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IndyCar 2009 (merged)


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#1 red stick

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 15:46

Never too early to get started. And to keep things interesting, it appears that Helio IS going to trial March 2 and will not get a delay, meaning that Penske may be forced to replace him.

http://www.indystar....1/1052/SPORTS01


As a practical matter, this is not too much of a surprise. Federal courts are fairly tightly run, and continuing a case because you want to go racing until October 2009 was never likely to impress a federal judge.

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#2 TwoCents

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 15:59

Cool to start this thread :up:

Let's hope we can keep out the usual IRL hate trolls, and I'm looking forward to next season.

Anyone know whether Sky is covering IndyCar again next year, guess they will? I'm cancelling my Sky Sports package for the duration of the winter period to save a bit of money, but fully intend to renew once the season starts.

#3 B Squared

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 16:12

Can we please put "IRL" to bed as soon as possible? IRL is the sanctioning body of IndyCar. Enough of the ambiguousness of IRL, IndyCar is the name that it known by: http://www.indycar.com/
Thank you all. BTW, it is a great idea - Thanks to Red Stick.

Brian

#4 Risil

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 16:18

Originally posted by B Squared
Can we please put "IRL" to bed as soon as possible? IRL is the sanctioning body of IndyCar. Enough of the ambiguousness of IRL, IndyCar is the name that it known by: http://www.indycar.com/
Thank you all. BTW, it is a great idea - Thanks to Red Stick.

Brian


Yeah, this is true. Indycar -- because of its pre-split associations -- seems a natural fit for the USOW scene in general. Now CART/CCWS is under the ground, I think top-level IRL-sanctioned open-wheel racing can reclaim it, culturally-speaking.

And now, the big question: Who can stop Ryan Briscoe?;)

#5 red stick

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 16:25

Originally posted by B Squared
IndyCar is the name that it known by. . .


Hence the name of the thread! Last year we did this race-by-race; due to the success of the NASCAR 2008 thread I'm wondering if a season-long discussion isn't the better way to go.

#6 TwoCents

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 16:28

Originally posted by red stick
Last year we did this race-by-race; due to the success of the NASCAR 2008 thread I'm wondering if a season-long discussion isn't the better way to go.


A lot better, at least now we have a place to put all the news tidbits that cannot be fitted in single race threads.

#7 red stick

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 16:31

Originally posted by Risil
And now, the big question: Who can stop Ryan Briscoe?;)


You've got to figure, based on the experience of the rise and fall of AGR, that Franchitti will be more helpful setting up cars at TGCR than Wheldon was, not that Dixon seemed to need the help last year. But it seems to me the early line has got to be among those three: Briscoe, Dixon, Franchitti.

Just for the sake of discussion:

1) Castroneves will either not race or face massive distractions.

2) Wheldon will not win another race.

3) Neither will Danica, unless she relearns something about road courses racing A1GP.

4) Vitor will.

And a question, any news about KV racing?

#8 anbeck

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 16:32

Originally posted by B Squared
Can we please put "IRL" to bed as soon as possible? IRL is the sanctioning body of IndyCar. Enough of the ambiguousness of IRL, IndyCar is the name that it known by: http://www.indycar.com/


You'd better tell that Autosport! The whole season long I thought about writing a letter so they change 'IRL' to 'Indy' on their website, but I never quite got to it...

Nevertheless, cool thread, I agree :)

1. Any changes to regulations next year?

2. If Helio cannot race, who'll get the seat? Any chances for Tracy?

#9 B Squared

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 16:39

Hence the name of the thread! red stick

I was pleased to see your appropriate choice! My comment was not directed to the foresight & common sense of the threads originator. :up:

Brian

#10 Rob

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 16:39

Originally posted by red stick
You've got to figure, based on the experience of the rise and fall of AGR, that Franchitti will be more helpful setting up cars at TGCR than Wheldon was, not that Dixon seemed to need the help last year. But it seems to me the early line has got to be among those three: Briscoe, Dixon, Franchitti.


I can't see anyone else winning it. I don't know if Briscoe is capable of winning a championship, but it's not impossible I guess. In my mind, it's too close to call between Dixon and Franchitti. Could go either way. Kanaan could be an outsider but I'm not convinced that AGR is working properly as a unit.

#11 Rob

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 16:43

Originally posted by anbeck
2. If Helio cannot race, who'll get the seat? Any chances for Tracy?


You'd have to believe he's a contender. Would the Captain take on someone like Darren Manning? He's a free agent who did very well last year.

If Roger is feeling brave then he ought to consider Scheckter. In the right environment he will be very very good.

#12 red stick

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 16:50

Originally posted by Rob
Kanaan could be an outsider but I'm not convinced that AGR is working properly as a unit.


I certainly wouldn't bet against Kanaan. I think there's a growing consensus that where his team would have helped him say, three years ago, his present teammates are . . . more of a hindrance.

#13 TwoCents

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 17:01

Originally posted by red stick


I certainly wouldn't bet against Kanaan. I think there's a growing consensus that where his team would have helped him say, three years ago, his present teammates are . . . more of a hindrance.


There were certainly a couple of moments this season where his team mates ruined his chances of a good finish. I would certainly not count him out for a championship which is well due.

Briscoe, on the other hand, is not ready for a championship yet IMO. He's talented, that's for sure, but still a little erratic perhaps?

#14 CWeil

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 17:07

Here's to hoping AGR wises up and gets a car full-time for Montagy. I think having him around would help AGR win more races and give someone for Kanaan to talk to.

#15 red stick

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 17:10

Originally posted by TwoCents
Briscoe, on the other hand, is not ready for a championship yet IMO. He's talented, that's for sure, but still a little erratic perhaps?


Early last year, yes. I think one of the stories of this past season was Briscoe's vast improvement as the year wore on. So I'd argue (or hope?) he's largely put his erraticism behind him.

A bigger threat to a Briscoe championship may be a lack of Castroneves sharing information on race weekends. If there is a new guy in the 3, he and Briscoe may not mesh as well.

#16 wewantourdarbyback

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 17:10

Who's available for Penske to take on?

Wilson
Manning
Tracy
Schekter
?

#17 red stick

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 17:10

Originally posted by CWeil
Here's to hoping AGR wises up and gets a car full-time for Montagy. I think having him around would help AGR win more races and give someone for Kanaan to talk to.


:up: :lol:

#18 red stick

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 17:12

Originally posted by wewantourdarbyback
Who's available for Penske to take on?

Wilson
Manning
Tracy
Schekter
?


Never too early to start a Hornish rumor, however unlikely. I'd rate Hornish MUCH MORE likely than Paul Tracy.

#19 TwoCents

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 17:12

By the way, weren't Forsythe gonna re-enter and put up a two-car effort next year? Is that still happening, anyone know, the silence has been deafening after the initial announcement earlier in the year...

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#20 Rob

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 17:12

Originally posted by wewantourdarbyback
Who's available for Penske to take on?

Wilson
Manning
Tracy
Schekter
?


You know, I completely forgot Justin was out of a ride :drunk:

Justin in a Penske would be formidable. He's the best bet for a long-term partnership.

#21 red stick

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 17:15

Originally posted by TwoCents
By the way, weren't Forsythe gonna re-enter and put up a two-car effort next year? Is that still happening, anyone know, the silence has been deafening after the initial announcement earlier in the year...


Not IndyCar, Indy Lights.

http://www.forsythe-racing.com/

And the silence post-announcement is just as deafening.

#22 Crazy Canuck

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 17:21

If Helio goes to Dancing with the Inmates, I would like to see Hunter-Rhey in the Penske seat, he matured really well last year.

Championship odds are as follows (IMHO):

1) Dixon (favorite, 4 sure)
2) Briscoe (looked really good at the end of last year, carry the momentum)
3) Frachitti (start of season could be weak due to rust)
4) Kannan (AGR explosion will cost him....again)

Of course, this assumes Helio will be teaching Bubba and '50 how to Dance. Otherwise, Helio is second.

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#23 Crazy Canuck

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 17:23

Originally posted by TwoCents
Cool to start this thread :up:

Let's hope we can keep out the usual IRL hate trolls, and I'm looking forward to next season.


:up: +1

Good luck keeping the usual suspects out.

CC

#24 wewantourdarbyback

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 17:27

Originally posted by Rob


You know, I completely forgot Justin was out of a ride :drunk:

Justin in a Penske would be formidable. He's the best bet for a long-term partnership.

Have to agree, I would love to see him in a top car (probably why I put him top of the list.... perhaps)

#25 anbeck

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 17:37

Originally posted by Crazy Canuck


:up: +1

Good luck keeping the usual suspects out.

CC


Put the trolls on the ignore list, put troll-quoters on the ignore list and this forum is an entertaining read ;)

Might it be possible that Helio can make a deal so he can race (you know, in these lawyer series you always see the defense trying to arrange a deal with the prosecutor...)?

#26 pingu666

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 18:12

hard not to see dario and kanaan not featuring isnt it?

title contenders should hopefully be atleast

dario
kanaan
dixon
ryan briscoe
helio (hopefully)

with a whole ton of others atleast being fully capable of running at the front at times

should be awsome :D

#27 aportinga

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 18:28

Originally posted by red stick


Never too early to start a Hornish rumor, however unlikely. I'd rate Hornish MUCH MORE likely than Paul Tracy.


Hornish is staying in NASCAR and PT is done with OW - in America at least. I would look at RHR or a bump up from the lower ranks - perhaps a surprise?

#28 aportinga

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 18:29

Originally posted by TwoCents
By the way, weren't Forsythe gonna re-enter and put up a two-car effort next year? Is that still happening, anyone know, the silence has been deafening after the initial announcement earlier in the year...


Discussion is Forsythe to Atlantics. There is an option of Coyne doing the same - who knows about KV Racing??? McDonalds stays on with NHL - regardless of Paul's unfortunate death.

That's all I know.

#29 MLC

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 21:21

Though I hope he remains in F1, if he becomes available a Bourdais/Penske partnership would be great to see.

#30 Scotracer

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 21:29

Are they using the same chassis as the old IRL cars?

Also, go Dario! :clap:

#31 Pikachu Racing

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 21:38

How about Rubens Barrichello if he's out F1 ride? He tested with Penske not long ago

#32 red stick

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 22:15

Originally posted by MLC
Though I hope he remains in F1, if he becomes available a Bourdais/Penske partnership would be great to see.


Agree on all counts. One of my own personal sublime moments at a track was watching Bourdais school all the other Champ Car drivers in negotiating the Turn 12-13-14 complex in practice at Road America last year. If F1 does not want him I hope he returns.

#33 red stick

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 22:16

Originally posted by Pikachu Racing
How about Rubens Barrichello if he's out F1 ride? He tested with Penske not long ago


I can't remember where I read it but I believe he's in no hurry to race on ovals.

#34 mapguy

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Posted 18 November 2008 - 01:24

Originally posted by TwoCents

Let's hope we can keep out the usual IRL hate trolls,


Translation: Fans from outside Marion County, Indiana.

Honest question. What was wrong with Indycar back in the mid 90's? Follow up question. What has Tony George done to cure the problem that existed back in the mid 90's?

According to the 'place fans' it was:

1: Engine leases. Whoops. Good job on that....

2: More American drivers. ditto.

3: More ovals, less street/road courses. OMFG!

4: CART evil team owners. Penske, Ganassi, Green/Andretti, Rahal, etc... OMFG, pt II!

Waiting for answers.....

#35 GhostR

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Posted 18 November 2008 - 01:34

I thought I saw that KV's probably not returning, or if they do they're a smaller effort? Add Power to the potentials list for Penske? Or is he already confirmed to be off somewhere else?

#36 pingu666

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Posted 18 November 2008 - 01:55

im from the uk and have never visited america, so go figure ;)

#37 red stick

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Posted 18 November 2008 - 04:05

Originally posted by aportinga
Hornish is staying in NASCAR and PT is done with OW - in America at least. I would look at RHR or a bump up from the lower ranks - perhaps a surprise?


Oh I agree. Curt Cavin of the Indianapolis Star has opined that Penske has poured too many resources into Hornish's NASCAR effort to quit after just a year. (Of course Cavin also thought Franchitti was done with indycars and off to sports cars, so who knows?). My point was that we'll see Hornish back at Marlboro Team Penske before Tracy, and we're not going to see Hornish. Cavin also has been suggesting RHR lately, so I wonder if there's something there?

#38 ColdHeart

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Posted 18 November 2008 - 08:51

What was wrong with Indycar back in the mid 90's?

Cars and tires got too fast. Arie ran almost 240 in practice, Zampedri almost went over the fence at Indy in '96





Follow up question. What has Tony George done to cure the problem that existed back in the mid 90's?

Slowed the cars down to the point they can run the highbank mile and a halfs like Homestead and Texas. And in the process, introduced a number of safety innovations.

#39 Dmitriy_Guller

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Posted 18 November 2008 - 09:04

Originally posted by Rob
If Roger is feeling brave then he ought to consider Scheckter. In the right environment he will be very very good.

Tomas did drive this year for a team closely affiliated with Penske. He did six races and finished zero.

At one time I was a fan of his. However, after 7 (!!) years of him racing Indycars mostly in top teams and getting absolutely nowhere, I have to conclude that Tomas is a lost cause. There is just something wired wrong in his brain, and it doesn't look like even the best driver managers can fix that. He always finds a way to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory, and often does it the same way time after time after time. He's also uncompetitive on road courses, which is surprising given his background.

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#40 Dmitriy_Guller

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Posted 18 November 2008 - 09:17

Originally posted by ColdHeart
What was wrong with Indycar back in the mid 90's?

Cars and tires got too fast. Arie ran almost 240 in practice, Zampedri almost went over the fence at Indy in '96





Follow up question. What has Tony George done to cure the problem that existed back in the mid 90's?

Slowed the cars down to the point they can run the highbank mile and a halfs like Homestead and Texas. And in the process, introduced a number of safety innovations.

If there is one thing the current generation of Indycars are known for, then it's for their remarkable resistance to almost going over the fence.

#41 red stick

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Posted 18 November 2008 - 12:11

Originally posted by Dmitriy_Guller

Tomas did drive this year for a team closely affiliated with Penske. He did six races and finished zero.

At one time I was a fan of his. However, after 7 (!!) years of him racing Indycars mostly in top teams and getting absolutely nowhere, I have to conclude that Tomas is a lost cause. There is just something wired wrong in his brain, and it doesn't look like even the best driver managers can fix that. He always finds a way to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory, and often does it the same way time after time after time. He's also uncompetitive on road courses, which is surprising given his background.


At this point hiring Scheckter really would be the triumph of hope over experience.

#42 red stick

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Posted 18 November 2008 - 12:26

The 2009 IndyCar schedule:

Date Track Layout TV Network
Sun 5-Apr Streets of St. Petersburg 1.8-mile street course VERSUS
Sun 19-Apr Streets of Long Beach 1.968-mile street course VERSUS
Sun 26-Apr Kansas Speedway 1.5-mile oval VERSUS
Sun 24-May Indianapolis Motor Speedway 2.5-mile oval ABC
Sun 31-May The Milwaukee Mile 1.0-mile oval ABC
Sat 6-Jun * Texas Motor Speedway 1.5-mile oval VERSUS
Sun 21-Jun Iowa Speedway .875-mile oval ABC
Sat 27-Jun * Richmond International .75-mile oval VERSUS
Sun 5-Jul Watkins Glen International 3.4-mile road course ABC
Sun 12-Jul Streets of Toronto 1.721-mile street course ABC
Sun 26-Jul Edmonton City Centre Airport 1.973-mile airport course VERSUS
Sat 1-Aug * Kentucky Speedway 1.5-mile oval VERSUS
Sun 9-Aug Mid-Ohio Sports Car Course 2.258-mile road course VERSUS
Sun 23-Aug Infineon Raceway 2.303-mile road course VERSUS
Sat 29-Aug * Chicagoland Speedway 1.5-mile oval VERSUS
Sun 6-Sep Belle Isle Park 2.07-mile street course VERSUS
Sat 19-Sep Twin Ring Motegi 1.5-mile oval VERSUS
Sat 10-Oct Homestead-Miami Speedway 1.5-mil oval VERSUS

* - night race

#43 Rob

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Posted 18 November 2008 - 12:44

Originally posted by red stick


At this point hiring Scheckter really would be the triumph of hope over experience.


I still think that with the right mentor, he could be championship material.

#44 Dmitriy_Guller

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Posted 18 November 2008 - 13:28

Originally posted by red stick


At this point hiring Scheckter really would be the triumph of hope over experience.

:lol:

#45 aportinga

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Posted 18 November 2008 - 13:52

Originally posted by Rob


I still think that with the right mentor, he could be championship material.


If he needs a mentor after all the experience and opportunities he's had then it's finished. He may as well go sip cocktails on some beach in Spain.

#46 Dmitriy_Guller

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Posted 18 November 2008 - 14:11

Originally posted by aportinga


If he needs a mentor after all the experience and opportunities he's had then it's finished. He may as well go sip cocktails on some beach in Spain.

Exactly. It's easy to forget that Tomas is a seasoned veteran, since he still drives like he did in 2002. If Chip Ganassi couldn't turn recklessness into controlled aggression, then no one can.

#47 aportinga

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Posted 18 November 2008 - 14:24

You assume Ganassi had the time to step away from the buffet to do this....

#48 Crazy Canuck

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Posted 18 November 2008 - 14:54

Originally posted by anbeck

Put the trolls on the ignore list, put troll-quoters on the ignore list and this forum is an entertaining read ;)


I've never been a fan of the ignore list...freedom of speech and all that. But considering they've been having the same argument since the split and it still isn't resolved, maybe I'll try it out.

I've added two this morning...and ya know what...I feel a little better :D


Tomas Sheckters carreer in IRL should be over, I suggest WTCC or somthing more robust.


CC

#49 B Squared

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Posted 18 November 2008 - 15:03

I truly thought Scheckter would gel within & be moderately successful at Luczo Dragon Racing. To say that I was wrong would be a massive understatement. I don't see other opportunities in this series for him.

Brian

#50 pingu666

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Posted 18 November 2008 - 15:04

i thought he did ok, i mean he is fast, just breaks stuff alot.