes:


I can recall mass disqualifications at a Bemsee meeting due to this mularkey; not sure how they knew what was kosher and what wasn't.

#21723 picblanc

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 18:29

I can recall mass disqualifications at a Bemsee meeting due to this mularkey; not sure how they knew what was kosher and what wasn't.


Surely (dont call me Surely! :D ) a 350 would be at a disadvantage/slower than a 351? Why would the blazers get uppity?

#21724 fil2.8

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 18:50

Surely (dont call me Surely! :D ) a 350 would be at a disadvantage/slower than a 351? Why would the blazers get uppity?



Shirley , :p , it was the Manx and G50 riders etc , IIRC who were upset , the TZ's were just to quick .......................

#21725 Russell Burrows

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 19:36

Surely (dont call me Surely! :D ) a 350 would be at a disadvantage/slower than a 351? Why would the blazers get uppity?


Shirley , :p , it was the Manx and G50 riders etc , IIRC who were upset , the TZ's were just to quick .......................


Ah, after venturing into the attic to root around in the old shoe box that is my archive, I see that I've mislead you, gentlemen. The occasion was a '71 Snetteron 350 race. Roger Cope, John Samways and Tom Robinson were excluded for 'wrong capacity machine', which must have been using a TD2 - which, of course, was easily distinguishable from its big brother - in an over 250 race. I note also that one Anthony Edwards is in the results, not though listed in the programme.

Edited by Russell Burrows, 22 March 2012 - 13:37.


#21726 fil2.8

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 20:47

Ah, after venturing into the attic to root around in the old shoe box that is my archive




Great minds think alike , Russ :clap: , I have a couple I use , all properly filed , of course ..................................... :rolleyes: :blush:

#21727 Russell Burrows

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 20:59

Great minds think alike , Russ :clap: , I have a couple I use , all properly filed , of course ..................................... :rolleyes: :blush:


Yes Phil, my stuff often also doubles as a bed for one of our cats. After scrutinising the blurb more closely I see that messrs Cope, Samways and Robinson were also excluded from all other races that day and that none of their names appear in the programme. Their exclusion then must have been because they just rocked up for a ride without entering. Mr Edwards too seems to have done something similar, yet wasn't excluded. Do you think I should dob him in to Bemsee?

Edited by Russell Burrows, 08 March 2012 - 21:21.


#21728 larryd

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 21:20

Some riders also just had a 250 or 350 and swapped top ends to suit the class.

Easiest conversion was the 350 to 351 Yamaha. Sod the 0.5 mm stepped crank pins, just change the blue plates for yellow and low and behold a 351 TZ :cool: :smoking: :eek: :rolleyes:


A genuine offset crankpin 351 needed two base gaskets to lift the ports.

Absence of the two gaskets gave it away as a fablon special

I've run both sorts in my day (long time ago) !!

:wave:


#21729 fil2.8

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 21:33

Mr Edwards too seems to have done something similar, yet wasn't excluded. Do you think I should dob him in to Bemsee?



Of , course , the correct proceedure , I should think they will take a very dim view of his misdemeanours , and block his entry's , until a full investigation is carried out :down: :wave:

#21730 Paul Collins

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 22:26

Surely (dont call me Surely! :D ) a 350 would be at a disadvantage/slower than a 351? Why would the blazers get uppity?


The genuine 'stroked' motors vibrated more and were actually slower than a 350

#21731 larryd

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 23:36

The genuine 'stroked' motors vibrated more and were actually slower than a 350


I remember that - slightly out of balance crank, I always thought.

#21732 tonyed

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Posted 09 March 2012 - 12:25

Ah, after venturing into the attic to root around in the old shoe box that is my archive, I see that I've mislead you, gentlemen. The occasion was a '71 Snetteron 350 race. Roger Cope, John Samways and Tom Robinson were excluded for 'wrong capacity machine', which must have been using a TD2 - which, of course, was easily distinguishable, from its big brother, in an over 250 race. I note also that one Anthony Edwards is in the results, not though listed in the programme.


Never M'Lud, I was lead astray, it was the 'eadaches and double vision what done it. All right I admit it all, but no one ever suspected that my four cylinder 125 Yamaha was just a TZ750 with black plates. :cool:

I had a 350 Aermacchi Metisse in 1971 (which replaced my Greeves Silverstone which I may have been entered on in the 250 race) so I am absolved from this henious crime. A full apology written on the back of a signed blank cheque will suffice. :smoking:

Anyway in 1971 TZs didn't exist so there were no oversize/undersize Yamahas. As said though the TD2 and TR2 engines were entirley different including the final drive side so they must have been using TD2s in a 350 race as I remember they all had TD2s at sometime. Can anyone remember who was the first to ride a 351 TR2? I know Nigel Rollason won a Senior Manx on one in 1971, but I suspect it might have been done earlier and possibly legally.

Edited by tonyed, 09 March 2012 - 12:30.


#21733 Russell Burrows

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Posted 09 March 2012 - 12:29

Never M'Lud, I was lead astray, it was the 'eadaches and double vision what done it. All right I admit it all, but no one ever suspected that my four cylinder 125 Yamaha was just a TZ750 with black plates. :cool:

Anyway in 1971 TZs didn't exist so there were no oversize/undersize Yamahas. As said though the TD2 and TR2 engines were entirley different including the final drive side so they must have been using TD2s in a 350 race as I remember they all had TD2s at sometime. Can anyone remember who was the first to ride a 351 TR2? I know Nigel Rollason won a Senior Manx on one in 1971, but I suspect it might have been done earlier and possibly legally.


So how did you get a start without then being disqualified like the rest?

Edited by Russell Burrows, 09 March 2012 - 18:58.


#21734 tonyed

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Posted 09 March 2012 - 12:31

So how did a get a start without then being disqualified like the rest?


Russell see my previous edited post which explains. I WAS INNOCENT.

Edited by tonyed, 09 March 2012 - 12:32.


#21735 suzrg500

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Posted 09 March 2012 - 16:21

They had a purge again in about 1977/78, not sure why Bemsee made such a fuss when no other organisers seemed bothered, It only used to bolster the sometimes depleted 500 grids at their meetings. I remember a race at Snett around the start of the season where about 1/2 the grid got chucked out. IIRC, myself, Don Wears, Geoff Went, Paul Harris, Chris Woodcock, Karl Rugg, Andy Hawkins and the list went on, I think the only TZ front runner left was Dennis Casement who ran a 375 TZ 750 top end. I think he finished 3rd or 4th but was obviously given the win :D

#21736 Paul Collins

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Posted 09 March 2012 - 17:36

I remember as a lad, cycling to a Cadwell practice day one Thursday during the school holidays, it would have been around 1972, Tony Rutter was just about the only person there in the morning, he did a few laps and then I watched him and his mechanic strip the top end of a TR2B and re-build it with different pistons and cylinders.

When I asked what he was doing he said they were trying an oversized top end for the 500 class, I think he said it was around 365cc, so i'm guessing he'd had some cylinders done by someone as opposed to a stroking job.

I remember he went out and did a good few laps on the rebuilt bike before declaring himself happy with it and loading it up in the van.

#21737 Robin127

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Posted 09 March 2012 - 18:03

They had a purge again in about 1977/78, not sure why Bemsee made such a fuss when no other organisers seemed bothered, It only used to bolster the sometimes depleted 500 grids at their meetings. I remember a race at Snett around the start of the season where about 1/2 the grid got chucked out. IIRC, myself, Don Wears, Geoff Went, Paul Harris, Chris Woodcock, Karl Rugg, Andy Hawkins and the list went on, I think the only TZ front runner left was Dennis Casement who ran a 375 TZ 750 top end. I think he finished 3rd or 4th but was obviously given the win :D


I think it was Dennis Casement who won the Bemsee 500 Production Championship in the early 80's riding a 350LC. If I remember correctly this championship was only open to bikes above 350cc and from what I was told his bike had the max overbore making it larger than 350 therefore elegible for the class.

Edited by Robin127, 09 March 2012 - 18:04.


#21738 picblanc

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 22:01

WWW? two well known riders, one at the back not so?
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#21739 Henry Snee

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 10:29

Ah, after venturing into the attic to root around in the old shoe box that is my archive, I see that I've mislead you, gentlemen. The occasion was a '71 Snetteron 350 race. Roger Cope, John Samways and Tom Robinson were excluded for 'wrong capacity machine', which must have been using a TD2 - which, of course, was easily distinguishable, from its big brother, in an over 250 race. I note also that one Anthony Edwards is in the results, not though listed in the programme.


If I recall the incident correctly Samways was riding our Bultacos as well as a Manx at the time. The 250 water cooled Bulto was faster and more reliable than the similar looking (with fairing on) 350 air cooled model. We probably thought we could get away with it! If PMBboy is looking in he may recall the incident more accurately.

Edited by Henry Snee, 22 March 2012 - 10:30.


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#21740 Russell Burrows

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 13:36

If I recall the incident correctly Samways was riding our Bultacos as well as a Manx at the time. The 250 water cooled Bulto was faster and more reliable than the similar looking (with fairing on) 350 air cooled model. We probably thought we could get away with it! If PMBboy is looking in he may recall the incident more accurately.


In this instance it seems they got the boot for not actually entering; none were listed in the programme.

#21741 knickerbrook

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Posted 23 March 2012 - 15:51

WWW? two well known riders, one at the back not so?
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Time for some clues then Gray :well: !!

#21742 picblanc

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Posted 23 March 2012 - 16:50

Time for some clues then Gray :well: !!



There is life out there thank you Barry! :D
From left to right, French GP rider, British rider now CRMC, & Dutch @ the rear.

#21743 knickerbrook

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Posted 23 March 2012 - 17:30

194 - Richard Peers Jones?

#21744 RC162

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Posted 23 March 2012 - 19:30


194 looks to me like Gordon Russell plus the then Norfolk based Lomas Pipes could be a connection.

#21745 picblanc

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Posted 23 March 2012 - 19:32

194 looks to me like Gordon Russell plus the then Norfolk based Lomas Pipes could be a connection.


:clap: Correct #194 Gordon Russell.

#21746 philippe7

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Posted 23 March 2012 - 21:21

....and my compatriot is I think Marc Fontan who later went on to greater things as a Sonauto Yamaha 500 factory rider, then Honda France for endurance - but sadly he had a fall in one of his first races for Honda which permanently damaged a major nerve in one of his arms which meant he had to give up riding - although he remained involved in the sport to this day in various positions....

Edited by philippe7, 23 March 2012 - 21:22.


#21747 picblanc

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Posted 23 March 2012 - 21:32

:clap: Correct Philippe Marc Fontan it is, Dutch guy is ? Kuiper I forget his first name for now.
Oh & its Brands 1978 or 79?

Edited by picblanc, 23 March 2012 - 21:32.


#21748 picblanc

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Posted 23 March 2012 - 22:27

WWW? one easy the other a well known name (still)
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#21749 picblanc

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Posted 23 March 2012 - 22:38

Brian Zeky from USA @ Brands Hatch King of Brands meeting during Motorcycle Mechanics Production race, I know nothing about Brian, does anyone remember him?
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#21750 fil2.8

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Posted 23 March 2012 - 23:45

no